From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 03:11:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJHTb-0000TFa; Fri, 1 Nov 96 03:09 PST X-Path: cornell.edu!bjs10 From: B J Snell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Date Date: Fri, 1 Nov 1996 06:09:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2.2.16.19961101060935.192f2a58@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 11:16 PM 10/29/96 -0500, you wrote: > > 11/4/96 is neither April 11th nor November 11th, but >November 4th!! > For future reference..... when one lives in Europe or is in the US Military services 11/4/96 is the Eleventh of April. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Barbara J. Snell Jansen's Dining, Cornell University 255-5960 bjs10@cornell.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 10:47:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJObP-0000i7a; Fri, 1 Nov 96 10:45 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!knowitall From: Roseanne Campbell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: copper reinforcing Date: Fri, 1 Nov 1996 18:45:46 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov1.184546.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Everyone, Does anyone have any tips for using the copper reinforcing -Strong Line_ I think its called? My project is slightly over 20" vertically. Do I really need to reinforce this size. This stuff is hard to bend to the proper shape-can you just put a piece here and there and get enough strength to serve the purpose? Thanks, Roseanne ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 11:07:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJOuF-0000zNa; Fri, 1 Nov 96 11:05 PST X-Path: gjr From: gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: copper reinforcing Date: Fri, 1 Nov 1996 11:05:19 PST Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk [In the message entitled "copper reinforcing" on Nov 1, 18:45, Roseanne Campbell writes:] > Does anyone have any tips for using the copper reinforcing -Strong Line_ I > think its called? My project is slightly over 20" vertically. Do I really > need to reinforce this size. This stuff is hard to bend to the proper > shape-can you just put a piece here and there and get enough strength to > serve the purpose? Although I have yet to use this product,...I believe if you use some needle nose pliers to help you bend it it will be easier. I wouldn't think you should have to reinforce it though. I thought the rule of thumb was anything over 2 ft. If you do reinforce, the strip should be woven into the pattern design (a continuous strip from top to bottom) in several areas. -- Glenna Rand gjr@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 13:15:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJQuw-0000zna; Fri, 1 Nov 96 13:14 PST X-Path: aros.net!jenkyn From: jenkyn@aros.net (Jenkyn A. Powell) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: copper reinforcing Date: Fri, 1 Nov 1996 15:27:29 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Roseanne, Yes you should add some reinforcement to your panel. It is my belief that there can not be too much reinforcement. Although you haven't said how wide your project is. I will assume for the sake of discussion it is a square. Reinforcement is the backbone of leaded glasswork and it should always be planned first when designing a project. Many modern glass people believe (incorrectly) that foil is so strong that it simply does not need to be reinforced. This is simply not the case. Given time the laws of entropy & gravity WILL win. Our job is to delay the inevitable as long as possible, reinforcement will help. Glenna's suggestion of using long nosed pliers is valid. Assemble the sections of the window that boarder the re-strip. Then bend the strip to the curvature to fit between them. Next tack the strip to the points where the soldered "cames" meet the re-strip. Slide the sections together, use glazing nails to fix the panel in place. Then solder the re-strip and foil together. This will, of course, make a slightly wider line. When designing this can be used to "reinforce the design as well as the window itself. Pardon me I tend to go on when prompted. Best of luck, Jenkyn A. Powell Powell Brothers & Sons http://www.powellbrosglassart.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 13:40:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJRJI-00019Ea; Fri, 1 Nov 96 13:39 PST X-Path: hiline.net!rgvmuse From: Rio Grande Valley Museum To: glass@bungi.com Subject: pussy willows Date: Fri, 01 Nov 1996 15:40:21 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov1.94021.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: HiLine Internet Customer Precedence: bulk I recall seeing a pussy willow with dogwood (I think, maybe azaleas) in a pattern book for sidelights, doorways and panels. it wasn't on the cover but there was a color picture of the completed piece as well as the pattern in the book - about 3 years ago. sorry, i know that's not much help..... Linn ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 14:33:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJS8q-00016Ta; Fri, 1 Nov 96 14:32 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: copper reinforcing Date: Fri, 01 Nov 1996 17:31:51 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov1.123151.0> References: <<1996Nov1.184546.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Roseanne Campbell wrote: > > Hi Everyone, > > Does anyone have any tips for using the copper reinforcing -Strong Line_ I > think its called? My project is slightly over 20" vertically. Do I really > need to reinforce this size. This stuff is hard to bend to the proper > shape-can you just put a piece here and there and get enough strength to > serve the purpose? > > Thanks, > Roseanne > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass it never hurts to reinforce. i like using the open mesh kind (which i'm pretty sure is just a solder wick only without the flux on it). it tends to absorb solder better, and does'nt oxidise. it's a little more expensive (but i hardly ever use it). it also depends on what the design is. for example if the piece is a grid, like a chess board, it will be floppy, and also kind of difficult to stongline. so basically it depends on your pattern, the best way to have the stongest joint possible is to put the strong line across the whole panel if you can weaving and shoving it through the whole panel. sometimes if you can design it in advance, is to leave a little bit more space for the line, so the solder can "drip" into the joint better. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 1 16:21:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJTpN-0000wwa; Fri, 1 Nov 96 16:20 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: First stitches Date: Fri, 1 Nov 1996 16:20:34 -0800 Message-ID: <199611020020.QAA01488@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >Nor have I ever gotten an infection from a glass cut It helps that they bleed. > >Since I'm a lead person the tips of my fingers are all cross-hatched with >little cuts, Try a product by American bandage. Also by others I am sure. It is a gauze that is impregnated with natural rubber. It sticks to itself but not to you. It is a little clunky at the begining but after you get used to it you can work all day pulling un-edged pieces into came with nary a cut. you put it in just your finger tips. I also use it to pre wrap my wrist to keep from getting skin irirtation from a wrist brace ( just fending off tendonitis.) worse on the right hand since I have callouses from guitar >strings on my left which just need to be sanded occasionally also good to keep those fingers from getting cut just before a jam night ( inevitably when I get the only cut of the week on my left hand) :-) > >This safety prceedure has saved me from sure disaster on more then one >occasion. I've seen sheets come apart in peoples hands and you don't wanna >know the gory details. > Especialy hate it when holding a sheet up to the light to show a client the color. ( luckily not me and no injurys just much embaresment.) MS ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 2 05:03:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJfhC-0000M7a; Sat, 2 Nov 96 05:01 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: First stitches Date: 02 Nov 96 07:59:26 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov2.125926.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > Try a product by American bandage. Also by others I am sure. It is a > gauze that is impregnated with natural rubber.< I'd rather it was impregnated with a synthetic considering the track record of natural rubber in the medical/dental industry in terms of serious allergies. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety Board IGGA 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2596 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 2 12:31:04 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJmiO-0000fma; Sat, 2 Nov 96 12:30 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sat, 02 Nov 1996 15:28:15 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov2.102815.0> References: <<327B94BA.7C1D@mars.superlink.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > just courious but what broke on your inland? i've had mine for over 10 > years, and it's still running strong. the only thing i had to replace > was the grid. though the only things i like about the glasstar and wish > they incorporated into the inland is the little drawer in the bottom, > and the long flexible splash gard. > > ---Mike Savad My touch top feature gave out, along with those of two customers. Another customer bought the Impulse and it made a very very loud grinding noise while grinding...she returned it. I have not had good luck selling the Inland grinder products. I'm also basing this on my review of all Inland products. Each new product that has come on the market, seems to be lacking in actual trial time, there are a lot of bugs still to be worked out. The twin spin attachment that I bought I think is a total wipeout. NOT WORTH IT. But silly me, bought each item the first few months they were out and since then Inland has added things to correct all the bugs I got in my original products. I have never had the first problem with ANY Glastar product. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 2 13:01:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vJnCD-0000nta; Sat, 2 Nov 96 13:01 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sat, 02 Nov 1996 16:00:41 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov2.11041.0> References: <<1996Nov2.102815.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joyce Moran wrote: > > > > > just courious but what broke on your inland? i've had mine for over 10 > > years, and it's still running strong. the only thing i had to replace > > was the grid. though the only things i like about the glasstar and wish > > they incorporated into the inland is the little drawer in the bottom, > > and the long flexible splash gard. > > > > ---Mike Savad > > My touch top feature gave out, along with those of two customers. > Another customer bought the Impulse and it made a very very loud > grinding noise while grinding...she returned it. I have not had good > luck selling the Inland grinder products. I'm also basing this on my > review of all Inland products. Each new product that has come on the > market, seems to be lacking in actual trial time, there are a lot of > bugs still to be worked out. The twin spin attachment that I bought I > think is a total wipeout. NOT WORTH IT. But silly me, bought each item > the first few months they were out and since then Inland has added > things to correct all the bugs I got in my original products. I have > never had the first problem with ANY Glastar product. > > Garden of Glass > Joyce Moran > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass intresting, i wonder if it has anything to do with the newer products, my grinders are pre touch top or resavoir removal. i do have a twin spin, works fine for me i wish it had better instructions though, i never used the touch top feature, don't need it. the only thing i don't like about the twin-spin is it throw water out at me. but the people there are nice, and when i called about some broken parts they sent me new ones free of charge (the ones you can't usassly buy, like a grid). ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 04:09:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vK1M7-0000xTa; Sun, 3 Nov 96 04:08 PST X-Path: ibm.net!mstreng From: Martin Streng To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Date Date: Sun, 03 Nov 1996 13:05:18 +0100 Message-ID: <1996Nov3.14518.0> References: <<2.2.16.19961101060935.192f2a58@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Crediet- en Effectenbank Precedence: bulk > > > For future reference..... when one lives in Europe > or is in the US Military services 11/4/96 is the Eleventh of April. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Barbara J. Snell > Jansen's Dining, Cornell University > 255-5960 > bjs10@cornell.edu > > ---- Thank you Barbara! I´m living in the Netherlands, Europe. From our per- spective Americans tend to look at the world as an outpost of the great U.S. of A. ;-) The word "international" often means "inter our states": IGGA? But don't let this bother you in any way: i'm enjoying your discussions very much and a lot of it apply's to our continent as well. For example: thanks to your comments i now know what soldering iron to buy. And allthough (is this English?) i sometimes think your discussions about health and safety are a little overdone (me driving a motorcycle through heavy traffic avery day seems to be more damaging) it did start me thinking about making some adjustments in my hobby-room. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 04:23:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vK1a9-0000dka; Sun, 3 Nov 96 04:23 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: First stitches Date: 03 Nov 96 07:22:09 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov3.12229.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > I have noticed that after working for years with stained glass, I hardly > notice the small cuts on my hands. >yeah generally that's what most people that's been doing stained glass >for while says. i don't care if i get cut, generally i don't even notice >it, until i see blood getting on the glass. My dad and I used to raise bees ... and the same attitude applied. Getting stung wasn't something one even *noticed anymore, but waiting for the sting was more of a bother. If a bee got under my clothing, I'd usually just press my hand against it to get the stinging thing over with. 'Course, it still bothered me that the poor bees commit suicide when they sting you their entire innards being connected to the stinger so that when they've attacked you, they afterwards die. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 07:43:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vK4hO-00011Ma; Sun, 3 Nov 96 07:42 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: mike peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sun, 3 Nov 1996 15:42:46 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov3.154246.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >My touch top feature gave out, along with those of two customers. >Another customer bought the Impulse and it made a very very loud >grinding noise while grinding...she returned it. I have not had good >luck selling the Inland grinder products. I'm also basing this on my >review of all Inland products. Each new product that has come on the >market, seems to be lacking in actual trial time, there are a lot of >bugs still to be worked out. The twin spin attachment that I bought I >think is a total wipeout. NOT WORTH IT. But silly me, bought each item >the first few months they were out and since then Inland has added >things to correct all the bugs I got in my original products. I have >never had the first problem with ANY Glastar product. > >Garden of Glass >Joyce Moran Joyce, I have used the large Wizard Deluxes in my studio for maybe 5-6 years and no problems, that's even with student abuse. I like the big Inland grinder because it is powerful, it's rugged, and it's cheaper than the Glastar. I run them for about a year, then sell them as used equipment and replace with new. Another local retailer called me about 6 months ago complaining about the Twin Spin and the Touch top models and asked if I had any returns with them. At that time, they where still so new on the market that I hadn't stocked them yet. But, I have seen Inland rush things through their R&D before so I began advising my customers to wait for a while, if they really wanted a "touch top" feature, try a foot switch. Since then, that local retailer has seen returns of almost all of the earlier Inland grinders he sold. While we're on Inland, I wonder if I could get your comments on their cutters? I put out several cutters for my classes and I encourage students to "try before they buy". One student was using the slim line with the clear acrylic handle and the handle just snapped in two. She wasn't putting any excess pressure that i could see. Later, I noticed that one of the pistol grip cutters was leaking oil like crazy ...... I found that the housing had started to split at the glued seam near the cutter head. One student bought a brass barreled Inland one night and opened it up to put some oil in it and couldn't get the top nut off. I finally got it off using pliers, but the threads were so burred that the nut wouldn't go back on. I use Toyo's and Fletcher's almost exclusively now and haven't had any problems with them. I guess the only product that Inland has that I recommend is their big grinder. I don't like their cutters and i don't like their soldering irons ...... breaker and running pliers seem to be OK, but Inland imports those anyway. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 09:51:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vK6h8-00013va; Sun, 3 Nov 96 09:50 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sun, 03 Nov 1996 12:49:51 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov3.74951.0> References: <<1996Nov3.154246.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk mike peck wrote: > > >My touch top feature gave out, along with those of two customers. > >Another customer bought the Impulse and it made a very very loud > >grinding noise while grinding...she returned it. I have not had good > >luck selling the Inland grinder products. I'm also basing this on my > >review of all Inland products. Each new product that has come on the > >market, seems to be lacking in actual trial time, there are a lot of > >bugs still to be worked out. The twin spin attachment that I bought I > >think is a total wipeout. NOT WORTH IT. But silly me, bought each item > >the first few months they were out and since then Inland has added > >things to correct all the bugs I got in my original products. I have > >never had the first problem with ANY Glastar product. > > > >Garden of Glass > >Joyce Moran > > Joyce, > > I have used the large Wizard Deluxes in my studio for maybe 5-6 years and no > problems, that's even with student abuse. I like the big Inland grinder > because it is powerful, it's rugged, and it's cheaper than the Glastar. I > run them for about a year, then sell them as used equipment and replace with > new. > > Another local retailer called me about 6 months ago complaining about the > Twin Spin and the Touch top models and asked if I had any returns with them. > At that time, they where still so new on the market that I hadn't stocked > them yet. But, I have seen Inland rush things through their R&D before so I > began advising my customers to wait for a while, if they really wanted a > "touch top" feature, try a foot switch. Since then, that local retailer has > seen returns of almost all of the earlier Inland grinders he sold. > > While we're on Inland, I wonder if I could get your comments on their > cutters? I put out several cutters for my classes and I encourage students > to "try before they buy". One student was using the slim line with the > clear acrylic handle and the handle just snapped in two. She wasn't putting > any excess pressure that i could see. Later, I noticed that one of the > pistol grip cutters was leaking oil like crazy ...... I found that the > housing had started to split at the glued seam near the cutter head. One > student bought a brass barreled Inland one night and opened it up to put > some oil in it and couldn't get the top nut off. I finally got it off using > pliers, but the threads were so burred that the nut wouldn't go back on. I > use Toyo's and Fletcher's almost exclusively now and haven't had any > problems with them. > > I guess the only product that Inland has that I recommend is their big > grinder. I don't like their cutters and i don't like their soldering irons > ...... breaker and running pliers seem to be OK, but Inland imports those > anyway. > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i did'nt know inland made glass cutters, i've had there irons, (big disapointment). i use and have always used, in one form or another, fletcher cutters, nothing else will do. i found toyo is expensive an leaks, (at least the pistol grip). and although i mentioned lots of times before i prefer large inland grinders. BTW what were the problems on the twinspin? since i have that grinder, i'm curious what i might have coming to me. also i know it's still new, and i'm not sure if it's released yet, but does anyone know if the bevel pro grinder works well? ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 15:37:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKC6c-00001Ca; Sun, 3 Nov 96 15:37 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGGA's international Date: 03 Nov 96 18:36:07 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov3.23367.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >The word "international" often means "inter our states": IGGA? While it's true that most of the IGGA's members are within the U.S., many members are not. And the *intention of the Guild is to be international; in other words, you don't have to be an American to join. Outside the U.S., currently there are members in Canada, England, France, Israel, Kenya, New Zealand, Republic of South Africa, Singapore, Switzerland, and the United Kingdom. We've been asked for model bylaws to set up local chapters of the Guild in India and in other countries, but so far, the only chapter currently set up outside the U.S. is in South Africa. Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 15:54:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKCMe-0000wJa; Sun, 3 Nov 96 15:54 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sun, 03 Nov 1996 18:51:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov3.135123.0> References: <<1996Nov3.154246.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > Joyce, > > I have used the large Wizard Deluxes in my studio for maybe 5-6 years and no > problems, that's even with student abuse. I like the big Inland grinder > because it is powerful, it's rugged, and it's cheaper than the Glastar. I > run them for about a year, then sell them as used equipment and replace with > new. > > Another local retailer called me about 6 months ago complaining about the > Twin Spin and the Touch top models and asked if I had any returns with them. > At that time, they where still so new on the market that I hadn't stocked > them yet. But, I have seen Inland rush things through their R&D before so I > began advising my customers to wait for a while, if they really wanted a > "touch top" feature, try a foot switch. Since then, that local retailer has > seen returns of almost all of the earlier Inland grinders he sold. > > While we're on Inland, I wonder if I could get your comments on their > cutters? I put out several cutters for my classes and I encourage students > to "try before they buy". One student was using the slim line with the > clear acrylic handle and the handle just snapped in two. She wasn't putting > any excess pressure that i could see. Later, I noticed that one of the > pistol grip cutters was leaking oil like crazy ...... I found that the > housing had started to split at the glued seam near the cutter head. One > student bought a brass barreled Inland one night and opened it up to put > some oil in it and couldn't get the top nut off. I finally got it off using > pliers, but the threads were so burred that the nut wouldn't go back on. I > use Toyo's and Fletcher's almost exclusively now and haven't had any > problems with them. > > I guess the only product that Inland has that I recommend is their big > grinder. I don't like their cutters and i don't like their soldering irons > ...... breaker and running pliers seem to be OK, but Inland imports those > anyway. > I do stock the Inland Running Pliers and grozers, the Inland Edgemaster Foiler, and the maroon Soldering Iron the 60008. I have had no problems with any of this equipment, but have not tried any other, so I wouldn't know the difference, and suppose my customers don't either. (Except that I have tried samples of the other new foiler that costs a bunch and didn't like the fact that it doesn't crimp the sides.) As for cutter's the only one I stock is Toyo's pistol grip, and do have problems with leakage sometimes. But I still like the way they handle for female students, and haven't found anything better. I tried one Fletcher sample with a fat cutting head, and couldn't stand the fatness of the head. I really think though, people like whatever they are most familiar with. It doesn't really matter who makes it, or how much it costs, or even the quality of the tool. So many of new stained glass people do it for 6 weeks and then drop out that quality doesn't matter in the least. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 16:02:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKCU6-0000bta; Sun, 3 Nov 96 16:01 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Sun, 03 Nov 1996 18:58:52 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov3.135852.0> References: <<1996Nov3.74951.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > i did'nt know inland made glass cutters, i've had there irons, (big > disapointment). i use and have always used, in one form or another, > fletcher cutters, nothing else will do. i found toyo is expensive an > leaks, (at least the pistol grip). and although i mentioned lots of > times before i prefer large inland grinders. BTW what were the problems > on the twinspin? since i have that grinder, i'm curious what i might > have coming to me. also i know it's still new, and i'm not sure if it's > released yet, but does anyone know if the bevel pro grinder works well? > > ---Mike Savad > On the Inland twin spin, the water reservoir was my biggest problem. If I shut it off completely, it leaked out. If I turned it on, it was way too much water. If I turned it on to a trickle, it still put out way too much water, if I filled the reservoir up, and then it emptied too soon. Because when I turned it off, it still leaked out. I finally came up with my own kind of drip system, but it was a major pain in the butt. Now I only drag it out for a piece that is completely straight lines, with no curves what so ever. Then I can put up with it. It sprays water all over the place and I have had to place extra towels on the front and sides of my machine, and wring them out every so often. It is not a pretty sight if you are trying to wait on customers inbetween grinding. From now on I really recommend to my customers to just buy the beveling bit, and to use a strip cutter for the straight lines. The twin spin is too much trouble. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 17:44:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKE5M-0000aWa; Sun, 3 Nov 96 17:44 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: safety Date: 03 Nov 96 20:43:19 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov4.14319.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Kristen wrote: > Do glass companies have MSDS for the glass that they produce. < Manufacturers or suppliers of any product with any potential for toxicity that is cut, ground, or treated in any way in which it can subsequenly get into the body must provide users that have employees with MSDSs by law (29 CFR 1012.1200). Glass, wood, solder, welding rods, metals that are machined or ground, grind wheels, compressed gasses, and so on--all must have MSDSs. > Some of the metals in glass are not good for you when they are in the dust > form grinding. < You bet. I personally have seen MSDSs for glass. Arsenic (whitish opaque), cadmium (yellow opaque), manganese (purple/brown clear), chrome (many greens and yellows), lead, and just about any toxic metal known can be found in colored glasses. > If they do do you know who I can contact for these MSDS sheets. < The manufacturer or importer is the responsible party. Also, anyone who puts their label on glass with their company's name and address on it becomes the manufacturer of record and is likewise responsible. > AS well, Elizabeth mentioned that you sent her MSDS sheets for glass > products. May I also have a copy these sheets. I will pay for copying > and snail mail. or if you can send the addresses where you received > these sheets from IO will contact them myself. < The manufacturer/importer usually supplies them free. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 3 18:51:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKF7f-0000i6a; Sun, 3 Nov 96 18:50 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: I live in England; where is UK?? Or is it the other way roun Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 03:20:45 +0000 Message-ID: <199611040248.CAA01292@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Martin (Streng)! Welcome aboard!!! Am delighted for another voice from Europe. Trust you have come across Greg from Poland (Are you still there Greg!!??) I am the poor "sucker" that started this "date discussion". (Why always ME...:-( ) I put my foot in it, forgetting that in USA they do some things back to front, got picked up on it, teased about it. They're a nice bunch and some of them will be over HERE (!!) in the next 6 months. You work in stained glass in the Netherlands...? Great, where do you get your get your glass? Germany? France? Belgium? Poland? Copperfoil or lead?? It is perfectly true what you say, that in USA Health & Safety issues are very much more of an issue than they are here in Europe But don't be fooled, these issues will hit us too like a bang. I don't know if you have been "lurking" for some time, before speaking up. If you have, then you will also realize that there are some real issues to be taken on board. This is particularly true in England (or is it UK - or is it Britain, or even Great Britain ?? Hey Albert, I dunno anymore where I live. I'm just a poor ole' little Viking refugee, slumming it on this strange little island... Where the hell AM I??) Yeah, I picked up Albert on the point of "International" some months ago (as in IGGA). Albert (bless his cotton socks) is working very hard on trying to make it, what I would call "International" ( I see that you agree with my definitions...). In the final analysis, I think it will take people like you, Greg and myself out there to speak up and MAKE it "International". When an English-as-a-mother-tongue- speaker calls something "International", I have long since learnt to be a little weary of what this actually entails. But this is a disadvantage you, Greg and myself as non-English-as-a-mother-tongue-speakers will always be up against. But let me tell you this, they're a really lovely bunch! They even occasionally forget that I am as "foreign" as they come. English to me is a "foreign" language. My life revolves around a) stained glass, b) communication and c) language (foreign or otherwhise...) Now and then, I get on my soap-box and pontificate about one or all of these subjects. Which reminds me: grinders: About 15-17 years ago I bought a Wizard deluxe . It grinds. That is what I want it to do. It still does it perfectly well. It doesn't make the coffee, nor does it make me my breakfast. And it certainly does not sing and dance. It was supplied with bits and pieces and attachements and accessories. I still have not quite worked out what they all do.. I have a few other manual and electrical grinding tools for various specific jobs. I try and cut glass in such a way that electrical grinding should be a safety aspect rather than adjusting for bad glass cutting.(I can hear the storm of protests rising already...)My Wizard still functions perfectly well and so I'll probably stick with it. I also use Toyo glass cutters of various sizes. They are the ones I have found most reliable. The smaller ones, (retailer described as "an ideal cutter for lady stained glass workers") snapped or cracked in the same way as already described by a number of postings. I had a metal-working student design and fit a metal sleeve onto my "teaching cutters" to prevent this happening. The very heavy duty Toyo cutter I myself use in my studio, I have used for about 5 years. I have replaced the cutting head once, but I am now finding that it is -very gently - beginning to bend.(the plastic bit). Some of my students are retired and take up stained glass purely as a hobby. Their hands are beginning to get a little bit stiff and occasionally arthritic. I have tried out the Toyo pistol grip cutter for possibly recommending to them. But I am not terribly impressed.The leaking problem has already been mentioned, to which I concur. Another problem I have found is that the head doesn't turn properly in the direction you want it to go and so your score-line becomes ragged and not a clean one. So you need to use your other fingers to guide the head. A bit of a trial if you have chosen that particular cutter because you have arthritis in your hands & fingers.... Soldering irons: I have to practice what I preach, which means that I have a whole collection of soldering irons, 90% by Weller. They are an excellent beginner's, hobbyist's iron .I also feel that they are a tool a professional need not be ashamed of. Again my very first Weller 75W electric iron that I bought about 20 years ago, is still alive and kicking and very much in use. I can't use gas irons in teaching (no facilities) and in my village we just didn't have gas until a few years ago. (Bottle gas: Health & safety, storage etc etc....) I have 1-2 very private, personal favorite irons. They never travel to class; they are rather special. They are powerful, real exquisite electric engineering and exceedingly light-weight (and expensive). They are also "no longer produced". Why does that always happen to the "dream tool"?? Shut up Elisabeth & go to bed.... 2.30 in the morning over here "Across the pond" (an hour earlier in the Netherlands....) Toby (The only one with at least one eye open...) ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 05:38:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKPE1-0000OXa; Mon, 4 Nov 96 05:38 PST X-Path: UCONNVM.UCONN.EDU!HCLADM02 From: mail To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: First stitches (fwd) Date: Mon, 04 Nov 96 08:33:09 EST Message-ID: <961104.083737.EST.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk May I second Monona's concern? Latex allergies are becoming a huge problem in medicine, not only for medical personnel, but for patients with frequent hospitalizations. We're not just talking uncomfortable rash here, but life-threatening anaphylactic shock. Do yourself a big favor and and try to limit your latex exposure. Dorothy Kalahan -- Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu ----------------------------Original message---------------------------- From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: First stitches Date: 02 Nov 96 07:59:26 EST > Try a product by American bandage. Also by others I am sure. It is a > gauze that is impregnated with natural rubber.< I'd rather it was impregnated with a synthetic considering the track record of natural rubber in the medical/dental industry in terms of serious allergies. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety Board IGGA 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2596 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 07:33:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKR1J-00011ra; Mon, 4 Nov 96 07:33 PST X-Path: Wittenberg.EDU!CUTLER From: CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU To: GLASS@BUNGI.COM Subject: lampbase sizes Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 10:32:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1996Nov4.63237.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: Bob Cutler I have nearly finished a 13in diameter/8 inch high lampshade and I am pondering the mysteries of which base height to use. Some time ago I think I recall seeing a note on this subject, but I have lost track of it. So is there a "rule of thumb" that one should follow in selecting bases for different diameter/height shades? Can anybody give me some suggestions about how to proceed? Thanks in advance for any help :) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 08:19:12 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKRjd-00016Aa; Mon, 4 Nov 96 08:18 PST X-Path: gjr From: gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Mon, 4 Nov 1996 08:18:42 PST Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk [In the message entitled "lampbase sizes" on Nov 4, 10:32, CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU writes:] > From: Bob Cutler > I have nearly finished a 13in diameter/8 inch high lampshade and I am pondering > the mysteries of which base height to use. Some time ago I think I recall > seeing a note on this subject, but I have lost track of it. > So is there a "rule of thumb" that one should follow in selecting bases for > different diameter/height shades? Can anybody give me some suggestions > about how to proceed? Thanks in advance for any help :) I think I recall my teacher saying to measure across the bottom of the shade. That number being about the height of the lamp base. Should look proportional. Hope this helps. -- Glenna Rand gjr@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 08:43:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKS6p-000129a; Mon, 4 Nov 96 08:42 PST X-Path: newtech.net!frogfoot From: FEFranks To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: First stitches Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 11:41:45 +0000 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19961104114145.0067a840@POP3.newtech.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 05:45 PM 10/30/96 -0500, you wrote: >mail wrote: >> >> I have noticed that after working for years with stained glass, I hardly >> notice the small cuts on my hands. I just try to keep the blood off >> stuff and keep the cut clean. There is no such thing as too much >> Neosporin and too many bandages! (NEVER had an infection, BTW. >> Now I knock on wood.) >> >> -- >> Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 >> UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 >> HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu >> ---- >> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >> To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > >yeah generally that's what most people that's been doing stained glass >for while says. i don't care if i get cut, generally i don't even notice >it, until i see blood getting on the glass. i only hate it when i get >blood on the pattern or the foil. personnaly i can't wear bandaids on >any of my fingers, no grip. i just let it bleed out, unless of course >it's a real bleeder, then it'll take a bit longer. usally the main >places i get cut is my pushing thumb (for grining), or the pointer >finger of my left hand, when breaking glass. and of course the little >"fun" bits that are around. > >---Mike Savad > >-- >Mike's Stained Glass >http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > As a nurse it is important for to avoid small cuts on my hands. It is not a good idea to give all those nasty little viruses an entry point into my body. Borrowing from my specialty, orthopedic surgery, I began to wear rubber gloves while cutting and grinding. I found that Playtex cleaning gloves work well. It is important that they fit tight to your fingertips so buy a pair that fit tight. They will stretch after awhile giving a nice fit. They last awhile and are easy to put back on if you place alittle powder in them when putting them back on. I have not had a cut on my hands in quite some time and the rubber helps with my grip while breaking and grinding also. Hope this helps. Remember-safety first!! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 10:12:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKTUu-0001C6a; Mon, 4 Nov 96 10:11 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: grinders, M.Savad Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 13:07:30 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.13730.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk Mike, we have using the Glastar superstar and have no problems, also DTI makes some good grinders. Have a good day ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 14:17:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKXKV-0000lOa; Mon, 4 Nov 96 14:17 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!arthurs.and.willis From: Joseph Arthurs To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: First stitches Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 17:18:19 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov4.91819.0> References: <<1.5.4.32.19961104114145.0067a840@POP3.newtech.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, I've been reading the comments on gloves and have decided to unlurk. I'm an environmental engineer by day and hobbyist by night. Part of the environmental duties involves spills response training. We use disposable acrylonitrile gloves for the spills when we're dealing with an unknown because of their resistance to most chemicals. I decided to take a pair home with me to try for soldering. They worked great! The size small fits my hands snugly and I have no loose glove material to interfere. There was no loss of tactile ability. It allows me to enjoy soldering once again, before using gloves any contact with the flux would cause me to burn and itch (I may be sensitizing). The acrylonitrile gloves have the advantage of not being made of latex and they can be used again and again. A box of 100 costs me approximately $25 Cdn and I buy them at one of the local safety supply stores. I see that we've got an industrial hygienist on this list. Any objections to acrylonitrile? Sometimes things are too good to be true and perhaps this is so with these gloves? Thanks much, Sandy Willis ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 15:24:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKYNM-000178a; Mon, 4 Nov 96 15:24 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Beginning hobbyist needs a glass grinder recommendation Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 18:23:11 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov4.132311.0> References: <<1996Nov3.135852.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joyce Moran wrote: > > > > > i did'nt know inland made glass cutters, i've had there irons, (big > > disapointment). i use and have always used, in one form or another, > > fletcher cutters, nothing else will do. i found toyo is expensive an > > leaks, (at least the pistol grip). and although i mentioned lots of > > times before i prefer large inland grinders. BTW what were the problems > > on the twinspin? since i have that grinder, i'm curious what i might > > have coming to me. also i know it's still new, and i'm not sure if it's > > released yet, but does anyone know if the bevel pro grinder works well? > > > > ---Mike Savad > > > > On the Inland twin spin, the water reservoir was my biggest problem. If > I shut it off completely, it leaked out. If I turned it on, it was way > too much water. If I turned it on to a trickle, it still put out way > too much water, if I filled the reservoir up, and then it emptied too > soon. Because when I turned it off, it still leaked out. I finally > came up with my own kind of drip system, but it was a major pain in the > butt. Now I only drag it out for a piece that is completely straight > lines, with no curves what so ever. Then I can put up with it. It > sprays water all over the place and I have had to place extra towels on > the front and sides of my machine, and wring them out every so often. > It is not a pretty sight if you are trying to wait on customers > inbetween grinding. From now on I really recommend to my customers to > just buy the beveling bit, and to use a strip cutter for the straight > lines. The twin spin is too much trouble. > > Garden of Glass > Joyce Moran > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass the way i solved the problem with the drippage is this, i tapped into my water pipe, and now have a continous drip feed. of course this makes even more soaked, but every new toy has it's problems. :) ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 15:28:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKYRM-0001Bua; Mon, 4 Nov 96 15:28 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 18:27:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov4.132723.0> References: <<1996Nov4.63237.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU wrote: > > From: Bob Cutler > I have nearly finished a 13in diameter/8 inch high lampshade and I am pondering > the mysteries of which base height to use. Some time ago I think I recall > seeing a note on this subject, but I have lost track of it. > So is there a "rule of thumb" that one should follow in selecting bases for > different diameter/height shades? Can anybody give me some suggestions > about how to proceed? Thanks in advance for any help :) > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass welp, the base diameter should be about half or a little larger then the diameter of the shade. the height depends on how tall the shade is and how high you want it to be. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 4 19:31:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKcCx-0000aza; Mon, 4 Nov 96 19:29 PST X-Path: Wittenberg.EDU!CUTLER From: CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 22:29:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1996Nov4.182940.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: Cutler on lampbase altitudes. OK, a base bottom should be 71/2 inches in diameter or thereabouts. The height of the shade is 8 inches. How high do I want the bse to be? High enough but not too high are rather general boundaries. And since these things are a bit of money I would like to avoid buying one that doesn't get it. :) Perhaps some clarification would help me figure things out. The harp altitude is another issue related to my original question. I'm still puzzled. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 04:04:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKkEb-0001E9a; Tue, 5 Nov 96 04:04 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 07:01:12 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.2112.0> References: <<1996Nov4.182940.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU wrote: > > From: Cutler on lampbase altitudes. > OK, a base bottom should be 71/2 inches in diameter or thereabouts. > The height of the shade is 8 inches. How high do I want > the bse to be? High enough but not too high are rather general > boundaries. And since these things are a bit of money I would like > to avoid buying one that doesn't get it. :) Perhaps some clarification > would help me figure things out. The harp altitude is another > issue related to my original question. I'm still puzzled. > ---- I usually tell my students to finish the lamp shade first, then try it on several lamp bases. We have special ordered ones that were suggested to go with certain lamp shades and when they arrived, just thought the proportion was not quite right. It all depends on the proportion of the lamp shade itself, if it is tall and skinny, or short and fat. Lots of times I can make a lampbase work, that doesnt in the beginning by changing the harp size, or adding risers to the top. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 06:47:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKmmJ-000197a; Tue, 5 Nov 96 06:46 PST X-Path: mail.smu.edu!gshultz From: gshultz@mail.smu.edu (Gary Shultz) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 08:46:07 -0600 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Very generally speaking, I have liked the "look" the best when the base is about half the width of the bottom of the shade and the heighth of the based -- from the top of the harp to the bottom of the base -- is about twice the height of the shade. =Gary >From: Cutler on lampbase altitudes. >OK, a base bottom should be 71/2 inches in diameter or thereabouts. >The height of the shade is 8 inches. How high do I want >the bse to be? High enough but not too high are rather general >boundaries. And since these things are a bit of money I would like >to avoid buying one that doesn't get it. :) Perhaps some clarification >would help me figure things out. The harp altitude is another >issue related to my original question. I'm still puzzled. >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ~(~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~)~ ~~~) Gary Shultz - SMU News and Information (~~~ ~~~~~( Tele. 214-768-7665 Fax: 214-768-7663 )~~~~~ ~~~~~~~) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~(~~~~~~~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 07:17:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKnFA-00016Aa; Tue, 5 Nov 96 07:16 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: lampbase sizes Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 10:15:40 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.51540.0> References: <<1996Nov4.182940.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU wrote: > > From: Cutler on lampbase altitudes. > OK, a base bottom should be 71/2 inches in diameter or thereabouts. > The height of the shade is 8 inches. How high do I want > the bse to be? High enough but not too high are rather general > boundaries. And since these things are a bit of money I would like > to avoid buying one that doesn't get it. :) Perhaps some clarification > would help me figure things out. The harp altitude is another > issue related to my original question. I'm still puzzled. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ok the base diameter should be around 4" the height depends on what kind of base you get, some come with a built in harp so dont. the height of the base from bottom to tippy top (including harp, if there is one), should be around 16-18" total. this way you'll have the 8 or so inches for the harp (providing the cap you use is'nt to deep), and about 8 or so inches that will be exposed on the bottom. then you'll have to decide how much of the base you really want to see, if the designed part goes to the edge of the lamp, or if it should be hidden a little bit. when i built my table lamp, i did'nt want to spend the high prices of the bases, so i made my own glass base. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 08:57:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKoo8-0000jaa; Tue, 5 Nov 96 08:57 PST X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: Shirley Suter To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Lampbase Sizes Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 10:50:12 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.45012.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service & Suter's Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Hey, Hey Cutler and gang! Here is my scientific, high-tech approach to selecting the perfect lampbase for those extra special stained glass shades: Find someone that has a really fat life insurance policy (with you as benefactor) and ask him/her to hold the lampshade above the table where you will wish it to eventually sit. Using your mind's eye (the one that sees dreams), envision the "invisible" base below the shade. When you see the shade at the perfect height above the table, measure from the lower edge of the shade to the tabletop. This will give you the darned near perfect base height. Now, let's discuss the harp size. This, in my opinion, is the most important measurement. No one wants to look at a beautiful lamp and see "lamp guts" spilling from the bottom of the shade. My suggestion for an 8" tall shade is to use a 7" harp. As you can probably tell by now, lampbase height selection is a matter of personal taste. I have made shades using the exact same mold size to make table lamps and floor lamps with equally satisfying results. Might I also suggest that you set aside a few bucks for a perfect finial to top off that perfect lamp. Nothing worse than seeing a beautiful creation topped by a crappy finial. Reminds me of a lady wearing an expensive cocktail dress with flip-flops....ACK!!! Have a day!!! Shirley Suter Grapeland, Tx. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 11:42:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKrNy-0000zYa; Tue, 5 Nov 96 11:42 PST X-Path: ucdavis.edu!krmcdonald From: krmcdonald@ucdavis.edu (Kathe R. McDonald) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Easter Visit to Chartres in France - UPDATE Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 11:42:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <199611051942.LAA24151@peseta.ucdavis.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi. I'm trying to change my ticket but am a bit confused about when you are all leaving UK. 4-5 days before April 2? Does that mean March 28? Kathe R. McDonald Office of Curricular Support "Aint no time to hate." J. Garcia 1995 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 13:17:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKsq7-0001Cna; Tue, 5 Nov 96 13:15 PST X-Path: atl.mindspring.com!cavu7 From: nancy lynberg To: glass@bungi.com Subject: tips for warming glass Date: Mon, 04 Nov 1996 15:48:36 -0500 Message-ID: <199611052113.QAA20753@itchy.mindspring.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 15:07:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKuaf-00015Wa; Tue, 5 Nov 96 15:07 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 17:28:30 -0500 Message-ID: <327FBF8E.116D@mars.superlink.net> References: <<199611052113.QAA20753@itchy.mindspring.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk nancy lynberg wrote: > > now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can > anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier > cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i suppose you can heat up the garage with a space heater (the electric kind, so you don't affixiate yourself with a kerosene one). or you can get a large heating tray and place your glass on that before cutting, that's realted to the hint too warm the glass prior to foiling. you can fill a large tub with hot (tap-hot) water and put the glass in that. you can keep the colors your going to use in the warm part of the house, then bring them out before you need them. though the best thng to do is to set up an inside shop if you can like in the basement, if you have one. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 15:43:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKv9G-00010Ga; Tue, 5 Nov 96 15:43 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: First stitches Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 18:48:02 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.10482.0> References: <<1996Nov4.91819.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Joseph Arthurs wrote: > > Hi, > Cdn and I buy them at one of the local safety supply stores. I see that we've got an industrial hygienist on this list. Any objections to acrylonitrile? Sometimes things are too good to be true and perhaps this is so with these gloves? > Sandy Willis > Hi, Where or what address to get gloves? April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 15:54:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKvJi-00013la; Tue, 5 Nov 96 15:54 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Fume trap Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 18:57:39 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.105739.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Hi Monona and all, Inland 5" x 6d" x 5"h fume trap with charcoal filter. #6006 replacement cartridges. Not much else to say about it exceptit's not worth it. I liked Steve S.'s kitchen hood exhaust idea. I can easily remove one 8x8 section in the window for outside venting. April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 16:17:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKvfV-0000jKa; Tue, 5 Nov 96 16:16 PST X-Path: macnet.com!jhendershott From: "J. Hendershott" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 16:19:26 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.81926.0> References: <<327FBF8E.116D@mars.superlink.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > nancy lynberg wrote: > > > > now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can > > anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier > > cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks Nancy The easiest way I've found is to use a hair dryer just before you are ready to cut. I sometimes warm a tricky piece of glass even in my warm studio. Try to warm it evenly if your working on a large piece. Janie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 17:55:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKxCN-0000x1a; Tue, 5 Nov 96 17:54 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Fume trap Date: Tue, 05 Nov 1996 20:48:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov5.154832.0> References: <<1996Nov5.105739.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk April Paine wrote: > > Hi Monona and all, > > Inland 5" x 6d" x 5"h fume trap with charcoal filter. #6006 replacement > cartridges. Not much else to say about it exceptit's not worth it. I > liked Steve S.'s kitchen hood exhaust idea. I can easily remove one 8x8 > section in the window for outside venting. April > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass yeah i have to agree with the inland fume trap, i have one does'nt work at all well, i probably should have gotten the hakko. although the hood idea should work really well, the only draw back i see is that it draws the fume upward towards your face. unless of course the hood is a bit away from you. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 17:55:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKxCN-0000hra; Tue, 5 Nov 96 17:54 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Lampbase Sizes Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 02:23:26 +0000 Message-ID: <199611060150.BAA22825@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk those extra special stained glass shades: Find someone that has a really fat life insurance policy (with you as benefactor) . Using your mind's eye (the one that sees dreams), envision the "invisible" base below the shade. When you see the shade at the perfect height above the table, measure from the lower edge of the shade to the tabletop. This will give you the darned near perfect base height. Now, let's discuss the harp size. This, in my opinion, is the most important measurement. No one wants to look at a beautiful lamp and see "lamp guts" spilling from the bottom of the shade. My suggestion for an 8" tall shade is to use a 7" harp. . Nothing worse than seeing a beautiful creation topped by a crappy finial. Reminds me of a lady wearing an expensive cocktail dress with flip-flops....ACK!!! Have a day!!! Shirley Suter Yep, that about sums it up Shirley! That's about my own carefully researched and scientific approach also, on the few rare occasions I attempt a lamp (or teach how to make them). Eloquently put!! Good on You! Why just have a day - have a ball!! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 17:56:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKxDX-000042a; Tue, 5 Nov 96 17:55 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Easter Visit to Chartres in France - UPDATE Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 02:23:26 +0000 Message-ID: <199611060150.BAA22831@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: krmcdonald@ucdavis.edu (Kathe R. McDonald) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Easter Visit to Chartres in France - UPDATE Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 11:42:00 -0800 (PST) Reply-to: glass@bungi.com Hi. I'm trying to change my ticket but am a bit confused about when you are all leaving UK. 4-5 days before April 2? Does that mean March 28? Kathe R. McDonald Office of Curricular Support "Aint no time to hate." J. Garcia 1995 Hi Kathe, Hope to dispel confusion; UK Party is leaving UK morning on Wednesday 2nd April ( exact time yet to be determined) for France; arrival Calais in France around noon on Wed. 2nd; arrival Chartres early/ mid evening Wednesday 2nd April; Staying over-night Chartres: Wednesday 2nd, Thursday 3rd, Friday 4th April; Travel back to UK on Saturday 5th April; arrival back at departure point in UK early/late evening Ssaturaday 5th April; transfer of all non-UK visitors to over-night accommodation. >From Sunday 6th April fun in UK can start (if we hadn't already painted the town red BEFORE 2nd April...).... So far there are about 3-4 of of you from Glass@Bungi either saving up or having already paid your tickets.....It is quite a financial commitment you are doing. We are initially concentrating on saving YOUR pennies by accommodating you here locally (about 40 miles north of London), hopefully for nothing other than the pleasure of having you with us, but at worst at local bed and breakfast accommodation, with at least a guarantee of a decent home-cooked Swedish meal..... and a lift into London...... and/or whatever else. You are not coming into a 5-Star Hilton International Hotel Chain here, but a regional, village and family ambience . If you can get here, we will do our best to look after you, keep you safe, happy and healthy and make sure you don't spend a penny more than you have to. Travelling is an expensive business - I should know - I have spent 35 years doing nothing else... Each and every one of you, who would like to come over, but have specific questions or problems, do feel free to e-mail me privately and ask. What have you got to loose. .... Lee Boe of "Rain-Boe Creations" has already contacted me to let me know that she has details of cheap air-fares from USA to Europe & UK. You will need to set aside approx. UK Sterling 150.oo for transport from UK to Chartres, accommodation there for 3 nights,, breakfasts and transport back to the UK. We in UK normally pay UK Sterling 90 approx just for a return flight to Paris with nothing else - just the flight.. Whoever can make it, we sure as hell are going to have a ball.... Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 5 19:18:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vKyVX-00012ia; Tue, 5 Nov 96 19:18 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Food Bowl Date: Tue, 5 Nov 1996 22:17:56 -0500 Message-ID: <199611060317.WAA18509@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I've just decided to make a stained glass strawberry bowl (from "Stained Glass Gifts" by Judy Miller, pub. Hidden House Publications, 1982) for a friend for Christmas. I plan to solder it with lead-free solder but am in a quandry as to what, if anything, to do about colouring the solder and protecting it. My questions are: 1. Is there any special technique to soldering with lead-free material (ie. higher or lower iron temp., different flux etc.)? 2. Is lead-free solder safe to use in a bowl that will hold fruit and such things (rather than runny liquids) 3. Can I use any kind of patination on the solder or am I just cancelling out the safety of using lead-free solder? 4. Whether I patinate or leave the solder lines silver, can I spray or brush them with some kind of laquer, varethane, or shellac? I guess most of my questions are directed to Monona, but if anyone else has any comments, I'd appreciate them. Jennifer ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 02:04:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL4q4-00019Ba; Wed, 6 Nov 96 02:04 PST X-Path: juno.com!jroey From: jroey@juno.com (Jerri M Roey) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 02:23:23 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov6.72323.0> References: <<199611052113.QAA20753@itchy.mindspring.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, My shop area is over the garage and it gets pretty cold up here. I bring the electric space heater up and warm up my glass in front of it. This idea just hit me last week when I pulled out the heater to place in the bathroom. (I'm a real sissy about showering in a COLD bathroom.) It worked great. Jerri On Mon, 04 Nov 1996 15:48:36 -0500 nancy lynberg writes: >now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, >can >anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate >easier >cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 06:12:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL8iJ-0001Eha; Wed, 6 Nov 96 06:12 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 6 Nov 96 09:05:57 -0500 Message-ID: <9611060905.AA00530@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<327FBF8E.116D@mars.superlink.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can > anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier > cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks Is cold glass really that much harder to cut than warm? Maybe I don't have enough experience to know the difference. During cold times of year my glass is probably around 50 F; this gives me no trouble. Never tried to cut glass colder than this, though. -- David C ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 06:28:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL8xJ-0001E2a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 06:27 PST X-Path: mail.smu.edu!gshultz From: gshultz@mail.smu.edu (Gary Shultz) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 08:26:57 -0600 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >nancy lynberg wrote: >> >> now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can >> anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier >> cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks >> I have a light table that uses incandescent bulbs instead of florescent and, as you might expect, the surface stays fairly warm. When I used to work in my garage, it was great for keeping my glass -- and my coffee or tea -- warm. Such a light table is fairly easy to make. Let me know if you want details on how to make one. =Gary ~(~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~)~ ~~~) Gary Shultz - SMU News and Information (~~~ ~~~~~( Tele. 214-768-7665 Fax: 214-768-7663 )~~~~~ ~~~~~~~) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~(~~~~~~~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 06:53:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL9Le-0000uxa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 06:52 PST X-Path: memach.com!lcbell From: Linda Campbell To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: RE: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 09:54:17 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.45417.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Gary, I'm sure interested in how you made your light table. Please post particulars. Thanks, Linda I have a light table that uses incandescent bulbs instead of florescent and, as you might expect, the surface stays fairly warm. When I used to work in my garage, it was great for keeping my glass -- and my coffee or tea -- warm. Such a light table is fairly easy to make. Let me know if you want details on how to make one. =Gary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 07:08:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL9aD-0000q0a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 07:08 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 10:06:52 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.5652.0> References: <<199611060317.WAA18509@smtp1.sympatico.ca>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk H. Taylor Buckner wrote: > > I've just decided to make a stained glass strawberry bowl (from > "Stained Glass Gifts" by Judy Miller, pub. Hidden House Publications, 1982) > for a friend for Christmas. I plan to solder it with lead-free solder but > am in a quandry as to what, if anything, to do about colouring the solder > and protecting it. My questions are: > 1. Is there any special technique to soldering with lead-free > material (ie. higher or lower iron temp., different flux etc.)? > 2. Is lead-free solder safe to use in a bowl that will hold fruit > and such things (rather than runny liquids) > 3. Can I use any kind of patination on the solder or am I just > cancelling out the safety of using lead-free solder? > 4. Whether I patinate or leave the solder lines silver, can I spray > or brush them with some kind of laquer, varethane, or shellac? > I guess most of my questions are directed to Monona, but if anyone > else has any comments, I'd appreciate them. Jennifer > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well i would'nt trust lead free solder for direct food contact. if you use opaque glass you could probably get away with spraying the inside with polyurethane. but probably the safest thing to do is, is to get a cheap glass bowl, and put stained glass around it, and still solder it with lead free. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 07:11:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vL9dD-0000RBa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 07:11 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 10:10:04 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.5104.0> References: <<9611060905.AA00530@LL.MIT.EDU>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David Cogen wrote: > > > now that winter is rapidly on the way, and my shop is in the garage, can > > anyone give any tips on keeping the glass warm so as to facilitate easier > > cutting? any and all ideas are most appreciated. thanks > > Is cold glass really that much harder to cut than warm? Maybe I don't have > enough experience to know the difference. During cold times of year my glass is > probably around 50 F; this gives me no trouble. Never tried to cut glass colder > than this, though. > > -- David C > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass basically i find it does'nt make a 'big' difference if it's hot or cold. though being cold tends to make it a little more brittle, like if you freeze taffy, it could shatter if you drop it, but when it's warm it's pliable. must be the structure of the glass or something. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 07:52:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLAGR-0001I8a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 07:51 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Wed, 6 Nov 96 10:47:52 -0500 Message-ID: <9611061047.AA06386@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<1996Nov6.5652.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > well i would'nt trust lead free solder for direct food contact. if you > use opaque glass you could probably get away with spraying the inside > with polyurethane. but probably the safest thing to do is, is to get a > cheap glass bowl, and put stained glass around it, and still solder it > with lead free. Why not? It's used in plumbing, isn't it? Of course, there's just water running through the pipes, not potentially acidic food. I personally would not hesitate using such a bowl myself, but might have reservations selling it. -- David C. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 08:14:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLAc3-00010ia; Wed, 6 Nov 96 08:13 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 11:12:56 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.61256.0> References: <<9611061047.AA06386@LL.MIT.EDU>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David Cogen wrote: > > > well i would'nt trust lead free solder for direct food contact. if you > > use opaque glass you could probably get away with spraying the inside > > with polyurethane. but probably the safest thing to do is, is to get a > > cheap glass bowl, and put stained glass around it, and still solder it > > with lead free. > > Why not? It's used in plumbing, isn't it? Of course, there's just water running > through the pipes, not potentially acidic food. > > I personally would not hesitate using such a bowl myself, but might have > reservations selling it. > > -- David C. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass plumbing solder is 95/5 which makes it a little pasty (i think) to work with, plus in older homes, though it was 50-50 there is'nt as much contact as there would be with fruit. if it were candy i'd probably say go for it, but fruit, acidic, etc. there could be lead leached out. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 08:18:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLAgW-0000IWa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 08:18 PST X-Path: pcmail.uni-trier.de!schumachera From: schumachera@pcmail.uni-trier.de To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 12:21:45 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.42145.0> References: <<1996Nov6.5104.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > though being cold tends to make it a little more brittle, like if you > freeze taffy, it could shatter if you drop it, but when it's warm it's > pliable. must be the structure of the glass or something. Mike's right, Remember that glass is a super cooled liquid. In one of my chem. classes we were discussing Non-Newtonian liquids, taffy and glass were both mentioned. A non-Newtonian liquid flows when slowly pulled, but breaks if pulled apart quickly, but they never cristalize. The difference between the taffy and glass is their melting points. But just as taffy pulls much easier when heated, glass does the same thing. Besides a taffy pull there was another experiment we did in school to show the properties of non-Newton fluids. mix water with corn starch until the corn starch is just fully wet (don't over do the HOH or it won't work correctly). Then play with it. It will form into a ball, but if you let it go in your hands it oozes through you fingers. If you pull it slowly it stretches, but it you pull it fast it breaks. Have fun, -- [ Kristen ] [ wrightk5@pilot.msu.edu ] [ ] [ I speak for my self and only represent everything that I am. ] ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 10:24:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLCeA-0000vca; Wed, 6 Nov 96 10:24 PST X-Path: voyager.net!delphigl From: delphigl@voyager.net (Delphi Stained Glass) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 13:23:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199611061823.NAA21353@vixa.voyager.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David, >Why not? It's used in plumbing, isn't it? Of course, there's just water running >through the pipes, not potentially acidic food. > >I personally would not hesitate using such a bowl myself, but might have >reservations selling it. The point behind lead-free solder is that it doesn't contain lead, but this doesn't guarantee the metal composition of the solder. I would hate to think that it may contain arsenic. Stephanie ______________________________________________________________________ Stephanie Braman ** E-mail: delphigl@voyager.net Delphi Stained Glass ** WWW: http://www.voyager.net/delphiglass 2116 E. Michigan Ave. ** Voice: 1-800-248-2048 (USA,Canada) Lansing, MI 48912 ** 1-517-482-2617 (International) USA ** Fax: 1-800-748-0374 (USA,Canada) 1-517-482-4028 (International) _____________________________________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 10:52:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLD4z-00015ha; Wed, 6 Nov 96 10:52 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl, and: Is there 3-D lead came? Date: Wed, 6 Nov 96 13:47:33 -0500 Message-ID: <9611061347.AA15597@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<199611061823.NAA21353@vixa.voyager.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > The point behind lead-free solder is that it doesn't contain lead, but this > doesn't guarantee the metal composition of the solder. I would hate to > think that it may contain arsenic. The main ingredients are tin and antimony, I believe. I wonder how long before the realize that antimony is just as toxic as lead? Other question: Does anyone make a lead came with a cross section like this: ---------- | | ----- | | | | | | or like this: --------------- ----- ----- | | | | | | or like this: | | | | | | ----- ----- ----- ----- | | | | | | It seems that these would be nice for making 3 dimensional glass objects -- at least if they were composed of right angles. -- David C. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 11:38:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLDno-00010Ya; Wed, 6 Nov 96 11:38 PST X-Path: smtplink.dis.anl.gov!lernerk From: "Ken Lerner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re[2]: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 96 13:30:56 CST Message-ID: <9610068473.AA847316375@smtplink.dis.anl.gov> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Its the chemistry angle that makes me skeptical: Given that the glass doesn't actually soften until it reaches a much much higher temperature, why should a few degrees one way or the other make a difference? In other words, the difference between 50 degrees and 75 degrees is significant for us people (fahrenheit, sorry, rest of the world) but it seems to me it shouldn't be too significant for the glass, since it doesn't actually soften until -- maybe 2000 degrees? Is there any rigorous research on this? ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Author: glass@bungi.com at SMTPLINK-EID Date: 11/6/96 11:09 AM > though being cold tends to make it a little more brittle, like if you > freeze taffy, it could shatter if you drop it, but when it's warm it's > pliable. must be the structure of the glass or something. Mike's right, Remember that glass is a super cooled liquid. In one of my chem. classes we were discussing Non-Newtonian liquids, taffy and glass were both mentioned. A non-Newtonian liquid flows when slowly pulled, but breaks if pulled apart quickly, but they never cristalize. The difference between the taffy and glass is their melting points. But just as taffy pulls much easier when heated, glass does the same thing. Besides a taffy pull there was another experiment we did in school to show the properties of non-Newton fluids. mix water with corn starch until the corn starch is just fully wet (don't over do the HOH or it won't work correctly). Then play with it. It will form into a ball, but if you let it go in your hands it oozes through you fingers. If you pull it slowly it stretches, but it you pull it fast it breaks. Have fun, -- [ Kristen ] [ wrightk5@pilot.msu.edu ] [ ] [ I speak for my self and only represent everything that I am. ] ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 13:37:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLFf5-0000pUa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 13:37 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!arthurs.and.willis From: Joseph Arthurs To: glass@bungi.com Subject: acrylonitrile gloves Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 16:38:31 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.83831.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi April, I don't know whether it's because I live in an industrial town (home of GM Canada) or whether all towns have safety stores. I went into the Yellow Pages of the phone book and looked up Safety Equipment. That's where I found the local equipment suppliers. A couple of them didn't stock the gloves but were quite willing to order them for me. There are many other suppliers out there and it may be cheaper to buy from a mail order company but by the time I pay duties, shipping, etc. I find it easier to go local. For Canadian sources and some American, check out: http://www.hazmatmag.com/guide/P034.HTML which has a list of Canadian and American suppliers of safety equipment and clothes. You might ask if they will send you a sample of their glove sizes. These tend to run really snug. Some people like that and other's don't. I know Levitt-Safety and Lab Safety both carry these gloves. Ask for the disposable, light blue nitrile gloves and they should understand what you're talking about. For Monona, I should have been more clear, we use two pairs of these under a much more rugged and impermeable glove when we're doing Class A spills training (so far no actual Class A spills, knock on wood). Hope this helps. I will continue to use these for now. Sandy ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 14:44:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLGhp-0001Eza; Wed, 6 Nov 96 14:44 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re[2]: tips for warming Date: 06 Nov 96 17:43:02 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov6.22432.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >world) but it seems to me it shouldn't be too significant for the > glass, since it doesn't actually soften until -- maybe 2000 degrees? >Is there any rigorous research on this? Well, it *starts to soften about about 1100, depending on its forumla. Some glass will flow at 700 or so, but we're not talking about *that kind of glass, and some won't soften until around 2800-3000, but we're not talking about that kind of glass, either. The glass we use will be pretty soft at 1400. At 2000 it'll be like honey in a jar. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 14:44:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLGhq-0001Epa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 14:44 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: 06 Nov 96 17:42:52 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov6.224252.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Why not? It's used in plumbing, isn't it? Of course, there's just water >running through the pipes, not potentially acidic food. It used to be that lead was used, but not any more, methinks, not legally. Besides, water's the "universal solvent," which is to say it'll dissolve anything (eventually). The collapse of the Roman Empire has been blamed on water-borne lead, since they used lead *pipes. >I personally would not hesitate using such a bowl myself, but might have >reservations selling it. You'd have some enormous liability problems, too. Imagine if the customer got sick and the illness was traced to the lead in the bowl. Any lawyer'd have a field day. Why not make the bowl and solder to the bottom a plate that reads, "For decorative use only. Do not use for food." Then arrange a nice still life of wax fruit. Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 14:44:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLGho-00019Ea; Wed, 6 Nov 96 14:44 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: warming glass Date: 06 Nov 96 17:42:53 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov6.224253.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >basically i find it does'nt make a 'big' difference if it's hot or cold. Absolutely right, Mike. Whether the glass is below freezing or over 100 degrees, its cuttability isn't affected. In fact, the warmer the glass, the worse the cuttability, as you say. Now if the studio's cold, working with warmed-up glass would certainly be a lot more *comfortable! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 15:14:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLHAr-00016za; Wed, 6 Nov 96 15:14 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 18:13:15 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.131315.0> References: <<9610068473.AA847316375@smtplink.dis.anl.gov>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Ken Lerner wrote: > > Its the chemistry angle that makes me skeptical: Given that the glass > doesn't actually soften until it reaches a much much higher > temperature, why should a few degrees one way or the other make a > difference? In other words, the difference between 50 degrees and 75 > degrees is significant for us people (fahrenheit, sorry, rest of the > world) but it seems to me it shouldn't be too significant for the > glass, since it doesn't actually soften until -- maybe 2000 degrees? > Is there any rigorous research on this? i don't know about rigorous, but warmer glass just works better. i guess it's just the crystaline values of the glass. though if i heated the glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair of scissors. :) now in human terms (i'm assuming most of you are,those of you reading this), i would rather go out side on a day of 50 degree's then one of 25, and i guess glass is the same way, but when you compare it to 1000 or more, it seems small. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 15:21:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLHH1-00017xa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 15:20 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: warming glass Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 18:19:38 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.131938.0> References: <<1996Nov6.224253.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >basically i find it does'nt make a 'big' difference if it's hot or cold. > > Absolutely right, Mike. Whether the glass is below freezing or over 100 > degrees, its cuttability isn't affected. In fact, the warmer the glass, the > worse the cuttability, as you say. > > Now if the studio's cold, working with warmed-up glass would certainly be a lot > more *comfortable! > > Albert > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass maybe it's not the temp. of the glass for cuttibitle reasons, but maybe for the holder of the cutter. because if someone is cold, they may not hold the cutter with the strenth that they would if they were warm. so a lighter score equals a poorer break, and then it's blamed on the glass. but when working with glass, it could'nt hurt to warm it, especially for foiling. and in some cases the glass may be the 'brittle' kind anyway, eg., antique, etc., and cold may disturb it more. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 15:45:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLHf1-0000j6a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 15:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: eating from st. glass Date: 06 Nov 96 18:44:32 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov6.234432.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk H. Taylor Buckner wrote: I've just decided to make a stained glass strawberry bowl (from "Stained Glass Gifts" by Judy Miller, pub. Hidden House Publications, 1982) for a friend for Christmas. I plan to solder it with lead-free solder but am in a quandry as to what, if anything, to do about colouring the solder and protecting it. My questions are: > 1. Is there any special technique to soldering with lead-free > material (ie. higher or lower iron temp., different flux etc.)? < Each type is different, but in general, most melt at a higher temperature and most have a narrower band of temperatures at which they are workable--in other words, they solidify very fast. > 2. Is lead-free solder safe to use in a bowl that will hold fruit > and such things (rather than runny liquids)< You need the MSDS on the lead free. THere are some that contain antimony which is almost as toxic as lead or cadmium which is more toxic than lead. The best ones contain combinations of silver, copper, zinc and tin. > 3. Can I use any kind of patination on the solder or am I just > cancelling out the safety of using lead-free solder? < Yup. Again, look at the MSDS. Tellurium, antimony, and similarly toxic metals are out. > 4. Whether I patinate or leave the solder lines silver, can I spray > or brush them with some kind of laquer, varethane, or shellac? < Those treatments will help, but only temporarily. They usually chip or wear off after a few years. You also need the MSDS on the glass itself. I find these vastly interesting. Obviously a lead-based glass and glass colored with lead, cadmium, or arsenic pigments is out. Think of the glass that is in contact with food as you would a ceramic glaze since it behaves the same. We have seen how lead crystal leaches into liquids. Two things will protect you in this transaction: 1) you are giving the piece to a friend rather than selling it and can enclose a card or letter explaining what the use should be; and 2) most intelligent people will look at the irregular stained glass surface and figure it is not for cereal. But you can never be sure what people will do. And unfortunately, makers of products are liable for damages if it can be shown that the actions of the user were at all reasonable. A bowl, arguably, could be used as a bowl for almost anything. Whenever you think about your legal responsibility, it is good to remember the case in Baltimore when a man's house burned down mysteriously in broad daylight. The fire started in his daughter's room. The man remembered that there was a stained glass sun catcher in the window, purchased a duplicate and proved that the beveled piece in the center could ignite the curtain fabric in the afternoon sun. When you sell things, you are responsible for damages even when you could not foresee them if the actions of the customer were reasonable. Get insurance and incorporate if possible. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 16:46:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLIb0-00011ua; Wed, 6 Nov 96 16:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: 06 Nov 96 19:44:17 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.04417.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Stephanie wrote: > The point behind lead-free solder is that it doesn't contain lead, but this > doesn't guarantee the metal composition of the solder. I would hate to > think that it may contain arsenic. < That's very perceptive. Lead is usually found in nature with arsenic and old lead solders routinely contained a percent or two of arsenic. I noticed this when MSDSs first started coming out on solders. However the combination of MSDSs identifying arsenic to customers and OSHA's tough rules have made it rare to find arsenic in solders now. Since arsenic is a carcinogen, it also must be reported on MSDSs in quanities of 0.1 % or more. So get the MSDS and see what is actually in the stuff. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 16:46:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLIb2-0001BIa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 16:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: 06 Nov 96 19:44:30 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.04430.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk M. Savad wrote in part (And I'm just not about to reprint the whole thing): > plumbing solder is 95/5 which makes it a little pasty (i think) to work > with< A common plumbing solder is 95% tin / 5% antimony (not lead). The rule is no solder on plumbing can contain 0.2% lead or more. But antimony is no great improvement over lead. There are now other antimony-free solders on the market for plumbing that some people find useful for stained glass. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 New York, NY 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 16:46:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLIb0-00017Ha; Wed, 6 Nov 96 16:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: 06 Nov 96 19:44:26 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.04426.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert wrote: > Why not make the bowl and solder to the bottom a plate that reads, > "For decorative use only. Do not use for food." Then arrange a nice still > life of wax fruit. < That's almost exactly what is required by the FDA for lead-leaching ceramic decorative ware. It would keep you out of trouble for sure. Monona ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 17:26:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLJDx-0000Wna; Wed, 6 Nov 96 17:25 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 19:22:04 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961106192456.2e979db4@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi; I read the grinder thread with interest, as my little glastarlet is making strange noises. The kind they sell here is the Diamond Max with the horizontal disk and the upright grinding head.... no one metioned how they were.. any ideas?? Any other suggestions are welcome! Meg Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 17:55:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLJgf-0000Zra; Wed, 6 Nov 96 17:55 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 20:54:17 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov6.155417.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961106192456.2e979db4@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Richard LaVal wrote: > > Hi; > I read the grinder thread with interest, as my little glastarlet is > making strange noises. The kind they sell here is the Diamond Max with the > horizontal disk and the upright grinding head.... no one metioned how they > were.. any ideas?? Any other suggestions are welcome! Meg > Richard and Meg LaVal > apdo. 24-5655 > Monteverde > COSTA RICA > tel: 506 645 5052 > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i don't really know how they're grinders are, but soon i'm planning to by the bevel pro. it looks good. but if inland comes out with one i'd probably go for that one. but knowing my track record with new toys, i buy one and another 6 companies comes out with the thing i just bought a month later. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 17:58:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLJjK-0000Uza; Wed, 6 Nov 96 17:58 PST X-Path: pacbell.net!kraby From: kraby@pacbell.net (Kenny Raby) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 01:55:57 GMT Message-ID: <1996Nov7.15557.0> References: <<1996Nov6.61256.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Mike, I may be confused here but how can any fruit, no matter how acidic leach lead out of LEAD-FREE solder? >From Delphi's web page: 1. Solder is a tin/lead alloy with the exception of lead-free solder which is a tin-copper alloy. All the discussion on the fruit bowl specified lead-free solder. On Wed, 06 Nov 1996 11:12:56 -0500, "M. Savad" wrote: > >plumbing solder is 95/5 which makes it a little pasty (i think) to work >with, plus in older homes, though it was 50-50 there is'nt as much >contact as there would be with fruit. if it were candy i'd probably say >go for it, but fruit, acidic, etc. there could be lead leached out. > >---Mike Savad Kenny kraby@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1960 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 18:00:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLJlM-0000O1a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 18:00 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: non-stained glass Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Thu, 7 Nov 1996 02:29:57 +0000 Message-ID: <199611070157.BAA06112@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Mertin Streng Thanks for your e-mail. Will reply directly Too tired & sleepy to think straight right now. Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 18:02:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLJnW-0001CPa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 18:02 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: 06 Nov 96 21:00:36 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.2036.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >though if i heated the glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair >of scissors. :) Huh? Shirley, you jest. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 19:41:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLLKg-0001C5a; Wed, 6 Nov 96 19:40 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Food Bowl Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 22:39:58 -0500 Message-ID: <199611070339.WAA25635@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Well... the message is coming through loud and clear. Stained glass is not for food use. I'm going to continue with the bowl (having started it yesterday before posting my queries), but I'm going to make it abundantly clear that it is ONLY for decorative purposes. I'll probably etch a message to that effect on the bottom with a diamond pen. And to think that the friend I plan to give it to is a lawyer, married to another lawyer! I'd planned to make others for sale if this one works out well. I'll re-think that now. Many thanks to all of you who took the time to respond. Much appreciated. Jennifer ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 6 19:55:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLLYb-0000jYa; Wed, 6 Nov 96 19:55 PST X-Path: dwave.net!staingls From: Steve Schaefer To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Fume trap Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 21:53:05 -0600 Message-ID: <199611070353.VAA14199@home.dwave.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk idea should work really well, the only draw back i see is that it draws >the fume upward towards your face. unless of course the hood is a bit >away from you. > When I installed the kitchen exhaust fan, I also added an extention to the air inlet to bring it down to the table... I used some aluminum coil stock.. I just bent it to fit... Steve S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 03:13:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLSOc-0000hwa; Thu, 7 Nov 96 03:13 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Food Bowl Date: 07 Nov 96 06:12:06 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.11126.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I'm going to continue with the bowl (having started it yesterday before >posting my queries), but I'm going to make it abundantly clear that it is >ONLY for decorative purposes. One last thing occurs to me. Why not design your bowl in such a way that a clear, store-bought (Pyrex?) bowl will fit inside of it? That way, the beauty of the stained glass bowl is not diminished, but any food would be contained by the "liner" bowl that's nested *inside the stained glass bowl. As for the notice on the bottom of the stained glass bowl, its wording could be revised to read something like, "Do not use for food storage without liner bowl." Just a thot. Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 05:08:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLUBe-0000aIa; Thu, 7 Nov 96 05:08 PST X-Path: atl.mindspring.com!cavu7 From: nancy lynberg To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 07:42:48 -0500 Message-ID: <199611071307.IAA14422@itchy.mindspring.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I've had my Diamond Max for a couple of months now and have no complaints. I'm very happy with it ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 05:55:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLUv6-0000vEa; Thu, 7 Nov 96 05:55 PST X-Path: memach.com!lcbell From: Linda Campbell To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: RE: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Thu, 7 Nov 1996 08:56:13 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.35613.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Question about the horizontal disk on the Diamond Max. How do you use the horizontal disc. I bought the thing because I like geometric designs and boxes and such and thought I would find lots of use for the big disk. I've tried it once. On the first pass I was cleaning up a picture frame side so I was at 90 degrees against the fence. The glass wanted to kick out on one side of the disk and draw into the fence on the other side because of the rotation of the disk, all the while bumping up and down. I was afraid I was going to chip the glass so Ibrought it to the side that pushed the glass to the fence. It quit bumping up and down and promptly ground a rectangular shape out of one side. Obviously, this was not the thing to do. But how do you control the opposing movement of the glass caused by the rotation of the wheel? I'm still new to this so have patience if my terminology isn't accurate. Thanks, Linda Campbell ---------- From: nancy lynberg[SMTP:cavu7@atl.mindspring.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 1996 7:42 AM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders I've had my Diamond Max for a couple of months now and have no complaints. I'm very happy with it ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 07:41:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLWa0-0000J2a; Thu, 7 Nov 96 07:41 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 10:40:13 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.54013.0> References: <<1996Nov7.15557.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Kenny Raby wrote: > > Mike, > > I may be confused here but how can any fruit, no matter how acidic leach > lead out of LEAD-FREE solder? > > >From Delphi's web page: > > 1. Solder is a tin/lead alloy with the exception of lead-free solder which > is a tin-copper alloy. > > All the discussion on the fruit bowl specified lead-free solder. > > On Wed, 06 Nov 1996 11:12:56 -0500, "M. Savad" > wrote: > > > > >plumbing solder is 95/5 which makes it a little pasty (i think) to work > >with, plus in older homes, though it was 50-50 there is'nt as much > >contact as there would be with fruit. if it were candy i'd probably say > >go for it, but fruit, acidic, etc. there could be lead leached out. > > > >---Mike Savad > Kenny > kraby@pacbell.net > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1960 > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well one factor is any other poisons that are in that solder. lead free was mainly designed for jewelry and such not for food. the other is the soldering iron, all this time you may have been using a lead based solder (and most likley were), so there's some lead right there. although not alot, there is some. the acidity in the fruits can help disolve in minute proportions lead, antimony, poison, etc. and then rub off onto the fruit, which is'nt good, or yummy. also even if there was'nt any poisons at all, the fruit may have a metalic taste too them...ewww. :) ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 07:47:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLWfP-0000lba; Thu, 7 Nov 96 07:46 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 10:42:03 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.5423.0> References: <<1996Nov7.2036.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >though if i heated the glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair > >of scissors. :) > > Huh? Shirley, you jest. > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i'm not, and don't call me shirley... the glass should be hot enough (if i could hold it) to cut it with scissors, after all that's what they do after pouring the glass from a ladel to a mold. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 07:59:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLWr0-00001ba; Thu, 7 Nov 96 07:58 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 10:53:31 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.55331.0> References: <<1996Nov7.35613.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Linda Campbell wrote: > > Question about the horizontal disk on the Diamond Max. > > How do you use the horizontal disc. I bought the thing because I like > geometric designs and boxes and such and thought I would find lots of use > for the big disk. I've tried it once. On the first pass I was cleaning up a > picture frame side so I was at 90 degrees against the fence. The glass > wanted to kick out on one side of the disk and draw into the fence on the > other side because of the rotation of the disk, all the while bumping up > and down. I was afraid I was going to chip the glass so Ibrought it to the > side that pushed the glass to the fence. It quit bumping up and down and > promptly ground a rectangular shape out of one side. Obviously, this was > not the thing to do. But how do you control the opposing movement of the > glass caused by the rotation of the wheel? > > I'm still new to this so have patience if my terminology isn't accurate. > Thanks, > > Linda Campbell > ---------- > From: nancy lynberg[SMTP:cavu7@atl.mindspring.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 1996 7:42 AM > To: glass@bungi.com > Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders > > I've had my Diamond Max for a couple of months now and have no complaints. > I'm very happy with it > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i personally have the twin spin and have the attachments to hold the glass upright. since the jig is towards me the glass will hold in place pretty well. if not just hold on real good, and be sure to use plenty of water. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 08:00:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLWrx-0000fla; Thu, 7 Nov 96 07:59 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 10:48:41 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.54841.0> References: <<199611070339.WAA25635@smtp1.sympatico.ca>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk H. Taylor Buckner wrote: > > Well... the message is coming through loud and clear. Stained glass > is not for food use. I'm going to continue with the bowl (having started it > yesterday before posting my queries), but I'm going to make it abundantly > clear that it is ONLY for decorative purposes. I'll probably etch a message > to that effect on the bottom with a diamond pen. And to think that the > friend I plan to give it to is a lawyer, married to another lawyer! I'd > planned to make others for sale if this one works out well. I'll re-think > that now. > Many thanks to all of you who took the time to respond. Much > appreciated. > Jennifer > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass an idea though that should be safe is to do it mosiac style. and glue the pieces to the outside of a glass bown and grout it like a mosiac. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 11:07:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLZmj-0000NIa; Thu, 7 Nov 96 11:06 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Viking design Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 14:02:39 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.9239.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have a request from a customer for any kind of Viking design. You all have been helpful in the past, so thought I would start here, in case someone knows of a pattern book that has anything Viking in it. We're talking Nordic ships, or headpieces, not the Football team Vikings. BTW the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted duplicated, and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that she turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to turn down, out of sheer frustration. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 13:21:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLbsf-0001Ana; Thu, 7 Nov 96 13:20 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Food Bowl Date: Thu, 7 Nov 1996 15:16:56 -0600 Message-ID: <199611072116.PAA04272@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >H. Taylor Buckner wrote: >> >> Well... the message is coming through loud and clear. Stained glass >> is not for food use. I'm going to continue with the bowl Informative thread this was. There are seemingly endless ideas around for making stuff out of SG (*theres always something new at Ed Hoys*) I remember one friday many moons ago after hours at the shop hangin out with some of the guys attempting to achieve imbibement and someone said stained glass NO! stained GLASSES! well that started it, lots of laughing and out came the glass cutters everybody cutting circles and other shapes out of different kinds of glass wrapping them in lead and soldering on little bridges and forming the temple pieces we roared for hours walking the shop around wearing those stupid things! (hey come on Monona, those were the old days) Anyway, I don't have a clear picture of this bowl project, is it like an upside lampshade with a flat bottom? To me it doesn't sound very suitable for the purpose intended. But I'll tell ya I've seen many a dynamite slumped and fused bowl which IMHO is a far more suitable technique for an item like this, that is if you have a kiln of course Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 13:34:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLc5l-00017ra; Thu, 7 Nov 96 13:34 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Thu, 7 Nov 1996 15:30:29 -0600 Message-ID: <199611072130.PAA04514@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 02:02 PM 11/7/96 -0500, Joyce Moran wrote: > BTW >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted duplicated, >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that she >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to >turn down, out of sheer frustration. > >Garden of Glass >Joyce Moran Joyce This lady is starting to tick me off too, send me her phone number...I'll straighten her out ;-) Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 13:54:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLcOP-0000Pga; Thu, 7 Nov 96 13:53 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: 07 Nov 96 16:52:29 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.215229.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >though if i heated the glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair > >of scissors. :) > Huh? Shirley, you jest. >i'm not, and don't call me shirley... the glass should be hot enough (if >i could hold it) to cut it with scissors, after all that's what they do >after pouring the glass from a ladel to a mold. Oh ... you knew that joke. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 13:54:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLcOP-0000Pra; Thu, 7 Nov 96 13:53 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Viking design Date: 07 Nov 96 16:52:31 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.215231.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted duplicated, >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that she >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to >turn down, out of sheer frustration. Customers. Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em. You have had a warning about this one, IMHO. Can you imagine now building the actual window, having it finished, taking it to install and having her say, "well, I'd like the color of that feather there in the middle of the panel changed to one that's a little lighter ... and the texture of that piece is too rough .. and, what? you want to charge extra for that? well, I never!" Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 14:30:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLcxg-00017Va; Thu, 7 Nov 96 14:30 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 17:29:07 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.12297.0> References: <<1996Nov7.215229.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > > >though if i heated the glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair > > >of scissors. :) > > Huh? Shirley, you jest. > > >i'm not, and don't call me shirley... the glass should be hot enough (if > >i could hold it) to cut it with scissors, after all that's what they do > >after pouring the glass from a ladel to a mold. > > Oh ... you knew that joke. > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass yeah that one's been done to death...beaten into the ground... .. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 14:46:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLdCg-00019Ya; Thu, 7 Nov 96 14:45 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 17:50:28 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov7.95028.0> References: <<1996Nov7.215231.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > finished, taking it to install and having her say, "well, I'd like the color of that feather there in the middle of the panel changed to one that's a little lighter ... and the texture of that piece is too rough > .. and, what? you want to charge extra for that? well, I never!" > > Albert I believe I'd pass on this one. Makes me cringe. Some things aren't about money. Dignity. April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 15:07:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLdXR-0000jma; Thu, 7 Nov 96 15:07 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: 07 Nov 96 18:05:34 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov7.23534.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Old jokes are the best, Mike. Yours, Old Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 18:19:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLgWf-0001C4a; Thu, 7 Nov 96 18:18 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 02:48:06 +0000 Message-ID: <199611080215.CAA32570@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Viking design Date: 07 Nov 96 16:52:31 EST Reply-to: glass@bungi.com >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted duplicated, >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that she >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to >turn down, out of sheer frustration. Customers. Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em. You have had a warning about this one, IMHO. Can you imagine now building the actual window, having it finished, taking it to install and having her say, "well, I'd like the color of that feather there in the middle of the panel changed to one that's a little lighter ... and the texture of that piece is too rough .. and, what? you want to charge extra for that? well, I never!" Albert ---- Yes Albert, all of that is perfectly true. But then again, think again; what WOULD we do without our customers......?? We have to strike a balance between feasibility, customer, customer commitment, craftsmanship and reality, and what it pays us at the end of the day. A tiny bi-product: how do WE as artists learn, get stretched by the process...... Sometimes, just now and then, a night-marish project just opens up within us something we ourselves just didn't know was there before...... That is the chance and risk we occasionally have to take. Some months ago,I remember posting an e-mail into the Group about my own "dream commission", namely a Viking design....... My concern with Joyce will be that she makes sure that she charges the Customer/Patron enough. This is "specialized stuff". Go for it!! demand generously and DO NOT ACCEPT dead-lines set by Customer - however much you want to please. I felt the same about the Indian Chief design, but hadn't quite crystallized my thoughts properly then. Joyce! YOU call the shots here! Your customer/patron will resepect you for it!! Special is special - after all!! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 18:19:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLgWi-0000IWa; Thu, 7 Nov 96 18:18 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 02:48:05 +0000 Message-ID: <199611080215.CAA32592@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Oh Joyce, Honestly!! There is ONE VIKING you should know by now exceedingly well!!!!! What do you need, how can I help??? E-mail me privately - if necessary But first of all, buy a little time.. This subject needs serious consideration. I have been drooling about the opportunity to do a real Viking design for years. I really don't mind if it kicks off with you. Here you are, totally forgetting that the cantankerous European voice in Glass@Bungi is an old historic bolshy Swedish Viking, with a history degree to boot. I have only these last couple of days been told off that my Viking (and heathen) history knowledge has failed to come up with details about heathen and Viking celebrations for the months of October and November - which now has sent me off to my Swedish and Scandinavian research literature, for further refreshers on the matter. (Oh shit, why are there only 24 hours in a day!!??). My first spontaneous thought for a stained glass Viking design is the Viking Long Boat. It does lend itself to stained glass very well. I am waiting to hear more. I will help. But you need to gain time from your patron. Elisabeth Margitsdotter av Sverige ( 'n Toby) ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 7 23:57:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLloi-00016Ga; Thu, 7 Nov 96 23:57 PST X-Path: ibm.net!mstreng From: Martin Streng To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 08:53:38 +0100 Message-ID: <1996Nov8.95338.0> References: <<199611080215.CAA32592@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Crediet- en Effectenbank Precedence: bulk Idea for a design: Imagine a cold, wild see in blue-green colours with white accents (etched?). In this, half hidden, a viking longboat with ragged sails. In the sky; Thor, with his thunder-and-lightning hammer. Clouds of grey-white with shades of horses. If put in a window with a tree on the background, the suggested movement will be emphasized. I hope. Wish i had a scanner..... ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 05:25:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLqva-0000zDa; Fri, 8 Nov 96 05:24 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Food Bowl Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 08:24:23 -0500 Message-ID: <199611081324.IAA06936@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert, Thanks for the suggested wording for the message on the underside of my food bowl. I'll try to fit it all in if there is room. The pattern I'm using is basically three flat sides with 3 other very narrow strips in between, (sort of like an upsidedown panel lamp) so it won't fit into or around any conventionaly shaped kitchen bowl. I would give some serious thought to using a mosaic technique for the next effort. I've been meaning to do some mosaic work for some time now, just haven't made time for it yet. Again, thanks for all the comments and suggestions. Jennifer H. Taylor Buckner B.Sc., D.S.A., M.A., M.B.A., Ph.D. Consulting Sociologist 2015 Gingras Brigham, Quebec, Canada J0E 1J0 Phone and Fax (514) 293-4835 e-mail taylor_buckner@sympatico.ca ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 06:39:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLs5i-0001C2a; Fri, 8 Nov 96 06:39 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: mike peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Found a peep-hole mate! Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 14:39:22 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov8.143922.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Many thanks to those of you that responded to my request for peep-hole material. I looked into several manufacturers of iridized glass (mostly Bullseye since Mike Savad suggested it), but couldn't find anything the customer liked. So, one of my co-workers suggested a small "door" within the panel. As I said, the pattern will be ala Frank Lloyd Wright, so somewhere high and centered in the panel, I'll make a small rectangle using Y came, then make a small door that will fit within the rectangle. I'll use the small hinges that are typically used for jewerly boxes, put a small knob on the opposite side and ......viola! The customer can walk up to her front door, open the little door in the panel and peek out! Note: the door insert will be double glazed with a sheet of clear tempered plate on the exterior, the panel with the inset door on the interior. The customer loved it, I'm not crazy about it, but it'll be easy enough and I feel it will be durable and complementary to the pattern. Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 07:01:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLsQx-0000pQa; Fri, 8 Nov 96 07:01 PST X-Path: digital.net!dti From: Jennifer Daniels To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: Diamond Max Grinders Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 10:00:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199611081500.KAA16656@digital.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk New diamond disks may be slightly coarse and need to be worked in. Start by smoothing the disk down and practicing on scrap glass. Using a firm grip move the glass back and forth across the disk. Allow water to drip freely from the water resevoir onto the disk. If you have any questions please call Mack Chase, our customer service mangaer, at 800-937-9593. He'd be happy to give you some helpful hints. Also, as a Diamond Max owner you can now upgrade your ginder into our hottest new product, the Bevel Max. The Bevel Max is a complete studio beveling system and allows you to make custom bevels in under five minutes. This is because all Max grinders use the same powerful base grinding unit, making them completely and easily convertible for additional grinding funcitons (ie - turn your Bevel Max or Power Max into a Diamond Max and vice versa). The goal is to save you money and studio space. A plus, all Max grinders now have five year warranties. Please give me a call if you need more info. Thanks, Jennifer Daniels Diamond Tech International http://www.artglassworld.com/supply/dti dti@digital.net At 08:56 AM 11/7/96 -0500, you wrote: >Question about the horizontal disk on the Diamond Max. > >How do you use the horizontal disc. I bought the thing because I like >geometric designs and boxes and such and thought I would find lots of use >for the big disk. I've tried it once. On the first pass I was cleaning up a >picture frame side so I was at 90 degrees against the fence. The glass >wanted to kick out on one side of the disk and draw into the fence on the >other side because of the rotation of the disk, all the while bumping up >and down. I was afraid I was going to chip the glass so Ibrought it to the >side that pushed the glass to the fence. It quit bumping up and down and >promptly ground a rectangular shape out of one side. Obviously, this was >not the thing to do. But how do you control the opposing movement of the >glass caused by the rotation of the wheel? > >I'm still new to this so have patience if my terminology isn't accurate. >Thanks, > >Linda Campbell >---------- >From: nancy lynberg[SMTP:cavu7@atl.mindspring.com] >Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 1996 7:42 AM >To: glass@bungi.com >Subject: Re: Diamond Max Grinders > >I've had my Diamond Max for a couple of months now and have no complaints. >I'm very happy with it > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > > > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 08:19:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLtea-0000ZTa; Fri, 8 Nov 96 08:19 PST X-Path: Wittenberg.EDU!CUTLER From: CUTLER@Wittenberg.EDU To: GLASS@BUNGI.COM Subject: lampbase:thanks all Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 11:19:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1996Nov8.71929.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk O.K. Thanks for reminding me that the "rules" are not all that strict in lampbasing :) I apreciate my new-found freedom. I'll exercise it by building my own with my trusty Shopsmith. Shirley, no one I know carries the kind of insurance needed for the task you suggest. :) But it IS a good idea certainly. Thanks to everyone else for your suggestions. Bob cutler ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 11:25:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLwYQ-0001Doa; Fri, 8 Nov 96 11:25 PST X-Path: camadm.Camosun.BC.CA!COOPERD From: cooperd@camadm.Camosun.BC.CA To: "GLASS@BUNGI.COM" Subject: SOLDER Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 11:25:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1996Nov8.4252.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Here's a dumb questions, but I'll ask this one anyway. I'm doing a foil window hanging and ran out of 40/60 solder, so I decieded to use 50/50, this doesn't look great, so I was wondering if I can now go over it with 40/60? Donna! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 14:30:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vLzRN-0000f7a; Fri, 8 Nov 96 14:30 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re: SOLDER Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 17:29:01 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov8.12291.0> References: <<1996Nov8.4252.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk cooperd@camadm.Camosun.BC.CA wrote: > > Here's a dumb questions, but I'll ask this one anyway. I'm doing a foil > window hanging and ran out of 40/60 solder, so I decieded to use 50/50, > this doesn't look great, so I was wondering if I can now go over it with > 40/60? Donna! > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass first off i hope your using 60/40...40/60 is a different type of solder. i personnaly always use 50-50 as a base solder. though if you go over an old solder line, it will always be difficult to get a good bead...you could always try..it could'nt hurt. just use plenty of flux and a hot iron. if it's real difficult to get a good bead try using 63/37 (ultimate). ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 17:34:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vM2JK-00010ta; Fri, 8 Nov 96 17:34 PST X-Path: atl.mindspring.com!cavu7 From: nancy lynberg To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re:bandsaws Date: Thu, 07 Nov 1996 20:08:57 -0500 Message-ID: <199611090143.UAA24214@answerman.mindspring.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk First, thanks for all the tips on warming glass, finally ended up getting a heat lamp, and it seems to be working well ift nothing else it's keeping me pretty warm. I'm beginning to think i just have some very brittle glass, the reds seem to be giving me much more trouble than anything. now onto bandsaw selection. I am considering buying a glass bandsaw and have been looking at the new Inland db100 "price sure is good" but was asking around and was told to look into the Gryphon , has anyone had any experience with it? Thanks again for all your valuable help ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 18:56:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vM3ax-0001Fwa; Fri, 8 Nov 96 18:56 PST X-Path: scv.net!fullspec From: Kay Allen To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re:bandsaws Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 18:53:59 -0800 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19961109025359.006c99e8@mail.scv.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ..I have the Gryphon. Don't use it much but when I do I'm very pleased with the results and the time it saves me on difficult curves. >.. I am considering buying a glass bandsaw and have been >looking at the new Inland db100 "price sure is good" but was asking around >and was told to look into the Gryphon , has anyone had any experience with >it? Thanks again for all your valuable help > >---- >. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 8 23:22:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vM74m-0000Nya; Fri, 8 Nov 96 22:39 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!vnunit1 From: vnunit1@ix.netcom.com (RICK D VAUGHN) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re:bandsaws Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 22:39:21 -0800 Message-ID: <199611090639.WAA05879@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: I am considering buying a glass bandsaw and have been >looking at the new Inland db100 "price sure is good" but was asking around >and was told to look into the Gryphon , has anyone had any experience with >it? We originally had an Inland "Tiger" and upgraded a year and a half ago to the Gryphon. The blades and guides are more expensive, but well worth the improved quality and design. We have never broken a blade, but use it alot in detailed production work and have worn out two blades and countless guides! Good Luck! Teresa V Color It Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 05:53:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMDpk-0000h6a; Sat, 9 Nov 96 05:52 PST X-Path: pilot.msu.edu!rosochac From: "Lisa Anne Rosochacki" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: bandsaws Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 08:52:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199611091352.IAA54293@pilot06.cl.msu.edu> References: <<199611090639.WAA05879@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk If you are looking into a bandsaw you might want to check out the Taurus II Ringsaw. Because the blade is coated with grit on all sides it allows you to cut in any direction and you also don't have to worry about super tight curves, and the length between the neck of the saw and the blade. Because you don't have to turn the glass you can cut much larger pieces on the ringsaw. Price-wise they are about 100.00 more than a Gryphon, and about 30.00 less than a Diamond Laser 3000, at least that is the price range in my area. I would check one out if you are in the market for a saw. lr ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 06:04:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vME0e-0000xqa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 06:03 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: mike peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re:bandsaws Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 14:03:36 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov9.14336.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I am considering buying a glass bandsaw and have been >looking at the new Inland db100 "price sure is good" but was asking around >and was told to look into the Gryphon , has anyone had any experience with >it? Thanks again for all your valuable help We used a Gryphon for several years with very little trouble. We used stainless steel blades for a short while because they were advertised to last longer. But, we switched to the copper blades because when the stainless steel keep breaking. We also noticed that the stainless steel blades ran with more vibration than the copper blades ........ anyway, we liked the Gryphon, but upgraded to the Taurus about a year ago and are very pleased with it. Bandsaws are all kinda pricy when you compare their cost to the rest of your equipment. If you're going to plung, take a hard look at the saws that have proven their worth on the market. Give the new saws a few years on the market to prove their worth, because if they're lemons, you won't be able to sell it very easily. Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 07:54:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMFjP-0000COa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 07:54 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: Re: Bandsaws Date: Sat, 09 Nov 1996 10:50:17 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov9.55017.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I agree that you should look at the Taurus II. I tried the Inland 3000 and returned it. The Taurus is great. I wouldn't trust Inland for anything unless it has been well proven over a considerable period of time. Their quality control stinks. If anyone has been reading the other e-mail over the past few weeks, you will see I am not alone in my opinion. -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 13:42:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMLAC-0000yKa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 13:42 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: tips for warming glass Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 13:41:57 -0800 Message-ID: <199611092141.NAA13423@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > > glass, since it doesn't actually soften until -- maybe 2000 degrees? > depending on the glass it starts slumping at around 1150 or so and will melt anywhere above 1250 ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 13:44:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMLC1-0000ita; Sat, 9 Nov 96 13:43 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 13:43:49 -0800 Message-ID: <199611092143.NAA25851@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > > >i don't know about rigorous, but warmer glass just works better. i guess >it's just the crystaline values of the glass. though if i heated the >glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair of scissors. I think that your scissors would melt at 2000 degrees, not to mention the damage to your skin. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 13:53:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMLLA-0000raa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 13:53 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 13:53:11 -0800 Message-ID: <199611092153.NAA28103@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >I have a request from a customer for any kind of Viking design. You all >have been helpful in the past, so thought I would start here, in case >someone knows of a pattern book that has anything Viking in it. We're >talking Nordic ships, or headpieces, not the Football team Vikings. BTW >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted duplicated, >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that she >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to >turn down, out of sheer frustration. > Send me an email post with the particulars. I can digitize the art work and provide a full size patern for your client. any size is ok. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 14:20:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMLkj-0000o7a; Sat, 9 Nov 96 14:19 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Sat, 09 Nov 1996 17:18:37 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov9.121837.0> References: <<199611092143.NAA25851@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Michael Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > > > > > >i don't know about rigorous, but warmer glass just works better. i > guess > >it's just the crystaline values of the glass. though if i heated the > >glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair of scissors. > > I think that your scissors would melt at 2000 degrees, not to mention > the damage to your skin. > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well, basically that was a figure of speech, though the scissors would not melt, it definitly would'nt be good for them. there are special sheers that trims off the glass after pouring it from a ladel. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 14:50:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMMEV-0000mxa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 14:50 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Sat, 09 Nov 1996 17:48:01 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov9.12481.0> References: <<199611092153.NAA28103@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Michael Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > >I have a request from a customer for any kind of Viking design. You > all > >have been helpful in the past, so thought I would start here, in case > >someone knows of a pattern book that has anything Viking in it. We're > > >talking Nordic ships, or headpieces, not the Football team Vikings. > BTW > >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida > >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted > duplicated, > >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that > she > >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to > >turn down, out of sheer frustration. > > > > Send me an email post with the particulars. I can digitize the art work > and provide a full size patern for your client. any size is ok. > > ms > Thanks, but she already accepted the original pattern. Placed her deposit and was quite nice today about it. So I'm taking the commission, the job is too big (too much $$) for me to turn down. I'm getting her final approval BEFORE I solder anything together. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 16:49:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMO5S-0000sya; Sat, 9 Nov 96 16:49 PST X-Path: aros.net!jenkyn From: jenkyn@aros.net (Jenkyn A. Powell) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 19:02:49 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >You wrote: >> >> >> >>i don't know about rigorous, but warmer glass just works better. i >guess >>it's just the crystaline values of the glass. though if i heated the >>glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair of scissors. > >I think that your scissors would melt at 2000 degrees, not to mention >the damage to your skin. > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass Not true, glass blowers do it all the time. jp ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 17:17:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMOVp-0000ida; Sat, 9 Nov 96 17:16 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: tips for warming gla Date: 09 Nov 96 20:14:58 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov10.11458.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >> i don't know about rigorous, but warmer glass just works better. i >> guess it's just the crystaline values of the glass. though if i heated the >> glass to 2000 degrees i could cut it with a pair of scissors. << Michael Smoucha wrote: > I think that your scissors would melt at 2000 degrees, not to mention > the damage to your skin.< As an old former hot glass worker, I can tell you: you can cut glass right out of the furnace with a scissors. It works best when the scissors is made of a metal that the glass wont stick to or if you dip the scissor in water first. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 New York, NY 10012 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 18:48:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMPvr-0000YQa; Sat, 9 Nov 96 18:47 PST X-Path: cetlink.net!karlp From: "KARL L. PREISACH" To: Subject: Latex Senstitzation; Monona? Date: Sat, 9 Nov 1996 21:17:25 -0300 Message-ID: <199611100247.VAA07588@moltar.cetlink.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi All, Since I use latex gloves almost daily at work and am thinking of buying some for SG work, I am wondering about sensitizing. I vaguely remember reading somewhere that one can develop an allergy to latex and that it may lead to aphylactic (sp?) shock. Does anyone know what the symptoms of this may be? That is, what should one watch for and if symptoms occur is it too late? This is not only of interest to me, but also to the Safety Department where I work. Any information or suggestions are (of course) greatly appreciated! TIA, Karl ps. I included Monona in the header since if anyone would know, it would be her. Thx. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 9 23:12:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMU3R-0000l4a; Sat, 9 Nov 96 23:11 PST X-Path: macnet.com!jhendershott From: "J. Hendershott" To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: Oval came frame? Date: Sat, 09 Nov 1996 23:12:11 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov9.151211.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I am looking for suggestions for framing FUSED glass oval panel. I would like to use a copper or zinc frame around the panel, but I don't know if or how to bend the came into an oval. I have a came bender and can do round panels fine, but I don't know if this will work for the oval pattern I am using. Since there are no solder lines in the panel, lead is not an option, nothing to solder it to. I prefer not to use a wood frame, too heavy for the smaller 14x9" panels. All suggestions will be greatly appreciated. Janie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 08:07:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMcOx-00012Ua; Sun, 10 Nov 96 08:06 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Latex Senstitzation; Monona? Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 11:05:15 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov10.6515.0> References: <<199611100247.VAA07588@moltar.cetlink.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk KARL L. PREISACH wrote: > > Hi All, > Since I use latex gloves almost daily at work and am thinking of > buying some for SG work, I am wondering about sensitizing. I vaguely > remember reading somewhere that one can develop an allergy to latex and > that it may lead to aphylactic (sp?) shock. Does anyone know what the > symptoms of this may be? That is, what should one watch for and if symptoms > occur is it too late? > This is not only of interest to me, but also to the Safety Department > where I work. Any information or suggestions are (of course) greatly > appreciated! > > TIA, > Karl > ps. I included Monona in the header since if anyone would know, it would be > her. Thx. > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass welp, if you've been using them daily and you don't see any redness in your hands then your probably not allergic. anapheleptic shock only occors if your really allergic to something. basically your throat swells up so much that you can breath. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 08:12:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMcTf-0000zta; Sun, 10 Nov 96 08:11 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Oval came frame? Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 11:10:09 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov10.6109.0> References: <<1996Nov9.151211.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk J. Hendershott wrote: > > I am looking for suggestions for framing FUSED glass oval panel. I would > like to use a copper or zinc frame around the panel, but I don't know if > or how to bend the came into an oval. I have a came bender and can do > round panels fine, but I don't know if this will work for the oval > pattern I am using. Since there are no solder lines in the panel, lead > is not an option, nothing to solder it to. I prefer not to use a wood > frame, too heavy for the smaller 14x9" panels. All suggestions will be > greatly appreciated. > > Janie > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass to bend came you would need a came bender. brass capped cam would work, but i don't know if it comes in border. you could make a glass frame and mix it with the fused. if you do use a wood one, you could trim the profile and make it thinner, so instead of having a 2" frame you would have a 1". ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 09:32:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMdj6-0000mOa; Sun, 10 Nov 96 09:31 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: Mike Peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Oval came frame? Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 17:31:12 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov10.173112.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 07:12 AM 11/10/96 +0000, you wrote: >I am looking for suggestions for framing FUSED glass oval panel. I would >like to use a copper or zinc frame around the panel, but I don't know if >or how to bend the came into an oval. I have a came bender and can do >round panels fine, but I don't know if this will work for the oval >pattern I am using. Since there are no solder lines in the panel, lead >is not an option, nothing to solder it to. I prefer not to use a wood >frame, too heavy for the smaller 14x9" panels. All suggestions will be >greatly appreciated. > >Janie I've bent zinc and brass into ovals using a came bender. It's more work than making a circle, but it works just fine if you keep the changing arch in mind while you're bending. I usually use a 1/4" or 3/8" U came, 1/2" works if you have a large oval or circle, but 3/4" doesn't work well except for the largest archs. Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 11:45:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMfoV-0001Ana; Sun, 10 Nov 96 11:45 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: cooperd@camadm.Camosun.BC.CA Subject: Re: SOLDER Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 11:43:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov10.3435.0> References: <<1996Nov8.4252.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Donna: You can go over it with 60/40 but I sometimes use Quickset and find it works really well in blending in with the 50/50 and helping 50/50 set before all the "vibrating lines" set in. PJ from CA> ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 13:58:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMhsT-000101a; Sun, 10 Nov 96 13:57 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: grinders Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 15:53:37 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961110152551.23a7869a@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi; Still trying to decide between a Diamond Max and a Glastar All-star (G 8). Any words of wisdom from anyone? I am doing mostly flat panels right now, but do do lamps sometimes too. So hard to buy without ever even seeing one. I noticed someone was having trouble using the disk on the Diaond max. Has anyone else had trouble.. (or not)?? Another related question I notice in the Delphi catalog that the diamond tech bits are much cheaper than the the glastar bits. glastar claims to have a special bonding process that gives longer life. Any thoughts? they are apparently interchangable. Meg Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 20:56:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMoPh-0000i0a; Sun, 10 Nov 96 20:56 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Exhausting April Date: 10 Nov 96 23:53:13 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov11.45313.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Sorry April, my husband has been in the hospital most of this week and I've forgotten a number of things I intended to do. > > Any ideas on venting to the outside. It has been suggested that the > reverse pull of a fan attached to a dryer vent could be used to vent out through the window. What do you think? We already have floor model > hepa & charcoal filter. < HEPA does good with metal fumes, but wont get the acid gases and organic vapors from the fluxes. The charcoal filter will get some of the gases and vapors--but only for a little while. They are not very reliable for this kind of work. >I wanted some table top exhaust that could pull > fumes as I work. Squirrel cage fan? < For a small operation like yours, any kind of small exhaust fan will do it. Ideally the fan should have more than one speed and range from 300 to 1000 CFM against 1/2 inch static pressure. > Don't they already sell something like this? < Even Sears may have exhaust fans that will work. Otherwise, check your yellow pages. Two middle range fan suppliers are Grainer and Dayton. > In the greenhouse you know the CFM but in the house? Room size 8' x 30' x > 20'. < In this case, the room size is irrelevant. You are not ventilating the whole room except incidentally. You are only concerned with venting a small local area at the work bench. You've gotten one pretty good suggestion from Steve Schaefer: extending a kitchen range hood that exhausts to the outside. You could also replace a pane in the window with a small exhaust fan as you suggested. In either case, you want the exhaust to be as close to work table level as possible. To make it even better, you could booth it in to prevent cross drafts and to direct all the flow of air over your work area. Which ever system you use, you need to test it with incense or some other source of smoke to see that it really moves the air away from you and to the outside. You also need to make sure that at the otherside of the room you have a source of fresh air. Remember: every cubic foot of air that the fan exhausts must be immediately replaced with another cubic foot of air. Otherwise, the room just develops a little negative pressure and the fan only looks like it is moving air. The replacement air must also come from the right direction--preferably from the oposite side of the room from the fan. The way to think about this is to imagine stretching at string from the source of air supply directly to the exhaust fan. Most of the air will follow this string. You want your work area to be in that pathway and as near the fan as possible. The supply air requirement also means that in the winter you will be throwing nice warm air out the exhaust and hauling cold air in from somewhere. Your heating costs will go up. There is no cheap way to do this. Ordinary exhaust fans and kitchen range hood fans also are not explosion proof. Spraying solvent-based aerosols in large quantities is out. Even great clouds of wood dust should be avoided since organic dusts like these can explode if exposed to a sparking motor. > Larry of Minore fitted a window with an exhaust fan. Also uses a small > portable fan to blow air across with area to keep fumes out of his face. < The exhaust fan is fine, but you do not want to blow air across your face and into the rest of the room. It is important that the exhaust fan be strong enough to draw the solder plume away and out on its own. In fact, creating turbulance of this kind while you solder is an especially bad idea for you since you will have your studio in the house. It guarantees that you will be spreading the fumes throughout the house. If any of this is still not clear, draw me a picture of the studio space with indications of doors, windows, work areas, etc. and send them snail mail. I'll sketch in where the best locations for the exhaust are. ANd here's hoping you sell a whole lot of SG for big $$ so you can get the operation into a separate studio the hell out of the house as soon as possible. Monona Rossol ACTS 181 Thompson St., # 23 NYC 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 10 22:44:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMq6i-0001Ara; Sun, 10 Nov 96 22:44 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!vnunit1 From: vnunit1@ix.netcom.com (RICK D VAUGHN) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Latex Senstitzation; Monona? Date: Sun, 10 Nov 1996 22:44:19 -0800 Message-ID: <199611110644.WAA16537@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Hi All, > Since I use latex gloves almost daily at work and am thinking of buying some for SG work, I am wondering about sensitizing. I vaguely remember reading somewhere that one can develop an allergy to latex and that it may lead to aphylactic (sp?) shock. Anaphylactic Shock is a risk when people become sensitized (allergic) to latex, as with any other allergy. Most commonly the first reaction to latex is a skin rash (contact dermatitis) which appears on the hands in the area directly covered by the gloves. This rash is red and itchy, possibly causing the skin to blister and weep if severe enough. The first thing to rule out is an allergy to the powder which is put into the gloves to make them slip on easier. This can be accomplished by trying powderless gloves, if the rash reappears or becomes worse the problem is to the latex. Once a person has developed an allergy to latex, they should use vinyl gloves to prevent further exposure to the latex. It is CRITICAL that persons who have developed an allergy to latex let all health care providers know about their allergy. Special precautions must be taken if the person is having dental work done (rubber dams are made of latex), surgery (many medical products have latex parts on them)or even their homes/offices painted. I know from both sides of the gate-I am a registered nurse administrator AND have an allergy to latex. One of the worst reactions I ever experienced was trouble breathing when they were painting a hallway near my office with latex based paint. For further information, please send me an e-mail me directly at vnunit1@ix.netcom.com Teresa Vaughn Color It Glass! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 04:05:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMv7G-0001I5a; Mon, 11 Nov 96 04:05 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: grinders Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 07:02:52 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov11.2252.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961110152551.23a7869a@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Richard LaVal wrote: > > Hi; > Still trying to decide between a Diamond Max and a Glastar All-star > (G 8). Any words of wisdom from anyone? I am doing mostly flat panels > right now, but do do lamps sometimes too. So hard to buy without ever even > seeing one. I noticed someone was having trouble using the disk on the > Diaond max. Has anyone else had trouble.. (or not)?? Another related > question I notice in the Delphi catalog that the diamond tech bits are much > cheaper than the the glastar bits. glastar claims to have a special bonding > process that gives longer life. Any thoughts? they are apparently > interchangable. Meg > Richard and Meg LaVal I have not had any experience with the Diamond Max, so I cannot say it isn't a good product. But I have had experience with Glastar products and I would say their quality is excellent. And it is true that Glastar bits last longer. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 06:00:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMwu2-0000qQa; Mon, 11 Nov 96 05:59 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: SOLDER Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 07:56:12 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961111072820.1cc74d2a@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk PJ What is Quickset??? And "vibrating lines" ??? Meg At 11:43 AM 11/10/96 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Donna: You can go over it with 60/40 but I sometimes use Quickset and >find it works really well in blending in with the 50/50 and helping 50/50 >set before all the "vibrating lines" set in. PJ from CA> > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 06:23:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMxFr-0000s7a; Mon, 11 Nov 96 06:22 PST X-Path: UCONNVM.UCONN.EDU!HCLADM02 From: mail To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Latex Senstitzation; Monona? Date: Mon, 11 Nov 96 09:09:40 EST Message-ID: <961111.092159.EST.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu> References: <<1996Nov10.6515.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Just because you are not allergic to latex NOW does not mean that you will not develop sensitivities later. Since the adoption of stringent universal precautions in medicine, with the continual putting on and off of latex gloves, the sensitization of medical personnel seems to have skyrocketed. Nurses have lost their careers! I am trying to do some research on this, but don't have much time what with my three jobs (glass being one!), but you can take yourself to a medical library and look it up in Index Medicus and find many articles, particularly in nursing magazines, about the problem. In any case, in a week or two, when I get a few minutes of time, I'll try and post some information from the medical literature. -- Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 08:02:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vMyoZ-00012Ga; Mon, 11 Nov 96 08:02 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 16:31:42 +0000 Message-ID: <199611111602.QAA19410@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > >I have a request from a customer for any kind of Viking design. You > all > >have been helpful in the past, so thought I would start here, in case > >someone knows of a pattern book that has anything Viking in it. We're > > >talking Nordic ships, or headpieces, not the Football team Vikings. > BTW > >the lady with the Indian chief design came back from her Florida > >vacation with a picture of a chieftain head that she wanted > duplicated, > >and it was almost identical to the one I put so much work into, that > she > >turned down before the vacation. This may be one job that I have to > >turn down, out of sheer frustration. > > > > Send me an email post with the particulars. I can digitize the art work > and provide a full size patern for your client. any size is ok. > > ms > Thanks, but she already accepted the original pattern. Placed her deposit and was quite nice today about it. So I'm taking the commission, the job is too big (too much $$) for me to turn down. I'm getting her final approval BEFORE I solder anything together. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- Well Done Joyce!!! Congratulations!! Go for it. Some commissions are like that. You just have to have them, go for them. Somehow, I thought you might. .....Do let us know how it goes. Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 10:30:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vN17R-0001Oqa; Mon, 11 Nov 96 10:30 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: Richard LaVal Subject: Re: SOLDER Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 10:28:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov11.2284.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961111072820.1cc74d2a@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Meg: You asked what is Quickset and "vibrating lines." Quickset is trade name for 67/32 solder by Canfield. Instant melt and solidifying point when heating. The vibrating lines I refer to are the lines that frequently form with 50/50 solder. The best way I can describe this is all solder solidifies at around 378 degrees F. The 60/40 solder melts at about 390 degrees F. and the 50/50 melts at about 412 degrees. The cool down period of the 60/40 is the "working space" you have when beading a project. The cool down period of the 50/50 solder gives you a 50-52 degrees "working space." If you move the project you are beading before it reaches the solidifying point, your project will end up with what I call vibrating lines...something less than smooth and rounded. I may not have the correct degrees on the melting points of the solder, I can look that information up from a technical soldering manual. But the whole idea is NOT to move the project, or bump it or otherwise cause it to move until the solder is set. PJ from CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 15:06:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vN5Q2-0001KRa; Mon, 11 Nov 96 15:05 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: SOLDER Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 18:04:15 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov11.13415.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961111072820.1cc74d2a@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Richard LaVal wrote: > > PJ > What is Quickset??? And "vibrating lines" ??? Meg > > At 11:43 AM 11/10/96 -0800, you wrote: > >Hi Donna: You can go over it with 60/40 but I sometimes use Quickset and > >find it works really well in blending in with the 50/50 and helping 50/50 > >set before all the "vibrating lines" set in. PJ from CA> > > > >---- > >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > > > > Richard and Meg LaVal > apdo. 24-5655 > Monteverde > COSTA RICA > tel: 506 645 5052 > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well quickset is another type of solder to make, making a bead easier. kinda like ultimate only a little cheaper and slightly more pasty. vibration lines are those little "pond like ripples" at the end of a joint. usually caused by shaking the iron when removing it from the work. however it is sometimes a desirable effect, used for decorative soldering. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 18:15:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vN8NW-0001Pka; Mon, 11 Nov 96 18:15 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 20:11:20 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961111194331.2f97aafa@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi folks; I have a friend coming to Costa Rica from Seattle WA. She is willing to bring whatever grinder I decide on. Any good hints on glass stores in Seattle??? By the way, thanks for clarifying what Quickset and vibrating lines are, of course I sometimes have the latter, just didn't know what they were called, besides yucky looking! Thanks Meg Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 19:22:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vN9QZ-00015Ua; Mon, 11 Nov 96 19:22 PST X-Path: juno.com!roadrunner47 From: roadrunner47@juno.com (Jacque E Smith) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re:Glass Grinders Date: Mon, 11 Nov 1996 22:19:33 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov12.31933.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961111194331.2f97aafa@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Well I don't have any experience with the diamond max . I have used the Glastar G8 for quite a few years.. Between Inland and Glastar I will take a Glastar anyday. They are quieter. The bit (Glastar bit) is more expensive but seem to last longer.. But the biggest plus is repair turn around. I got a bit stuck and hack sawed it off. I thought the whole thing would have to be replaced. Sent it to Glastar and they called said no way just would refinish the shaft for me.. ....This particular grinder was about 8 years old and was thrilled to have my grinder back to me in less than 72 hours. I have an Inland in fact two of them..but really like my Glastar.. If I sound like I am repeating my self I am...VBG...Just my opinion Roadrunner ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 19:25:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vN9TR-0001AIa; Mon, 11 Nov 96 19:25 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: grinders Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 22:20:56 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov12.222056.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk I`ve talked to Diamond a few times and think they would be glade to hear from you. I use a Glastar Allstar now and have no troubles. We will become a DTI dealer the first of the year. If any way I can help please let us know. Good Luck.. The Craft Nook,Inc. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 11 20:46:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNAjK-00019ga; Mon, 11 Nov 96 20:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Latex Senstitzation; Date: 11 Nov 96 23:43:46 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov12.44346.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Teresa Vaughn, Thanks for the excellent description of latex reaction. However, one point bothers me. > Special precautions must be taken...snip....or even their homes/offices > painted. I know from both sides of the gate-I am a registered nurse > administrator AND have an allergy to latex. One of the worst reactions I > ever experienced was trouble breathing when they were painting a hallway > near my office with latex based paint.< As a chemist specializing in art materials and paints, I can say with some assurance that latex wall paints are essentially never made with natural rubber latex. They are called latex only because they are water dispersions of various plastic materials such as acrylic, urethane, vinyl, etc. These chemicals aren't even related to latex proteins in any way. I'm sure you had a reaction, but not to rubber. There are plenty of other sensitizers in these paints. The worst reaction comes from badly formulated latex urethane paints which have unreacted urethane monomers (isocyanates) in them. These compounds also are famous for causing anaphylaxis and isocyanate asthma. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 New York, NY 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 12 07:17:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNKaL-0000uZa; Tue, 12 Nov 96 07:17 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: grinders Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 10:15:50 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov12.51550.0> References: <<1996Nov12.222056.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Boatwright, W.L. wrote: > > I`ve talked to Diamond a few times and think they would be glade to hear from you. > I use a Glastar Allstar now and have no troubles. We will become a DTI dealer the first > of the year. If any way I can help please let us know. > > Good Luck.. > > The Craft Nook,Inc. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well basically it does'nt really matter which grinder you get, it seems you'll be getting the same info for each grinder. and basically it's because it's just a sealed motor with a diamond head on it. what i'd like to see is a hybrid between the glasstar and the inland. a grinder that has a large work surface (also a surface where the glass does'nt cut into), a wide spray gaurd, a glass splash shield, and a utility drawer. i think i used a glaster once, but i still like my inlands. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 12 14:56:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNRkp-0000oca; Tue, 12 Nov 96 14:56 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Viking design Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:56:10 -0800 Message-ID: <199611122256.OAA27588@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >> > > >Thanks, but she already accepted the original pattern. Placed her >deposit and was quite nice today about it. So I'm taking the >commission, the job is too big (too much $$) for me to turn down. I'm >getting her final approval BEFORE I solder anything together. > >Garden of Glass >Joyce Moran >---- >always a good idea to have everything signed off on. We have clients sign off on the scale, the full size, samples of all the glass and all locations. Any changes are handled with change orders at extra charge. Lots of paper and work but worth saving all your hair. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 12 14:59:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNRnn-00010ga; Tue, 12 Nov 96 14:59 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tips for warming glass Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:59:24 -0800 Message-ID: <199611122259.OAA27792@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >>You wrote: >>> >>> >>> >Not true, glass blowers do it all the time. >jp > > >---- >The point is glass melts at well below 2000 degrees. many metals melt at 2000 or below.Didnt realy expect people to alter their glass cutting techniques. Energy cost might just be prohibitive. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 13 03:31:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNdWy-0000RNa; Wed, 13 Nov 96 03:30 PST X-Path: cornell.edu!bjs10 From: B J Snell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Latex Senstitzation; Monona? Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 06:30:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2.2.16.19961113063118.19977ee6@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 09:09 AM 11/11/96 EST, you wrote: >Just because you are not allergic to latex NOW does not mean that >you will not develop sensitivities later. Since the adoption of >stringent universal precautions in medicine, with the continual >putting on and off of latex gloves, the sensitization of medical >personnel seems to have skyrocketed. Nurses have lost their >careers! I am trying to do some research on this, >-- >Dorothy Kalahan, Good Morning: I do not know much about the latex gloves, we purchase vinyl gloves for the staff here.... We are in the food biz and are required to wear them by law..... We do have a few employees that have developed sensitivities, we thought it might be the talc in the gloves. But anyway, I purchased thin white cotten liners employees wear on their hands before they put on the gloves. I purchased them at a housekeeping supply company. They are produced for employees that change beds all day. Those in this industry have developed sensitivities to the residual chemicals that sanitized the sheets, etc. We do not require that the employees wear these however I do make them available to anyone interested in them. I bought a couple of pairs for myself to wear under gloves while doing glass. They are especially comfortable while grinding.. and are not at all expensive. Perhaps something to help... Barbara ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Barbara J. Snell Jansen's Dining, Cornell University 255-5960 bjs10@cornell.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 13 17:45:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vNqrC-00012Ta; Wed, 13 Nov 96 17:44 PST X-Path: cetlink.net!karlp From: "KARL L. PREISACH" To: Subject: Latex Sensitization Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 20:17:29 -0300 Message-ID: <199704150044.UAA13115@moltar.cetlink.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello All, Sincere thanks to everyone who provided the warnings and suggestions concerning my questions about latex allergies. As usual, I am overwhelmed by the amount of information you possess and your willingness to share. Your help was indeed valuable. Thanks Again, Karl ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 15:43:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOXth-000174a; Fri, 15 Nov 96 15:42 PST X-Path: arn.net!loveta From: "Loveta Elmore" To: "glass bungi" Subject: list Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 16:42:07 -0800 Message-ID: <199611152339.RAA04001@arnet.arn.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR E-MAIL LIST LOVETA ELMORE ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 17:33:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOZdT-0000uSa; Fri, 15 Nov 96 17:33 PST X-Path: netaxs.com!maruca From: maruca@netaxs.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: test? Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 20:33:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1996Nov15.153313.0> References: <<1996Nov12.51550.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Is everyone making ready for the holiday crafts fairs? Hard to believe there've been no posts today! Mary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 19:07:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOb5a-0000K8a; Fri, 15 Nov 96 19:06 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: no mail Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 22:06:02 -0500 Message-ID: <199611160306.WAA03633@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I think everyone must have gone into hibernation for the winter, because I've not had any e-mail from the bungi group for at least two days now, maybe more, and I'm quite sure my system hasn't been down. I've had mail from other sources. Anyone out there? Jennifer ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 20:55:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOcml-00019Ha; Fri, 15 Nov 96 20:55 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: no mail Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 21:16:48 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov15.141648.0> References: <<199611160306.WAA03633@smtp1.sympatico.ca>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk H. Taylor Buckner wrote: > > I think everyone must have gone into hibernation for the winter, > because I've not had any e-mail from the bungi group for at least two days > now, maybe more, and I'm quite sure my system hasn't been down. I've had > mail from other sources. Anyone out there? Jennifer > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassHi Jennifer, Me thinks that there may be that Christmas rush on, at least that's what I'm experiencing. And so, there's not much time for the internet and typing. I've received several bungi messages during the last few days. so maybe your server had some problems? You're not alone, never fear. Glass workers only seem that way. T. in Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 20:55:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOcmq-0000QXa; Fri, 15 Nov 96 20:55 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: test? Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 21:19:14 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov15.141914.0> References: <<1996Nov15.153313.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk maruca@netaxs.com wrote: > > Is everyone making ready for the holiday crafts fairs? Hard to believe > there've been no posts today! > > Mary > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassHi Mary, Seems like none of us has time right now, what with the last minute "let's get these holiday items done" mode looming over us. It's just that time of year. Never fear, there will be lots of messages soon. It's cyclical. We work alone, yet don't enjoy being alone on the internet. Strange people we are. T. in Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 15 22:59:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOeiO-0000gCa; Fri, 15 Nov 96 22:58 PST X-Path: aol.com!LNETWORKS From: LNETWORKS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: no mail Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 01:58:49 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov15.205849.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, I have been having problems with reconfiguring after Win95 installation, only thing that works right now is AOL (bless their little pointy heads) and also real busy getting ready for shows. Still here thou, never fear. Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 03:15:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOihv-00016Aa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 03:14 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: test? Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 06:10:00 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.1100.0> References: <<1996Nov15.153313.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk maruca@netaxs.com wrote: > > Is everyone making ready for the holiday crafts fairs? Hard to believe > there've been no posts today! > > Mary > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass I worked till midnight last night on Christmas projects. You can't cut and type at the same time. While cutting last night I tried warming the glass for the first time. I placed it in front of a small space heater for a few minutes before cutting. I never had an easier job of cutting. This is a great suggestion. I still cheated on my inside curves with my wonderful new Taurus II, but I believe I could have just as easily cut these curves. I need suggestions. I am making a box and I want to put an agate in the lid. It is multicolored with iron pyrite on the edge which will act as the handle. My problem is that this stone is 1/4 inch thick while the glass is only 1/8". Any suggestions on how I can pull this off and have a project that looks good? I have not decided yet what type of glass to surround the stone with. -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 04:08:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOjXn-0001STa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 04:08 PST X-Path: voicenet.com!hilary From: "Hilary A. Bobker" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Exhausting April Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 06:34:03 -0400 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.2343.0> References: <<1996Nov11.45313.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: HABit Fashion Services Precedence: bulk Monona Rossol wrote: > > Sorry April, my husband has been in the hospital most of this week and I've > forgotten a number of things I intended to do. > Monona- sorry to hear that your husband has been ill. Please give him our best wishes for a speedy recovery. Hilary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 08:08:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOnHf-0001Qsa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 08:07 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Busy little elves Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 11:12:41 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.31241.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Hi all, Busy, busy, busy little elves working in the glass shop. Making angels, and plant containers. April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 08:19:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOnSR-0001Rda; Sat, 16 Nov 96 08:19 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Cheese Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 11:22:47 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.32247.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk I believe that that the cream is the fat. The actual cheese is the protein and the whey is the starch. If I'm wrong someone please correct me. The book doesn't say. April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 08:39:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOnlu-0000FBa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 08:39 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: test? Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 11:37:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.63732.0> References: <<1996Nov16.1100.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk James R. Laws wrote: > > maruca@netaxs.com wrote: > > > > Is everyone making ready for the holiday crafts fairs? Hard to believe > > there've been no posts today! > > > > Mary > > > > ---- > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > I worked till midnight last night on Christmas projects. You can't cut > and type at the same time. > > While cutting last night I tried warming the glass for the first time. > I placed it in front of a small space heater for a few minutes before > cutting. I never had an easier job of cutting. This is a great > suggestion. I still cheated on my inside curves with my wonderful new > Taurus II, but I believe I could have just as easily cut these curves. > > I need suggestions. I am making a box and I want to put an agate in the > lid. It is multicolored with iron pyrite on the edge which will act as > the handle. My problem is that this stone is 1/4 inch thick while the > glass is only 1/8". Any suggestions on how I can pull this off and have > a project that looks good? I have not decided yet what type of glass to > surround the stone with. > -- > "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as > he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, > and he will become what he could and should be." > Goethe > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass you simply wrap the agate with foil 3/8" works fine. it's ok to let the agate rise above the surface, just put a bead around it. you can also put decorative soldering there too. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 08:40:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOnmf-0000ufa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 08:39 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: ooops! cheese Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 11:44:47 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov16.34447.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Sorry guys, Making cheese questions posted to wrong group. April ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 16 17:53:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vOwPR-0001Soa; Sat, 16 Nov 96 17:52 PST X-Path: tznet.com!DIACCA From: Topp Shop & Gallery To: glass@bungi.com Subject: bookkeeping & taxes Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 19:51:11 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19961117015111.00668df4@mail.tznet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk HI! Since I am a newbie at this stuff, having gotten my first computer a few months ago after 28 years in business. What kind of program should I be looking for to do my books. Inventory, costs, record keeping, tracking customers. I will want to change everything I have been doing all these years. Have read in the Craft Report over the years different artists writting about whatever program they use. But at that time I didn't have a computer! Now what! I am running Windows 95 and Word most of the time. My daughter says I need Excel? What would be compatible and not too far over my head for an artists business? Pat ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 05:37:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vP7Ok-0001RSa; Sun, 17 Nov 96 05:36 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: bookkeeping & taxes Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 07:32:49 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961116091841.2f6795ac@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk My husband uses Quatro Pro and says it is user freindly... good luck Meg At 07:51 PM 11/16/96 -0600, you wrote: >HI! > >Since I am a newbie at this stuff, having gotten my first computer a few >months ago after 28 years in business. What kind of program should I be >looking for to do my books. Inventory, costs, record keeping, tracking >customers. I will want to change everything I have been doing all these >years. Have read in the Craft Report over the years different artists >writting about whatever program they use. But at that time I didn't have a >computer! Now what! I am running Windows 95 and Word most of the time. My >daughter says I need Excel? What would be compatible and not too far over >my head for an artists business? Pat > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 08:35:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPAAZ-0001F0a; Sun, 17 Nov 96 08:34 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: bookkeeping & taxes Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 11:28:50 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov17.62850.0> References: <<1.5.4.32.19961117015111.00668df4@mail.tznet.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Topp Shop & Gallery wrote: > > HI! > > Since I am a newbie at this stuff, having gotten my first computer a few > months ago after 28 years in business. What kind of program should I be > looking for to do my books. Inventory, costs, record keeping, tracking > customers. I will want to change everything I have been doing all these > years. Have read in the Craft Report over the years different artists > writting about whatever program they use. But at that time I didn't have a > computer! Now what! I am running Windows 95 and Word most of the time. My > daughter says I need Excel? What would be compatible and not too far over > my head for an artists business? Pat > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass I would recommend "Quick Books" made by Quicken. All of Quicken's products are well thought out and user friendly. -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 09:53:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPBO5-0001RDa; Sun, 17 Nov 96 09:52 PST X-Path: midusa.net!glassman From: Richard Morrison To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: bookkeeping & taxes Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 11:52:24 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov17.55224.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961116091841.2f6795ac@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Richglass Creations Precedence: bulk Richard LaVal wrote: > > My husband uses Quatro Pro and says it is user freindly... good luck Meg > > At 07:51 PM 11/16/96 -0600, you wrote: > >HI! > > > >Since I am a newbie at this stuff, having gotten my first computer a few > >months ago after 28 years in business. What kind of program should I be > >looking for to do my books. Inventory, costs, record keeping, tracking > >customers. I will want to change everything I have been doing all these > >years. Have read in the Craft Report over the years different artists > >writting about whatever program they use. But at that time I didn't have a > >computer! Now what! I am running Windows 95 and Word most of the time. My > >daughter says I need Excel? What would be compatible and not too far over > >my head for an artists business? Pat > > > >---- > >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > > > > Richard and Meg LaVal > apdo. 24-5655 > Monteverde > COSTA RICA > tel: 506 645 5052 > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 11:41:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPD4M-0000NNa; Sun, 17 Nov 96 11:39 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Bookkeeping Date: Mon, 18 Nov 1996 14:35:27 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov18.143527.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk In reply to Todd Shop and Gallery We use Quick Books and think its very good and user friendly, it give a lot of help. Good Luck: The Craft Nook, Inc. 227 South 8th Street Fernandina Bch., Fla. 32034 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 19:36:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPKV0-0001Iva; Sun, 17 Nov 96 19:35 PST X-Path: voicenet.com!hilary From: "Hilary A. Bobker" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: bookkeeping & taxes Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 22:01:44 -0400 Message-ID: <1996Nov17.18144.0> References: <<1.5.4.32.19961117015111.00668df4@mail.tznet.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: HABit Fashion Services Precedence: bulk Topp Shop & Gallery wrote: > >What kind of program should I be looking for to do my books. Pat- Try Quicken or the more advanced Quick Books. Can't be beat for simple minded record keeping. Hilary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 17 19:47:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPKfQ-0000XUa; Sun, 17 Nov 96 19:46 PST X-Path: direct.ca!tonsper From: direct.ca!tonsper To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re:Get your husband back soon Date: Sun Nov 17 19:46:36 1996 Message-ID: <96Nov17.194421-0800pdt.33647-21560+756@orb.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Best wishes Monona. Hope that your husband is up and running soon. Debbie A. Vancouver, BC. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 18 07:47:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPVv0-0000sTa; Mon, 18 Nov 96 07:47 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: test? Date: Mon, 18 Nov 96 10:45:08 -0500 Message-ID: <9611181045.AA21947@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<1996Nov15.153313.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > Is everyone making ready for the holiday crafts fairs? Hard to believe > there've been no posts today! I will not stoop so low as to make stained glass X-mas ornaments, etc. Of course, I don't do stained glass for a living. I don't have a commercial outlet for anything I like to make, yet, but I doubt if a holiday craft fair would work for me. What about consignment art galleries? Anyone do this? -- David ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 18 15:52:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPdUD-0001WOa; Mon, 18 Nov 96 15:52 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: consignment Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 18:47:51 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov19.184751.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk To David Cogen David, you did not say where you are located. We are a gift and craft store,located on Amelia Island, Fla. We take consigmentd. We pay every two weeks and give you an item by item of the pieces sold. Be carefull. Some people will try to rob you. If we can help please give us a call The Craft Nook, Inc. 227 South 8th Street Fernandina Bch., Fla. 32034 904-321-1601 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 05:55:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPqdg-0000WWa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 05:55 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 08:54:24 -0500 Message-ID: <199611191354.IAA05556@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David Cogen asked about consignment art galleries... First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do I, lucky me too) but for some people on this list it's a very important contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. I don't have my work in any art galleries, but I have joined a co-op of artists and artisans who rent a small store in a tourist/ski town near my house. We all display our work in the store and are free to put on display whatever we want. If someone wants to turn out multiple small items at a low cost and price that's their choice. Most of us prefer to take our time, do larger, more time-consuming "arty" work, but, again, that's our choice. We are each responsible for our portion of the rent, and we receive 100% of the sale proceeds of our stuff. We also have consignment members who agree to pay 38% of the sales to us. All things considered, it works out pretty well. Have a nice day. Jennifer ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 06:56:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPrb7-0000PJa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 06:56 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 96 09:55:30 -0500 Message-ID: <9611190955.AA03790@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<199611191354.IAA05556@smtp1.sympatico.ca>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. > You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do > I, lucky me too) but for some people on this list it's a very important > contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put > down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. You're right. That did come off a little harsh. It was intended to be humorous/sarcastic. I didn't mean to be insulting in any way. I am sorry. My projects tend toward intricate many-pieced designs that take me many many hours. My wife is always telling me to make X-mas ornaments, etc, because she could take them to her craft fairs, etc. I know she's right, but haven't done it yet. -- David ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 06:57:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPrbg-0000R6a; Tue, 19 Nov 96 06:57 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: consignment galleries Date: 19 Nov 96 09:56:37 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov19.145637.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. > ... for some people on this list it's a very important >contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put >down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. Hear, hear! Well said. It takes more muscles to sneer than it does to smile, after all. Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 07:17:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPrvM-0000a8a; Tue, 19 Nov 96 07:17 PST X-Path: ibm.net!mstreng From: Martin Streng To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 16:13:12 +0100 Message-ID: <1996Nov19.171312.0> References: <<9611190955.AA03790@LL.MIT.EDU>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Crediet- en Effectenbank Precedence: bulk Hi all, when looking at some (most) news-groups i'm very often disappointed because people are so rude and unforgiving. When someone makes a clumsy remark entire populations start sending hate-mail. They don't even bother to consider the possibility that maybe this person did not mean to offend anybody. When i then look at this glass@bungi bunch and the way they COMMUNICATE i really feel good. Thank you all!! David Cogen wrote: > > > First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. > > You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do > > I, lucky me too) but for some people on this list it's a very important > > contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put > > down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. > > You're right. That did come off a little harsh. It was intended to be > humorous/sarcastic. I didn't mean to be insulting in any way. I am sorry. > > My projects tend toward intricate many-pieced designs that take me many many > hours. My wife is always telling me to make X-mas ornaments, etc, because she > could take them to her craft fairs, etc. I know she's right, but haven't done > it yet. > > -- David > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 07:32:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPs9e-0000h6a; Tue, 19 Nov 96 07:32 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 10:30:22 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov19.53022.0> References: <<199611191354.IAA05556@smtp1.sympatico.ca>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk H. Taylor Buckner wrote: > > David Cogen asked about consignment art galleries... > First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. > You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do > I, lucky me too) but for some people on this list it's a very important > contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put > down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. > I don't have my work in any art galleries, but I have joined a co-op > of artists and artisans who rent a small store in a tourist/ski town near my > house. We all display our work in the store and are free to put on display > whatever we want. If someone wants to turn out multiple small items at a > low cost and price that's their choice. Most of us prefer to take our time, > do larger, more time-consuming "arty" work, but, again, that's our choice. > We are each responsible for our portion of the rent, and we receive 100% of > the sale proceeds of our stuff. We also have consignment members who agree > to pay 38% of the sales to us. All things considered, it works out pretty > well. Have a nice day. Jennifer > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i'm curious, i go to a store very simaler to yours, i was wondering if your larger more arty things sell? is the town a 'touristy area' or a 'richer area', so far the most expensive thing i sold there was like only 20 bucks. i heard that country stuff is selling (if that means anything in other country's) so i'm making a bunch of mini-panels..i hope they sell, or i sure am going to have alot of gifts at home...:) ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 07:40:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPsHG-00019ga; Tue, 19 Nov 96 07:39 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 10:38:11 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov19.53811.0> References: <<1996Nov19.171312.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Martin Streng wrote: > > Hi all, > > when looking at some (most) news-groups i'm very often disappointed > because people are so rude and unforgiving. When someone makes a > clumsy remark entire populations start sending hate-mail. They don't > even bother to consider the possibility that maybe this person > did not mean to offend anybody. > > When i then look at this glass@bungi bunch and the way they COMMUNICATE > i really feel good. Thank you all!! > > David Cogen wrote: > > > > > First of all, don't put down Christmas ornament making so adamantly. > > > You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do > > > I, lucky me too) but for some people on this list it's a very important > > > contribution to their daily bread. Hard for them to have someone to put > > > down their efforts in such a cavalier manner. > > > > You're right. That did come off a little harsh. It was intended to be > > humorous/sarcastic. I didn't mean to be insulting in any way. I am sorry. > > > > My projects tend toward intricate many-pieced designs that take me many many > > hours. My wife is always telling me to make X-mas ornaments, etc, because she > > could take them to her craft fairs, etc. I know she's right, but haven't done > > it yet. > > > > -- David > > ---- > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well, yeah, but some times people do mean what they say (not in this case though). i can understand how suncatchers can be laughed at, there the little things compared to windows and lamps. they can only really be sold for a little amount of money. but on the other hand, suncatchers make up at least 50% of todays stained glass, although i have to admit that alot of the stuff in gift shops are junk (the ones that are lead with electroplate on them). and yeah there are slip ups, and in some cases some people truly mean what they say no matter how snobbish it may seem... ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 09:21:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPtqp-0000qWa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 09:20 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: "Boatwright, W.L." Subject: Re: consignment Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 09:18:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov19.11849.0> References: <<1996Nov19.184751.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi. You said you took consignments. What rate do you provide to the artist? In some cases the mark up for the artist to get a fair price is far more than tourists or buyers are willing to pay.. PJ from CA. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 10:40:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPv5L-0000h9a; Tue, 19 Nov 96 10:39 PST X-Path: UCONNVM.UCONN.EDU!HCLADM02 From: mail To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Country stuff(Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 96 13:36:30 EST Message-ID: <961119.133859.EST.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu> References: <<1996Nov19.53022.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Mike Savad mentions that "country stuff" is selling, and it does, here in Connecticut. That does NOT include glass, far as I can tell. Wood and fabric and the ever-present wreaths. I hear glass is big in Florida! -- Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 12:32:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vPwpn-0001Osa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 12:31 PST X-Path: CapAccess.org!rejones From: "Robert E. Jones" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Country stuff(Re: consignment galleries Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 15:34:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1996Nov19.103436.0> References: <<961119.133859.EST.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk On Tue, 19 Nov 1996, mail wrote: > > Mike Savad mentions that "country stuff" is selling, and it does, > here in Connecticut. That does NOT include glass, far as I can > tell. Wood and fabric and the ever-present wreaths. > > I hear glass is big in Florida! That makes sense. Houses in Florida traditionally have more windows in them than home up north due to the climate. I live in a new house (it's 1 month old) in PA. 2,200 square feet with 9 (that's nine) windows. Very energy efficient, but tough to display any work. Bob ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 16:39:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQ0fq-0001ILa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 16:37 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Consignment (but not only..) Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 01:06:00 +0000 Message-ID: <199611200038.AAA32005@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David, What a gallant chap you are! It's so easy to relate to one's own circumstances only and let slip an unfortunate remark quite innocently, to which someone somewhere takes offense. I have done it myself... Martin, How equally gallant of you to post those kind comments into the Group. We can be quite a hot-headed bunch, now and then. But, Thank God for a smile and a bit of laughter to diffuse a tricky situation. What I personally enjoy is, that we have got to know one another as individuals over this last year or so, we have also been able to look at each others' work. To me personally, it's been a great source of both enjoyment, new information, new sources, new ways of doing things. (...and I have still your e-mail to reply to...) Consignment: (Now I know what the term mean - I was puzzled at first. The difference between English and English, yet again!). David (and no doubt others), I am quite sure that "Across the Pond" you have Community Centres, Leisure Centres in one form or another, as we do here in UK. Over here, these are run by the local government. These also include local Sports/Arts/Crafts Centres, as well as your local and/or regional Public Library. Because they are designed to represent and serve the local or regional community, they also have to SHOW that they do. This often takes the form of display areas, display cabinets or such similar within the premises which are made available to local artists and craftsmen to have a temporary, semi-permanent or permanent display, often for free. The display area is free, but anything they sell for you, you will have to give them a set percentage of the selling price (normally 20%). This is how I myself started off selling my small-item stained glass (mainly clocks). Local Libraries and Leisure Centres also are keen on arranging "Craft Demonstration Days". This is the level I suggest you try and enter into. Local Art Colleges should hav display cabinets for local artists/craftsmen. Ignore totally so called Art Galleries!! I think it was Mike Savad who said that most of them are a rip-off (Peggy Johnson had some very relevant addition to make as well). I get the feeling that the situation is very similar in UK as it is in the USA. I have had a number of offers over the years to have my stained glass displayed in both Regional and National Art Galleries... The cost to me in respect of time, travelling, administration, arguments, display accessories, accounting, commission payment to the "Art Gallery",associated bills, and subsequent servicing of end-customer and so forth, makes it cost more than the "kudos" is worth in hard cash in my bank account. The "kudos" of having a couple of stained glass pieces for sale at the Victoria & Albert Museum in London, just isn't worth it. What is for sale there is incredibly expensive - for WHAT it is. Not for me. I like to live at the grass roots. And I like to produce quality that I do not have to get red in the face about. But , two additional accessories you MUST produce in multitudes to look professional (but not over-lavish) and that is 1) a business card; 2) a good-looking, crisp, promotional leaflet about yourself and your stained glass work - not too glossy, not lavish (or people might worry about the price they have to pay). That leaflet should include details about how you operate (are you prepared to visit the customer?), in very general terms, what can the customer expect; who you are; what your strengths are ; what stained glass have you done so far and have you exhibited or received any awards/prizes and how/when/where to contact you. You should be able to produce such a leaflet on your computer using a very simple DTP package. It should be eye-catching, simple, neat, professional and informative. I am myself still receiving orders for quite substantial stained glass work on the basis of such a leaflet that I produced on my early DOS DTP package about 5-6 years ago. .... Your next stage up, would be to make an attractive colour-photomontage of your best work, have it colour-photocopied (or in-deed run off you splendiferous colour computer printer!!), laminate it and use it as a "special" hand-out to the customer with mega-money in his back-pocket..... (Make sure you add all such costs into the quotation to him. If you are too cheap, he thinks you are no good!) "Craft Fairs" as such , here in the UK , have become saturated with little old ladies who knit pink wooly toilet-roll covers with frills on...... (i.e. a dead loss on a local basis. The Big International Craft Exhibitions are a different matter, but then you are talking mega-money!!). I think it was Mike Savad again who referred to the absolutely dreadful quality of sun-catchers on sale in so called "Craft Shops" They are made with some sort of strange lead very quickly. They have hung in the shop for a few weeks . The lead has begun to sag and part company with the glass. They are sort of made out of 5 indifferent pieces of glass, out of some sort of strange pattern book, with a few blobs of clumsy solder to hold them together... You look at them and you positively "cringe" and when you turn the price label and realize that the shop is demanding about 50 bucks from the ignorant punter, you crawl away almost in shame. We have them here too Mike.... YYYEEEEUUUCCCCKKKKK! So its not surprising that the craftsmen seriously involved into sun-catchers have some serious obstacles to fight against. It's not my thing, it's not your thing... It doesn't matter what you do, if you do it WELL and apply real craftsmanship and individuality to what you do do, then THAT is what matters. Oh shit, I have gone on too long again... David, has this been of any use? Help? Ideas? If not, Mea Culpa! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 17:39:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQ1dU-0001LSa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 17:39 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Up-date Health & Safety in UK Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 02:07:40 +0000 Message-ID: <199611200139.BAA12344@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi All, I have kept my nose to the grindstone for the last couple of weeks and said very little; Reason 1: I have had to pacify & deal with 2 particularly obnoxious "know-it-all" customers ( we all get them now and then) I could have murdered the buggers...! Reason 2: I am repairing 3 panels from 3 different customers dating back to about 1830. I am absolutely terrified. 1 panel belongs to an Internationally renowed painter who has already turned down 4 other stained glass craftsmen - he is particularly "fussy"....; Reason 3: the second one belonging to a classic music artist known world-wide, for whom I have made some rather dramatic musical instruments stained glass panels a couple of years ago; Reason 4: A super-market bag of about 500 bits delivered to me in total shambles with roughly the instructions "recreate it Elisabeth, and do it to size and period"! WHY do I let myself into these things!!!??? Reason 5: Elisabeth, will we have our "Whale Design" before Christmas? (Please give me a template, polite, informative, helpful, customer-friendly answer that spells NO). Reason 6: Chartres: I am deep into it. Reason 7: IT's time for the UK tax-man to demand HIS accounts again!! Reason 8: The GOOD BIT!!!!! I have shared with you all the trials & tribulations about my friend Susan and her forced early retirement as Head of Arts in a UK secondary School on ground of health problems caused by the School. In these last 2 months there have been quite a lot of medical examinations I have had to ferry her to and from. Initially the government medical team, agreed she had suffered, but because government money is involved, they left her short of 2 "points" of the recognized classification. We then had to lodge an official and legal Appeal. (i.e. another 6-8 horrendeous form-filling sessions). Luckily her Medical Practinioner was quite helpful and agreed to write another letter/certificate. More tests, more officialese, more hearings, more Medical Panels..Susan and I spent a solid week rehearsing "interview techniques".... Day of Interview: me sweating blood (... I Can't be THERE!!) 10 days later: The UK Government confirms that additional information has come to light, thus confirming "Permanent Disability Status" Monetory Benifit to be allowed AND back-dated to the time THEY disputed it. Moreover, an Appeal would therefore no longer be necessary.. PHEW!! Guess who has just written to the Union Solicitor!!?? This is really ammunition! I am well pleased! Susan herself has spent a rather diffucult autumn. She WANTS to do so many things, she tries so hard, she helps me with my drawings, she has made such considerable contributions towards my stained glass drawing techniqes and abilities. But Life just ain't just that easy if you can't breathe...... So many of you have helped me and encouraged me both in the Group and privately. I did say, it's a long haul. This was quite a victory! Hence I want to share it with you. Hey Folks, We here in the UK have just had our FIRST snow! I am beginning to scout for a nice gammon hind-quarter to shove cloves, mustard and all sorts of Swedish exotic things into for a Swedish Christmas. (Pickled red cabbage,Curley-soup with egg halves & Swedish Caviar, Swedish Rice porridge with cinnamon.....???)) Want a slice?? Come on over!! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 19 18:11:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQ285-0001RJa; Tue, 19 Nov 96 18:11 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Monona Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 02:39:20 +0000 Message-ID: <199611200211.CAA19452@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Dear Champion, The fact that I am posting my message on "the tail end", does not mean that I did not have you in my mnd WEEKS ago.We all function on the basis of our own fundamental premises and daily lives. Thank you, Monona, for having put so much of yourself into the Group, when you had anxieties of your own. We are ALL with you and will not be satisfied with anything less than that your other half shall make total and complete revcovery. If not, why not and we will all want to share and help!! Like it or Leave it Monona! Much Love & Thoughts! Elisabeth 'n Toby and all of UK ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 00:30:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQ82r-000049a; Wed, 20 Nov 96 00:30 PST X-Path: ibm.net!mstreng From: Martin Streng To: Mail_groep_glas_in_lood Subject: poor quality/low(?) prices Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 09:16:54 +0100 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.101654.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Crediet- en Effectenbank Precedence: bulk My teacher, who also has his own shop/workplace in Arnhem (the Nether- lands) told me this: He has been contacted a couple of times by someone, asking him if he would be interested in having some of his pieces made in India. He was thinking of sun-catchers and other "mass-production" stuff. The costs of shipping, travelling and so on would be far less then the profit they could make. My teacher turned this offer down, but he is very disturbed and told us the end of civilization as we know it was near ;-) I don't think his customers come to him because he always makes the same window over and over again, but because they truly admire his craftsmenship and unique designs. But, as Mike said: these little pieces do make up a lot of one's income. Luckily he is not in the tiffany-lamp-buisiness: we have shops selling these in practically every street in every town. They are made in Poland or by retired/unemployed people. They all look the same! I myself am a systems analist and still do a lot of programming. In this buisiness too, the low-cost countries are taking over parts of the market. And again: they only take over the mass-programming. It appears that close contact with your customers is worth more then cheap prices. Keep up the good work!! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 04:23:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQBgj-0001Lha; Wed, 20 Nov 96 04:23 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 07:18:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.21832.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk OK folks, the ultimate question. Has anyone thought of any great things to do with scrap glass? I still have the first piece of glass I cut ten years ago. I store it by color in large clear plastic bins. I use it for small pieces that I am working on but it would be nice to find some other uses. I really have never liked the type of mosaics that use small squares of glass, so that is really not one of my options. What are your ideas other than a large trash bin? I love my glass and I have a hard time parting with it in that manner. I do have one idea that I would like to share. A great aunt, that has long since passed, used to save small pieces of glass of different colors which she would put in a resin and make beautiful cylindrical candle holders. We still have one but I have no idea how to make one. Does anyone know? -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 04:27:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQBkP-0001PUa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 04:27 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!104344.622 From: "Christie Wood & George D'Ascenzo" <104344.622@CompuServe.COM> To: "\"M. Savad\"" , Bungi Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: 20 Nov 96 07:22:35 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov20.122235.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Mike. I sell most of my works through consignment galleries. Most of my sales are in two categories: 1) $20 range for original design suncatcher angels 2) $100-$600 for custom or semi-custom panels made to order. In the later category I hang up a 'sample' panel which is large, complex and an original design. Then people see the 'sample', come into the gallery, discuss something similar with the owner, and then owner and I come up with a quote for a custom or semi-custom panel for the client. I change the 'sample' panel about once every other month. Works for me. The owners and I have a good working relationship. They know what I can/can't do, and don't promise the client anything until I have worked on the design. I control the pricing of the work. With one gallery I even gave her my pricing scheme since I have authorized her to quote prices for me. Maybe this approach will work for you. ...Christie Wood ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 04:29:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQBme-00001ba; Wed, 20 Nov 96 04:29 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Up-date Health & Safety in UK Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 07:24:40 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.22440.0> References: <<199611200139.BAA12344@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Toby wrote: > > Hi All, > I have kept my nose to the grindstone for the last couple of weeks > and said very little; > Reason 1: I have had to pacify & deal with 2 particularly obnoxious > "know-it-all" customers ( we all get them now and then) I could have > murdered the buggers...! > Reason 2: I am repairing 3 panels from 3 different customers dating > back to about 1830. I am absolutely terrified. 1 panel belongs to an > Internationally renowed painter who has already turned down 4 other > stained glass craftsmen - he is particularly "fussy"....; > Reason 3: the second one belonging > to a classic music artist known world-wide, for whom I have made some > rather dramatic musical instruments stained glass panels a couple of > years ago; > Reason 4: A super-market bag of about 500 bits delivered to me in total > shambles with roughly the instructions "recreate it Elisabeth, and do > it to size and period"! > WHY do I let myself into these things!!!??? > Reason 5: Elisabeth, will we have our "Whale Design" before Christmas? > (Please give me a template, polite, informative, helpful, > customer-friendly answer that spells NO). > Reason 6: Chartres: I am deep into it. > Reason 7: IT's time for the UK tax-man to demand HIS accounts again!! > > Reason 8: The GOOD BIT!!!!! > I have shared with you all the trials & tribulations about my friend > Susan and her forced early retirement as Head of Arts in a UK > secondary School on ground of health problems caused by the School. > In these last 2 months there have been quite a lot of medical > examinations I have had to ferry her to and from. Initially the > government medical team, agreed she had suffered, but because > government money is involved, they left her short of 2 "points" of > the recognized classification. We then had to lodge an official and > legal Appeal. (i.e. another 6-8 horrendeous form-filling sessions). > Luckily her Medical Practinioner was quite helpful and agreed to > write another letter/certificate. More tests, more officialese, more > hearings, more Medical Panels..Susan and I spent a solid week > rehearsing "interview techniques".... > Day of Interview: me sweating blood (... I Can't be THERE!!) > 10 days later: The UK Government confirms that additional information > has come to light, thus confirming "Permanent Disability Status" > Monetory Benifit to be allowed AND back-dated to the time THEY > disputed it. Moreover, an Appeal would therefore no longer be > necessary.. > PHEW!! > Guess who has just written to the Union Solicitor!!?? This is really > ammunition! I am well pleased! > Susan herself has spent a rather diffucult autumn. She WANTS to do so > many things, she tries so hard, she helps me with my drawings, she > has made such considerable contributions towards my stained glass > drawing techniqes and abilities. But Life just ain't just that easy > if you can't breathe...... > So many of you have helped me and encouraged me both in the Group and > privately. > I did say, it's a long haul. This was quite a victory! Hence I want > to share it with you. > Hey Folks, We here in the UK have just had our FIRST snow! > > I am beginning to scout for a nice gammon hind-quarter to shove > cloves, mustard and all sorts of Swedish exotic things into for a > Swedish Christmas. (Pickled red cabbage,Curley-soup with egg halves & > Swedish Caviar, Swedish Rice porridge with cinnamon.....???)) > Want a slice?? > Come on over!! > Elisabeth 'n Toby > ---- > As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" > North Lights Stained Glass - homepage > http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm > ---- > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass And I thought I had a high stress job! I think I am currently happy to be just doing glass as a hobby and not a profession. The way it is now I just give all of my work as gifts. If they don't like it, at least it is the thought that counts. -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 07:47:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQErw-00004ra; Wed, 20 Nov 96 07:47 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 10:45:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.54532.0> References: <<1996Nov20.21832.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk James R. Laws wrote: > > OK folks, the ultimate question. Has anyone thought of any great things > to do with scrap glass? I still have the first piece of glass I cut ten > years ago. I store it by color in large clear plastic bins. I use it > for small pieces that I am working on but it would be nice to find some > other uses. I really have never liked the type of mosaics that use > small squares of glass, so that is really not one of my options. What > are your ideas other than a large trash bin? I love my glass and I have > a hard time parting with it in that manner. > > I do have one idea that I would like to share. A great aunt, that has > long since passed, used to save small pieces of glass of different > colors which she would put in a resin and make beautiful cylindrical > candle holders. We still have one but I have no idea how to make one. > Does anyone know? > -- > "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as > he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, > and he will become what he could and should be." > Goethe > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well, of course you can use it to make suncatchers, mosaics are good and they don't have to be squares (i can't stand those either), they could be made just like a suncatcher only with grout. stepping stones are coming in for some reason. i heard of a person making wind chimes from them, by drilling a small hole in the top and hanging it. if you have a kiln of some kind you can fuse it, as long as you know there compatable with each other, or at least you can get one sheet and fuse it with it self. generally i use it for small things, suncatchers and the like. an easy project that sells pretty well too is a 2x3" pocket mirror. you cut out 2 exact size pieces, 1 mirror, 1 color (solid), and foil them together with 3/8". i've had no problems selling them at $3.45 i've seen them as high as $10.00 but that's way too much. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 08:04:56 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQF8g-000044a; Wed, 20 Nov 96 08:04 PST X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 16:03:07 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <9611201603.AA14968@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<1996Nov20.21832.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > I do have one idea that I would like to share. A great aunt, that has > long since passed, used to save small pieces of glass of different > colors which she would put in a resin and make beautiful cylindrical > candle holders. We still have one but I have no idea how to make one. > Does anyone know? Hmm. Many years ago I had a go at making resin thingys. As far as I can remember, it's simply a process of taking the transparent resin, adding any colouring, stirring it up with a few drops of hardener, pouring it into the mould, letting it set, add any objects, repeat with another layer, and so on. Typically 3-4 layers for a normal paperweight - one clear layer for the top, one or two more to encapsulate things, then a final (often opaque) layer for the base. Usually, it came out shiny from the mould - you had to sand/polish the last layer if you needed that shiny, but since that usually ended up on the bottom, it was often OK as it was. I can't remember if you had to coat the mould with any release agent or not; I think the mould I was using was some sort of glossy ceramic, not the flexible rubbery ones you use for candlemaking and plaster casts. So for a candle holder, you'd just need a cylindrical mold, with an inner cylindrical lump to create the hole in the middle; you probably need to be quite careful about heat, since the resin is reasonably likely to do nasty things if it overheats or catches fire (*) (for example, if a candle burns all the way down) - you may need to incorporate some other type of holder to avoid this sort of problem. (*) I've got no idea what they put in the resin, but I've never seen any plastic that *doesn't* get upset when overheated - at best, it smells awful, at worst it's likely to be toxic and/or spread fires. -- _|_ Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) / | Hemel Hempstead, UK jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \_|_ jerry@shell.portal.com (alternate) \__/ www.selune.demon.co.uk (soon) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 09:37:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQGa9-0000EMa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 09:37 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, "\"M. Savad\"" , Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:32:58 -0600 Message-ID: <199611201732.LAA16361@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 07:22 AM 11/20/96 EST, Christie Wood & George D'Ascenzo wrote: >Hi Mike. I sell most of my works through consignment galleries. Most of my >sales are in two categories: 1) $20 range for original design suncatcher angels >2) $100-$600 for custom or semi-custom panels made to order. In the later >category I hang up a 'sample' panel which is large, complex and an original >design. Then people see the 'sample', come into the gallery, discuss something >similar with the owner, and then owner and I come up with a quote for a custom >or semi-custom panel for the client. I change the 'sample' panel about once >every other month. The sample panel approach sounds like a fine way to go Christie. My experience is that trying to sell premade panels is very difficult especially if they are fairly expensive there seems to always be some thing not quite right to potential buyers. I myself have never sold a premade panel, then again I rarely fabricate panels that are not commissioned. The ones that I have made were originally for competitions and were some of my better work, afterwards I put them out for display in an assortment of retail environments never sold a one of them, ended up as gifts or dust collectors. Len BTW... anybody what to buy a genuine leaded glass panel with a motiff of a black and white grebe barely moving across a pool of dark gray semi-antique with graphic minimalistic water forms in med blue french reamy and a touch of turquoise with a very abstract reflection done in blenko purples and translucent flashed white 24x36. I'll give ya a deal ;-) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 09:57:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQGtV-00004za; Wed, 20 Nov 96 09:57 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, "glass@bungi.com" Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:53:02 -0600 Message-ID: <199611201753.LAA17022@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 07:18 AM 11/20/96 -0500, James R. Laws wrote: >OK folks, the ultimate question. Has anyone thought of any great things >to do with scrap glass? I still have the first piece of glass I cut ten >years ago. I store it by color in large clear plastic bins. I use it >for small pieces that I am working on but it would be nice to find some >other uses. I really have never liked the type of mosaics that use >small squares of glass, so that is really not one of my options. What >are your ideas other than a large trash bin? I love my glass and I have >a hard time parting with it in that manner. Hi James, I just put 4 five gallon buckets of scrap in the truck of my car to help with traction when the snows fly this afternoon. I have also considered using scrap as aggragate for a small concrete pour There are many small items that can be fabricated with scrap as suggested by other folks but if thats not your thing then I would suggest placing a clasified ad or some other means of getting the word out. I do it periodically usually during the yard sale season and have always sold lots of glass to crafters who have ideas for small stuff. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 09:58:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQGuk-0000zta; Wed, 20 Nov 96 09:58 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:54:19 -0600 Message-ID: <199611201754.LAA17070@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do >I, lucky me too) Many of us who have been on this list for awhile have made comments that where a bit hasty and in my humble opinion you are in this case guilty of that yourself. Perhapes you would care to clarify what you mean by the above statement that you are lucky not to have to earn a living at SG. Are you implying that the quality of your work, sales ability and/or commitement/love of SG is not adequate enough to provide you the income necessary to satisfy your lifestyle, and that those of us so inclined are somehow less fortunate then you? Or that what you do for a living, if anything, is a superior activity? Just asking. Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 09:59:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQGvs-0000Dua; Wed, 20 Nov 96 09:59 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:55:29 -0600 Message-ID: <199611201755.LAA17130@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >You may not have to earn a living at stained glass - lucky you, (neither do >I, lucky me too) Many of us who have been on this list for awhile have made comments that where a bit hasty and in my humble opinion you are in this case guilty of that yourself. Perhapes you would care to clarify what you mean by the above statement that you are lucky not to have to earn a living at SG. Are you implying that the quality of your work, sales ability and/or commitement/love of SG is not adequate enough to provide you the income necessary to satisfy your lifestyle, and that those of us so inclined are somehow less fortunate then you? Or that what you do for a living, if anything, is a superior activity? Just asking. Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 11:32:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQINt-0000Lqa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 11:32 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Date: 20 Nov 96 14:29:53 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov20.192953.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Perhapes you would care to clarify what you mean by the above >statement that you are lucky not to have to earn a living at SG. > ... Or that what you do for a living, if >anything, is a superior activity? Just asking. I didn't read her comment that way at all, but as an accolade for those of you who *do make their living with *any craft. It's hard work being both creative and businesslike at the same time and I think Elisabeth's attitude has shown her respect for glassworkers all along. You misread her, methinks. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 11:49:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQIdf-0000IDa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 11:48 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Consignment (but not only..) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 96 14:45:33 -0500 Message-ID: <9611201445.AA04154@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<199611200038.AAA32005@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elisabeth sez: > "Craft Fairs" as such , here in the UK , have become saturated with > little old ladies who knit pink wooly toilet-roll covers with frills > on...... (i.e. a dead loss on a local basis. The Big International > Craft Exhibitions are a different matter, but then you are talking > mega-money!!). Very amusing description! Fairly accurate, too, for New England, from what I've seen. Another thing about "Craft Fairs", which is frustrating to those like my wife who are trying to sell their carefully hand-made items, are those who are selling cheap mass-produced imports which superficially look the same to those who don't know much about the craft. She is trying to sell handmade jewelry, while others are selling things they buy from a catalog, at huge markup, and still making a profit. I don't think that kind of thing should be allowed at a "Craft Fair". Nothing against what they're selling, but it's not a craft; that is a misrepresentation. > I think it was Mike Savad again who referred to the absolutely > dreadful quality of sun-catchers on sale in so called "Craft Shops" I was in a consignment type gallery last week that happened to have a lot of stained glass from several different crafters. The differences in quality were amazing! Now, I am not an expert, but I can recognize quality. There was one crafter whose lead lines were nice and rounded and smooth. But others were of varying degrees of quality. The worst of the lot looked like quite a mess. Uneven, flat solder lines, flux residue, dribbles where the solder melted through a large gap between the pieces, corroded and untinned foil, and some of the borders were completely lacking in straightness. And, one of the mirror pieces was starting to corrode, apparently because they used unsuitable mirror glass for the flux, or vice versa. What is unfortunate is that all the items were expensive. And justifiably, because we all know it takes time to make these things. But I could see no relationship between quality and price. This probably does disservice to the art as a whole. With all these items in the same gallery, at similar prices, potential customers may be left with a confused impression of the art as a whole, and be left thinking that stained glass is a rather crude sort of hackery, where sometimes one is "lucky". I sort of rambled in the above. Actually, it may not be quite accurate. This may be the impression to the casual windowshopper, but a potential buyer can, presumably, tell the difference. But, I wonder, are there any buyers? I'll go back in a few months and see what I recognize. The owner did admit to me that it's the ceramics, not the stained glass, that keeps her in business. -- David ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 11:57:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQIm9-0000Nfa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 11:57 PST X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen From: David Cogen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Consignment (but not only..) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 96 14:54:45 -0500 Message-ID: <9611201454.AA04598@LL.MIT.EDU> References: <<199611200038.AAA32005@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elisabeth sez: > hung in the shop for a few weeks . The lead has begun to sag and part > company with the glass. They are sort of made out of 5 indifferent > pieces of glass, out of some sort of strange pattern book, with a few > blobs of clumsy solder to hold them together... You look > at them and you positively "cringe" and when you turn the price label > and realize that the shop is demanding about 50 bucks from the > ignorant punter, you crawl away almost in shame. > We have them here too Mike.... > YYYEEEEUUUCCCCKKKKK! How about educating the customers? Training them to recognize junk? And to appreciate quality? Make up some nice posters. "This is a bad solder line." "This is a good solder line." "Look how beautiful is the second, how ugly is the first". Do it in a way that makes them feel as passionate as you do about quality. Make it so that they have to go right out and buy something of quality, just for the pleasure of owning something so perfect! Of course, I have little idea how this would actually be done. -- David ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 12:57:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQJhL-0000JAa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 12:56 PST X-Path: indy.net!jlaws From: "James R. Laws" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 15:51:39 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.105139.0> References: <<1996Nov20.192953.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >Perhapes you would care to clarify what you mean by the above > >statement that you are lucky not to have to earn a living at SG. > > ... Or that what you do for a living, if > >anything, is a superior activity? Just asking. > > I didn't read her comment that way at all, but as an accolade for those of you > who *do make their living with *any craft. It's hard work being both creative > and businesslike at the same time and I think Elisabeth's attitude has shown her > respect for glassworkers all along. > > You misread her, methinks. > > Albert > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass You clearly did misread my comment on not making a living at stained glass. My statement was intended to say that I am in a very high pressure job but the the level of stress that must be associated with working on repairs for art that is over 100 years old must be equally if not more stressful. By the way, Albert, maybe we should talk. I run a mental hospital for a living and I really like people who interpret things the way you do.;-) -- "Treat a person as he is, and he will remain as he is. Treat a person as if he were what he could be, and he will become what he could and should be." Goethe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 14:33:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQLCq-00004ja; Wed, 20 Nov 96 14:33 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!arthurs.and.willis From: Joseph Arthurs To: glass@bungi.com Subject: sorry if this is a repeat question, how do I remove scratches from glass? Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 17:32:50 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.93250.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, Have been enjoying all the postings and thought some of you might be able to help me with something. I had posted this question on one of the newsgroups but something has happened with our server and I can't access the newsgroups anymore. I have a couple of bevels that I've done an acid etch on. I like to wrap them in came and give them away as hostess gifts (when someone invites me to their house either for the first time or for a party) because they're a little more individual than wine or candy but also incredibly simple. I also try to make them seasonal so if someone really doesn't like it the piece can go into hiding for most of the year. Anyhow, a couple of these bevels have developed hairline scratches (my carelessness, no doubt) that are very small, about a quarter to half inch long. Since they are on bevels they are very obvious. Is there a rubbing compound that can take the small scratch away? Or, am I better to start over? I am interested in rescuing a couple of them because I actually sandblasted those ones. The glass store that had the sandblaster went out of business so I'm out of luck for access. Any tips would be most appreciated. Thanks for your help in advance. Sandy ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 14:58:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQLaa-0000G2a; Wed, 20 Nov 96 14:57 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Date: 20 Nov 96 17:56:32 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov20.225632.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >By the way, Albert, maybe we should talk. I run a mental hospital for a >living and I really like people who interpret things the way you do.;-) Oh, well now ... that's sounds a treat! I'll be ready to check in for a nice long rest at any time just now. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 15:07:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQLjb-0000Qia; Wed, 20 Nov 96 15:07 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Consignment (but not only..) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 18:05:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.13523.0> References: <<9611201454.AA04598@LL.MIT.EDU>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk David Cogen wrote: > > Elisabeth sez: > > > hung in the shop for a few weeks . The lead has begun to sag and part > > company with the glass. They are sort of made out of 5 indifferent > > pieces of glass, out of some sort of strange pattern book, with a few > > blobs of clumsy solder to hold them together... You look > > at them and you positively "cringe" and when you turn the price label > > and realize that the shop is demanding about 50 bucks from the > > ignorant punter, you crawl away almost in shame. > > We have them here too Mike.... > > YYYEEEEUUUCCCCKKKKK! > > How about educating the customers? Training them to recognize junk? And to > appreciate quality? > > Make up some nice posters. > > "This is a bad solder line." > "This is a good solder line." > "Look how beautiful is the second, how ugly is the first". > > Do it in a way that makes them feel as passionate as you do about quality. Make > it so that they have to go right out and buy something of quality, just for the > pleasure of owning something so perfect! > > Of course, I have little idea how this would actually be done. > > -- David > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass the problem with that is that we all do try, but i found that certain people have trouble telling stained glass from that cheap plastic stuff. you know the kind they used to sell in kits to melt in your stove. they call them sun catchers also, which makes things a little confusing. other problems lie when you try to point those things out, alot of people just see it as color, and money. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 15:12:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQLo6-0000MVa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 15:11 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: sorry if this is a repeat question, how do I remove scratches from glass? Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 18:10:03 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.13103.0> References: <<1996Nov20.93250.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joseph Arthurs wrote: > > Hi, > > Have been enjoying all the postings and thought some of you might be able to help me > with something. I had posted this question on one of the newsgroups but something has > happened with our server and I can't access the newsgroups anymore. > > I have a couple of bevels that I've done an acid etch on. I like to wrap them in came > and give them away as hostess gifts (when someone invites me to their house either for > the first time or for a party) because they're a little more individual than wine or > candy but also incredibly simple. I also try to make them seasonal so if someone really > doesn't like it the piece can go into hiding for most of the year. Anyhow, a couple of > these bevels have developed hairline scratches (my carelessness, no doubt) that are very > small, about a quarter to half inch long. Since they are on bevels they are very > obvious. Is there a rubbing compound that can take the small scratch away? Or, am I > better to start over? > > I am interested in rescuing a couple of them because I actually sandblasted those > ones. The glass store that had the sandblaster went out of business so I'm out of luck > for access. > > Any tips would be most appreciated. > > Thanks for your help in advance. > > Sandy > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well if you can feel it with your nail your out of luck...unless of course you put your name there (although it's small they should remember who they got it from. :) ) if you can't feel the scratch, use cerium oxide and water to form a paste. and just keep rubbing it in until the scratch goes away. or at least polishes it a bit hiding it a bit better. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 15:21:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQLxI-0000REa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 15:21 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: Mike Peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 23:21:29 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov20.232129.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 12:18 PM 11/20/96 +0000, you wrote: >OK folks, the ultimate question. Has anyone thought of any great things >to do with scrap glass? We box it up about 10 lbs at a time and donate it to local art schools, high schools, girl and boy scouts, or anything charitable ........ no money changes hand until tax time which works fine for me. At the same time, some people associated with these organizations actually visit our studio to see and/or learn more about stained glass ........... which is even better. Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 16:34:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQN5c-0000BVa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 16:34 PST X-Path: waterw.com!artglass From: artglass@waterw.com (pj friend) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: RestHomes for Glass Artists!!! Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 19:34:24 -0500 Message-ID: <9611210034.AA05318@water.waterw.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > >By the way, Albert, maybe we should talk. I run a mental hospital for a > >living and I really like people who interpret things the way you do.;-) > >Oh, well now ... that's sounds a treat! I'll be ready to check in for a nice >long rest at any time just now. > >Albert, Could you see if there is space for two more???? This is the months for "I need it for the holidays!!" clients. my best pj > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 18:59:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQPM6-0000PLa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 18:59 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: sorry if this is a repeat question, how do I remove scratches from glass? Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 18:58:59 -0800 Message-ID: <199611210258.SAA23004@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Hi, > Anyhow, a couple of >these bevels have developed hairline scratches (my carelessness, no doubt) that are very >small, about a quarter to half inch long. Since they are on bevels they are very >obvious. Is there a rubbing compound that can take the small scratch away? Or, am I >better to start over? > > the depth of the scratches is what is impotrant not so much the lenght. In order to polish out these scratches you need to remove the glass to the level of the depth of the scratch. If you don't have access to beveling equipment and need to do this with a drill you will have quite a rough time of it. There realy is no magic cream that will do this job. In many cases it would cost more ( either in time or money if you need to have this done by someone with the equipment ) than it may be worth, unless the piece in question is very special. If you still want to try and the scratch is superficial use cerium oxide ( a jewelers rouge) Any scratch requiring a more abrasive grit is probably beyond home capabilities. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 19:09:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQPVg-0000SKa; Wed, 20 Nov 96 19:09 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Need help Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 19:08:54 -0800 Message-ID: <199611210308.TAA02457@dfw-ix6.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Here it is almost the holidays, and our studio is swamped with work. I work with a studio in the Chicago area and we are looking for a craftsperson with at least five years experience in a studio setting. We need someone who can start producing right away. Please send any inquireries to Botti @ix.netcom.com. MS ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 19:14:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQPat-00013Ga; Wed, 20 Nov 96 19:14 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: 20 Nov 96 22:13:23 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov21.31323.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >> I do have one idea that I would like to share. A great aunt, that has >> long since passed, used to save small pieces of glass of different >> colors which she would put in a resin and make beautiful cylindrical >> candle holders. We still have one but I have no idea how to make one. >> Does anyone know? << Jerry Cullingford wrote: > (*) I've got no idea what they put in the resin, but I've never seen > any plastic that *doesn't* get upset when overheated - at best, it smells > awful, at worst it's likely to be toxic and/or spread fires. < There were about 10 different recalls by the US Consumer Product Safety Commission of products involving candles. Glass and ceramic holders cracked spilling flaming wax, one porous type of holder would saturate with hot wax and the whole thing would catch fire, some candles with more than one wick flared up to produce 10 inch flames.....all pretty impressive. Make them for fun, but don't sell them. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety 181 Thompson St., # 23 New York, Ny 10012-2586 212/777-0062 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 20 19:53:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQQC9-00003na; Wed, 20 Nov 96 19:52 PST X-Path: juno.com!jroey From: jroey@juno.com (Jerri M Roey) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 22:22:14 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov21.32214.0> References: <<1996Nov20.21832.0>>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Speaking of scrap glass, I've seen something recently in "Glass Patterns Quartlerly" about recycling glass into new glass. The picture looked like the glass was ground up, melted into new sheets, with lots of colors (not single colors). Does anyone know anything about this? How's it done? Where's it done? Jerri ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 01:46:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQVhn-0000Bja; Thu, 21 Nov 96 01:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: 21 Nov 96 04:44:58 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov21.94458.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >about recycling glass into new glass. The picture looked like the glass >was ground up, melted into new sheets, with lots of colors (not single >colors). Does anyone know anything about this? How's it done? Where's >it done? Everywhere, Jerri. To start with, the meaning of Uroboros Glass's name and logo, the mythological snake that ate itself beginning with its own tail, was a reference to the fact that they were using recycled glass to create their stained glass sheets. But all glass manufacturers do this: when I was running my hot glass studio, the Owens-Illinois plant down the street had *mountains of Gerbers baby food jars that had been rejected for one reason or another. Those were destined for the furnaces to be remelted and remade into *more Gerbers baby food jars. (Well, that's what they made.) I don't know if all of the stained glass manufacturers, let alone even Uroboros these days, given the demand for stained glass, can wholly make their glass out of remelted scrap, but at least a percentage of it will be, since using "cullet" (scrap glass) lowers the necessary melting temperature enough to save them significant amounts of money on fuel in making glass. How's it done? Smash it up, mix it with the sand and other stuff that is the basis of glass, shovel it into the furnaces, let it melt and make glass! Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 04:48:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQYVy-00002Sa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 04:45 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!104344.622 From: "Christie Wood & George D'Ascenzo" <104344.622@CompuServe.COM> To: Bungi Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: 21 Nov 96 07:43:51 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov21.124351.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Mike Savad wrote: Oh, guess you're talking about consignment or craft malls, rather than free-standing retail galleries which take consignments. I also have a booth inside a craft mall. There are two other stained glass craftsmen in this rather large craft mall. My work is original design, and I offer about 75 different items in my booth. I must say that I have the same problem as you. Stained glass just does not look good next to wooden crows on a stick "country" crafts. I have been in this mall for 5 months, and December is my last. I'm getting out of the little stuff and am concentrating on larger panels and custom work. These jobs I am receiving through my own advertisement and through the consignment/commission work brought in by the retail art galleries. As to the other two stained glass artists who are in the craft mall...one has good work , but only does lead-wrapped suncatchers. The other does (IMHO) really poor quality stuff. I don't know how he makes his booth fee. ...Christie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 08:07:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQbew-00004Ja; Thu, 21 Nov 96 08:07 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Thu, 21 Nov 1996 11:05:37 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov21.6537.0> References: <<1996Nov21.124351.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Christie Wood & George D'Ascenzo wrote: > > Mike Savad wrote: > it's not a touristy area, or a gallery. the store is more focused on > crafts, all different kinds, so people come in not expecting to see > stained glass. and of course there is the higher price to sell stained > glass things, instead people go for the little things made from pipe > cleaners, or needle point...cuz there cheap... though i have to say if > anything i have the widest selection of stuff there, there are a few > other people who have stained glass things, they have about 40-50 items > to choose from, i have over 200. but the people are'nt buying, i'm > hoping that since it's around the holiday season more people will buy > stuff. and the owner of the store is'nt of great help, she designs her > own ads..there so bad, that she could'nt even find it...and she designed > it...> > > Oh, guess you're talking about consignment or craft malls, rather than > free-standing retail galleries which take consignments. I also have a booth > inside a craft mall. There are two other stained glass craftsmen in this rather > large craft mall. My work is original design, and I offer about 75 different > items in my booth. I must say that I have the same problem as you. Stained > glass just does not look good next to wooden crows on a stick "country" crafts. > I have been in this mall for 5 months, and December is my last. I'm getting out > of the little stuff and am concentrating on larger panels and custom work. > These jobs I am receiving through my own advertisement and through the > consignment/commission work brought in by the retail art galleries. > > As to the other two stained glass artists who are in the craft mall...one has > good work , but only does lead-wrapped suncatchers. The other does (IMHO) > really poor quality stuff. I don't know how he makes his booth fee. > > ...Christie > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i also know of a mall that does it, but it's like 75 bucks a month to rent to glass shelves, $120 for wall space, and then they raise the cost for rent during the holiday season and ask for a 20% commission (the only one time you may acually see a profit). in the store i'm at now (i don't see why anyone would make so many), odd ball things, like this one guy has a bunch of free standing tulips, they really don't look all that good but he has like 6 of them...god only knows why... ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 09:01:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQcVB-0000F0a; Thu, 21 Nov 96 09:01 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Date: Thu, 21 Nov 1996 10:57:21 -0600 Message-ID: <199611211657.KAA16950@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 02:29 PM 11/20/96 EST, Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >Perhapes you would care to clarify what you mean by the above > >statement that you are lucky not to have to earn a living at SG. > > ... Or that what you do for a living, if > >anything, is a superior activity? Just asking. > >I didn't read her comment that way at all, but as an accolade for those of you >who *do make their living with *any craft. It's hard work being both creative >and businesslike at the same time and I think Elisabeth's attitude has shown her >respect for glassworkers all along. > >You misread her, methinks. > >Albert Albert, Seems to be a lot of misreading going on here. My response was to a comment made by Jennifer (H Taylor Buckner) not to Elisabeth who I find to be so delightfully overwhelming that I expect the I would only be able to blabber in her presence should that occasion ever arise ;-) and as far as James ( mental hospital fellow) comments go I was not responding to him either although if he would care to pmail me I would be glad to discuss my philosophies on zen and the art of the stained glass window. we could also discuss the ploy of corporate america to work everybody to death in the name of the stock holders while encouraging people to believe that terminal job stress is a result of their own shortcomings. If I misinterpated Jennifers remarks I do apologize. Maybe Mike Savad is right, deleting to much of the message your responding to causes confusion. Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 09:31:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQcxt-00002aa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 09:31 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, Bungi Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: Thu, 21 Nov 1996 11:27:01 -0600 Message-ID: <199611211727.LAA17657@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk It can be a very frustrating situation when quality work is intermixed with junk and trinkets at a fair etc. One posible solution that could work for some folks is to apply to juried shows if you feel your work could meet the standards. An example would be the Victorian Garden Party in the Cleveland area. A 2 day show. They use a selection committe who approve on the basis of presentation, uniqueness and quality. They limit the number of sellers in each media. They do not accept decoupage, commercial photos, velvet paintings :-) machine made reproductions or items from molds, kits or any imports. There are numerous fairs and shows throughout the country (USA) that have similiar standards. The clientel at these type of shows are there looking for good stuff and are, I would assume, willing to pay for it. There is a web site that lists many of them. Hope this helps. Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 09:32:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQczB-0000Hsa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 09:32 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Date: 21 Nov 96 12:30:24 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov21.173024.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Seems to be a lot of misreading going on here. Yes, probably true on my part. As "experienced" as I am with email, I still sometimes have to remind myself that just because the "To:" in the header has my name on it doesn't mean that it's directed at me. Or even that the response is to the person who's quoted above/below the remarks. I sometimes have to page down to the bottom of a message to see whether it's a remark directed to/from the bungi.com group or one directed to me personally. Senility rules, where I'm concerned, at least sometimes. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 17:14:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQkB7-0000dta; Thu, 21 Nov 96 17:13 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: RestHomes for Glass Artists!!! Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 01:40:58 +0000 Message-ID: <199611220112.BAA09739@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >By the way, Albert, maybe we should talk. I run a mental hospital for a > >living and I really like people who interpret things the way you do.;-) > >Oh, well now ... that's sounds a treat! I'll be ready to check in for a nice >long rest at any time just now. > >Albert, Could you see if there is space for two more???? This is the months for "I need it for the holidays!!" clients. my best pj > .... and ME too please... :-) I was the one supposed to be stressed, remember! By the way, never in a month of Sundays would I dream of denegrating real crafts and craftsmen, whether full-time, part-time, hobbyists, beginners or learners. Being full-time myself, I have championed each and every category many a time, as I think is well established. If I accidentally phrased something in an unfortunate way, then I am truly sorry. ( And thank you Albert! (May I reserve a room near you?)) Explanation: - What do you expect from a silly foreigner? - It was 4 o'clock in the morning - our time.I should have been in bed. - One or two quotes I was credited with, I think came not from me, but from a different direction. But some times it's difficult to remember who said what. I do it all the time. Mike Savad said: "People only see colour and money". Absolutely RIGHT! My experience too. However, the poster idea (Thank you David)) gave me another idea. When I can bring myself to spend my hard-earned money so foolishly, I intend to buy a kind of "Rogues Gallery" of awful "craftsmanship" and make a well annotated montage of them for display. ;-) Take care now! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 17:15:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQkB7-0000Psa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 17:13 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 01:40:58 +0000 Message-ID: <199611220112.BAA09736@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Art colleges and secondary school Art Departments are always knocking on my door for scrap glass for their pottery/ceramic departments. Potters use scrap glass as glazes for their artefacts and are only too grateful for it. If I am not wrong, we have a handful of ceramicists in this Group. Surely they could put you on to their own particular Potters List e-mail.... Hey you ceramicists, where are you!? Speak up! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 17:15:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQkB7-0000Pga; Thu, 21 Nov 96 17:13 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: consignment gallerie Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 01:40:58 +0000 Message-ID: <199611220113.BAA09742@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Dear Len (Alcamo) et al., Seems to be a lot of misreading going on here. Aha, mystery and bewilderment solved! Phew! < not to Elisabeth who I find to be so delightfully overwhelming that I expect the I would only be able to blabber in her presence should that occasion ever arise ;-) > Oh come, come, pussycat! Flattery will get you everywhere. Or is this in reality a sweet way of telling me to shut up?? ;-) Ok, Ok, but please be NICE! We are already lining up to book in.... I'm in favour of "selective editing" Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 20:10:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQmvj-0000EIa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 20:09 PST X-Path: scv.net!fullspec From: Kay Allen To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Glass Craft Expo '97 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 1996 20:06:56 -0800 Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19961122040656.006e8920@mail.scv.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Did anyone on the list go to the Glass Expo in Las Vegas last year? Was it worth your while? Is anyone going in March of 97? Kay ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 20:55:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQndx-0000UJa; Thu, 21 Nov 96 20:55 PST X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: Shirley Suter To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Must be Holiday Season! Date: Thu, 21 Nov 1996 22:57:10 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov21.165710.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service & Suter's Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Transcript of an actual phone call today...... me: .....I'm afraid that I am booked solid through January. customer: But you told me last February that you would love to create my front entry and I want it before my Christmas party! Can't you start on it now and have it finished by December 15th? me: I'm afraid that is quite impossible, ma'am, since I am committed through January with confirmed commissions. customer: Can't you squeeze me in? me: ..blah, blah, blah.... AAAUUUUGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Just posted this ditty above my bench: "Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, The courage to change the things I cannot accept, And the wisdom to hide the bodies of those people I had to kill today Because THEY PISSED ME OFF! And also, Help me to be careful of the toes I step on today, As they may be connected to the ass that I may have to kiss tomorrow." Going Nuts in Grapeland, Shirley ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 21 21:13:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQnvc-0000Qna; Thu, 21 Nov 96 21:13 PST X-Path: accesscomm.net!spinn From: spinn@accesscomm.net (Stephen Pinn) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Must be Holiday Season! Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 05:06:23 GMT Message-ID: <1996Nov22.5623.0> References: <<1996Nov21.165710.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: PinnCorp. Precedence: bulk Great poem Deserata will never be the same!! Thanks for the laugh - Steve On Thu, 21 Nov 1996 22:57:10 -0600, you wrote: >Transcript of an actual phone call today...... > >me: .....I'm afraid that I am booked solid through January. >customer: But you told me last February that you would love to create >my front entry and I want it before my Christmas party! Can't you start >on it now and have it finished by December 15th? >me: I'm afraid that is quite impossible, ma'am, since I am committed >through January with confirmed commissions. >customer: Can't you squeeze me in? >me: ..blah, blah, blah.... AAAUUUUGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > >Just posted this ditty above my bench: > >"Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, >The courage to change the things I cannot accept, >And the wisdom to hide the bodies of those people I had to kill today >Because >THEY PISSED ME OFF! >And also, >Help me to be careful of the toes I step on today, >As they may be connected to the ass that I may have to kiss tomorrow." > >Going Nuts in Grapeland, >Shirley >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 03:40:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQtxK-0000JIa; Fri, 22 Nov 96 03:39 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!104344.622 From: "Christie Wood & George D'Ascenzo" <104344.622@CompuServe.COM> To: Bungi Subject: Re: consignment galleries Date: 22 Nov 96 06:36:57 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov22.113657.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Len wrote: Care to share the web site address with us? Please? ...Christie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 05:43:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQvsN-0000K8a; Fri, 22 Nov 96 05:42 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!taylor_buckner From: "H. Taylor Buckner" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Misreading Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 08:42:01 -0500 Message-ID: <199611221342.IAA03647@smtp1.sympatico.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Len, My comments about being lucky because I didn't have to earn a living doing stained glass were very definitely not intended to put down those who do. In fact, if you would go back and re-read my original message carefully I think you'll realize that I was defending them, but at the same implying that having to earn your living at the craft is a tough row to hoe. It's clear to me from the comments I've read since joining this list, that putting up with clients who demand the impossible (like no design you show them is ever quite the "right" one, like the people who want it yesterday, like the people who object to the price you're asking for something you've put hours and days into, etc.etc.etc.) is not the easiest way to earn money. I implied I was "lucky" because I am able to indulge in my passion and obsession with glass without those pressures. Since I actually retired early in order to spend more time on glass, I don't think my committment is open to question. If, however, you feel I trod on your psychic toes, mea culpa. Regards, Jennifer ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 06:10:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vQwJE-0000Cda; Fri, 22 Nov 96 06:10 PST X-Path: falcon.cc.ukans.edu!elgarber From: elgarber@falcon.cc.ukans.edu (Ellen Garber) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Must be Holiday Season! Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 08:10:20 -0600 Message-ID: <9611221410.AA12142@falcon.cc.ukans.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Sorry you are experiencing so much stress, but the proverb,"ditty", you shared is a classic. Thanks. Ellen> Transcript of an actual phone call today...... > >me: .....I'm afraid that I am booked solid through January. >customer: But you told me last February that you would love to create >my front entry and I want it before my Christmas party! Can't you start >on it now and have it finished by December 15th? >me: I'm afraid that is quite impossible, ma'am, since I am committed >through January with confirmed commissions. >customer: Can't you squeeze me in? >me: ..blah, blah, blah.... AAAUUUUGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > >Just posted this ditty above my bench: > >"Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, >The courage to change the things I cannot accept, >And the wisdom to hide the bodies of those people I had to kill today >Because >THEY PISSED ME OFF! >And also, >Help me to be careful of the toes I step on today, >As they may be connected to the ass that I may have to kiss tomorrow." > >Going Nuts in Grapeland, >Shirley >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Ellen Garber The Department of History The University of Kansas Lawrence, Kansas 66045 Homepage: http://www.clas.ukans.edu/History ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 10:14:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR06o-00004Ea; Fri, 22 Nov 96 10:13 PST X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com, Bungi Subject: art/craft fairs- was consign.. Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 12:09:44 -0600 Message-ID: <199611221809.MAA17606@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Care to share the web site address with us? Please? >...Christie You bet! http://www.us.itd.umich.edu/~liamr/renfest/list.html This list is all period/theme fairs and there are plenty of them. I had another list with more general art/craft fairs but somehow lost my bookmark or ??? I remember it didn't take much of a search in Yahoo to find the addresses though. Len ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 16:01:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR5Wx-00002Ha; Fri, 22 Nov 96 16:01 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Holiday Season! What holiday?? Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Sat, 23 Nov 1996 00:27:53 +0000 Message-ID: <199611230000.AAA07257@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Absolutely LOVED your ditty Shirley!! Thanks for the laugh! Absolutely classic! I not only have the phonecalls, but even little notes in the post. And I am currently " only" running a 5 months lead-time. Just can't win! .....would I be infringing on copyright if I posted it above MY bench? ... Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 17:09:21 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR6ZJ-000053a; Fri, 22 Nov 96 17:07 PST X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: Shirley Suter To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Holiday Season! What holiday?? Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 19:10:09 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov22.13109.0> References: <<199611230000.AAA07257@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service & Suter's Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Toby wrote (with the help of Elisabeth, I'm sure): > .....would I be infringing on copyright if I posted it above MY > bench? ... > Elisabeth 'n Toby I certainly hope not, since I stole it myself ;) Received it in e-mail from a first year college student who got it from someone else, etc.... Thought it was absolutely perfect and just had to share it with my pals! Squirrelly Shirley ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 18:27:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR7oK-0000ICa; Fri, 22 Nov 96 18:27 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Scrap Glass Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 18:27:04 -0800 Message-ID: <199611230227.SAA03568@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > Speaking of scrap glass, I've seen something recently in "Glass >Patterns Quartlerly" about recycling glass into new glass. The picture >looked like the glass was ground up, melted into new sheets, with lots of >colors (not single colors). Does anyone know anything about this? How's >it done? Where's it done? > > We once used glass that was recycled by a company out west. Interesting colors, but realy rough to cut. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 19:31:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR8nd-0000Xqa; Fri, 22 Nov 96 19:30 PST X-Path: aol.com!LNETWORKS From: LNETWORKS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Must be Holiday Season! Date: Fri, 22 Nov 1996 22:30:25 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov22.173025.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Best laugh I've had in a long time-great Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations PS still dont have reg. internet up and running-getting msg thru AOL-I am still here though ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 22 20:44:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vR9wv-0000Ira; Fri, 22 Nov 96 20:44 PST X-Path: nethawk.com!1091 From: 1091@nethawk.com (Sue Eiszler) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Holiday Season! What holiday?? Date: Fri, 22 Nov 96 20:44 PST Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Shirley, I sure am glad you stole the 'motto'. It is great and was a big hit at work today. Everyone had to make a copy. Thanks for making my Friday! Sue 1091@nethawk.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 23 06:09:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRIlD-0000Cia; Sat, 23 Nov 96 06:08 PST X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Must be Holiday Season! Date: Sun, 24 Nov 96 01:05:19 +1100 Message-ID: <199611231408.BAA17125@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<1996Nov21.165710.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <1996Nov21.165710.0>, on 11/21/96 at 10:57 PM, Shirley Suter said: >Transcript of an actual phone call today...... >me: .....I'm afraid that I am booked solid through January. >customer: [edit] >Just posted this ditty above my bench: >"Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, The courage >to change the things I cannot accept, [edit] >Going Nuts in Grapeland, >Shirley What about. . . . I'm 51% Sweetheart, 49% Bitch Don't Push it! Percentages subject to change without notice. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9222 1124, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 23 11:13:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRNVj-0000P3a; Sat, 23 Nov 96 11:13 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Must be Holiday Seas Date: 23 Nov 96 14:11:56 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov23.191156.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >What about. . . . I'm 51% Sweetheart, 49% Bitch ... Don't Push it! Hey, I thought this was a family network! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 08:35:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRhVy-0000cDa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 08:34 PST X-Path: juno.com!fstryczek From: fstryczek@juno.com (Frank M. Stryczek, Jr.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Craft Expo '97 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 11:34:05 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov24.16345.0> References: <<1.5.4.32.19961122040656.006e8920@mail.scv.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I missed it, but am eagerly looking for information on the March '97 show. Any info on it? Thanks FStryczek On Thu, 21 Nov 1996 20:06:56 -0800 Kay Allen writes: >Did anyone on the list go to the Glass Expo in Las Vegas last year? >Was it >worth your while? >Is anyone going in March of 97? > >Kay > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 09:08:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRi1Q-0000EVa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 09:07 PST X-Path: xavier.xu.edu!CRABLE From: "Elaine Crable, 745-2029" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 12:05:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <961124120548.2420a630@xavier.xu.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I am making up my Christmas list and would like to know what glass cutting and grinding and soldering equipment you would recommend...right now I don't have anything but have been using equipment at a local glass shop. Any suggestions on where to purchase it besides at my local glass shop..seems there is a high mark-up. Thanks ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 10:00:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRipt-0000KTa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 09:59 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Glass Craft Expo '97 Date: 24 Nov 96 12:57:11 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov24.175711.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I missed it, but am eagerly looking for information on the March '97 >show. Any info on it? Frank (and Kay): They had a full page ad in our most recent issue. Let's see: It has three monkeys at the top of the page, doing the opposite of their usual trick; this time it says, "See, Hear, Speak GLASS. We won't hide anything from you. We offer the best classes and workshops with the best instructors to learn about art glass .. whether you're a beginner or a long time craftsman. We offer displays, exhibits and product demonstrations by the best manufacturers. We want to share the wealth of information available in this industry. We invite you to join us and be reminded of forgotten techniques or learn new ones. We invite you to experience fun times with other art glass people at receptions and special events. Don't miss these great opportunities to SEE, HEAR, AND SPEAK GLASS." Two shows are listed, the first is called "Glass Craft Regional Conference," October 31-Nov 3, 1996 (guess we missed that one), the other is "Glass Craft National EXPO '97, March 13-16, 1997, Cashman Convention Center, Las Vegas NV. "Over 100 classes-50 instructors; EXPO Product Exhibition (3/14-16), Special Guest-Artist Dinner Party, Glass Harmonica Concert, Special Art Glass Gallery Display (kaleidoscopes, marbles, paperweights, and other objects)." The registration packet has been available since 9/15. Contact Las Vegas Management, 2408 Chapman Drive, Las Vegas NV 89104-3455. (800) 217-4527 or (702) 734-0070. Fax (702) 734-0636. Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 10:46:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRjZW-00000sa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 10:46 PST X-Path: fbo.com!dloda From: Dave Loda To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 10:53:01 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov24.2531.0> References: <<961124120548.2420a630@xavier.xu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > I am making up my Christmas list and would like to know what glass > cutting and grinding and soldering equipment you would recommend...right > now I don't have anything but have been using equipment at a local glass > shop. Any suggestions on where to purchase it besides at my local > glass shop..seems there is a high mark-up. >Elaine; The local glass shop is their to teach and answer your questions immediatly. If you have a problem, they are most likely more than ready to help you on it. Don't you think that you should show them some loyality and purchase from them. A old adage I heard once rings true here. Would you go to a auto parts store and buy the parts you need for your auto and than bring the car and parts to the dealer to install? Of course not, but if you did, you would most likely shown the door. Please support your local glass supplier. Beleive me, they are not making a killing Dave Loda Stained Glass of Newport > Thanks > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 12:22:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRl4D-0000aXa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 12:22 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: Shirley Suter Subject: Re: Holiday Season! What holiday?? Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 12:19:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov24.41958.0> References: <<1996Nov22.13109.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Shirley: I suspect I missed the diddy. Since I love diddies, please repeat it. I don't know how I missed it because I always take care to read all my messages. I do confess it has been a really busy time. PJ from CA> ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 15:24:59 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRnuO-0000Lja; Sun, 24 Nov 96 15:24 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 17:18:13 -0500 Message-ID: <3298C9A5.57AA@mars.superlink.net> References: <<961124120548.2420a630@xavier.xu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > I am making up my Christmas list and would like to know what glass > cutting and grinding and soldering equipment you would recommend...right > now I don't have anything but have been using equipment at a local glass > shop. Any suggestions on where to purchase it besides at my local > glass shop..seems there is a high mark-up. > > Thanks > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass if there is a high mark up i would find another store, catalogs have shipping charges. i would get (because i already have) a fletcher terry score master 2 glass cutter. a inland wizard grinder, i'm not sure what else you want to get, there's alot of cool toys you can get for stained glass. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 15:24:59 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRnuP-0000Mua; Sun, 24 Nov 96 15:24 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 17:21:38 -0500 Message-ID: <3298CA72.6260@mars.superlink.net> References: <<1996Nov24.2531.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Dave Loda wrote: > > Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > > > I am making up my Christmas list and would like to know what glass > > cutting and grinding and soldering equipment you would recommend...right > > now I don't have anything but have been using equipment at a local glass > > shop. Any suggestions on where to purchase it besides at my local > > glass shop..seems there is a high mark-up. > >Elaine; > > The local glass shop is their to teach and answer your questions > immediatly. If you have a problem, they are most likely more than ready > to help you on it. Don't you think that you should show them some > loyality and purchase from them. A old adage I heard once rings true > here. Would you go to a auto parts store and buy the parts you need for > your auto and than bring the car and parts to the dealer to install? Of > course not, but if you did, you would most likely shown the door. > Please support your local glass supplier. Beleive me, they are not > making a killing > > Dave Loda > Stained Glass of Newport > > Thanks > > ---- > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass however some are, for example i go to two different stores. the first one has pretty decent prices, but not as much stock as the other store. the second store, has a much larger inventory, but the prices are around 20% or more higher. sometimes it's worth it, sometimes not. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 18:43:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRr14-0000J7a; Sun, 24 Nov 96 18:43 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: location Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 21:38:50 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.213850.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk Peggy, I live in Fernandina Bch., on Amelia Island north of Jacksonville. Sounds like you have a good deal on selling your works. Wish we could get more people involve in The Art. HAVE a good day, Walter ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun Nov 24 19:50:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vRs3R-0000REa; Sun, 24 Nov 96 19:49 PST X-Path: california.com!cmcmurdo From: Chris McMurdo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Patina over patina Date: Sun, 24 Nov 1996 20:50:48 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov24.125048.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black patina or should I remove the copper patina first? Chris McMurdo San Mateo, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 04:25:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS061-0000Tia; Mon, 25 Nov 96 04:25 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 07:14:53 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.21453.0> References: <<1996Nov24.125048.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Chris McMurdo wrote: > > I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the > way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks > blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black > patina or should I remove the copper patina first? > > Chris McMurdo Black will do just fine over the top of Copper IF you apply it and only rinse it off, do not wipe at it. Blot dry. Let it sit for 24 hours, then polish the piece. It may still have a slight coppery undertone, but will be mostly black. If you need it to be completely black, you need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the copper patina. Gardeon of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 04:56:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS0a3-0000Wla; Mon, 25 Nov 96 04:56 PST X-Path: xavier.xu.edu!CRABLE From: "Elaine Crable, 745-2029" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 7:55:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <961125075500.24210d6b@xavier.xu.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thanks to those with purchasing suggestions..this is all so new and I know if I don't get the right equipment the job is going to be more difficult. Mike Savad...I did find out that the glass shop I have been using is higher than one across town so I will check others out too...they do price differently. Thank you Joyce for your list...could you send me your address again, I accidentally deleted it... Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people Bye ELaine ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 05:57:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS1Wt-0000TYa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 05:56 PST X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 13:55:15 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <9611251355.AA03209@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<961125075500.24210d6b@xavier.xu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elaine asked: > Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people People have different preferences - if you're not used to soldering, I'd suggest the Weller 100W thermostatic one, on the grounds that the tip temperature (and so performance) is likely to be more consistent. Non-thermostatic irons add heat continuously - as a result, what tends to happen is that the tip temperature increases while you're not using it, and then drops as you work with it. Experienced workers are used to this, allow for the initial higher temperature, and then adjust the rate at which they solder to keep the tip around the temperature they want. Rheostats *do not* control temperature directly - they just allow you to reduce the rate at which you add heat to the iron - this reduces the equilibrium temperature when you're not using the iron, and allows you to work slower when you are using it. Thermostatic irons can give you the best of both worlds - When they're heating up, they use full power, so they recover quickly, and they switch off at the desired temperature, so the tip stays close to the desired temperature at all times; that avoids the initial difference in behaviour. However, having said all that, once you've got used to soldering, you should be able to use most types of iron successfully, as long as you're not using a seriously underpowered one that can't stay hot enough; several of the professionals here swear by various non-thermostatic irons - possibly in part because they prefer working faster (and so hotter) than the normal setting. Finding an iron you can hold/use comfortably is also important :-). -- _|_ Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) / | Hemel Hempstead, UK jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \_|_ www.selune.demon.co.uk (soon) \__/ ----------------------------------------------------- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 06:04:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS1eA-0000cRa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 06:04 PST X-Path: falcon.cc.ukans.edu!elgarber From: elgarber@falcon.cc.ukans.edu (Ellen Garber) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 08:04:26 -0600 Message-ID: <9611251404.AA07632@falcon.cc.ukans.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have had the same results with copper patina. Is this the nature of the copper patina? I have never had a problem with the black. Ellen>Chris McMurdo wrote: >> >> I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the >> way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks >> blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black >> patina or should I remove the copper patina first? >> >> Chris McMurdo > > >Black will do just fine over the top of Copper IF you apply it and only >rinse it off, do not wipe at it. Blot dry. Let it sit for 24 hours, >then polish the piece. It may still have a slight coppery undertone, >but will be mostly black. If you need it to be completely black, you >need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the >copper patina. > >Gardeon of Glass >Joyce Moran > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Ellen Garber The Department of History The University of Kansas Lawrence, Kansas 66045 Homepage: http://www.clas.ukans.edu/History ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 06:44:12 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS2GD-0000cfa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 06:43 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 09:41:15 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.44115.0> References: <<961125075500.24210d6b@xavier.xu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > Thanks to those with purchasing suggestions..this is all so new and I > know if I don't get the right equipment the job is going to be more > difficult. > > Mike Savad...I did find out that the glass shop I have been using is higher > than one across town so I will check others out too...they do price > differently. > > Thank you Joyce for your list...could you send me your address again, I > accidentally deleted it... > > Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people > > Bye > ELaine > ---- I carry the cheaper Inland because: a) I can attach it to the temperature control (mini phaser) instead of having to unplug, and let cool down the tips such as in the Weller models and Ungar etc. b) because I have a tendency to burn up my soldering iron by leaving it on accidentally, and don't mind replacing a $20.00 iron rather than replacing a $50-120.00 iron. (This has only happened twice in 11 years, but I still don't like my own part in ruining a piece of good equipment.) c) it is lighter weight than some of the more expensive models and causes less fatigue when I solder for long periods of time. d) it does the job. (quite well in fact). Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 06:54:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS2QR-0000a4a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 06:54 PST X-Path: mail.smu.edu!gshultz From: gshultz@mail.smu.edu (Gary Shultz) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 08:53:26 -0600 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have had a similar experience with copper patina, which is why I seldom use it. I have been able to improve the appearance by using very fine steel wool on the solder and restaining with copper patina. I've also had fairly good luck using very find steel wook on the solder stained with copper and then applying black patine. Best of luck to you, =Gary >I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the >way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks >blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black >patina or should I remove the copper patina first? > >Chris McMurdo >San Mateo, CA >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ~(~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~)~ ~~~) Gary Shultz - SMU News and Information (~~~ ~~~~~( Tele. 214-768-7665 Fax: 214-768-7663 )~~~~~ ~~~~~~~) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~(~~~~~~~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:11:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS2gd-0000DDa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:11 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 15:38:27 +0000 Message-ID: <199611251511.PAA16522@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joyce in reply to Chris McMurdo wrote: < snip: If you need it to be completely black, you need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the copper patina.> Methinks you don't need to be so drastic. It should suffice to wire-wool it off and then re-patina... Use fine grade wire or plastic "wire-wool" Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:12:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS2gd-0000DFa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:11 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 15:38:27 +0000 Message-ID: <199611251511.PAA16492@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Ellen wrote: I have had the same results with copper patina. Is this the nature of the copper patina? I have never had a problem with the black.> You might find that if you clean your project scrupulously before applying tha copper patina and dry it thoroughly, it won't be so "blotchy". For some reason copper patina has less ability to "cut through" grunge and flux, than black patina. This makes cleanining beforehand more critical. Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:36:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS35F-0000aPa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:36 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:34:31 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.53431.0> References: <<1996Nov24.125048.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Chris McMurdo wrote: > > I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the > way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks > blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black > patina or should I remove the copper patina first? > > Chris McMurdo > San Mateo, CA > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass sounds like there was either too much oxidation or flux on the project. you'll have to remove both the oxidation and patina to repatina the piece. use 0000 steelwool, once shiny clean with soap and water to get any residue off the solder. and when it is shiny try the copper again it may come out better. also 2 other things, what brand patina were you using, because i know inland makes their's, it goes on shiny then turns brown until you polish it. Jax goes on and stays shiny. and i think i have an old bottle of canfield patina, it always goes on dark and splotchy (but i use that as an antique look sometimes). and second did you shake the bottle, oh and one other thing, did you use a brush (if so what else may have been on it), or a rag or something? ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:42:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS3Ay-0000aea; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:42 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:40:31 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.54031.0> References: <<961125075500.24210d6b@xavier.xu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > Thanks to those with purchasing suggestions..this is all so new and I > know if I don't get the right equipment the job is going to be more > difficult. > > Mike Savad...I did find out that the glass shop I have been using is higher > than one across town so I will check others out too...they do price > differently. > > Thank you Joyce for your list...could you send me your address again, I > accidentally deleted it... > > Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people > > Bye > ELaine > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass the iron is always a tough question, for the longest time i've been using an ungar, but because of it's history of being expensive and all, the next iron will be different. i'm not sure which iron i'll get i was thinking about the inland insta-heat (anyone have this one?), but i still hav'nt researched it yet. as for the store, be sure to go to both stores, you'll have a much wider selection, however going to the cheaper store (often more smaller) they may give you a good deal on some things if your a good customer. i know the guy i go to reconizes me by voice, and sometimes i can get a 10% or more discount on certain things. but it's not like he is'nt making any money off of me, and i do bring quite a few people to his store, so i think it breaks even. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:45:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS3Dx-0000Sfa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:45 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:43:26 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.54326.0> References: <<9611251355.AA03209@crosfield.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jerry Cullingford wrote: > > Elaine asked: > > Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people > > People have different preferences - if you're not used to soldering, I'd > suggest the Weller 100W thermostatic one, on the grounds that the tip > temperature (and so performance) is likely to be more consistent. > Non-thermostatic irons add heat continuously - as a result, what tends to > happen is that the tip temperature increases while you're not using it, and > then drops as you work with it. Experienced workers are used to this, > allow for the initial higher temperature, and then adjust the rate at which > they solder to keep the tip around the temperature they want. Rheostats > *do not* control temperature directly - they just allow you to reduce the > rate at which you add heat to the iron - this reduces the > equilibrium temperature when you're not using the iron, and allows you to > work slower when you are using it. Thermostatic irons can give you the best > of both worlds - When they're heating up, they use full power, so they > recover quickly, and they switch off at the desired temperature, so the > tip stays close to the desired temperature at all times; that avoids the > initial difference in behaviour. > > However, having said all that, once you've got used to soldering, you > should be able to use most types of iron successfully, as long as you're > not using a seriously underpowered one that can't stay hot enough; several > of the professionals here swear by various non-thermostatic irons - possibly > in part because they prefer working faster (and so hotter) than the normal > setting. Finding an iron you can hold/use comfortably is also important :-). the other plus point i have to say for non-thermastatic irons, is that you may want to do decorative soldering with it, and as we found out (since i don't use a weller i did'nt know about it), that a weller iron can't use a reostat, and so you really can't lower the tip temp. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:49:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS3Hl-00001Ua; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:49 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:47:34 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.54734.0> References: <<9611251404.AA07632@falcon.cc.ukans.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > Ellen>Chris McMurdo wrote: > >> > >> I just patinaed a stained glass picture frame and do not like the > >> way it turned out. I used copper patina on 60/40 solder and it looks > >> blotchy, copper with dark blotchy patches. Can I go over it with black > >> patina or should I remove the copper patina first? > >> > >> Chris McMurdo > > > > > >Black will do just fine over the top of Copper IF you apply it and only > >rinse it off, do not wipe at it. Blot dry. Let it sit for 24 hours, > >then polish the piece. It may still have a slight coppery undertone, > >but will be mostly black. If you need it to be completely black, you > >need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the > >copper patina. > > > >Gardeon of Glass > >Joyce Moran > > Ellen Garber wrote: > > I have had the same results with copper patina. Is this the nature of the > copper patina? I have never had a problem with the black. well, it does happen, however after you clean the stuff off, you can go back and polish it so it turns shiny for a while. i found that Jax patina, though expensive, and difficult to apply, stays the copperest the longest, so far the only darkening (over the last 3 years or so), is that it's turning slightly redish. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:52:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS3KY-0000asa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:52 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:50:24 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.55024.0> References: <<1996Nov25.44115.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joyce Moran wrote: > > Elaine Crable, 745-2029 wrote: > > > > Thanks to those with purchasing suggestions..this is all so new and I > > know if I don't get the right equipment the job is going to be more > > difficult. > > > > Mike Savad...I did find out that the glass shop I have been using is higher > > than one across town so I will check others out too...they do price > > differently. > > > > Thank you Joyce for your list...could you send me your address again, I > > accidentally deleted it... > > > > Another question on equipment...which is the best soldering iron for people > > > > Bye > > ELaine > > ---- > > I carry the cheaper Inland because: > a) I can attach it to the temperature control (mini phaser) > instead of having to unplug, and let cool down the tips such as in the > Weller models and Ungar etc. > b) because I have a tendency to burn up my soldering iron by > leaving it on accidentally, and don't mind replacing a $20.00 iron > rather than replacing a $50-120.00 iron. (This has only happened twice > in 11 years, but I still don't like my own part in ruining a piece of > good equipment.) > c) it is lighter weight than some of the more expensive models > and causes less fatigue when I solder for long periods of time. > d) it does the job. (quite well in fact). > > Garden of Glass > Joyce Moran > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass yeah i had the inland profesional for a while, lasted a couple of years, the only things i did'nt like about that one was: 1. the cord was way to thick, it had a mind of it's own. 2. the collar that held the tip on coroded off, though i was able to get a free replacement, it was still a hassle. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 07:55:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS3N6-0000Pta; Mon, 25 Nov 96 07:55 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 10:53:05 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.5535.0> References: <<199611251511.PAA16522@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Toby wrote: > > Joyce in reply to Chris McMurdo wrote: > < snip: If you need it to be completely black, you > need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the > copper patina.> > Methinks you don't need to be so drastic. It should suffice to > wire-wool it off and then re-patina... Use fine grade wire or plastic > "wire-wool" > Elisabeth 'n Toby > > ---- > As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" > North Lights Stained Glass - homepage > http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm > ---- > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass and along with that if you were to re-solder the oxidized solder (the patina shell) will mix into the solder, so now you'll have messy lines ('cuz you should'nt re-go over lines), and now it's mixed with more oxides... ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 08:46:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS4AT-0000X9a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 08:46 PST X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 16:44:21 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <9611251644.AA05309@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<1996Nov25.54326.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > the other plus point i have to say for non-thermastatic irons, is that > you may want to do decorative soldering with it, and as we found out > (since i don't use a weller i did'nt know about it), that a weller iron > can't use a reostat, and so you really can't lower the tip temp. > > ---Mike Savad True, but since the temperature is controlled by a temperature-sensitive material in the tip, you can use a different tip set for a lower temperature - they are available for several temperatures, but not having tried decorative effects myself, I can't say whether there's one that's suitable. I'm curious - what happened when you tried using a rheostat? did the iron stop working altogether, or did you just have problems getting the temperature down? -Jerry -- _|_ Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) / | Hemel Hempstead, UK jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \_|_ www.selune.demon.co.uk (soon) \__/ ----------------------------------------------------- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 09:21:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS4i2-0000U2a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 09:20 PST X-Path: aol.com!StndGlass1 From: StndGlass1@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 12:20:35 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.72035.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-11-25 11:48:11 EST, you write: << I'm curious - what happened when you tried using a rheostat? did the iron stop working altogether, or did you just have problems getting the temperature down? >> If you use a rheostat with the W100, the temperature controlling mechanism in the rheostat fights with the controller in the soldering iron. 9 times out of 10, it has been my experience (or that of my students who keep trying this no matter what we say) the rheostat will win, and the temperature controlling features of your W100 will be null and void. Your iron will still work, but the features you paid extra for are no longer there. Jenna Meredith Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 09:24:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS4lY-0000bYa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 09:24 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 09:54:45 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.25445.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice at assembling 3-dimensional pieces. I've tried to assemble the sides in a hexagon and found afterward that the assembled sides did not fit the base. So I took the sides apart to start over. Here are my questions: Do I have to use an xacto knife or something similar to remove all the adhesive residue from the places where I had to remove the tinned foil? Can I patch in the foil in those places where it was removed in order to take the sides apart? If so, are there any tips about how to do this? Is there a way to hold the six sides in place before soldering so I can fit the bottom to the assembled sides? Or, what is the best sequence for assembling? How many sides should be asssembled before trying to fit all six sides together? In other words, should I try to assemble two sets of three side pieces first and then assemble those two pieces together? What keeps the six sides from changing their angle while they're being soldered together? How can I make sure the bottom will fit the assembled sides? I've cut to the pattern and it's exact. I would appreciate any pointers, admonishments whatever you have to offer. Thanks T. in Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 11:23:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS6cW-0000Tpa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 11:23 PST X-Path: memach.com!lcbell From: Linda Campbell To: "glass@bungi.com" Subject: RE: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 14:24:28 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.92428.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I'm just a novice too but I would: -Make sure all the sides are the same size. -Tack the sides together at the ends, starting with two pieces and adding the rest one at a time. Use the bottom pattern to ensure that the inside angle of each of the two side is 120 degrees. -Since you have only tacked, the corners, you should be able to move it about a bit to get the opposing sides parallel. -Use the completed hexagonal cylinder to draw a pattern for the bottom, using either the inside or outside, depending one whether you want to bottom to fit inside or be on the outside. I would remove all the foil and glue and start over - you will feel better about it. Just my $.02. Linda Campbell I don't speak for Metro Machine and God knows they don't have any idea what I'm thinking. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 14:45:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS9lK-0000kKa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 14:44 PST X-Path: juno.com!roadrunner47 From: roadrunner47@juno.com (Jacque E Smith) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 17:42:25 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov25.224225.0> References: <<1996Nov25.25445.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Assembling a Hex Vase can be a bit tricky..need at least a few hands..:) I use masking tape ..lots of it..I lay the pieces out in order snugged up to each other.. and the gently lift into position..You still have quite a bit of flexability...You can then use a bit of tacky wax or solder in a couple spots to stabilize. A jig helps sometimes..set up over the pattern bottom and seems to help aligning the top section.. When I have to unfoil something..I take off the foil and use a toothbrush and soapy water to scrub off the adhesive....works for me.. and then dry thoroughly and let sit a bit before foiling again.. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 14:51:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vS9rt-0000kXa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 14:51 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 17:48:38 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.124838.0> References: <<1996Nov25.25445.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Phil Taylor wrote: > > I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've > started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice at > assembling 3-dimensional pieces. > I've tried to assemble the sides in a hexagon and found > afterward that the assembled sides did not fit the base. So I took the > sides apart to start over. > Here are my questions: > Do I have to use an xacto knife or something similar to remove > all the adhesive residue from the places where I had to remove the > tinned foil? > Can I patch in the foil in those places where it was removed in > order to take the sides apart? If so, are there any tips about how to > do this? > Is there a way to hold the six sides in place before soldering > so I can fit the bottom to the assembled sides? Or, what is the best > sequence for assembling? > How many sides should be asssembled before trying to fit all six > sides together? In other words, should I try to assemble two sets of > three side pieces first and then assemble those two pieces together? > What keeps the six sides from changing their angle while they're > being soldered together? > How can I make sure the bottom will fit the assembled sides? > I've cut to the pattern and it's exact. > I would appreciate any pointers, admonishments whatever you have > to offer. Thanks T. in Montana > ---- I would use tape (masking or electrical) on the 6 pieces first, both on the inside (first) and on the outside. Be sure there is no flux residue under the tape when you are trying to attach it. Then I would tape those pieces to the bottom, rotating the 6 sides until I found the best line up with the bottom. If at that point, one side is too big, take it out and grind it down a little. And then finally tack solder. Then you can remove the tape and do your final soldering. I wouldn't start and stop the foil for a patch on the top of the vase, but if the patch is going to be on an inside seam, you could do it. If you have any trouble at all with the foil coming unstuck, then refoil the whole piece. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 15:52:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSAoz-0000lsa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 15:52 PST X-Path: sympatico.ca!arthurs.and.willis From: Joseph Arthurs To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 18:51:55 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.105155.0> References: <<1996Nov25.54734.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, I've been reading about the blotchy copper patina. I had heard that this was a problem but was told in my beginning class that cleaning is absolutely essential (already mentioned) but that drying it and heating it with a blowdryer also helps a lot. The trick supposedly is to apply the patina while the piece is still warm to the touch from blowdrying and to stop and blowdry each portion prior to patina. I tried this technique on a Winnie the Pooh suncatcher and it came out pretty good, but I haven't tried anything else so I don't know whether I was just lucky, or whether there's any truth to it. Haven't really had the chance to investigate further. I did make a point of going over the solder lines with ultra fine steel wool before I tried heating it up, so that could have been as much as anything. Don't know whether this helps. Sort of curious as to whether this is one of these wive's tails that occur. Sandy ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:00:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSAwk-0000i6a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:00 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 18:58:19 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.135819.0> References: <<9611251644.AA05309@crosfield.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jerry Cullingford wrote: > > > the other plus point i have to say for non-thermastatic irons, is that > > you may want to do decorative soldering with it, and as we found out > > (since i don't use a weller i did'nt know about it), that a weller iron > > can't use a reostat, and so you really can't lower the tip temp. > > > > ---Mike Savad > > True, but since the temperature is controlled by a temperature-sensitive > material in the tip, you can use a different tip set for a lower temperature - > they are available for several temperatures, but not having tried decorative > effects myself, I can't say whether there's one that's suitable. > > I'm curious - what happened when you tried using a rheostat? did the iron > stop working altogether, or did you just have problems getting the > temperature down? > > -Jerry dunno, since i never had a weller, but i think other's said that the iron did'nt heat properly or something. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:08:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSB4X-0000Sva; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:08 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:05:44 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.14544.0> References: <<1996Nov25.25445.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Phil Taylor wrote: > > I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've > started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice at > assembling 3-dimensional pieces. > I've tried to assemble the sides in a hexagon and found > afterward that the assembled sides did not fit the base. So I took the > sides apart to start over. > Here are my questions: > Do I have to use an xacto knife or something similar to remove > all the adhesive residue from the places where I had to remove the > tinned foil? > Can I patch in the foil in those places where it was removed in > order to take the sides apart? If so, are there any tips about how to > do this? > Is there a way to hold the six sides in place before soldering > so I can fit the bottom to the assembled sides? Or, what is the best > sequence for assembling? > How many sides should be asssembled before trying to fit all six > sides together? In other words, should I try to assemble two sets of > three side pieces first and then assemble those two pieces together? > What keeps the six sides from changing their angle while they're > being soldered together? > How can I make sure the bottom will fit the assembled sides? > I've cut to the pattern and it's exact. > I would appreciate any pointers, admonishments whatever you have > to offer. Thanks T. in Montana > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ok let's see, removeing the old foil is ok, the glue should'nt hurt the new foil, though you should make sure it's clean of any flux. patch jobs are ok because it's a 3-d piece and the edges are sealed. when your ready to solder tape your pieces together in the shape of the vase, (of course making sure that the angles all work together. when taping it (masking tape, or electrical tape will be fine), providing the base has been cut accuratly, tape the base in also. then tack all the joints. for the future, if all the sides fit perfectly, and it does'nt look lop-sided, trace the inside or outside of the projects' base and make a new bottom, which should fit like a glove, just be sure to grind here or there and fit it in before you foil. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:14:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSBAN-0000kAa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:14 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:12:24 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.141224.0> References: <<1996Nov25.105155.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joseph Arthurs wrote: > > Hi, > > I've been reading about the blotchy copper patina. I had heard that this > was a problem but was told in my beginning class that cleaning is > absolutely essential (already mentioned) but that drying it and heating > it with a blowdryer also helps a lot. The trick supposedly is to apply > the patina while the piece is still warm to the touch from blowdrying and > to stop and blowdry each portion prior to patina. I tried this technique > on a Winnie the Pooh suncatcher and it came out pretty good, but I > haven't tried anything else so I don't know whether I was just lucky, or > whether there's any truth to it. Haven't really had the chance to > investigate further. I did make a point of going over the solder lines > with ultra fine steel wool before I tried heating it up, so that could > have been as much as anything. > > Don't know whether this helps. Sort of curious as to whether this is one > of these wive's tails that occur. > > Sandy > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well, heat seems to be a cure all in alot of cases, usally after i scrub the piece clean i finish it off in hot water, does'nt hurt. it also depends on how old the patina is, brand, quality of the solder, if you redip your brush in the bottle, etc. but in almost any case polishing it afterwards, yields just about the same results. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:24:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSBJu-0000Y0a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:24 PST X-Path: fbo.com!dloda From: Dave Loda To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 16:30:52 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.83052.0> References: <<1996Nov25.72035.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk StndGlass1@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 96-11-25 11:48:11 EST, you write: > > << I'm curious - what happened when you tried using a rheostat? did the iron > stop working altogether, or did you just have problems getting the > temperature down? >> > > If you use a rheostat with the W100, the temperature controlling mechanism in > the rheostat fights with the controller in the soldering iron. 9 times out > of 10, it has been my experience (or that of my students who keep trying this > no matter what we say) the rheostat will win, and the temperature controlling > features of your W100 will be null and void. Your iron will still work, but > the features you paid extra for are no longer there. > > Jenna > Meredith Stained Glass > ---- The Weller 80 works extreamly well with a reostate, and the cord is not as thick as the w100. Also it is about half the price of the W100 and less thanthe Unger. FWIW Unger is owned by Weller Dave Loda Stained Glass of Newport ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:25:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSBKk-00002Ra; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:25 PST X-Path: az.stratus.com!charlie From: Charles Spitzer To: glass@bungi.com Subject: cheap copper sulfate Date: Mon, 25 Nov 96 17:24:49 -0700 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Customer Assistance Center, Stratus Computer, Inc. Precedence: bulk I found that you can buy copper sulfate at the local chemical supply store cheaply. I paid around $12 for 500mg, which should be enough to make about 10 gallons of patina. Re: the age of copper patina: Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little distilled water should make it go back into solution. Patina shouldn't be bothered by being old, as the copper sulfate doesn't degrade into other chemicals. --- Charles Spitzer charlie@az.stratus.com Phoenix, AZ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:36:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSBVP-0000nxa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:36 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:34:08 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.14348.0> References: <> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Charles Spitzer wrote: > > I found that you can buy copper sulfate at the local chemical supply store > cheaply. I paid around $12 for 500mg, which should be enough to make about 10 > gallons of patina. > > Re: the age of copper patina: > Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little > distilled water should make it go back into solution. Patina shouldn't be > bothered by being old, as the copper sulfate doesn't degrade into other > chemicals. > --- > Charles Spitzer > charlie@az.stratus.com > Phoenix, AZ > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass the copper sulfate does'nt but the chemicals to keep the suspension going does, like in novacan patina the stuff never settles, it has a few different acids in it, which can destablize and weaken. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 16:49:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSBhn-0000c7a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 16:48 PST X-Path: aol.com!StndGlass1 From: StndGlass1@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:48:48 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.144848.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-11-25 19:26:33 EST, you write: << The Weller 80 works extreamly well with a reostate, and the cord is not as thick as the w100. Also it is about half the price of the W100 and less thanthe Unger. FWIW Unger is owned by Weller >> No question about it. The Weller 80 watt is designed to work with the rheostat. A good iron for your investment. Still, if you aren't going to be doing decorative soldering, I would recommend the W100 to most hobbyists. Jenna Meredith Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 17:31:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSCM9-0000jNa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 17:30 PST X-Path: riverview.net!vgillespie From: vgillespie To: Glass@Bungi.com Subject: Copper Patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 20:29:06 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov25.12296.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I've been lurking around reading notes for quite a few months now, but have never responded. After reading alot of answers to the copper patina question, I would like to offer the following input: Copper patina does not work well if there is any flux residue on the project. It also has a funny way of reacting with many types of cleaners. I know it's tempting to use dish soap or any other cleaner, but many leave a residue that reacts poorly with patina. If you are using black patina, you will probably not notice any adverse affects, because black patina causes the solder to oxidize. It is quite strong and will "cut thru" most residue. Copper patina is a plating, which needs to "adhere" to the solder (for lack of a better word). There is a cleaner that should be available at your supplier called CJ'S Flux and Patina Remover. It is formulated so that it doesn't react with copper patina. It may seem a little pricy (around $5 for 8 0z.) but it is concentrated and goes a long way. A drop about the size of a dime will clean a panel around 12" x 18". Use a scrub brush and clean the project well, getting in the joints and corners. Rinse until you think it's gone, and then rinse some more. Dry the panel off and apply the patina immediatly. Another important step in bringing up the shine of copper patina is to apply a finishing compound or wax. This will bring up the shine and "seal" the surface. Metals (and metal platings) will oxidize when exposed to air. This "seal" will keep the air from the metal. I have been using CJ'S Cleaner, Novacan Copper Patina and Kem-O-Pro Finishing Compound for 10 years and have had many comments on how nice the finish looks. Just my 2 cents worth....Hope it helps. Vicki ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 19:33:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSEH2-0000g7a; Mon, 25 Nov 96 19:33 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:33:21 -0800 Message-ID: <199611260333.TAA29585@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >Joyce in reply to Chris McMurdo wrote: >< snip: If you need it to be completely black, you >need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the >copper patina.> >Methinks you don't need to be so drastic. It should suffice to >wire-wool it off and then re-patina... Use fine grade wire or plastic >"wire-wool" >Elisabeth 'n Toby > > >---- I think you are probably correct in the less agresive solution. also I think that the formulation of the copper versus black has a lot to do with its ability to fight through grunge. Due to the nature of our use (mostly restoration of old lamps) we never use commecial patinas but mix our own using various mixes of muriatic,copper sulfate, water and salt. In this way we can play with the mix to match the exsisting patina more closely. The more coppery patinas are achieved using copper sulfate and water only. The blacker the more muriatic. I think that the presence of the acid may be the defining difference regards grunge cutting. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 19:44:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSERd-0000Gea; Mon, 25 Nov 96 19:44 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:44:18 -0800 Message-ID: <199611260344.TAA00872@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Phil Taylor wrote: >> >> I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've >> started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice at >> assembling 3-dimensional pieces. >> for >the future, if all the sides fit perfectly, and it does'nt look >lop-sided, trace the inside or outside of the projects' base and make a >new bottom, which should fit like a glove, just be sure to grind here or >there and fit it in before you foil. > >---Mike Savad > >-- Dont forget to leave some room for the thickness of the foil. Nothing like getting a perfect fit foiling and finding that fit grew. ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon Nov 25 19:49:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSEW4-0000YAa; Mon, 25 Nov 96 19:49 PST X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Mon, 25 Nov 1996 19:48:53 -0800 Message-ID: <199611260348.TAA09596@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >I found that you can buy copper sulfate at the local chemical supply store >cheaply. I paid around $12 for 500mg, which should be enough to make about 10 >gallons of patina. Just go to your hardware store or home center and buy some Root killer (for sewers and septic systems) this is 99.9% copper sulfate. about $6 - $8 per 2lb bottle. > >Re: the age of copper patina: >Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little >distilled water should make it go back into solution. Patina shouldn't be >bothered by being old, as the copper sulfate doesn't degrade into other >chemicals. >--- or just use hot tap water. mix in some muriatic to vary the color. ms >Charles Spitzer >charlie@az.stratus.com >Phoenix, AZ >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 04:31:21 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSMfJ-0000kxa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 04:31 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 07:28:26 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.22826.0> References: <> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Charles Spitzer wrote: > > I found that you can buy copper sulfate at the local chemical supply store > cheaply. I paid around $12 for 500mg, which should be enough to make about 10 > gallons of patina. > > Re: the age of copper patina: > Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little > distilled water should make it go back into solution. Patina shouldn't be > bothered by being old, as the copper sulfate doesn't degrade into other > chemicals. > --- Have you actually tried this? My first experience with copper sulfate that way, was with my 1st stained glass instructor. She mixed the stuff up, but had no way of heating it in class, and our projects turned out absolutely awful. (Enough to cure me of using copper patina for a long long time). But after trying the commercial stuff, I have had not problem getting a decent color every time. (I have had blotchy stuff in the beginning days, before I knew enough to clean properly). But her solution caused my project to turn an ugly brown...no shine, no nice coppery color, just butt ugly! Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 04:51:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSMyq-0000S4a; Tue, 26 Nov 96 04:51 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 06:47:28 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961117012524.2d6f15e6@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ms; Interesting to here what you have to say about acids. I had heard you could use muriatic acid, even got some, then lost the reference. Can you tell us more about proportions? I accidently spilled some orange juice on something I was patina-ing with copper sulfate and water solution, and I thought it did work better... Meg > >I think you are probably correct in the less agresive solution. also I >think that the formulation of the copper versus black has a lot to do >with its ability to fight through grunge. Due to the nature of our use >(mostly restoration of old lamps) we never use commecial patinas but >mix our own using various mixes of muriatic,copper sulfate, water and >salt. In this way we can play with the mix to match the exsisting >patina more closely. The more coppery patinas are achieved using copper >sulfate and water only. The blacker the more muriatic. I think that the >presence of the acid may be the defining difference regards grunge >cutting. > >ms >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 04:55:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSN2Y-00006Ca; Tue, 26 Nov 96 04:55 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 06:51:20 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961117012915.2d6f654a@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have. Here in Costa Rica the copper sulfate crystals are all I have available. I melt them in water, and warm this solution. Then I clean meticulously and dry. Put it on and wax it. usually turns out fine, I suspect that the cleaning wasn't good enough in the few times it turned blotchy. Also, don't judge till you have shined it, it always comes up a lot better than when you first apply it. Meg >Have you actually tried this? My first experience with copper sulfate >that way, was with my 1st stained glass instructor. She mixed the stuff >up, but had no way of heating it in class, and our projects turned out >absolutely awful. (Enough to cure me of using copper patina for a long >long time). But after trying the commercial stuff, I have had not >problem getting a decent color every time. (I have had blotchy stuff in >the beginning days, before I knew enough to clean properly). But her >solution caused my project to turn an ugly brown...no shine, no nice >coppery color, just butt ugly! > >Garden of Glass >Joyce Moran >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 07:09:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSP80-0000YJa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 07:08 PST X-Path: worldnet.att.net!summit-stained-glass From: Mike Peck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 15:08:48 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.15848.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I think you are probably correct in the less agresive solution. also I >think that the formulation of the copper versus black has a lot to do >with its ability to fight through grunge. Due to the nature of our use >(mostly restoration of old lamps) we never use commecial patinas but >mix our own using various mixes of muriatic,copper sulfate, water and >salt. In this way we can play with the mix to match the exsisting >patina more closely. The more coppery patinas are achieved using copper >sulfate and water only. The blacker the more muriatic. I think that the >presence of the acid may be the defining difference regards grunge >cutting. > >ms Mike, Hum, I've had more success than failures with copper patinas, but I have always used commercially available patinas (usually Novacan). I never thought to mix up my own, thanks for planting the seed! My $0.02 (US) worth, I think there are a couple of things that you can do to hedge your success. First, when I am going to copper patina, I will use solder with the highest tin content, ie, 63/37. Someone told me that the lead in the solder can concentrate in small areas as the solder solidifies and will produce a splotchy appearance when the patina is applied. Using 50/50 solder allows the tin/lead to demix to some extent when molten and you'll get pockets within your solder line where the tin or lead will concentrate. I dunno about all this chemistry happening, but the claim made to this is that the copper actually bonds with the tin in the solder rather than the lead. Any chemists out there that can confirm this? The other thing I have noticed is that Canfield and Hirsh solders tend to give better(more consistent) results than other brands I have tried. I think their respective levels of impurities are less or maybe better controlled than other solder brands. I always scrub the piece as others have described, and I always polish with a nonabrasive tarnish remover. I still get an ugly splotch now and then, but I generally attribute it to some contaminate that I didn't get off the surface. At any rate, I just burn it out with a soldering iron, rescrub the area and reapply fresh patina. It seems to work just fine. Mike Peck Summit Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 07:54:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSPq3-0000Yla; Tue, 26 Nov 96 07:54 PST X-Path: aol.com!GlasCrafts From: GlasCrafts@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Stained Glass Sales Flyer Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 10:54:18 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.55418.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk It may be of interest to the list to check the Glass Crafters Stained Glass web page at http://www.craftweb.com/org/glascrafts/glascraf.shtml Here you can obtain an email of the Holiday Sales Flyer. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 08:01:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSPwR-00003Fa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 08:00 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina over patina Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 10:58:59 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.55859.0> References: <<199611260333.TAA29585@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Michael Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > > > >Joyce in reply to Chris McMurdo wrote: > >< snip: If you need it to be completely black, you > >need to go over all the soldering with your iron, to get rid of the > >copper patina.> > >Methinks you don't need to be so drastic. It should suffice to > >wire-wool it off and then re-patina... Use fine grade wire or plastic > >"wire-wool" > >Elisabeth 'n Toby > > > > > >---- > > I think you are probably correct in the less agresive solution. also I > think that the formulation of the copper versus black has a lot to do > with its ability to fight through grunge. Due to the nature of our use > (mostly restoration of old lamps) we never use commecial patinas but > mix our own using various mixes of muriatic,copper sulfate, water and > salt. In this way we can play with the mix to match the exsisting > patina more closely. The more coppery patinas are achieved using copper > sulfate and water only. The blacker the more muriatic. I think that the > presence of the acid may be the defining difference regards grunge > cutting. > > ms > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass would it be ok if you shared the recipe for your patina, i have all the ingrediants, but always wanted to make my own, but there is'nt any good recipes out there.. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 08:02:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSPy0-0000UJa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 08:02 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 11:00:40 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.6040.0> References: <<199611260344.TAA00872@dfw-ix8.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Michael Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > >Phil Taylor wrote: > >> > >> I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've > >> started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice > at > >> assembling 3-dimensional pieces. > >> > for > >the future, if all the sides fit perfectly, and it does'nt look > >lop-sided, trace the inside or outside of the projects' base and make > a > >new bottom, which should fit like a glove, just be sure to grind here > or > >there and fit it in before you foil. > > > >---Mike Savad > > > >-- > > Dont forget to leave some room for the thickness of the foil. Nothing > like getting a perfect fit foiling and finding that fit grew. > > ms > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass welp usally when it's foiled i can usally push it through, though if i used the back edge of my marker line when cutting, then lightly grind it, it should be enough space for clearence. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 08:07:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSQ2l-0000Nza; Tue, 26 Nov 96 08:07 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 11:05:30 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.6530.0> References: <<1996Nov26.22826.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joyce Moran wrote: > > Charles Spitzer wrote: > > > > I found that you can buy copper sulfate at the local chemical supply store > > cheaply. I paid around $12 for 500mg, which should be enough to make about 10 > > gallons of patina. > > > > Re: the age of copper patina: > > Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little > > distilled water should make it go back into solution. Patina shouldn't be > > bothered by being old, as the copper sulfate doesn't degrade into other > > chemicals. > > --- > > Have you actually tried this? My first experience with copper sulfate > that way, was with my 1st stained glass instructor. She mixed the stuff > up, but had no way of heating it in class, and our projects turned out > absolutely awful. (Enough to cure me of using copper patina for a long > long time). But after trying the commercial stuff, I have had not > problem getting a decent color every time. (I have had blotchy stuff in > the beginning days, before I knew enough to clean properly). But her > solution caused my project to turn an ugly brown...no shine, no nice > coppery color, just butt ugly! > > Garden of Glass > Joyce Moran > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass well, really, patina is designed to antique the piece and not turn it shiny. the first patinaes made it look coppery brown, which is good if you want to make it look like an antique. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 12:29:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSU81-0000ika; Tue, 26 Nov 96 12:29 PST X-Path: vetmed.wsu.edu!JCGRAHN From: "Jennifer C. Grahn" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 12:28:27 PST8PDT Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Jen ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 13:20:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSUum-0000TWa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 13:19 PST X-Path: tpgi.com.au!llutz From: llutz To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 08:20:51 +1000 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.182051.0> References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jennifer C. Grahn wrote: > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > appreciated. I get it and find it useful- like all magazines, it has some very simple projects & things I'm not interested in- but, it has to appeal to a wide audience- However, I do find it generally worth getting. I'm not sure why, but most of the product ads do not include a contact address for the company- I suppose they assume you can go to your local dealer (in my case- at least 250miles away). The ads at least let me know what is available- even if it takes a long time to track it down- I have had a new grinder on order for the past 2 months- directly from the Australian distributer- it must be on a slow boat from the US via Europe, S. Africa, etc. As for your enquiry- try a copy or borrow a copy to have a look before you buy. Larry from Oz ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 13:24:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSUzf-0000Uva; Tue, 26 Nov 96 13:24 PST X-Path: juno.com!roadrunner47 From: roadrunner47@juno.com (Jacque E Smith) To: glass@Bungi.com Subject: Re: Copper Patina Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 16:21:30 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov26.212130.0> References: <<1996Nov25.12296.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Vicky is this Glasstoys Vickie? If so Hi! lost your other e-mail address when my hard drive lost everything on it..including Prodigy..Let me know if this is you...Jacque ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 15:08:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSWbU-0000RFa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 15:07 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Glass Pattern Quarterly Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 17:57:19 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.175719.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk We recieve GPQ and are very please with the informantion, The customers like to look thru the mag. Have a good day. Walter ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 15:29:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSWvI-0000J5a; Tue, 26 Nov 96 15:28 PST X-Path: MMAC.IS.LMSC.LOCKHEED.COM!Rund#m#_Sharen From: "Rund, Sharen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: OOF: RE: Glass Pattern Quarterly Date: 26 Nov 1996 15:24:14 U Message-ID: <1996Nov26.72414.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello, I'm away from the office but will be returning on 12/2 - if you need something - see Mike Fabel Happy T-bird day!!! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 17:12:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSYWc-0000lPa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 17:10 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 20:08:53 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.15853.0> References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jennifer C. Grahn wrote: > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > > Jen > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass i get it, it's generally designed for beginners, but there's also fused stuff in there too. i wish it came out more then quarterly though. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 17:14:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSYYi-0000aHa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 17:13 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 20:11:06 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.15116.0> References: <<1996Nov27.182051.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk llutz wrote: > > Jennifer C. Grahn wrote: > > > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > > appreciated. > I get it and find it useful- like all magazines, it has some very simple > projects & things I'm not interested in- but, it has to appeal to a wide > audience- However, I do find it generally worth getting. I'm not sure > why, but most of the product ads do not include a contact address for > the company- I suppose they assume you can go to your local dealer (in > my case- at least 250miles away). The ads at least let me know what is > available- even if it takes a long time to track it down- I have had a > new grinder on order for the past 2 months- directly from the Australian > distributer- it must be on a slow boat from the US via Europe, S. > Africa, etc. > As for your enquiry- try a copy or borrow a copy to have a look before > you buy. > Larry from Oz > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass yep, i feel the same way about the magazine, it's not great, or anything, but i think we get it 'cuz the is'nt that many magazines on stained glass. 2 or 3 i think. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 19:24:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSabX-0000MMa; Tue, 26 Nov 96 19:24 PST X-Path: gte.net!leestat From: Lee Boe To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 22:20:24 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.172024.0> References: <<199611260348.TAA09596@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Lee Boe Precedence: bulk Thanks Michael, I was just wondering where to get straight copper sulfate. Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations Michael Smoucha wrote: > > Just go to your hardware store or home center and buy some Root killer > (for sewers and septic systems) this is 99.9% copper sulfate. about $6 > - $8 per 2lb bottle. > > > >Re: the age of copper patina: > >Since the water evaporates and leaves a bluish salt, adding a little > >distilled water should make it go back into solution. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 19:49:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSazk-0000Xra; Tue, 26 Nov 96 19:49 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 20:19:29 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.131929.0> References: <<1996Nov25.224225.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk Jacque E Smith wrote: > > Assembling a Hex Vase can be a bit tricky..need at least a few hands..:) > I use masking tape ..lots of it..I lay the pieces out in order snugged up > to each other.. and the gently lift into position..You still have quite a > bit of flexability...You can then use a bit of tacky wax or solder in a > couple spots to stabilize. > A jig helps sometimes..set up over the pattern bottom and seems to help > aligning the top section.. > > When I have to unfoil something..I take off the foil and use a toothbrush > and soapy water to scrub off the adhesive....works for me.. and then dry > thoroughly and let sit a bit before foiling again.. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassHi Jacque, Thanks for the tips. I'm going to give it a try. T. In Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 19:56:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSb6R-0000hea; Tue, 26 Nov 96 19:56 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 20:26:18 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.132618.0> References: <<1996Nov25.92428.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk Linda Campbell wrote: > > I'm just a novice too but I would: > > -Make sure all the sides are the same size. > -Tack the sides together at the ends, starting with two pieces and adding > the rest one at a time. Use the bottom pattern to ensure that the inside > angle of each of the two side is 120 degrees. > -Since you have only tacked, the corners, you should be able to move it > about a bit to get the opposing sides parallel. > -Use the completed hexagonal cylinder to draw a pattern for the bottom, > using either the inside or outside, depending one whether you want to > bottom to fit inside or be on the outside. > > I would remove all the foil and glue and start over - you will feel better > about it. Just my $.02. > > Linda Campbell > > I don't speak for Metro Machine and God knows they don't have any idea what > I'm thinking. > > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassHi Linda, Thanks for the tips. I appreciate your taking the time -- T. in Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 19:58:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSb8Z-0000Bha; Tue, 26 Nov 96 19:58 PST X-Path: montana.com!chip3 From: Phil Taylor To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 20:28:23 -0700 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.132823.0> References: <<1996Nov25.14544.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Chip3 Video Precedence: bulk M. Savad wrote: > > Phil Taylor wrote: > > > > I need some advice and direction on a hexagonal vase that I've > > started. I'm having some problems, mostly because of being a novice at > > assembling 3-dimensional pieces. > > I've tried to assemble the sides in a hexagon and found > > afterward that the assembled sides did not fit the base. So I took the > > sides apart to start over. > > Here are my questions: > > Do I have to use an xacto knife or something similar to remove > > all the adhesive residue from the places where I had to remove the > > tinned foil? > > Can I patch in the foil in those places where it was removed in > > order to take the sides apart? If so, are there any tips about how to > > do this? > > Is there a way to hold the six sides in place before soldering > > so I can fit the bottom to the assembled sides? Or, what is the best > > sequence for assembling? > > How many sides should be asssembled before trying to fit all six > > sides together? In other words, should I try to assemble two sets of > > three side pieces first and then assemble those two pieces together? > > What keeps the six sides from changing their angle while they're > > being soldered together? > > How can I make sure the bottom will fit the assembled sides? > > I've cut to the pattern and it's exact. > > I would appreciate any pointers, admonishments whatever you have > > to offer. Thanks T. in Montana > > ---- > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ok let's see, removeing the old foil is ok, the glue should'nt hurt the > new foil, though you should make sure it's clean of any flux. patch jobs > are ok because it's a 3-d piece and the edges are sealed. when your > ready to solder tape your pieces together in the shape of the vase, (of > course making sure that the angles all work together. when taping it > (masking tape, or electrical tape will be fine), providing the base has > been cut accuratly, tape the base in also. then tack all the joints. for > the future, if all the sides fit perfectly, and it does'nt look > lop-sided, trace the inside or outside of the projects' base and make a > new bottom, which should fit like a glove, just be sure to grind here or > there and fit it in before you foil. > > ---Mike Savad > > -- > Mike's Stained Glass > http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassHi Mike, Thanks for the tips. You always come through and I feel better about fixing a mess. T. in Montana ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue Nov 26 20:06:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSbG0-00006Ra; Tue, 26 Nov 96 20:05 PST X-Path: gte.net!leestat From: Lee Boe To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 23:02:14 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.18214.0> References: <<1996Nov27.182051.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Lee Boe Precedence: bulk Hi, I find GPQ very usefull, but if you want the ad's to have the address and phone #'s of the co.'s in the ads you need to subscribe to the magzine. The copy's available at the Glass Store's do not have product contact info in the ads. I have a subscription and have no trouble contacting manufactures. You may still get the products at your glass Store, because mgr. direct orders are usually quite large. (Ok if you are a dealer or larger producing studio.) Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations llutz wrote: > > Jennifer C. Grahn wrote: > > > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > > appreciated. > I get it and find it useful- like all magazines, it has some very simple > projects & things I'm not interested in- but, it has to appeal to a wide > audience- However, I do find it generally worth getting. I'm not sure > why, but most of the product ads do not include a contact address for > the company- I suppose they assume you can go to your local dealer (in > my case- at least 250miles away). ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 04:56:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSjWi-00002fa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 04:55 PST X-Path: BACKROADS.NET!bartman From: Bart Huffman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 07:54:18 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov26.235418.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961117012915.2d6f654a@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Richard LaVal wrote: > > I have. Here in Costa Rica the copper sulfate crystals are all I have > available. I melt them in water, and warm this solution. Then I clean > meticulously and dry. Put it on and wax it. usually turns out fine, I > suspect that the cleaning wasn't good enough in the few times it turned > blotchy. Also, don't judge till you have shined it, it always comes up a > lot better than when you first apply it. > Meg > I was wondering if you would share your recipe for patina. Since you only use copper sulfate, and can't get commercial patinas, I figured that you would know what mistakes not to make with copper sulfate. Thanks Bart ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 06:37:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSl6B-0000IMa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 06:36 PST X-Path: CapAccess.org!rejones From: "Robert E. Jones" To: "Jennifer C. Grahn" Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 09:39:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1996Nov27.43942.0> References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk On Tue, 26 Nov 1996, Jennifer C. Grahn wrote: > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > > Jen Jen, About two weeks ago, I ask the same questions almost verbatim. I got no response. That might say something in it self. Bob ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 08:05:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSmUA-0000bFa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 08:05 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 08:03:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov27.0313.0> References: <<1996Nov25.135819.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk The subject line of this message should be rheostats. Since when has it been found that a rheostat does not work with a soldering iron. That is the whole purpose of it...to control temperature. This comes as a real surprise to me. I've used a Weller iron for some 12 years regularly with a rheostat and have found it to regulate temperature for tinning, soldering, and decorative soldering all at different temperatures. I have noticed that the Weller iron seem only to heat on one side. I would appreciate additional information on this. PJ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 08:13:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSmbR-0000J4a; Wed, 27 Nov 96 08:12 PST X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 08:10:44 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <1996Nov27.01044.0> References: <<1.5.4.16.19961117012915.2d6f654a@sol.racsa.co.cr>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Subject line should be cleaning solder wire. I have found that when the solder wire shows oxidation I take fine steel wool and go over it to rid the wire of oxidation before I solder. This helps give me a good clean solder bead free from splotchy marks caused by contamination in the solder oxides. Anothe .02cents worth. PJ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 08:21:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSmjQ-00005Ca; Wed, 27 Nov 96 08:21 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 11:19:02 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.6192.0> References: <<1996Nov27.0313.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Peggy W. Johnsen wrote: > > The subject line of this message should be rheostats. Since when has it > been found that a rheostat does not work with a soldering iron. That is > the whole purpose of it...to control temperature. This comes as a real > surprise to me. I've used a Weller iron for some 12 years regularly with > a rheostat and have found it to regulate temperature for tinning, > soldering, and decorative soldering all at different temperatures. I have > noticed that the Weller iron seem only to heat on one side. I would > appreciate additional information on this. PJ > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass welp, it was only on the weller, though i think there should be something in the archives about it. something like a bi-metalic elelement in the iron's tip, and it may be burned out if used with a reostat. but really shoud'nt that be on the box somewhere? but since i don't have a weller, i'm really not sure. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 09:52:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSo9g-0000PSa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 09:52 PST X-Path: aol.com!StndGlass1 From: StndGlass1@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Purchasing Glass Equipment Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 12:52:08 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.7528.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-11-27 11:07:21 EST, you write: << Since when has it been found that a rheostat does not work with a soldering iron. >> It's not that a rheostat doesn't work with a weller iron, it's just a certain model. Weller's 80 watt works beautifully with the rheostat, but the Weller 100 watt with Temperature Controller has a built in "rheostat". I put that in quotations because it does control the temperature (keeps it at 700 degrees if you use the standard tips that come with the iron), but it doesn't allow for adjustment. If you use the rheostat for that model, it fights with the built in temperature controller and doesn't work for long. Jenna Meredith Stained Glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 10:41:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSoul-0000bga; Wed, 27 Nov 96 10:40 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: 27 Nov 96 13:39:09 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov27.18399.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Subject line should be cleaning solder wire. Thread drift, continental drift, The Drifters ... it's what makes life interesting. Have a nice T-Day, everyone! Albert __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ http://www.bungi.com/glass/igga/ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 12:17:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSqPe-0000BAa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 12:16 PST X-Path: tiac.net!phil7 From: Philip McRae To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Al's T-bird Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 15:00:54 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.7054.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Al, ole sport, I'm gonna pass on the bird, but really chow down on the sausage,walnut, and cranberry stuffing. So much so the belt will need a new notch. Happy Thanksgivings everyone! Phil7 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 13:33:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vSrap-0000Soa; Wed, 27 Nov 96 13:32 PST X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: Shirley Suter To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Happy T/G Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 15:31:37 -0600 Message-ID: <1996Nov27.93137.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service & Suter's Stained Glass Precedence: bulk ........me me me me me.......... Happy Bird-day to you. Happy Bird-day to you. Happy Bird-day to everyone........Happy Bird-day to you!!!!! :) S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed Nov 27 15:16:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vStCh-0000bza; Wed, 27 Nov 96 15:15 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Thanksgiving - MY Version..... Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 23:42:49 +0000 Message-ID: <199611272315.XAA10422@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ...do..re...mi..fa... squeak , splutter, squeak..... Happy "Bird-Day" to you ALL!! >From Across The Pond, where we don't celebrate Thanksgiving, we (the Royal We) will nevertheless be with you in thoughts. Another year is closing in, time to take stock again, time to set new goals....time to be grateful for another 12 months' survival. 1997 will be a very exciting year for me personally; I will celebrate my first year in the Internet, 10 years as a FULL-time stained glass artisan; I have regained my own health (after a number of years of struggling to over-come numerous surgical "intrusions"), my business is really taking off and I have 15 firm commissions to start the new year with and awaiting news of another 4 (one of which involving about 100 sq.ft. of stained glass!!) I have made some wonderful new friends, some of which I hope to meet at Easter. My village is caring and supportive, the Colleges where I teach couldn't do enough for me. Sure, money isn't all that plentiful, but whoever "reigns Up There" might want me to sweat a bit, but sure doesn't want me to "go under". I have a lot to be thankful for, a lot to be joyful about. The world is full of nastiness, ill-will and corruption. How wonderful to be able - just once or twice - to take a step back and look at the good things in Life and to be able to say "Thank You". That to me is what a Thanksgiving Day is all about.... Thank you ALL for this last year. Tomorrow, I will be thinking of each of you and hope you will have a great Day. You will eat the BIRD; a bird is a being with wings, it is meant to fly; it is meant to soar to the sky and roam the world carried by the wind, the air and the light. I leave you to visualize the symbolisms....... All of you, be nurtured, be fed and have a wonderful time! Then let's get back and tease, inform, discuss, debate and argue. As stained glass artisans, we are the Messengers of Colour & Light. As regards ME, I am just a rotten old Viking Heathen, who just would like to grab this chance to say thank you and wish you well and a wonderful Day! Greta The Frightful Viking (alias Elisabeth 'n Toby) ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 28 02:45:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vT3xN-0000Gva; Thu, 28 Nov 96 02:44 PST X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: unsubscribe Date: 28 Nov 96 05:42:43 EST Message-ID: <1996Nov28.104243.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I will be unable to pick up my mail until Monday and know my mailbox will go over the 100 limit if I say tuned. I'll tune in again when I'm back. Monona ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 28 03:39:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vT4o3-0000B4a; Thu, 28 Nov 96 03:39 PST X-Path: coventry.ac.uk!byx015 From: Mike Simpson To: glass@bungi.com Subject: U.K. suppliers of Kokomo glass Date: Thu, 28 Nov 1996 11:38:51 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <1996Nov28.113851.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Are there any British suppliers of Kokomo glass? Also Chicago Art glass, Youghiogheny and Bullseye. I tend to need smallish quantities, from 4 to 10 sq. ft. but this is more than is found in the "random packs" that a few suppliers have. I already have a good supplier of Uroboros and erratic supplies of Bullseye and know that Decorative Glass Supplies in Bingley are getting a stock of Kokomo in February but I need some now. Thanks for any help that you can give, Mike Simpson. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 28 09:28:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTAFe-0000NNa; Thu, 28 Nov 96 09:27 PST X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: U.K. suppliers of Kokomo glass Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Thu, 28 Nov 1996 17:54:33 +0000 Message-ID: <199611281727.RAA01767@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello Mike (Simpson), Where in UK are you based?? The first obvious place is James Hetley & Co Ltd in London; special "Mail Order" tel. No. 0171- 780 2346. Gen. Fax No.: 0171-790-0201 Further afield...: Pearsons Glass Ltd in Liverpool: tel: 0151-207 1474; fax: 0151- 207 2110 in East Kilbride: 013552-30175 (no fax) Let me know how you get on.... Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu Nov 28 14:56:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTFNK-0000U9a; Thu, 28 Nov 96 14:56 PST X-Path: brinet.com!reflections From: "Kathy Sagy" To: Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Thu, 28 Nov 1996 17:51:10 -0600 Message-ID: <199611282359.SAA12384@bones.brinet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Pretty to look at and pricey. The flyer given away by your local glass store is better. The price is the same from the Glass Patterns Quarterly as it is in the store, look throuh one @ your favorite glass store before you subscribe! ---------- > From: Jennifer C. Grahn > To: glass@bungi.com > Subject: Glass Patterns Quarterly > Date: Tuesday, November 26, 1996 6:28 AM > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > > Jen > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 05:12:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTSk5-0000J1a; Fri, 29 Nov 96 05:12 PST X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 07:08:36 -0600 Message-ID: <1.5.4.16.19961127155439.2eef2958@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I am afraid that I haven't been very scientific with my measurements. Will try to check them and get back to you. Basically I just use a copper sulfate and water solution, and warm it. Meg At 07:54 AM 11/27/96 -0800, you wrote: >Richard LaVal wrote: >> >> I have. Here in Costa Rica the copper sulfate crystals are all I have >> available. I melt them in water, and warm this solution. Then I clean >> meticulously and dry. Put it on and wax it. usually turns out fine, I >> suspect that the cleaning wasn't good enough in the few times it turned >> blotchy. Also, don't judge till you have shined it, it always comes up a >> lot better than when you first apply it. >> Meg >> > >I was wondering if you would share your recipe for patina. Since you >only use copper sulfate, and can't get commercial patinas, I figured >that you would know what mistakes not to make with copper sulfate. > >Thanks >Bart >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Richard and Meg LaVal apdo. 24-5655 Monteverde COSTA RICA tel: 506 645 5052 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 05:16:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTSne-0000C6a; Fri, 29 Nov 96 05:16 PST X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 08:13:39 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.31339.0> References: <<199611282359.SAA12384@bones.brinet.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Kathy Sagy wrote: > > Pretty to look at and pricey. The flyer given away by your local glass > store is better. The price is the same from the Glass Patterns Quarterly > as it is in the store, look throuh one @ your favorite glass store before > you subscribe! > > ---------- > > From: Jennifer C. Grahn > > To: glass@bungi.com > > Subject: Glass Patterns Quarterly > > Date: Tuesday, November 26, 1996 6:28 AM > > > > I wanted to know if anyone on the list gets Glass Patterns Quarterly. > > If anyone does what do you think of it? Is it worth the money? do > > you find it useful? Any input good or bad would be greatly > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Jen Personally I think Glass Patterns Quarterly is great for what it is. It gives precise information about a project from start to finish. The only problem is that most people don't want to do the same project as 30,000 other people, and may only be interested in one or two patterns out of the whole magazine, and quickly tire of paying out $4.50 for a lot of stuff they will never use. Personally, I have always been a collector of patterns, and sometimes 5-10 years down the line, it has paid off. When someone asks me "Can you do a peacock?" I remember the beautiful front cover, and can pull out that peacock design right in front of their eyes...they are amazed. For some reason, my steel trap mind doesn't remember all the patterns in all the pattern books, so I'm not as amazing with those in front of a customer. And my customers love to see it already done in full color, so they can visualize what it will look like in their homes. Glass Patterns Quarterly does a great job at photographing these patterns. Those are some of the reasons why I still buy Glass Patterns Quarterly. Garden of Glass Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 12:47:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTZqN-0000HPa; Fri, 29 Nov 96 12:47 PST X-Path: primeline.com!vgplugs From: April Paine To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Speciality Framing Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 15:52:32 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.75232.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Victorian Greenhouse & Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Hi all, Is there a better mecnhanism than a pantograph to guide a router from a template or stencil to do lettering etc- ? "I try to live and enjoy today so that I will not give all my happiness to what is my ideal of tomorrow." April Momma to little Charlie 3/96, Jasmine 2/85, Teran 2/87 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 15:59:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTcpL-0000cra; Fri, 29 Nov 96 15:58 PST X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Speciality Framing Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 18:56:36 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.135636.0> References: <<1996Nov29.75232.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk April Paine wrote: > > Hi all, > > Is there a better mecnhanism than a pantograph to guide a router from a > template or stencil to do lettering etc- ? > > "I try to live and enjoy today so that I will not give all my > happiness to what is my ideal of tomorrow." April Momma to > little Charlie 3/96, Jasmine 2/85, Teran 2/87 > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass as far as i know, no. there is that new router, that's supposed to cut easily through things, alond with it being easy to control. ---Mike Savad -- Mike's Stained Glass http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 17:31:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTeG4-0000QGa; Fri, 29 Nov 96 17:30 PST X-Path: fbo.com!dloda From: Dave Loda To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Patterns Quarterly Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 17:37:17 -0800 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.93717.0> References: <<199611282359.SAA12384@bones.brinet.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Kathy Sagy wrote: > > Pretty to look at and pricey. The flyer given away by your local glass > store is better. The price is the same from the Glass Patterns Quarterly > as it is in the store, look throuh one @ your favorite glass store before > you subscribe! > Actually, it's cheaper to by it from your glass supplier than to subscribe. Dave Loda Stained Glass of Newport > ---------- > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 18:14:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTewD-0000WMa; Fri, 29 Nov 96 18:13 PST X-Path: aol.com!LNETWORKS From: LNETWORKS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: cheap copper sulfate Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 21:13:42 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.161342.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Richard, I would be interested in knowing the water/copper sulfate proportions. And How warm??? Just under boiling, hot to touch, etc. Thanks Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 20:30:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTh3y-0000KGa; Fri, 29 Nov 96 20:30 PST X-Path: home.com!leestat7 From: leestat7 To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Test Message Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 23:26:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.182623.0> References: <<1996Nov26.18214.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: @Home Network Precedence: bulk A test message to check new address ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 22:07:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTiZE-00004Ja; Fri, 29 Nov 96 22:06 PST X-Path: aol.com!LNETWORKS From: LNETWORKS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Test Message Date: Sat, 30 Nov 1996 01:06:14 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.20614.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Returning test msg. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri Nov 29 22:18:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTikZ-0000Bpa; Fri, 29 Nov 96 22:18 PST X-Path: aol.com!LNETWORKS From: LNETWORKS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hexagonal Vase Date: Sat, 30 Nov 1996 01:18:02 -0500 Message-ID: <1996Nov29.20182.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Just one other thought, when you cut something with identical size pieces (or supposed to be) , stack the pieces together. One on top of each other, and check the size. Any that are not quite the right size will show up before foiling, and can be ground to be the right size. Lee Boe Rain-Boe's Creations ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat Nov 30 09:01:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0vTslt-0000Axa; Sat, 30 Nov 96 09:00 PST X-Path: net-magic.net!tcn From: tcn@net-magic.net (Boatwright, W.L.) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Router Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 11:55:09 +0000 Message-ID: <1996Dec1.11559.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: The Craft Nook, Inc. Precedence: bulk To April Pain, April yes there are two companies that makes templetes that makes the use of a router very easy.. We use the EZ Route System and the other one is Join Tech. If i can be of any help please contact us at: The Craft Nook, Inc. 227 South 8th Street Fernandina Bch., Fla. 32034 904-321-1601 Email tcn@net-magic.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass