From owner-glass Wed May 1 04:41:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEaG8-00011ma; Wed, 1 May 96 04:39 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: Albert Lewis <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: I.G.G.A. & Golden Retri Date: 01 May 96 07:37:41 EDT Message-ID: <1996May1.113741.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I received all the info about the IGGA (many Thanks Albert!), but >nowhere a mention of exactly how to pay my money (i.e.name/place of >your bank, bank code, account no etc). Sure, I can go and buy an >International Money Order, but that will cost me more than the >subscription itself; I can also ask my own bank to find out (for which >they will charge me about $30), or I - if I had them - can supply my bank >with the details, in which case they will only charge me about $14.( All >exclusive of the subs itself, of course). Also, couldn't find anything >specific about Chapters in Uk or Europe - or did I miss something? Elisabeth, We sent you the smail package on the 20th of last month. It would have gone by airmail, since you're on the other side of the pond, but even it won't give the name of our bank, bank code, account number, etc., since nobody's ever asked before how they could *wire transfer their membership dues into the Guild. International members have, until now, sent money orders, etc., drawn on a U.S. bank ... but you're right: the banks have us by the short hairs in the case of international movements of money. You pay a premium for the U.S. draft, then the Guild pays a premium, too. I'm forwarding this note to Bill Smith, the Guild's treasurer, so he can contact the Guild's bank and get the interbank numbers, etc., so that you and other international members (or would-be members) can handle payment of dues more efficiently and more inexpensively. As for Local Chapters in the UK or in Europe, so far none have been set up, although we have sent sets of Model Bylaws and the other necessary information to several people there. Cape Town, South Africa is the nearest Local Chapter, but I guess that's hardly local to you, is it? I'll be back to you soonest, __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 04:41:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEaG8-0001H4a; Wed, 1 May 96 04:39 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: Albert Lewis <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Shop names Date: 01 May 96 07:37:47 EDT Message-ID: <1996May1.113747.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk C Lambert: I don't know what others here received in the message you sent yesterday, but for me your message reads: eJ8+Ig0EAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd and so on, for about 30-35 lines. Did you attach a file? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 05:53:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEbOI-00019ra; Wed, 1 May 96 05:52 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: Shop names Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 08:45:34 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May1.44534.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB373A.C46B0740 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable HMMM MYSTERY CODING I WILL FOWARD THIS TO MY COMPUTER CONSULTANT AND = SEE WHAT HE SAYS... i HAVE HAD THIS PROBLEM BEFORE BUT ONLY WITH aol = USERS ---------- From: Albert Lewis[SMTP:70544.3642@CompuServe.COM] Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 1996 7:37 AM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Shop names C Lambert: I don't know what others here received in the message you sent = yesterday,=20 but for me your message reads: eJ8+Ig0EAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABB= JAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdb= gDd and so on, for about 30-35 lines. Did you attach a file? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB373A.C46B0740 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgIMAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAPAAAAUkU6IFNob3AgbmFtZXMAvwQBBYADAA4AAADM BwUAAQAIAC0AIgADADMBASCAAwAOAAAAzAcFAAEACAAsABQAAwAkAQEJgAEAIQAAADE1MTBBMkRC MENBM0NGMTFBREY0NDQ0NTUzNTQwMDAwAPMGAQOQBgBcBQAAEgAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAAL ACkAAAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5AACp+RZcN7sBHgBwAAEAAAAPAAAAUkU6IFNob3AgbmFtZXMAAAIB cQABAAAAFgAAAAG7N1wW2NuiEBajDBHPrfRERVNUAAAAAB4AHgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAf DAEAAAAWAAAAY2xhbWJlcnRAbW9ubW91dGguY29tAAAAAwAGEHixaVcDAAcQ3wIAAB4ACBABAAAA ZQAAAEhNTU1NWVNURVJZQ09ESU5HSVdJTExGT1dBUkRUSElTVE9NWUNPTVBVVEVSQ09OU1VMVEFO VEFORFNFRVdIQVRIRVNBWVNJSEFWRUhBRFRISVNQUk9CTEVNQkVGT1JFQlVUT04AAAAAAgEJEAEA AADmAwAA4gMAAPcGAABMWkZ12EFUlf8ACgEPAhUCqAXrAoMAUALyCQIAY2gKwHNldDI3BgAGwwKD MgPFAgBwckJxEeJzdGVtAoMzdwLkBxMCgH0KgAjPCdk78RYPMjU1AoAKgQ2xC2DgbmcxMDMUUAsK FFHFC/JjAEAgSE0bAAXQAFlTVEVSWSBDAE9ESU5HICBJACBXSUxMIEZPAFdBUkQgVEhJGQXwVE8b MRuxTVBVAxtxG7FOU1VMVEEUTlQUsE4dAFNFRSkcUEhBHvBIH3BTQSUbUC4gUCBpGuBBVgcfcB+g HQVQUk9CTFJFGyBCRRywUh9wQnUeECAecEwboBxgHSAgkmEG8CBVH1BSUwqFQQqLbGkxODAC0Wnw LTE0NA3wDNAl0wtZXDE2CqADYBPQYwVALV8n9wqHJqsMMCd2RgNhOs8o/id2DIIUsGxiBJAFQAZM B9AEAFtTTVRQEDo3MDUl4C4zNog0MkAIUG1wdQZh6HZlLh3RXSifKa0GYFcCMCrfK+tXCYBuB5Bk GGF5LAXQNAAgMDEBNCAxOTk2IDc6NDM3FLBNL38prVRvGzG/K+tnC2AEEEBidWkZEGkuBaBtNY8w jnUcYmonsTevK+tTaG/wcCBuYQeBI/8lAy4w7yZ3GkUndgqFQy0QPyAs0lY6P2wcQGQCICcFQGt0 bm8H4HcRgAVAJ5BoJwSQBCBFkWUgFhBjZbppLwBkIIADoEWBIAeBqHNhZ0YQeQhgIBGw/wIwR6AH kBPQCyA0AgqFOeD/BUACEAXAB4BHoknCR1QWEAhhZHNDbWVKOCsASWcwRUFRYVFYQ0FBTJBNJEJM 81FAZVFCZ0FJTSI100ygTSVEb0zxTk4wTsEPTjBNIU5RTjBCQkpBfkcKhU/RTZFNgk8hTSNNg1Hy UhNDd0FQRE/zIVMAQWY4UE6zRDATTSVP0VNzE0BMNmoARUJtZGJnRGSnP2wAcEagc29FYG40IA9J ogGgCGAFQDMwLTMcNSAlMDPBIHAgRGn/RqBHskVAAZARcCNQSZADEOxlPz9sW15fXG9df131z1r/ X2Qsul9qRXgFkElwd0ZxWRFGMXQFsF8PY3RJNwIwBJFFQGkCIAdAIEfmdQMQRqBvZmVQOZIUsZti QBPAczQgZIBjLmMfX1wPaT9eLz+ZKFlGBbFz9zyABPRlASARcRkQB5A0IP8LUErwEbBHIAtwAyBi 4Dzg9TmDLRYQcQpQE8A53zeA/0fiRqBi4EbjJTATwDQgZ4N3bm85n1ETchFwRnEEIGF+dm7hAaBa UFmRRdACQHBQOi8vd3cQLjnnL79z4z9sP99A70H8FTEAfGAAAAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAAAAABAAAcw IIuc6ls3uwFAAAgwIIuc6ls3uwEeAD0AAQAAAAUAAABSRTogAAAAADWG ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB373A.C46B0740-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 10:48:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEfzs-0001N4a; Wed, 1 May 96 10:47 PDT X-Path: aol.com!ScottSGN From: ScottSGN@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: shop names Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 13:47:08 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May1.9478.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Katie wrote: >I used one of my favorite pieces to name my shop... >I made the wizard from the dream world pattern >book. Took a really good picture of it and had my >business cards printed up with "Enchanted Glass" As the publisher of "Dreamworld," I'm glad Katie enjoyed and was inspired by the wizard pattern in that book. I'm guessing from Katie's post that she has included the photo of the wizard on her business card. A word of caution (to everyone) however... if you plan to use a copyrighted design (other than your own) on printed material (a business card, in this example), I'd highly recommend contacting the copyright holder first. I don't particularly want to reopen the copyright can-of-worms here, but suffice it to say that if you don't have permission to use copyrighted images, you're inviting trouble. Fortunately for Katie, the designers of the wizard (Suzy and Scott Rosema) and I are reasonable folks who don't want to overcomplicate her life... but there are artists, designers and publishers out there who may feel otherwise. Well, now that I HAVE kind of reopened the copyright issue again, let me just say this... there was a fair amount of discussion recently about whether a craftsperson can legally make and sell a project from a copyrighted pattern/book. No definitive answer surfaced in that discussion. That's because copyright law is subject to way too much interpretation and you're not going to get a definitive answer without going to court. Assuming that none of you want to end up in court dealing with what should be a relatively simple issue like this (I know I don't), just contact the copyright holder and work something out. I know most of our industry's publishers personally and most are very reasonable folks, who would be willing to work with you to figure out a win/win solution to any copyright issue. I CAN tell you this much... most stained glass designers I've talked to about this issue have made it clear that they don't care if someone makes one or two projects from their design to sell at a craft show or as a commission. But if you plan to make one particular project over and over, or plan to mass produce one project for sale through a catalog, the designer is going to want to hear about it. As much as the legal issue, I think it's just common courtesy to contact the designer/publisher if you plan to use their design for profit. If you start producing ongoing income from one design, I think it's appropriate that the designer start getting a small royalty since he/she was partly responsible for that particular project selling well. I'm sure most of you would feel the same if you were in the designer's position. And now for something completely different... shop names! If you want to avoid having a commonly used name, don't choose "Touch of Glass," "Kaleidoscope" or anything with "Sun" or "Classic(al)" in it (Sunrise, Sunburst, Classical Art Glass, Classic Glass, etc.). According to our database of over 5000 glass businesses, these are the most common names. In fact, if you can avoid the temptation of using plays on words (Pane in the Glass), you'll probably have a more unique name. Scott SGN Publishing Stained Glass News ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 14:32:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEjUV-0001U6a; Wed, 1 May 96 14:31 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: shop names Date: Wed, 1 May 1996 17:25:22 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May1.132522.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB3783.38B43C00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i AM GLAD YOU ARE REASONABLE AND KIND PEOPLE... I DID PUT UNDER THE = PICTURE(ALBIET IN TINY PRINT) "DREAMWORLD DESIGN" IF YOU GUYS REALLY = ARE UNHAPPY i WILL KEEP THE 150 CARDS I HAVE LEFT. =20 KATIE ---------- From: ScottSGN@aol.com[SMTP:ScottSGN@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 1996 1:47 PM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: shop names Katie wrote: >I used one of my favorite pieces to name my shop... >I made the wizard from the dream world pattern >book. Took a really good picture of it and had my >business cards printed up with "Enchanted Glass" As the publisher of "Dreamworld," I'm glad Katie enjoyed and was = inspired by the wizard pattern in that book. I'm guessing from Katie's post that she has included the photo of the = wizard on her business card. A word of caution (to everyone) however... if you = plan to use a copyrighted design (other than your own) on printed material (a business card, in this example), I'd highly recommend contacting the copyright holder first. I don't particularly want to reopen the copyright can-of-worms here, but suffice it to say that if you don't have permission to use copyrighted images, you're inviting trouble. Fortunately for Katie, the designers of = the wizard (Suzy and Scott Rosema) and I are reasonable folks who don't want = to overcomplicate her life... but there are artists, designers and = publishers out there who may feel otherwise. Well, now that I HAVE kind of reopened the copyright issue again, let me = just say this... there was a fair amount of discussion recently about whether = a craftsperson can legally make and sell a project from a copyrighted pattern/book. No definitive answer surfaced in that discussion. That's because copyright law is subject to way too much interpretation and = you're not going to get a definitive answer without going to court. Assuming that none of you want to end up in court dealing with what = should be a relatively simple issue like this (I know I don't), just contact the copyright holder and work something out. I know most of our industry's publishers personally and most are very reasonable folks, who would be willing to work with you to figure out a win/win solution to any = copyright issue. I CAN tell you this much... most stained glass designers I've talked to = about this issue have made it clear that they don't care if someone makes one = or two projects from their design to sell at a craft show or as a = commission. But if you plan to make one particular project over and over, or plan to = mass produce one project for sale through a catalog, the designer is going to = want to hear about it.=20 As much as the legal issue, I think it's just common courtesy to contact = the designer/publisher if you plan to use their design for profit. If you = start producing ongoing income from one design, I think it's appropriate that = the designer start getting a small royalty since he/she was partly = responsible for that particular project selling well. I'm sure most of you would = feel the same if you were in the designer's position. And now for something completely different... shop names! If you want to avoid having a commonly used name, don't choose "Touch of Glass," "Kaleidoscope" or anything with "Sun" or "Classic(al)" in it (Sunrise, Sunburst, Classical Art Glass, Classic Glass, etc.). According to our database of over 5000 glass businesses, these are the most common names. = In fact, if you can avoid the temptation of using plays on words (Pane in = the Glass), you'll probably have a more unique name. Scott SGN Publishing Stained Glass News ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB3783.38B43C00 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IikVAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAPAAAAUkU6IHNob3AgbmFtZXMA3wQBBYADAA4AAADM BwUAAQARABkAFgADABwBASCAAwAOAAAAzAcFAAEAEQAXABQAAwAYAQEJgAEAIQAAADIxMTBBMkRC 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dihhhgNccWkwdFhwOi/EEDCQLj1HL78tYwAMQ39Ej0WVPdV9PdACADXgAAADABAQAAAAAAMAERAA AAAAQAAHMMBCB2ykN7sBQAAIMMBCB2ykN7sBHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAACccA== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB3783.38B43C00-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 14:57:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEjtA-0001Tea; Wed, 1 May 96 14:56 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: Albert Lewis <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Wiring IGGA member dues Date: 01 May 96 17:54:15 EDT Message-ID: <1996May1.215415.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk To those who were interested in how IGGA membership dues might be more easily transferred to IGGA's bank without having to pay the exhorbitant fees exacted by *their bank and also subjecting IGGA to the exhorbitant fees *its bank would also extract, leaving IGGA with 27 cents after all is said and done (okay, that's an exaggeration!), here's the info from Bill Smith, the Guild's treasurer: The *Routing Number* sometimes called *ABA Number* for the IGGA bank is: 323070380. Our Account Number is: 28769 14061. These two numbers should be sufficient to electronically transfer funds from anywhere. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 21:02:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEpYz-0001L6a; Wed, 1 May 96 21:00 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Shop names Date: Wed May 1 21:00:12 1996 Message-ID: <96May1.205419-0700pdt.28498-19391+153@orb.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Bob you wrote: >Hi all. I have been following the various threads with interest. >I am thinking about what to put on my business card by way of a name >for my custom stained glass "shop." I use ""'s because I'm not sure >I'll ever have a real SHOP, but assuming I do for now, I am wondering >what to call it. >Is there someplace "out there" a list of names already in use? >Just wondering. > >Bob Cutler > You must have a local corporate registry where can check names which you have already chosen, there should also state & national registeries. I do know that in order to be absolutely safe you should also check Canadian registeries. Up here our wonderful government charges $30. for each name you want to check, actually you can chose 3, in order of preference, and you get the first one which comes up unregistered. Then another $30. to register the name. Anyway, now that I've made a long story longer, the reason I suggest to also have the name checked in Canada is that we have a restaurant here which is called the "Stinking Rose". The owner has been operating quite successfully for a number of year when he was hit with a law suite. Apparently, there is also a successful restaurant in California, can't recall exactly where now, but operating longer that the eatery here, and it was thought the name was stolen. They did go to court, and the fellow here apparently used the name that his grandmother in Italy used to call garlic. The courts did allow the name to stand, they obviously believed the fellow as he is still operating under that name. But, in the mean time it cost him some grief not to mention the $$$$ in lawyers fees. Karin ---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 1 21:25:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEpul-00010ea; Wed, 1 May 96 21:22 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Sheep pattern Date: Wed May 1 21:22:45 1996 Message-ID: <96May1.211643-0700pdt.268160-14226+112@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >>Jodi, >Eventually, I will sell my wool. Right now, I use it to spin and make >sweaters. My flock is rather small. Once I have a larger flock, I hope to >produce wool, yarn, and the like to sell. I wouldn't be spinning the bulk >then. I would send the fleece and have it spun. Do you spin? If you would >like, after I have my sheep shorn, I could send some wool. I think it will >be a while before I have them sheared though. I hear we are going to get >another foot of snow. Argh, how long is this winter going to be:) > No I don't spin, although I've been known to get a little spinny on occassion. I was just kidding about the wool as it probably wouldn't make it thru customs. ie. We can't bring wicker products across the border. >>>Did you get any other sheep patterns ? > >I am going to order the CD from Hackney Designs if I ever get around to it. >Hopefully, I will be able to incorperate several designs together to create >what I want. I have several different breeds and I think I can adapt the >pattern that you sent me to represent them. > >Well, I will keep you posted on how it turns out. I just started a window >for my Mother so, it will be a while until I can get started on a new one. >Also, it is time to lamb and I wil be in the barn for a while. > I want to do my mother's front door, which right now it has a very large oval bevelled glass in it. The house was built approx. 1916 so it also has windows which are old stained glass, so I would really like to put something in the door which will compliment the windows, but I haven't found anything yet. Karin >PS Good luck with your window. > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 2 03:24:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uEvWY-0001AJa; Thu, 2 May 96 03:22 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: Albert Lewis <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Shop names Date: 02 May 96 06:21:10 EDT Message-ID: <1996May2.102110.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I am thinking about what to put on my business card by way of a name >for my custom stained glass "shop." >Bob Cutler > >You must have a local corporate registry where can check names which you >have already chosen, there should also state & national registeries. I do >know that in order to be absolutely safe you should also check Canadian >registeries. >Karin > In the U.S. the rules are a little different and, although I'm no lawyer, I believe I'm right that a new corporate name must only *not match another in the same state. I believe that the "big boyz" like McDonalds, and so on, actually register their corporate names in *every state, as well as in every foreign country in which they do ... or plan to do ... business. There was a story in the NY Times yesterday, in fact, about McDonalds and others having to throw their weight around in places like South Africa where they're only just now setting up franchises, but finding that local nationals have been using their well-known names for years. But Bob, you weren't talking about forming a corporation, were you? If not, you'd be doing a "DBA" ... Bob Cutler oing usiness s [Whatever You End Up Calling Your Shop]. There are advantages to being a DBA, a sole proprietorship ... and there are disadvantages. If you *were planning on forming a corporation, there are certain protections and advantages to that, as well as disadvantages, too. Why not stop by your local town/city clerk's office and ask them about being a sole proprietor, as opposed to a corporation? They'll tell you about any local licenses you'll need, too. Then there are the county people ... and the state offices ... as well as the Feds. And they'll all have their hands out (of course). Going into business is fun, exciting, and challenging; it can be profitable, too, but you have to do all the boring stuff like keep accurate books, comply with local/county/state/federal regulations, file all *kinds of forms monthly, quarterly, semi-annually, annually ... and the forms are different, depending on whether you're a sole proprietorship or a corporation and whether that corporation was formed in the state in which you're doing business or in another state (like Delaware, which is another story ... GO CORP in CompuServe for more information). But, Karin, your concerns apply only if Bob's planning to open franchises of "Bob's Stained Glass" in Canada, as well as in his home town/state. I'm pretty sure about that. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 2 17:35:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uF8pI-0000Vra; Thu, 2 May 96 17:34 PDT X-Path: awinc.com!jthomson From: "Julie M. Thomson" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Glass Dye?? Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 17:30:35 -0700 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk A fellow at work today asked me to inquire on whether or not there is such a thing as glass dye. Several years ago he had some stained glass panels made up, but the brightness of the light coming through them makes it such that it is difficult to see the patterns. He was wondering if there is any way to dye the glass to make it so that less light can get through thus they will be more visually appealing. He specifically said that he is not interested in a paint, but a dye. Any answers I can pass on to him? ===================================== Julie M. Thomson - jthomson@awinc.com Rossland, British Columbia, Canada ===================================== ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 2 18:45:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uF9vB-0001Ooa; Thu, 2 May 96 18:44 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Dye?? Date: Thu, 02 May 1996 21:45:29 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May2.174529.0> References: <> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Julie: I would think that a dye is unlikely, but I've heard that there are tinted waxes that you can buy to polish the finished work. That's my only idea. Matt McDonnell T & M Stained Glass Julie M. Thomson wrote: > > A fellow at work today asked me to inquire on whether or not there is such a > thing as glass dye. He was wondering if there is any way > to dye the glass to make it so that less light can get through thus they > will be more visually appealing. He specifically said that he is not > interested in a paint, but a dye. > > Any answers I can pass on to him? > ===================================== > Julie M. Thomson - jthomson@awinc.com > Rossland, British Columbia, Canada > ===================================== -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 3 14:56:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFSnk-0000txa; Fri, 3 May 96 14:54 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Dye?? Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 14:58:45 -0700 Message-ID: <199605032158.OAA13562@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >A fellow at work today asked me to inquire on whether or not there is such a >thing as glass dye. Several years ago he had some stained glass panels made >up, but the brightness of the light coming through them makes it such that >it is difficult to see the patterns. He was wondering if there is any way >to dye the glass to make it so that less light can get through thus they >will be more visually appealing. He specifically said that he is not >interested in a paint, but a dye. > > There is no such item that I am aware of. There are stains but those require firing in a kiln. The deca paints are also a posibility but if not applied properly can look bad. One thought is to control the amount of light by installing a sheet of glazing to the exterior to control light. This can be either a textured clear or a tinted glass. This solution will cut down an the ammount of light being transmited evenly thus preserving as much of the original artist vision of the balance of tone but altering the overall effect to suit the owner.I suggest that you get decent size samples of whatever you are thinking of useing and try them out before you change the entire piece. good luck ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 3 16:51:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFUca-0001Sxa; Fri, 3 May 96 16:50 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Dye?? Date: Fri, 03 May 1996 19:51:53 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May3.155153.0> References: <> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Julie M. Thomson wrote: > > A fellow at work today asked me to inquire on whether or not there is such a > thing as glass dye. Several years ago he had some stained glass panels made > up, but the brightness of the light coming through them makes it such that > it is difficult to see the patterns. He was wondering if there is any way > to dye the glass to make it so that less light can get through thus they > will be more visually appealing. He specifically said that he is not > interested in a paint, but a dye. > > Any answers I can pass on to him? > ===================================== > Julie M. Thomson - jthomson@awinc.com > Rossland, British Columbia, Canada > ===================================== > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassJulie: I would think that a dye is unlikely, but I've heard that there are tinted waxes that you can buy to polish the finished work. That's my only idea. Matt McDonnell T & M Stained Glass -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 05:55:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFgqp-0001Wqa; Sat, 4 May 96 05:54 PDT X-Path: aol.com!NAPPERzzzz From: NAPPERzzzz@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Tours of glass mfgs Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 08:54:12 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May4.45412.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Does anyone have the address and phone # for Chicago Art Glass and a place in Milwaukee that makes art glass. Do they have tours...can you buy glass there? Looking for something to do on vacation the end of May. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 06:43:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFhZW-0000nya; Sat, 4 May 96 06:40 PDT X-Path: server.northernnet.com!hensley From: Mike & Jodi Hensley To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Tours of glass mfgs Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 08:41:22 -0500 Message-ID: <199605041341.IAA19758@server.northernnet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk The telephone for Chicago Art Glass is (414) 892-2744 toll free (800) 344-4913 address that I have is Chicago Art Glass P.O. Box 293 Plymouth, WI 53073 I am not sure if you can buy glass there. Hope it helps. Jodi At 08:54 AM 5/4/96 -0400, you wrote: >Does anyone have the address and phone # for Chicago Art Glass and a place in >Milwaukee that makes art glass. Do they have tours...can you buy glass >there? Looking for something to do on vacation the end of May. >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 06:51:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFhiT-0000ooa; Sat, 4 May 96 06:49 PDT X-Path: server.northernnet.com!hensley From: Mike & Jodi Hensley To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Sheep pattern Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 08:50:39 -0500 Message-ID: <199605041350.IAA19864@server.northernnet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Karin, >I want to do my mother's front door, which right now it has a very large >oval bevelled glass in it. The house was built approx. 1916 so it also has >windows which are old stained glass, so I would really like to put something >in the door which will compliment the windows, but I haven't found anything >yet. What is the pattern in the windows? What is the dimensions on the oval? I will keep my eye out for something. >No I don't spin, although I've been known to get a little spinny on occassion. >I was just kidding about the wool as it probably wouldn't make it thru customs. >ie. We can't bring wicker products across the border. I also get a bit spinny often. I did not even think of customs. Wow, no wicker baskets over the border, that is ridiculous. Jodi ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 06:55:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFhm2-0000tHa; Sat, 4 May 96 06:53 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: Albert Lewis <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Tours of glass mfgs Date: 04 May 96 09:50:39 EDT Message-ID: <1996May4.135039.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Does anyone have the address and phone # for Chicago Art Glass and a >place in Milwaukee that makes art glass. Do they have tours...can you >buy glass there? Chicago Art Glass has been out of business for quite a while. (First there was Canadian Art Glass, then Colorado Art Glass, then Chicago Art Glass ... they never had to change their monogrammed towels! ) But Milwaukee? Yes: Schlitz Furnaces, 245 No. Water Street, Milwaukee WI 53202. Phone: (414) 272-4527. Fax: (414) 277-0505. Manufacturers of glass, opalescent and cathedral sheet glass, pressed jewels and turtlebacks. I suspect you *can buy glass there, but you should ask. Tours? Dunno. Ask 'em. They make awfully nice glass, don't they? While you're there, ask about the "famous" German restaurant downtown. Great, great food! (And beers.) __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 08:01:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFimh-0000w5a; Sat, 4 May 96 07:58 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Wiring IGGA member dues Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 15:50:42 +0000 Message-ID: <199605041503.QAA16305@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis: In a nutshell, this is an answer to your last 2 messages (1st May 07:37 and 1st May 17.54) I am reluctant in repeating ad nauseum "I said this" then "you said that". We "across the pond" find it jolly expensive to be with/join up with/participate with you "over there". There are so many assumptions made, just because we speak the same language (I have noticed that in particular and very much in the question of chosing a shop/trading name!!!) It's been very interesting and very revealing. I love stained glass, I too want to promote the understanding "across the pond". It is strange how this love and obsession (well, almost) lures one into the most unlikely fields and subjects..... Part of my earlier professional life involved very much the principle of "if- I- am -looking- for- money- from -you,- then -here- are -every- conceivable- banking -detail -from -me -and -you -will- have- no- work- and- no -excuse- in -not- giving -me -what- I -am -asking -for".EVERY single written communication conducted by the companies I worked for carried as part of their letter-headings banking details, example: Fred Bloggs & Co Ltd, address; registered address, directors:....holding company (if applicable) Company Registration Number....; Bankers: Chase Manhattan Bank, City of London Branch, Threadneedle Street, London EC1, Bank Sorting Code: 01-067--531, Fred Bloggs Account Number: 3611234 By naming the actual name of the Bank, I can then very quickly narrow down in my "host" country which bank is a "correspondent " with the Chase Manhattan Bank (i.e. I start the scale of reducing charges and time-wasting) The Bank code ID number has got different "names" in Europe, but actually works practically in the same way ; the first digits confirms the verbal bank name , the second lot of digits identifies town and the third lot of digits identifies specific branch . The numbers then to follow is YOUR company?organisation/business unique and only bank account number (at that branch in that town in that specific bank). I have 3 bank accounts in UK, 2 in Sweden (from where I hail) 1 in Germany , one in Eastern Europe (for my Godchildren) and one or two others here and there. I realize that the banking system in the USA functions somewhat different. I think that you are losing an awful lot of potential members (you call yourself INTERNATIONAL - don't you??) because of this very difference. When you get my subs from me, it will be from Midland Bank PLC, UK, Bank Sorting Code: 40-43-46, a/c 714......(and so on). The statement Midland Bank is a verbal pointer to any clerk ( do we do business with them directly or not?) the 40 code confirms the Bank Name, the 43 identifies in numerals the town and the 46 identifies the exact subsidiary. I can take through the exact equivalent systems of "Svenska Handelsbanken", "Deutsche Bank", Credit Lyonaise", Banque de Luxembourg etc.... In a nutshell, help us to help you.... I will take your "ABA Numbers" to my bank early next week and ask them what these mean to THEM and what they can do with them (at max. $14!!!) I will report back. I have laboured the point a bit much perhaps - but I do hope you realize what I am driving at and am trying to do. Talk to Bill again and discuss with him the possibility of stating ALL banking details in your "International" correspondence..... Personally, anyone abroad asking me for money and subscriptions and does not give me "internationally" feasible and acceptable ways to pay my monies, won't get it. I am a busy person too......(And that statement is not a "put down"...) YOU stand to gain as well. Sorry to have gone on about this. I DO want to promote stained glass - and I do think we have a hell of a lot to exchange between the "pond" !!!! South Africa Chapel!?? You're dead right!!! My father taught me to swim at 18 months (he picked me up by the scruff of my neck held me over the pier and said "swim"!!! Then he dropped me into the North Sea. I swam!!!!!!! ) Even then, I don't think I could quite manage to make it across the pond to South Af rica. Can I "pass" on that one, please!?? I plead feebleness and "old age"; Karin; you have broken my heart (not just the woodland photographic sessions) your wool-spinning really got my imagination going.... Years ago in the UK there was in the national press some articles about real experimental "spinning". Some women in the county of Dorset/Somerset in the UK gave lyrical accounts of how they were spinning wool from all sorts of long-haired animal companions, even "bobtails" (or as they are called in the UK "Old English Sheepdogs") It may sound absurd and bizarr, but I "hanker" after the idea of being able to wrap myself in a sweater of my 8 st. bobtail who protected and guarded over me for almost 15 years. He was called Trooper. He is buried in my garden with his twin sister Victoria. I have planted an oak tree over his ashes. I have his "wool" and fur from many years. It's washed,clean and securely packed. I am just waiting for "who, where" and "when" .(my protective sweater!!) Trooper's great nephew Toby Tobias is now just about "adult" . (He also has a little feature on my WEB Home Page). Karin, any ideas....??? Frontiers, customs, taxes notwitstanding...??? And for goodnes sake.... DO use thin fishing wire to secure your work in photographic sessions!!! OUCH!!! Over and out. P.S. Jeeez, I have gone on , haven't I.!! ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 08:33:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFjHM-0001Wza; Sat, 4 May 96 08:29 PDT X-Path: houston.infocentral.com!stephenp From: stephenp@houston.infocentral.com (Stephen Pinn) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Sat, 04 May 1996 15:32:49 GMT Message-ID: <318b7888.1739609@mail.houston.infocentral.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: PinnCorp. Precedence: bulk subscribe glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 13:08:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFnbn-0001FPa; Sat, 4 May 96 13:07 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Tours of glass mfgs Date: 04 May 96 15:29:44 EDT Message-ID: <960504192944_70544.3642_JHD88-1@CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I didn't know CAG was still around! Thanks, Mike & Jodi! Hmm. Moved to Wisconsin, eh? Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 17:44:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFruW-0001L0a; Sat, 4 May 96 17:42 PDT X-Path: server.northernnet.com!hensley From: Mike & Jodi Hensley To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Tours of glass mfgs Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 19:43:40 -0500 Message-ID: <199605050043.TAA06568@server.northernnet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert, I am not sure if that address and phone number is correct. Someone gave me the phone and address a while back. > >I didn't know CAG was still around! Thanks, Mike & Jodi! > >Hmm. Moved to Wisconsin, eh? > >Albert > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 4 21:10:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uFv4k-00016ua; Sat, 4 May 96 21:05 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Shop names Date: Sat, 4 May 1996 21:05:30 -0700 Message-ID: <199605050405.VAA25375@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Well, it is probably in Gilroy, CA a.k.a. the garlic capital of the world. I also know of a restaurant in Kentucky, which had been operating for a very, very long time under the name of McDonalds. Actually, it was called Norman McDonalds, but everyone called it McDonalds. Well, to make a long story short he was sued by the golden arches McDonalds and even though he had been in business selling burgers many years longer and had the name from the onset he could not afford the legal fight and last I heard he changed the name of his restaurant. Kinda sad that this local establishment had to bend to the money grubber chain restaurant. Just thought I would share that with you. >You must have a local corporate registry where can check names which you >have already chosen, there should also state & national registeries. I do >know that in order to be absolutely safe you should also check Canadian >registeries. Up here our wonderful government charges $30. for each name you >want to check, actually you can chose 3, in order of preference, and you get >the first one which comes up unregistered. Then another $30. to register >the name. Anyway, now that I've made a long story longer, the reason I >suggest to also have the name checked in Canada is that we have a restaurant >here which is called the "Stinking Rose". The owner has been operating quite >successfully for a number of year when he was hit with a law suite. >Apparently, there is also a successful restaurant in California, can't >recall exactly where now, but operating longer that the eatery here, and it >was thought the name was stolen. They did go to court, and the fellow here >apparently used the name that his grandmother in Italy used to call garlic. >The courts did allow the name to stand, they obviously believed the fellow >as he is still operating under that name. But, in the mean time it cost him >some grief not to mention the $$$$ in lawyers fees. > >Karin > >---- >>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >> >> > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 5 05:48:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uG3DW-0001Cpa; Sun, 5 May 96 05:47 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: wiring IGGA dues Date: 05 May 96 08:43:27 EDT Message-ID: <1996May5.124327.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Toby, Thanks to your persistence and insistance we've gotten the information together that should help you and all other international members and would-be members wire your dues and other payments into the Guild's bank. Here's what's been added to the online announcement about the Guild and its dues structure: International membership rates are twice the above, mostly to defray the additional costs of postage to deliver their newsletters. The Guild's bank information needed by *your bank to wire-transfer your dues is as follows: Bank of America 1-800-873-2632 735 Southeast 6th Street, Grants Pass, Oregon 97526 The *Routing Number* sometimes called *ABA Number* for the IGGA bank is: 323070380. Our Account Number is: 28769 14061. These two numbers should be sufficient to electronically transfer funds from anywhere. Next on the list for the Board: getting set up to accept credit cards. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 5 10:10:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uG7JE-0001HRa; Sun, 5 May 96 10:09 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Curt & Karen Shawkey Subject: Re: Pricing your stain glass for selling Date: Sun, 05 May 96 10:07:36 -0500 Message-ID: <199605051709.KAA21400@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- Howard...here, to pick apart a bit of what you said, if you think the Mexican shades are "nice" then you need more exposure to quality shades. There are places where $2.00 per WEEK is a living wage, so competing for that market with U. S. labor will be difficult. My philosophy is that there are people with vehicles that fall in the $50k to $250k and why should they NOT own one of my shades. I show in some very expensive areas where price is no consideration. Over thew years I have gotten thank you notes from people who were pleased to be able to find the quality available from me. >From time to time I send a note asking how one of my "children" is doing, and a small up-date on my curent piece(s), a subtle way of advertising. If you are doing work to keep you in your "habit", try upping the price a bit so as to make some type of a minimum wage at it. Keep records of time and materials as well,so as to know what it costs to produce a piece. Enough for now. Enjoy....H -- UNDER CONSTRUCTION... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 5 10:18:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uG7RO-0000uHa; Sun, 5 May 96 10:17 PDT X-Path: g6-p5.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: GLASS@BUNGI.COM Subject: Introduction Date: Sun, 5 May 96 10:17 PDT Message-ID: <1996May5.17170.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, As a newbie I think an introduction might be in order. This is my fourth year of stained glass most of which is done in a small but well equipped workshop in my basement where I turn out a stained glass panel about every ten days or so on average. Each panel gets photographed and scanned into my p.c. where I keep a file of .JPG's which if anyone is interested, can be sent as e-mail attachments. At work I have a blasting cabinet and have made a number of etched panels for which I make wooden frames. I also turn wooden frames for round stained glass panels, often leaving the bark on to enhance the rustic quality. My current experiments are with etched flashed glass. I am interested in visiting a glass manufacturers plant if such a trip is available and am always looking for fresh designs/ideas. Steve Anthony Burlington, Ontario. Canada. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 10:55:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGUU6-0001Fca; Mon, 6 May 96 10:54 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re: Introduction Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 12:21:26 -0500 Message-ID: <199605061721.MAA20921@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 10:17 AM 5/5/96 PDT, you wrote: >Hi, As a newbie I think an introduction might be in order. > >This is my fourth year of stained glass most of which is done in a small but >well equipped workshop in my basement where I turn out a stained glass panel >about every ten days or so on average. > >Each panel gets photographed and scanned into my p.c. where I keep a file of >.JPG's which if anyone is interested, can be sent as e-mail attachments. > >At work I have a blasting cabinet and have made a number of etched panels >for which I make wooden frames. I also turn wooden frames for round stained >glass panels, often leaving the bark on to enhance the rustic quality. > >My current experiments are with etched flashed glass. > >I am interested in visiting a glass manufacturers plant if such a trip >is available and am always looking for fresh designs/ideas. > >Steve Anthony >Burlington, Ontario. >Canada. > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Hi Steve, I got your message. It seems that I got into stained glass kinda late. My 2 girlfriends have been doing it for more than 3 years now. I still have alot to learn. Do you use the foil methode or leaded came? I learned how to use the foil and am thinking about taking a class to learn how to use the came. So far I have mostly done suncatchers. No windows yet. I feel that I need more practice before I attempt such a big project. I also have my spot in the basement. It is my way of relaxing away from the kids. I run a daycare out of my home plus I have 2 boys of my own. One is 11 and one will be 5 in August. Stained glass has been my sanity. I have been looking into some places that make glass. Still haven't heard about any that you can tour yet. Although there is one here in Wisconsin, in Milwaukee called Studio On that puts kits together as well at making up stained glass items that you can tour. It is a really nice place and they have 2 locations. One that is just a store and one that does the kits and is a store. I haven't been to the second one yet but it is a good place to get supplies. The prices are pretty good. I usually go to either Madison or Milwaukee for my supplies as well as ordering them from Warner-Crivellaro. By the way, what is etched flashed glass. I've never heard of it. I have done glass etching with a diamond tipped tool as well as using the acid. Well, have to go. Time for another activity with the kids. Hope to hear from you soon. Joy Hall Beaver Dam, Wisconsin USA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 12:26:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGVu7-0000goa; Mon, 6 May 96 12:25 PDT X-Path: mail.gardencitynet.co.uk!kris From: "Kris" To: glass@bungi.com, toby@northlights.co.uk Subject: Temporary pause Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 19:13:14 +0000 Message-ID: <199605061931.UAA14527@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Dear All, our Network supplier has totally reconfigured their system this weekend. I suspect any email to us will get bounced for about a week at maximum until the address changes promulgate to all corners of the internet. So - Northlights and 'kris' have 'unsubscribed' from the list and we will resubscribe next weekend. Anyone sending us private email should also expect problems. Kris -- "Everything in life is transient; including life itself" ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 13:10:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGWak-0001bCa; Mon, 6 May 96 13:09 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: E-mail problems Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 20:54:42 +0000 Message-ID: <199605062015.VAA15736@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi everybody Network supplier changing their system which means mail will bounce back during these 24-36 hours. Back in a few days time. ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 15:46:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGZ1N-0000p0a; Mon, 6 May 96 15:44 PDT X-Path: compuserve.com!101670.3010 From: "Philip M. Kenchatt" <101670.3010@compuserve.com> To: Stained Glass Archives Subject: Europe Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 18:44:19 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May6.144419.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi All, I am looking for a particular product that I know is available in Europe, but I am having difficulty in locating the manufacturers. I should like to contact trade organisations in the countries listed below, which have a similar function to that of the IGGA and British Society of Master Glass Painters. Any advice on whom to contact would be very welcome. Perhaps Albert with his specialist knowledge might be able to help? Germany Austria Holland Belgium Switzerland Norway Denmark Sweden Best Wishes. Phil ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 16:15:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGZSv-0001X7a; Mon, 6 May 96 16:13 PDT X-Path: g6-p9.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Introduction Date: Mon, 6 May 96 16:13 PDT Message-ID: <1996May6.23130.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 12:21 PM 5/6/96 -0500, you wrote: snip, snip. >>My current experiments are with etched flashed glass. >> >>I am interested in visiting a glass manufacturers plant if such a trip >>is available and am always looking for fresh designs/ideas. >Hi Steve, > >I got your message. It seems that I got into stained glass kinda late. My >2 girlfriends have been doing it for more than 3 years now. I still have >alot to learn. Do you use the foil methode or leaded came? I learned how >to use the foil and am thinking about taking a class to learn how to use the >came. So far I have mostly done suncatchers. No windows yet. I feel that >I need more practice before I attempt such a big project. I also have my >spot in the basement. It is my way of relaxing away from the kids. I run a >daycare out of my home plus I have 2 boys of my own. One is 11 and one will >be 5 in August. Stained glass has been my sanity. > snip, snip. >By the way, what is etched flashed glass. I've never heard of it. I have >done glass etching with a diamond tipped tool as well as using the acid. > >Well, have to go. Time for another activity with the kids. Hope to hear >from you soon. > >Joy Hall >Beaver Dam, Wisconsin >USA > > Hello Joy, Nice to hear from you. Personally I use the foil method and will stick to it (no pun intended) I did consider the leaded method but feel that I don't need the contact with lead every evening. My family doctor suggested getting a lead/blood test done yearly if a lot of lead is handled so based on that I stay with the foil. As your skill in cutting and fitting glass improves you will make nice tight joints and foil will enhance this. I too use stained glass as an escape, I own a business just west of Toronto and after a day of stress the glass room is very inviting, my 11 year old daughter likes to help and has mastered foiling and the odd cut, plus some cream acid etching. My 14 year old son on the other hand finds glass very un-cool. Regarding your comment on only having made sun catchers so far, a window is only a bunch of suncatchers joined together - but many times more rewarding!! If you can make a simple flower, make a dozen and join them together, add a vase and wella! you have created a panel to be proud of. Today I found out that the Spectrum plant in Washington run tours, so do Corning glass in upper New York state. Stectrum supply most glass stores and apparently put on a superb tour. Flashed glass is plain clear glass that has a "flashing" or thin coating of coloured glass attached, so, if you etch (sandblast) the thin top layer away you see through the blasted areas. Especially effective in back lit applications. This glass is NOT cheap but you can use small pieces incorporated into larger panels - very effective! If your computer is set up to view .JPG files let me know and I will show you a few of my efforts in stained and etched glass. Keep up the good work. Steve Anthony Burlington, Ont. Canada. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 17:11:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGaMh-0000yia; Mon, 6 May 96 17:10 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Europe Date: 06 May 96 20:06:36 EDT Message-ID: <1996May7.0636.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I am looking for a particular product that I know is available in Europe, >but I am having difficulty in locating the manufacturers. Phil, Thanks for your confidence. It's trade organizations you're looking for? Otherwise, what *is the product? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 17:45:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGatI-0001B1a; Mon, 6 May 96 17:44 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Europe Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 01:38:13 +0000 Message-ID: <199605070050.BAA21662@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Phil, Have had to come off the subscription list for a few days, but your message managed to sneak through... Anything I can do to help?? What's the product? Am a Swede, live in the UK and speak fluent German; am also a member of the BSMGP. Direct e-mail will probably stand a better chance of reaching me, without being bounced back for the next few days. If not, try again next weekend. Regards ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 6 23:40:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGgPd-0001cka; Mon, 6 May 96 23:38 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re: Introduction Date: Mon, 6 May 1996 23:37:56 -0700 Message-ID: <199605070637.XAA19175@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >Each panel gets photographed and scanned into my p.c. where I keep a file of >.JPG's which if anyone is interested, can be sent as e-mail attachments. > I would be very intrested in seeing your work. I am always up for seeing if I am holding my own in the quality and creativity departments. Please send me a couple of pictures if you can. Thank you. DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 7 01:56:56 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGiYb-0001Bya; Tue, 7 May 96 01:55 PDT X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: International payments Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 09:57:12 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <9605070857.AA04116@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<199605041503.QAA16305@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Just to add my 2p worth on the subject: The easiest way to make international payments is by credit card (visa/mastercard). The credit card company will do the translation for you, at a reasonable exchange rate, and without an extra charge. (Of course, this assumes the people you want to pay take credit cards). Simple, and you can do it over the phone. Next cheapest (from the UK to USA, anyway) are things called international money orders - basically, dollar cheques drawn on a US bank. Barclays Bank do these; I assume they work the same as a normal cheque as far as the recipient is concerned. The drawback for the sender is that there's an additional charge - I think it was about 5UKP (about $7.50) last time I got one; it may be higher (UKP 7.50 or so?) now, which is a significant overhead for smaller ammounts. I did look into wiring money abroad some years back - but the charges for that are high enough to rule it out for most purposes; I forget the exact cost, but I think it was something like 25 - 50 UKP or above, and possibly much higher. OK for transferring thousands, not really on for typical small/medium orders. (I may well have the details wrong - it was a long time ago, so if its changed, I'd be interested to hear). -- _|_ / | Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) \_|_ jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \__/ Hemel Hempstead, UK jerry@shell.portal.com (alternate) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 7 14:43:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGuWH-0001aMa; Tue, 7 May 96 14:42 PDT X-Path: g7-p3.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Pictures Date: Tue, 7 May 96 14:42 PDT Message-ID: <1996May7.21420.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 11:37 PM 5/6/96 -0700, you wrote: > >> >>Each panel gets photographed and scanned into my p.c. where I keep a file of >>.JPG's which if anyone is interested, can be sent as e-mail attachments. >> >I would be very intrested in seeing your work. I am always up for seeing if I >am holding my own in the quality and creativity departments. Please send me a >couple of pictures if you can. Thank you. > >DR NO >Monterey, CA > Joseph, No problem! But give me a couple of days as I am building a new light box and will photograph my panels again with more "natural" light. I will aim for Thursday evening. Steve. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 7 14:51:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGueK-0001Oxa; Tue, 7 May 96 14:50 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Introduction Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 14:46:28 -0700 Message-ID: <199605072146.OAA03580@dfw-ix3.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >At 12:21 PM 5/6/96 -0500, you wrote: > >snip, snip. > >I did consider the leaded method but feel that I don't need the contact with >lead every evening. My family doctor suggested getting a lead/blood test >done yearly if a lot of lead is handled so based on that I stay with the foil. What do you think the solder is made of? Actually you come into a more dangerous contact with lead in the form of fumes from soldering ( a much more intensive and prolonged experience in foiling) than when leading. The lead you handle does not get absorbed through the skin and if you exercise resonable caution (i.e. do not eat or smoke (gag) while working, and make sure you wash your hands and clothing when done with work) you truly limit your exposure. A blood test is not a bad idea. In all cases it is not a bad idea to where a mask equiped with the proper filters ( acid gas and organic vapor is good with a HEPA pre-filter) as well as insure proper ventalation. > >Flashed glass is plain clear glass that has a "flashing" or thin coating of >coloured >glass attached, so, if you etch (sandblast) the thin top layer away you see >through the blasted areas. > Flashed glass can also be a color flashed on another color such as in red flashed over blue or red over yellow. These are harder to find but well worth the effort. Also if you "fire" the glass post blasting you can get rid of much of the "frosting" that blasting causes. MS ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 7 18:04:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGxf7-0001E4a; Tue, 7 May 96 18:03 PDT X-Path: g7-p13.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Introduction, reply Date: Tue, 7 May 96 18:03 PDT Message-ID: <1996May8.130.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 02:46 PM 5/7/96 -0700, you wrote: >You wrote: >> >>At 12:21 PM 5/6/96 -0500, you wrote: >> >>snip, snip. >> >>I did consider the leaded method but feel that I don't need the >contact with >>lead every evening. My family doctor suggested getting a lead/blood >test >>done yearly if a lot of lead is handled so based on that I stay with >the foil. > >What do you think the solder is made of? I thought the solder used in the foiling method was an amalgamation of tin/lead whereas the leaded method was just lead??? Do I stand corrected? I use a "fume eater" which draws fumes through an activated filter!! Actually you come into a more >dangerous contact with lead in the form of fumes from soldering ( a >much more intensive and prolonged experience in foiling) than when >leading. The lead you handle does not get absorbed through the skin and >if you exercise resonable caution (i.e. do not eat or smoke (gag) while >working, and make sure you wash your hands and clothing when done with >work) you truly limit your exposure. A blood test is not a bad idea. In >all cases it is not a bad idea to where a mask equiped with the proper >filters ( acid gas and organic vapor is good with a HEPA pre-filter) as >well as insure proper ventalation. >> > >>Flashed glass is plain clear glass that has a "flashing" or thin >coating of >>coloured >>glass attached, so, if you etch (sandblast) the thin top layer away >you see >>through the blasted areas. >> >Flashed glass can also be a color flashed on another color such as in >red flashed over blue or red over yellow. These are harder to find but >well worth the effort. Also if you "fire" the glass post blasting you >can get rid of much of the "frosting" that blasting causes. > Thanks for that info' I have not tried to "fire" glass, yet! Steve. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 7 20:30:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uGzvf-0001bva; Tue, 7 May 96 20:28 PDT X-Path: compuserve.com!101670.3010 From: "Philip M. Kenchatt" <101670.3010@compuserve.com> To: Stained Glass Archives Subject: Europe Date: Tue, 7 May 1996 17:42:29 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May7.134229.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Yes, it is the trade organisations that I should like to contact. I am hoping that by writing to them that they may be able to identify the manufacturers that I am looking for. I am a little reluctant to describe the produce that I am looking for on an open mailing list. I hope that members of the group will not take offence, but in this instance I should like to maintain a degree of business confidentiality. Best wishes. Phil ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 8 14:10:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHGTt-00010fa; Wed, 8 May 96 14:09 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 16:13:43 -0400 Message-ID: <960508161342_109425000@emout13.mail.aol.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello Steve: I too would like to see your work. I have been doing glass for a very short time and I too would like to compare our ideas,etc... ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 8 18:43:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHKiJ-0000lpa; Wed, 8 May 96 18:40 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Introduction, reply Date: Wed, 8 May 1996 18:37:49 -0700 Message-ID: <199605090137.SAA14372@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >I thought the solder used in the foiling method was an amalgamation of >tin/lead whereas the leaded method was just lead??? Do I stand corrected? > >I use a "fume eater" which draws fumes through an activated filter!! > > > Solder comes in many mixes the one most often used in leaded work is a 60/40 mix ( 60% tin 40% lead) often the solder used in foil work is 50/50 (50%tin 50% lead). It is good that you use a fume eater for as I mentioned earlier the act of soldering puts more lead particals into the air than any other operation in the art glass field with the exception of wire brushing old lead to clean. Lead absorbtion is most prevelant through inhalation much more so than by ingestion. Thus even with use of a fume hood a good resperator is a worthwhile investment for soldering and an absolute nessesity if you ever find yourself in a situation where you have to brush, steel wool or otherwise abrade either lead or solder. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 8 20:19:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHMEu-0001Zua; Wed, 8 May 96 20:18 PDT X-Path: g5-p7.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Wed, 8 May 96 20:17 PDT Message-ID: <1996May9.3170.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 04:13 PM 5/8/96 -0400, you wrote: >Hello Steve: > > I too would like to see your work. I have been doing glass for a very >short time and I too would like to compare our ideas,etc... > > >Sure thing, I will sent tomorrow evening as an attachment to personal e-mail. Steve. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 9 15:08:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHdpj-0001Tpa; Thu, 9 May 96 15:05 PDT X-Path: g6-p3.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Introduction, reply Date: Thu, 9 May 96 15:05 PDT Message-ID: <1996May9.2250.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 06:37 PM 5/8/96 -0700, you wrote: >You wrote: >> > >> >>I thought the solder used in the foiling method was an amalgamation of >>tin/lead whereas the leaded method was just lead??? Do I stand >corrected? >> >>I use a "fume eater" which draws fumes through an activated filter!! >> >> >> Solder comes in many mixes the one most often used in leaded work is >a 60/40 mix ( 60% tin 40% lead) often the solder used in foil work is >50/50 (50%tin 50% lead). It is good that you use a fume eater for as I >mentioned earlier the act of soldering puts more lead particals into >the air than any other operation in the art glass field with the >exception of wire brushing old lead to clean. Lead absorbtion is most >prevelant through inhalation much more so than by ingestion. Thus even >with use of a fume hood a good resperator is a worthwhile investment >for soldering and an absolute nessesity if you ever find yourself in a >situation where you have to brush, steel wool or otherwise abrade >either lead or solder. > The solder I use for foil work is 60/40. The comments you made (above) are all very valid and should not be overlooked by even the occasional user of solder. At work we repair electronic components and soldering is common, we have an extraction hood, smoke eater and a respirator available for those that will use it. Steve Anthony. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 9 20:05:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHiVZ-0001Ura; Thu, 9 May 96 20:04 PDT X-Path: nz1.netzone.com!lorley From: "Lorley L. Oneyear" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Thu, 09 May 1996 20:12:10 -0600 Message-ID: <2.2.32.19960510021210.00673fd0@mail.netzone.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. Lorley from Phoenix area ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 9 21:20:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHjeh-0001TPa; Thu, 9 May 96 21:18 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: "Lorley L. Oneyear" Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Thu, 09 May 96 20:55:02 -0500 Message-ID: <199605100356.UAA01934@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- This is Howard...I know of no reason that either solder is more or less preferred. With any basic skills one can use either solder with GOOD results. Usually the one you learn with first is generally the one you will stay with From owner-glass Thu May 9 21:49:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHk81-0001QRa; Thu, 9 May 96 21:48 PDT X-Path: sprynet.com!glassy From: glassy@sprynet.com To: glass@BUNGI.COM Subject: Re: Introduction Date: Thu, 9 May 1996 21:49:08 -0700 Message-ID: <199605100449.VAA18964@m2.sprynet.com> References: <<199605061721.MAA20921@peoples1.peoples.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Steve. I would love to see some of your work too! I'm also a newbie...only been doing this for a little over a year. I'd like to see what the "other folks" are doing! Debby On Mon, 6 May 1996, Joy Hall wrote: >At 10:17 AM 5/5/96 PDT, you wrote: >>Hi, As a newbie I think an introduction might be in order. >> >>This is my fourth year of stained glass most of which is done in a small but >>well equipped workshop in my basement where I turn out a stained glass panel >>about every ten days or so on average. >> >>Each panel gets photographed and scanned into my p.c. where I keep a file of >>.JPG's which if anyone is interested, can be sent as e-mail attachments. >> >>At work I have a blasting cabinet and have made a number of etched panels >>for which I make wooden frames. I also turn wooden frames for round stained >>glass panels, often leaving the bark on to enhance the rustic quality. >> >>My current experiments are with etched flashed glass. >> >>I am interested in visiting a glass manufacturers plant if such a trip >>is available and am always looking for fresh designs/ideas. >> >>Steve Anthony >>Burlington, Ontario. >>Canada. >> >>---- >>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >> >> >Hi Steve, > >I got your message. It seems that I got into stained glass kinda late. My >2 girlfriends have been doing it for more than 3 years now. I still have >alot to learn. Do you use the foil methode or leaded came? I learned how >to use the foil and am thinking about taking a class to learn how to use the >came. So far I have mostly done suncatchers. No windows yet. I feel that >I need more practice before I attempt such a big project. I also have my >spot in the basement. It is my way of relaxing away from the kids. I run a >daycare out of my home plus I have 2 boys of my own. One is 11 and one will >be 5 in August. Stained glass has been my sanity. > >I have been looking into some places that make glass. Still haven't heard >about any that you can tour yet. Although there is one here in Wisconsin, >in Milwaukee called Studio On that puts kits together as well at making up >stained glass items that you can tour. It is a really nice place and they >have 2 locations. One that is just a store and one that does the kits and >is a store. I haven't been to the second one yet but it is a good place to >get supplies. The prices are pretty good. I usually go to either Madison >or Milwaukee for my supplies as well as ordering them from Warner-Crivellaro. > >By the way, what is etched flashed glass. I've never heard of it. I have >done glass etching with a diamond tipped tool as well as using the acid. > >Well, have to go. Time for another activity with the kids. Hope to hear >from you soon. > >Joy Hall >Beaver Dam, Wisconsin >USA > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 9 23:18:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHlWS-0001UNa; Thu, 9 May 96 23:17 PDT X-Path: detroit.freenet.org!ae479 From: ae479@detroit.freenet.org (Sue Becker) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: glue for mosaics Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 02:17:45 -0400 Message-ID: <199605100617.CAA13027@detroit.freenet.org> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Have just acquired an old metal legged, glass top table and would like to try a mosaic on it. Must I use a specific glue to adhere the glass? Is there a recipe for the grout available? Any ideas or cautions you might share certainly would be appreciated. Reply-To: ae479@detroit.freenet.org -- p ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 00:06:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHmHG-0001Sna; Fri, 10 May 96 00:06 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 00:06:10 -0700 Message-ID: <199605100706.AAA03840@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Joseph, >No problem! Please call me David. That is what I go by except on official accounts like this. > >But give me a couple of days as I am building a new light box and will >photograph my panels again with more "natural" light. Sure, I have nothing else to do except work on my glass projects. I am currently working on a project I designed. It is in lead came and has 69 pieces, but could have more, but i wanted the circle in the middle to be one solid piece. Hope it turns out like I want it wasn't cheap for all the glass, even though I did use alot of scrap glass from other projects. > >I will aim for Thursday evening. O.K. DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 00:28:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHmcS-0000ioa; Fri, 10 May 96 00:28 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Introduction, reply Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 00:28:05 -0700 Message-ID: <199605100728.AAA04234@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >>>I did consider the leaded method but feel that I don't need the >>contact with >>>lead every evening. My family doctor suggested getting a lead/blood >>test >>>done yearly if a lot of lead is handled so based on that I stay with >>the foil. >> >>What do you think the solder is made of? > Actually, a blood lead test is advisable for anyone who works with lead or lead products (yes, both 50/50 solder and 60/40 solder have lead in them only the amount is different to allow the solder to set quicker) > >I thought the solder used in the foiling method was an amalgamation of >tin/lead whereas the leaded method was just lead??? Do I stand corrected? They both are a tin/ lead composite, but only the abount is different. See the above statement in parenthesis^ > >I use a "fume eater" which draws fumes through an activated filter!! > > That is a very good idea, but you may want to use a respirator if you are really that worried. The amount of lead in you body, it is said, must reach like 5% to start to have bad effects. I just today had a talk with a guy who works in a stained glass shop. He said he was up to .11 last year, but lowered his level to .08 by taking the proper precautions like using a respirator with the proper filters and washing and showereing after using lead. He told me that if you don't work with it every day then obviously the risk is lowered, but if you do stupid things while working with lead (ie. breath solder fumes, eat without thoroughly washing, or in any way have your hands in contact with your mouth) then anyone can suffer from lead. The bottom line is BE AWARE THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH A SUBSTANCE THAT CAN CAUSE YOU HARM. TREAT IT WITH RESPECT AND YOU WILL BE OK!!!!!!!! DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 00:33:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHmh4-0001BQa; Fri, 10 May 96 00:32 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Europe Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 00:32:54 -0700 Message-ID: <199605100732.AAA04297@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I am a little reluctant to describe the produce that I am looking for on an >open mailing list. I hope that members of the group will not take offence, >but in this instance I should like to maintain a degree of business >confidentiality. > Well, friend if you really feel that such confidentiallity is needed then by all means you should have it. I am not trying to be a smart ***, but didn't you come to this news group asking for info on certain products? And now you don't want to be specific due to a fear about business confidentiality. I would respectfully ask that you not be so worried. DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 01:04:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHn9i-0001DRa; Fri, 10 May 96 01:02 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: glue for mosaics Date: 10 May 96 03:59:33 EDT Message-ID: <1996May10.75933.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Have just acquired an old metal legged, glass top table and would like to >try a mosaic on it. Must I use a specific glue to adhere the glass? >Is there a recipe for the grout available? Touch all of the glass pieces with a grinder or something to avoid leaving edges that will cut you when you're applying the grout. My 2c worth, if a little obvious. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 01:14:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHnJb-0001Dia; Fri, 10 May 96 01:12 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Europe Date: 10 May 96 04:11:37 EDT Message-ID: <1996May10.81137.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Well, friend if you really feel that such confidentiallity is needed then >by all means you should have it. Well said, Dr. Reminds me of a fellow ten years or so ago who used to call me about every six months about an "invention that will revolutionize stained glass" that he had in his basement. Never would tell me what it was/did; all very hush-hush, you know ... haven't heard from him in a few years. Haven't seen stained glass revolutionized yet, either. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 01:17:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHnM1-0000xqa; Fri, 10 May 96 01:15 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 01:15:11 -0700 Message-ID: <199605100815.BAA05085@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 08:12 PM 5/9/96 -0600, you wrote: >Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have >seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he Well, 50/50 is recommended for lead came since it allows more time before it sets up over 60/40. A matter of seconds is all. When you work with foil it is more important that the solder harden quicker so you can run your seam. >uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" >octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually >work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered >if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. >Lorley from Phoenix area > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 05:01:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHqrb-0001Bya; Fri, 10 May 96 05:00 PDT X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Fri, 10 May 1996 07:59:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605101159.HAA15798@brutus.bright.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 08:12 PM 5/9/96 -0600, you wrote: >Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have >seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he >uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" >octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually >work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered >if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. >Lorley from Phoenix area . Pure tin melts at 450F, pure lead melts at 620F, but a tin/lead alloy of 63/37(tin/lead) melts at 358F. A 60/40 solder alloy begins to melt at a temperature of 361F and is completely liquid at 370F. A 50/50 solder alloy has a melting range of 361F to 414F. The 63/37 alloy produces the lowest possible melting temperature which does not have a melting range. It both melts and freezes at 358F. There is a category of lead-free solder containing .5% silver, 4% copper and 95.5% tin. It begins to melt at a temperature of 440F and is completely liquid at 500F for a working zone of 60 degrees. Compared to 50/50, it requires an even hotter iron and more care while working. However, for situations where lead is undesirable, such as for jewelry, napkin or tissue holder, or night lights for kids' room, and many other applications, the extra care and cost is worth it. IMO it is necessary to use 60/40 on copper foil work that you intend to patina copper or brass. The higher content of tin will give you a shinier appearance in your end product. Of course that's not the only thing you need to think about to get a shiney appearance. I did a piece with one side the lead-free and the other side 60/40 to see if I could tell the difference in the solder appearance. I could. The lead free was even shinier than the 60/40. It has remained shiney over the years, and I've never had to repolish. I've had real problems with the 63/37 not being used to the instant set up quality. And your iron must be turned up and kept hot, which is not good for most beginners since they don't move fast enough to not crack the glass. Lamp workers use 50/50 to solder the pieces together, then use a top coat of 60/40 to produce a nice shiney appearance. Because 50/50 is cheaper this appeals to some, but I prefer 60/40 in all my work. JMHO. Joyce Moran ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 05:37:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uHrRP-0001Fta; Fri, 10 May 96 05:37 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: BlindCopyReceiver:;@compuserve,.com Subject: IGGA News Memo Date: 10 May 96 08:28:50 EDT Message-ID: <1996May10.122850.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk IGGA Online News Memo: NEW LOCAL CHAPTER OF THE GUILD FORMING ------------------------------------------------------------------------- We received a very enthusiastic call from Betty Heard in New Mexico yesterday; she's planning to set up the "Four Corners Chapter" of the Guild. Local chapter materials, including the model bylaws, were sent out to her today. Are you in the UT/NM/AZ/CO "Four Corners" area? You can get information about the new chapter by writing or calling: Betty Heard, Crystal Visions Studio, 4008 East Main Street, Farmington NM 87402. (505) 324-8688. GLASS SCHOOLS OFFERED GUILD NEWSLETTER AT COST ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Seventy-seven letters sent to glass schools today. Their text, approved by IGGA's Board last week, offers them discounts on bulk orders (10 or more) of the Guild's newsletter, "Common Ground: Glass" ... pretty much at cost. Retailers and others who sell supplies to glass artists and craftspeople are to be offered the same deal on the "newsletter" (the most recent issue is 72 pages; is that still a newsletter?) ... at cost: $3.50/copy plus $8 shipping on 10 copies. Single copies of that issue are still $5 plus $2.16 postage (twice that outside North America). AWARD-WINNING IGGA BOARD MEMBER WRITES AND IS WRITTEN ABOUT ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Monona Rossol's article on lead test kits that appeared in last fall's CG:G was reprinted in Orton's "Firing Line," winter 1996 (which arrived day before yesterday). She was mentioned elsewhere in that issue as the recipient of the Choice Magazine "Outstanding Academic Book Award" for her book, "The Artist's Complete Health and Safety Guide." Monona is a member of the IGGA Board of Directors and is known internationally as an expert in safety in the theater, as well as in the arts and crafts. Congratulations, Monona! THIS JUST IN VERBATIM (from Gerry Phibbs, IGGA's Chairman, on CIS) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I received a brochure in today's mail, and thought it might be of interest to some of our members in this section. From: Schlitz Studios/ Schlitz Furnaces 245 N. Water Street Milwaukee, WI 53202 (414) 277-0742 (414) 277-0505 FAX We're moving! - And we don't want to move all this glass! We have 25 years of glass stashing All hand picked. All glass for sale!! 23,000 pounds of Schlitz 10,800 pounds of Old Uroboros 2,700 pounds of Youghiogheny 7,200 pounds of Oceana 24,000 pounds of Kokomo 7,800 pounds of Lins 5,700 pounds of early 1900 glass Jewels!! Jewels!! Jewels!!! For more information call.. (see numbers above) Sounds like there may be some real bargains to be had.. makes me wish I weren't 2,000 miles away! Anyone who's in the area, and visits, please fill us in here on the Forum. Peace -Gerry ========================================================================== Do you like receiving this online news memo? Don't do anything; we'll send it to you whenever we get around to it, which might be fairly often. Or not. You don't like it? Simply reply to 70544.3642@compuserve.com saying UNSUBSCRIBE in the text of your message. =========================================================================== Our Mission: To facilitate communication among glass artists, to encourage education and promote excellence in the glass arts. __________________________________________ International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ An IRS 501(c)(6) Non-Profit Organization ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 18:43:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uI3fp-00013wa; Fri, 10 May 96 18:40 PDT X-Path: g7-p8.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Fri, 10 May 96 18:40 PDT Message-ID: <1996May11.1400.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >snip. > >Please call me David. That is what I go by except on official accounts >like this. > > >Sure, I have nothing else to do except work on my glass projects. I am >currently working on a project I designed. It is in lead came and has 69 >pieces, but could have more, but i wanted the circle in the middle to be >one solid piece. Hope it turns out like I want it wasn't cheap for all the >glass, even though I did use alot of scrap glass from other projects. > > David, You should have received the .JPG files by now. >From your comment I guess you spend a fair bit of time working on glass projects, do you photograph any of your work? Steve. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 20:10:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uI51H-0001Jma; Fri, 10 May 96 20:06 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: filters and Pb tests Date: 10 May 96 23:05:13 EDT Message-ID: <1996May11.3513.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >>I use a "fume eater" which draws fumes through an activated filter!!<< I'm not sure what an "activated filter" or "fume eater" is. "Smoke eaters" are a brand of filter systems, but they sell many types only some of which are recommended for lead fume. "Activated charcoal" will not capture lead fume but works on certain types of flux vapors and gases. What you really need is either an electrostatic precipitator that is designed for fume capture or a high efficiency particulate air (HEPA) filter that is guaranteed to capture 99.995% of particles as small as 0.3 micron in diameter. You really need to now this stuff because there are a lot of filter sellers out there ripping off crafts people. >>The amount of lead in you body, it is said, >>must reach like 5% to start to have bad effects. << The effects at 5% would be "dead as a lead doornail." You must mean 5 micrograms per deciliter (ug/dl). >>I just today had a >>talk with a guy who works in a stained glass shop. He said he was up >>to .11 last year, but lowered his level to .08 by taking the proper >>precautions like using a respirator with the proper filters and washing >>and showereing after using lead.<< Haven't clue about your units here either. How about I make a little chart of lead values used in the US and Canada since Canadians use a different system: U.S. Canada 0 ug/dl = 0 micromoles/liter (umol/L) 5. " = 0.241 umol/L 10. " = 0.483 " 15. " = 0.724 " 20. " = 0.965 " 25. " = 1.206 " 30. " = 1.448 " 35. " = 1.689 " 40. " = 1.930 " Now we can talk. At 5 ug/dl, we can begin to see loss of mental acuity in children and at 10 ug/dl we can see it clearly on testing. While the studies of mental acuity are on children, I suspect we adults get dumber around 10 ug/dl also. At 25 ug/dl in about 25 States, the health department reports your test to the Centers for Disease Control. Women whose blood lead is 30 ug/dl when they are pregnant are documented to have babies with problems although common sense tells us that even at 10 ug/dl, we can expect some brain effects. And so on. It is not enough to get your blood tested. Know what the numbers mean. There are still creaky old doctors out there that think 40 ug/dl is OK because that's what they were told 30 years ago. >>DR NO in Monterey CA<< No Dr. in NYC. Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist with Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 10 20:15:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uI569-00012Ea; Fri, 10 May 96 20:12 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Sat, 11 May 96 12:01:17 Message-ID: <199605110311.NAA13421@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199605100815.BAA05085@otter.mbay.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199605100815.BAA05085@otter.mbay.net>, on 05/10/96 at 01:15 AM, "Joseph D. Noble" said: >Well, 50/50 is recommended for lead came since it allows more time before >it sets up over 60/40. A matter of seconds is all. When you work with >foil it is more important that the solder harden quicker so you can run >your seam. I always thought it was the other way. 60/40 cause it sets quick - for came. And 50/50 for foil as the longer 'set time' allows you to develop and run you seam. But since I haven't done any foil work. I may well stand corrected. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~  ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 11 13:37:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uILMN-0001FIa; Sat, 11 May 96 13:33 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: BlindCopyReceiver:;@compuserve,.com Subject: IGGA News Memo Date: 11 May 96 16:28:50 EDT Message-ID: <1996May11.202850.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk IGGA Online News Memo: May 11, 1996 NEWS OF NEW LOCAL CHAPTERS GENERATES MORE NEW LOCAL CHAPTERS ----------------------------------------------------------------- Yesterday's announcement about the formation of the "Four Corners Chapter" of the Guild in the UT/NM/AZ/CO area generated a spate of requests for model bylaws and announcements of other glass artists and craftspeople wanting to set up local chapters in their areas, too. MARYLAND Jay Planalp, a Guild member in Maryland, responded the same day that IGGA Memo 5/10/96 went out: "Is there a Chapter in the MD/WV/VA/DC area? If not, I'd be interested in working to get one started. I've always been a sucker for a good cause." We sent him the model bylaws, an application for a StartUp Grant and enough membership applications and other stuff the following day. If you're in his area and want to get involved in the new local chapter, contact Jay C. Planalp, Leadlighters Studio, 5609 West Falls Road, Mt Airy MD 21771. (410) 795-6135. He's also reachable at planalp@ix.netcom.com NEW ENGLAND Then we heard from Avery Anderson, up Boston way. Said she, "Plans are underway for the formation of a New England Guild (ME, NH, MA, RI, CT, VT). Glass artists who are interested in participating in the formation of this chapter, please contact Cheryl Kumiski, 114 North Road, Brentwood, NH 03833 - phone (603) 679-5478; or Avery Anderson, 4 Wesson Road, North Grafton, MA 01536 - phone (508) 839-6095; CompuServe 73074,2425. ----------------------------------------------------------------- LOTS OF GLASS ACTIVITY AT BUNGI.COM We discovered bungi.com a couple of weeks ago. There's a terrific group of glass people who gather there to discuss glass questions, ask for advice on techniques, suggestions on appropriate shop names, the advantages and disadvantages of studio incorporation, whether dye is something used to color glass, where they can find tours of glass factories or patterns for bevelled glass in front doors, copper foil versus working with lead came, safety questions, and more. To subscribe and start getting in on this activity, email to: glass-request@bungi.com with the message subscribe glass [insert your email address here] To send messages to the list, mail to: glass@bungi.com They have archives, too, at http://www.bungi.com/glass ----------------------------------------------------------------- GUILD'S "SOURCES GUIDE" A HIT ONLINE AND OFF pj friend [74077,1461@compuserve.com ... and yes, her name is all lower case] is a member of the Guild and active in the Glass section of the Handcrafts forum on CompuServe. She got her copy of the Guild's Spring 1996 newsletter, 'Common Ground: Glass,' which includes the annual 'Sources Guide' to glass suppliers and messaged us: "What a wonderful job you did on the newest issue of Common Ground. It will be in my library forever. Every phone number I ever needed in one place." The 'Sources Guide' is available online free of charge in Library 5 of the Handcrafts forum on CompuServe. ----------------------------------------------------------------- * I G G A I * o ^ o ^ o ^ o * ^o * o * o * o * o^ \ \ \ \|/ / / / \^o^*^o^*^o^/ \o_o_o_o/ Winner: Studio Promo Crown! UNDER THE TENT ... AND OTHER PROMOTIONAL TECHNIQUES One of the Northeast's stellar glassblowing studios -- Fellerman & Raabe -- is holding an Under The Tent Sale next week. On the 11th of May, we got a nice blue card printed black with the announcement of the 25-75% off Memorial Day (May 23-27, 10a-6p) sale taking place two weeks later. Nice work, nicely promoted ... and on time! We've received notices of workshops, sales and shows *after they'd taken place. Why? Because they'd been mailed Third Class (Bulk Rate) too close to the date of the event! Fellerman & Raabe's piece came via First Class mail ... just a card, mailed obviously to previous customers (like ourselves). So they've narrowed the mailing to people who know their work, made sure it looks nice ... spent their money wisely, printing black ink on an elegant blue card stock. Very efficient, very businesslike ... and they create great work, too! [Fellerman & Raabe Glassworks, South Main St., Route 7, Sheffield, MA 01257. SHELLY JURS' FULL COLOR DOUBLE POSTCARD We've gotten several of these over the past couple of years: Shelly Jurs is doing bulk mailings of cards -- and now *double postcards -- that show her work in glorious color. These are high-quality, professionally shot photographs, obviously, showing her work in its very best light (and inevitably in very luxe environments). The work speaks for itself ... and for Jurs' great creative abilities ... but she doesn't stop there. She educates the customer ("New focus of interest at entry enriches interior & increases feeling of space," reads one headline; "Wow, Wow, Wow! The response to your work has been enthusiastic and positive," she quotes a Colorado arts program director) then pitches the potential customer with an easy-tearoff return postcard! They just check off [ ] YES! I like your ideas and would like to discuss some of my own with you [ ] I'd like a free catalog or [ ] Other requests then they mail the card back. There's space for them to insert their name and address, but that's already on the other side, since it was the *outside of the card that got the piece to them in the first place (Hmm. Wonder if the Post Office had any problems identifying which way the card was headed?). [Shelly Jurs, Jurs Architectural Glass, 4167 Wilshire Boulevard, Oakland, CA 94602-3423.] Very slick, very nice presentations! The Studio Promo Crown goes to *both of these glass artists, each with a very different but effective approach to increasing their business. ================================================================= Do you like receiving this online news memo? Don't do anything; we'll send it to you whenever we get around to it, which might be fairly often. Or not. It depends on how busy the Exec. Dir., Albert Lewis, might be that day or week. You don't like it? Simply reply to 70544.3642@compuserve.com saying UNSUBSCRIBE in the text of your message. ================================================================= Our Mission: To facilitate communication among glass artists, to encourage education and promote excellence in the glass arts. __________________________________________ International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 (914) 278-2152 Fax: (914) 278-2481 __________________________________________ An IRS 501(c)(6) Non-Profit Organization ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 12 10:45:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIfC6-0000kha; Sun, 12 May 96 10:44 PDT X-Path: waterw.com!artglass From: artglass@waterw.com (pj friend) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 13:46:13 -0400 Message-ID: <9605121746.AA00117@water.waterw.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was different from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this is a duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the site at bungi.com. my best, pj ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 12 10:57:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIfNr-0000Lpa; Sun, 12 May 96 10:56 PDT X-Path: gjr From: gjr@daver.bungi.com (Glenna Rand) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 10:56:34 PDT Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk [In the message entitled "Re: IGGA News Memo" on May 12, 13:46, pj friend writes:] > Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was different > from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this is a > duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the site at > bungi.com. Hi PJ, This is just an email mailing list which allows people to discuss problems, techniques, etc. I have noticed IGGA posts here too. I do not restrict unless it is not related to stained glass. If you do not want to participate with this group any further please let me know. -- Glenna Rand gjr@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 12 12:09:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIgVC-000120a; Sun, 12 May 96 12:08 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: 12 May 96 15:04:51 EDT Message-ID: <1996May12.19451.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was >different from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this >is a duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the >site at bungi.com. pj, IGGA publishes Common Ground: Glass, a quarterly newsletter of 32 to 72 pages, in the old-fashioned ink-on-paper-delivery-via-the-Post-Office kind of way. Last Friday, I put together an announcement for a few people, then realized there were *others who might be interested ... and it evolved into the "IGGA News Memo," which is available online only. So I'm not removing you (since you say to do so only if it's a duplication of the newsletter), until I hear differently. And this is going to you via bungi.com, so everyone else will understand the difference, too. Albert [Oh, I see what's happening, pj. Glenna's note made it all clear! You were sent a copy of the memo direct to your email address ... and a copy was sent to bungi.com as well. Since you also get everything that appears on bungi.com you received *two copies of the memo! Once as a member of the Guild and once as a reader of bungi.com Since I can't control whether you're reading bungi.com or not and since the direct copy is sent to you because you're in the Guild's mailing list, the duplication's inevitable, unless you stop reading bungi.com or drop your membership in the Guild or *keep your membership but have us eliminate your email address from your record so you won't get the duplicate, but then you won't have it listed in the Guild List that appears in CG:G ... gawd! this is getting confusing!] ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 12 14:51:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIj2i-0000ypa; Sun, 12 May 96 14:51 PDT X-Path: macmail1.cig.mot.com!IL75-MS-SMTP#u#gwi From: "IL75-MS-SMTP_gwi" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Undeliverable Mail Date: 12 May 1996 16:48:57 -0500 Message-ID: <199605122151.RAA17381@po_box.cig.mot.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Unknown Microsoft mail form. Approximate representation follows. Message: IGGA News Memo Sent: Sat, May 11, 1996 3:55 PM To: Beise Tom On Server: IL75-macmail1 Date: Sun, May 12, 1996 4:48 PM Reason: Could not be delivered because the destination Microsoft Mail server could not be found. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 12 17:25:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIlQv-0000yxa; Sun, 12 May 96 17:24 PDT X-Path: planet.net!dogwood From: Doug Morlock & Daria Schetzina To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Mailing List Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 20:24:02 +0100 Message-ID: <1996May12.21242.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: NorthStar & Miss Daria's Specialties Precedence: bulk Please remove me from mailing list. thank you, dogwood@planet.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 03:50:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIvBt-00016la; Mon, 13 May 96 03:49 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Mailing List Date: 13 May 96 06:13:01 EDT Message-ID: <960513101301_70544.3642_JHD35-4@CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Please remove me from mailing list. Thanks for telling us. But I can't find "dogwood," Doug Morlock, or Daria Schetzina in the list. How was it addressed? (Oh, I'll bet you got a copy because you subscribe to bungi.com ... do you? Well, in that case, I'm not sure what to do ... our little news memo is about glass and so we sent it to bungi.com thinking that *it is read by people who are interested in glass.) I guess what we'll do is remove bungi.com to avoid offending anyone. That's been done. (Nice address, dogwood ... very evocative!) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 05:15:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIwVs-0000JAa; Mon, 13 May 96 05:14 PDT X-Path: cpcn.com!maruca From: maruca@cpcn.com (la madrugadora) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: IGGA newsletter Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 08:09:53 -0400 Message-ID: <9605131209.AA12422@info.cpcn.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Why not let the meathead unsubscribe rather than depriving the rest of us who are indeed interested in reading the IGGA material? Please continue to forward that valuable newsletter through glass@bungi. thanks! Mary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 05:15:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uIwVw-0000G8a; Mon, 13 May 96 05:14 PDT X-Path: cpcn.com!maruca From: maruca@cpcn.com (la madrugadora) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: IGGA newsletter Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 08:09:53 -0400 Message-ID: <9605131209.AA12420@info.cpcn.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Why not let the meathead unsubscribe rather than depriving the rest of us who are indeed interested in reading the IGGA material? Please continue to forward that valuable newsletter through glass@bungi. thanks! Mary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4x1-0001AIa; Mon, 13 May 96 14:14 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: IGGA Date: 13 May 96 17:05:30 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21530.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >thanks for sending on all the info. Yes, I like receiving it as editor >for the Bulletin of The Enamelist Society. Presumably you found our >email address from our home page on Craftweb.com/ As you propably know >this groups consists of enamelists worldwide and I will publish relevant >info from what you write in our printed Bulletin. Most enamelists are not >on internet, so this will be a different way to distribute info. How >about if you mention our home page to your glass constituents? It is > under "groups" in that heading. SNAG is there >also and these crafts are all related and people might like to know of >each other's groups. In any case, thanks for including us. Glad you found it helpful ... that was its intent. Your group's web site (and bungi.com) was included in a full-page listing on the back cover of our most recent issue ... and we're glad to hear you can use the info in the news memo. You'll mention us as its source? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:21 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4x1-0001Bya; Mon, 13 May 96 14:14 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: IGGA newsletter 2Bornot? Date: 13 May 96 17:05:27 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21527.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Why not let the meathead unsubscribe rather than depriving the rest of >us who are indeed interested in reading the IGGA material? >Please continue to forward that valuable newsletter through glass@bungi. >Mary, maruca@cpcn.com Now I'm torn ... which is it to be? It certainly makes sense to route glass-oriented information to a newsgroup that's interested in it. On the other hand, a few people uninterested in glass-oriented information may object, alas. I'd suggest a "vote" to arrive at a consensus, but I wouldn't know how many people subscribe to bungi.com to ever be able to decide whether a majority said "yea" to it. Perhaps Glenna can give us some direction on this. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4xp-0001E3a; Mon, 13 May 96 14:15 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Newsletter Date: 13 May 96 17:05:56 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21556.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I feel your decision to remove your newsletter from bungi.com was the >wrong decision. I dabble in stained glass and welcome any information >about what is happening, different techniques, etc. ... >Bungi is for people who have an interest in glass and the information >that you posted is certainly glass related. Don't let the whining >minority silence you. Keep posting and keep sharing your information. Don Scott Lethbridge, Alberta Thanks for your supportive comments, Don. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4y0-0000wYa; Mon, 13 May 96 14:15 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Mailing List Date: 13 May 96 17:05:52 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21552.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >PLEASE, do not remove bungi.com. If anyone is offended by your info, >she/he should toughen up. I can't believe that anyone is that easily >offended; but if so, the rest of us should not be deprived. Thanks! Do you >know how non-compuservers can access your library? I'd love to have a >look!! Thanks, Ray. The HANDCRAFTS library would only be accessible by CompuServe customers, alas, but we'd be glad to share *our files, which are considerable. Glenna told me how to ftp them to the bungi.com archive, but I haven't done it yet. I need to chat with her about how they're organized, etc. Would you like a list of available files? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4xs-0000cMa; Mon, 13 May 96 14:15 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: IGGA Newsletter Date: 13 May 96 17:05:41 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21541.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I would like to continue receiving the newsletter. If you stop sending it >to Glass@bungi, please put my address on the newsletter mailing list. >Kelly Bryant >Placement Coordinator >Department of Geological Sciences >The University of Texas at Austin Will do, Kelly ... do you have a glass program there? If so, we'd like to add it to our database and send you a copy of the newsletter for your students. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 14:20:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ4xk-00012da; Mon, 13 May 96 14:15 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGAA newsletter Mail Date: 13 May 96 17:05:44 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.21544.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >ALBERT: (I think that's who this should be directed to) >Can an alternative be developed for subscribers like me (and >maruca@cpcn.com) who wish to receive *BOTH* the IGAA mail AND >remain subscribers to bungi.com? I wouldn't go so far as to >call anyone a 'meathead' but I guess I can understand that some >folks don't want all forms of email. Not me, the more the better :) >If you have an mailing list please add my email address to it. I have >found the IGAA newsletter interesting and like receiving it. >Thanks! Liz. I'm not sure an alternative will be necessary, Liz, if the trend continues this way ... so far, only one m**th**d has lobbed a stone our way. And yes, the nut behind the wheel is: Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 15:08:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ5mD-0001Dna; Mon, 13 May 96 15:07 PDT X-Path: nethawk.com!1091 From: 1091@nethawk.com (Sue Eiszler) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA newsletter 2Bornot? Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 18:06:31 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I'd suggest a "vote" to arrive at a consensus, but I wouldn't know how many >people subscribe to bungi.com to ever be able to decide whether a majority said >"yea" to it. Why don't those who don't want to read it just use the delete key and let the rest of us enjoy... Sue 1091@nethawk.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 15:21:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ5yg-0001Cva; Mon, 13 May 96 15:20 PDT X-Path: gjr From: gjr@daver.bungi.com (Glenna Rand) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA newsletter 2Bornot? Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 15:20:25 PDT Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk [In the message entitled "IGGA newsletter 2Bornot?" on May 13, 17:05, "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" writes:] > I'd suggest a "vote" to arrive at a consensus, but I wouldn't know how many > people subscribe to bungi.com to ever be able to decide whether a majority said > "yea" to it. > > Perhaps Glenna can give us some direction on this. No,..no vote please! It's not hard to delete messages that don't interest you. -- Glenna Rand gjr@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 15:46:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ6Mv-0001EVa; Mon, 13 May 96 15:45 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Another IGGA news memo? Date: 13 May 96 18:39:34 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.223934.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk There's another IGGA News Memo prepared, but it's not been sent to bungi.com .. and won't be until we get the go-ahead from Glenna, if that's the way things work here. The tenor of the messages seems to be running heavily in favor of the memos being posted here ... but I'd rather not offend anyone. By the way, I was taking a look at web sites today ... and photos of Glenna's work look r e a l g o o d online! Of course, at work I have this humongous 17" CTX high-res monitor that makes *everything look good, but compared to everything *else I've seen online, I was impressed with the quality of the images! JPEGs, if I remember rightly. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 16:42:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ7F3-0001Bia; Mon, 13 May 96 16:41 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: IGGA News Memo 05/13/96 Date: 13 May 96 19:32:25 EDT Message-ID: <1996May13.233225.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ----------------------------------------------------------------- IGGA Online News Memo: May 13, 1996 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Random glass info passed along after being compiled by the International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. a 501(c)(6) nonprofit organization ----------------------------------------------------------------- BEADMAKERS' BARGAINS Sundance Art Glass sent us a flyer offering didymium safety glasses at what they call "unbeatable pricing." Looks pretty good to us: wholesale pricing on them drops as low as $16/pair, if you can use 144 pair! (The one-pair-only price is $29, if that's more to your taste.) Who designed these frames, though? Not Foster Grant! You, too, can look like the scientists in old Japanese monster movies! There was a long discussion in the Glass section [GO HANDCRAFTS] on CompuServe about the merits and drawbacks (as well as the myths) of eye protection. If you'd like a copy of it, download SAFEGLAS.THD from Library 5 there or ask for SAFEEYES.TXT (an ASCII file of eye protection info) from 70544.3642@compuserve.com Beadmakers will also be interested in Sundance's "Mandrel Madness Sale," in which they're offering mandrels of 1/16"-3/23" x 10" for as little as 99 cents each. The sale runs through May 30. Sundance Art Glass is at 231 S. Whisman Road, Mountain View, CA 94041. Tel. (415) 965-2266. ----------------------------------------------------------------- ART GLASS SUPPLIERS ASSOCIATION TURNS 10 CELEBRATES IN NASHVILLE July 17-21 Cash and carry sales are finally part of the AGSA's annual trade show. For many years, those attending the show weren't allowed to do anything but take orders for later delivery. So if that's what kept you from attending, it's all the more reason now to make the Nashville scene next July at Source'96! Of course, workshops, seminars, techniques and tricks o' the trade are all part of the event, too: painting on glass, dalles de verre, sandblast carving, fusing & slumping, beadmaking, restoration & repair, non-traditional reinforcement, decorative soldering, wire wrapping, installation & protective glazing, photographing your work, lead & copper foil, patina & finishing, creativity & design, kaleidoscopes, mosaics ... the list goes on and on! For info on registering for Source'96, the AGSA's event of the year, call (614) 452-4541. ----------------------------------------------------------------- GET RID OF THOSE KILN FUMES! Glass beadmakers often use ceramic kilns as annealers and slumpers use them to ... what else: slump! Vent-A--Kiln has a new video describing the hidden health hazards of kiln fumes. It's $7 from Vent-A-Kiln at (716) 876-2023. Fax: (716) 876-4383. ----------------------------------------------------------------- MORE VIDEOS -- THIS TIME TECHNIQUES A series of videotapes on stained glass techniques will be released during the AGSA Source'96 show (see above) in July by Giraffe Enterprises. Eight titles being released this year will cover soldering, foiling & foil overlays, cutting & scoring, patinas & finishes, design, lead came, reinforcement, framing with metal, beads & marbles, and torchwork. See them at the show or contact them at glassgiraf@aol.com -- their web site is at http://www.glassgiraffe.com ----------------------------------------------------------------- TWO CANADIAN GLASS SHOWS SLATED "Where's the Content/Context," the Glass Art Association of Canada Members' Juried Exhibition at the Canadian Class & Glass Gallery in Waterloo, Ontario is set for June 2 - September 2. "V6: Hot off the Coast," another show running simultaneously, features work by six Vancouver glass artists. For info, write to Canadian Class & Glass Gallery, 25 Caroline St. N., Waterloo, ON Canada N2L 2Y5. Phone: (519) 746-1882. Fax: (519) 746-6396. ----------------------------------------------------------------- ================================================================= Do you like receiving this online news memo? Don't do anything; we'll send it to you whenever we get around to it, which might be fairly often. Or not. It depends on how busy the Exec. Dir., Albert Lewis, might be that day or week. You don't like it? Simply reply to 70544.3642@compuserve.com saying UNSUBSCRIBE in the text of your message. ================================================================= Our Mission: To facilitate communication among glass artists, to encourage education and promote excellence in the glass arts. __________________________________________ International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 (914) 278-2152 Fax: (914) 278-2481 __________________________________________ Membership info: 70544.3642@compuserve.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 18:58:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJ9MX-0000O0a; Mon, 13 May 96 18:57 PDT X-Path: baldcom.net!mruv From: mruv@baldcom.net To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGAA newsletter Mail Date: Mon, 13 May 96 18:57 PDT Message-ID: References: <<1996May13.21544.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I would like to receive the newsletter. I think it is a wonderful source. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 21:34:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJBnz-0001DHa; Mon, 13 May 96 21:33 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Europe Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:33:27 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140433.VAA25646@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 04:11 AM 5/10/96 EDT, you wrote: > >Well, friend if you really feel that such confidentiallity is needed then > >by all means you should have it. > >Well said, Dr. >Reminds me of a fellow ten years or so ago who used to call me about every six >months about an "invention that will revolutionize stained glass" that he had in >his basement. Never would tell me what it was/did; all very hush-hush, you know >... haven't heard from him in a few years. > >Haven't seen stained glass revolutionized yet, either. Thanks Albert, I tried to say it nicely. Yea, the biggest revolution I've seen in stained glass is the grinder (in the olden days I think they only used grozer pliers). DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 21:37:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJBov-0000uUa; Mon, 13 May 96 21:34 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:34:32 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140434.VAA25689@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 01:15 AM 5/10/96 -0700, you wrote: >At 08:12 PM 5/9/96 -0600, you wrote: >>Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have >>seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he > >Well, 50/50 is recommended for lead came since it allows more time before it >sets up over 60/40. A matter of seconds is all. When you work with foil >it is more important that the solder harden quicker so you can run your seam. > >>uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" >>octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually >>work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered >>if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. >>Lorley from Phoenix area >> >>---- >>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >> >> >DR NO >Monterey, CA > May have gotten that backwards. Sorry DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 21:49:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJC0o-0000GVa; Mon, 13 May 96 21:47 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:46:44 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140446.VAA26054@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >David, >You should have received the .JPG files by now. > >>From your comment I guess you spend a fair bit of time working on glass >projects, >do you photograph any of your work? > >Steve. > Well, I have really been spending alot of time lately on glass. I am working on perfecting my art (isn't everyone). Seems like each project teaches you something new you thought you already knew. Next week I will begin a copper foil project, I'm getting tired of lead for now. I do photo- graph my works with a simple polaroid camera. I don't have a scanner so I guess it is just too much trouble to get it converted to .jpg for now. Maybe someday I'll do it as my inventory grows. I think I have a problem with getting .jpg, since I didn't get yours and it isn't the first time that happened. Oh well, thanks for the effort anyway. David DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 21:57:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJC8A-0000PGa; Mon, 13 May 96 21:54 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: filters and Pb tests Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 21:54:23 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140454.VAA26265@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thanks for the info Monna. It is always good to get this type of info. Maybe my nubers were not exactly accurate. I am still not yet an expert in this area, or maybe I have too much lead in me to think straight (just kidding of course). I sit/type corrected. >U.S. Canada > >0 ug/dl = 0 micromoles/liter (umol/L) >5. " = 0.241 umol/L >10. " = 0.483 " >15. " = 0.724 " >20. " = 0.965 " >25. " = 1.206 " >30. " = 1.448 " >35. " = 1.689 " >40. " = 1.930 " > >Now we can talk. At 5 ug/dl, we can begin to see loss of mental acuity in >children and at 10 ug/dl we can see it clearly on testing. While the >studies of mental acuity are on children, I suspect we adults get dumber >around 10 ug/dl also. > >At 25 ug/dl in about 25 States, the health department reports your test to >the Centers for Disease Control. Women whose blood lead is 30 ug/dl when >they are pregnant are documented to have babies with problems although common >sense tells us that even at 10 ug/dl, we can expect some brain effects. > >And so on. It is not enough to get your blood tested. Know what the numbers >mean. There are still creaky old doctors out there that think 40 ug/dl is OK >because that's what they were told 30 years ago. > >>>DR NO in Monterey CA<< > >No Dr. in NYC. I am not a medical doctor obviously . >Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist with Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 22:05:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJCFH-0001FHa; Mon, 13 May 96 22:02 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:01:41 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140501.WAA26474@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 10:56 AM 5/12/96 PDT, you wrote: >[In the message entitled "Re: IGGA News Memo" on May 12, 13:46, pj friend writes:] >> Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was different >> from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this is a >> duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the site at >> bungi.com. > >Hi PJ, I very much enjoy the imput of the IGGA news memo. It is glass related and I find it enjoyable. If you get it from another place simply trash it here or there. Whichever is easier. DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 22:09:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJCK3-0000Noa; Mon, 13 May 96 22:06 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Mailing List Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:06:32 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140506.WAA26613@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I think it is very unfortunate that you removed your memo from bungi.com. I for one would like to give you a vote of confidence for doing it, and I very much enjoyed reading your memo. Would you please reconsider? After all it is glass related and everyone on this thread does not get a copy of it, and those that do can simply ignore or delete/trash it. Thank you and I hope you reconsider. >Thanks for telling us. But I can't find "dogwood," Doug Morlock, or Daria >Schetzina in the list. How was it addressed? (Oh, I'll bet you got a copy >because you subscribe to bungi.com ... do you? Well, in that case, I'm not sure >what to do ... our little news memo is about glass and so we sent it to >bungi.com thinking that *it is read by people who are interested in glass.) > >I guess what we'll do is remove bungi.com to avoid offending anyone. That's been >done. > >(Nice address, dogwood ... very evocative!) > DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 22:12:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJCMI-0000TKa; Mon, 13 May 96 22:09 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:08:58 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140508.WAA26673@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I guess that would work too, Albert, if you are willing to add us to your mailing list then please add me also. drno@mbay.net Thanks > > >Will do, Kelly ... do you have a glass program there? If so, we'd like to add >it to our database and send you a copy of the newsletter for your students. > >Albert > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 13 22:13:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJCNd-0000Fwa; Mon, 13 May 96 22:10 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA newsletter 2Bornot? Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 22:10:21 -0700 Message-ID: <199605140510.WAA26715@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Count me as one vote in favor. After all this is a forum on stained glass related information isn't it??? > >Now I'm torn ... which is it to be? It certainly makes sense to route >glass-oriented information to a newsgroup that's interested in it. On the other >hand, a few people uninterested in glass-oriented information may object, alas. > >I'd suggest a "vote" to arrive at a consensus, but I wouldn't know how many >people subscribe to bungi.com to ever be able to decide whether a majority said >"yea" to it. > >Perhaps Glenna can give us some direction on this. > __________________________________________ > Albert Lewis Executive Director > International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. > __________________________________________ > >---- DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 01:31:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJFSZ-0000vwa; Tue, 14 May 96 01:27 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Europe Date: 14 May 96 04:25:41 EDT Message-ID: <1996May14.82541.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Yea, the biggest revolution I've seen in stained glass is the grinder (in >the olden days I think they only used grozer pliers). Doc: Yes, and the grinder's not even really necessary, for the most part. That's one of the charms of stained glass, that its techniques are essentially unchanged since time immemorial. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 01:31:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJFSY-0000P6a; Tue, 14 May 96 01:27 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: 14 May 96 04:25:45 EDT Message-ID: <1996May14.82545.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Will do, Kelly ... do you have a glass program there? If so, we'd like >to add it to our database and send you a copy of the newsletter for your >students. > >I guess that would work too, Albert, if you are willing to add us to your >mailing list then please add me also. >drno@mbay.net Well, there's a difference here that should be explained: the IGGA News Memo started going out last Friday ... it's the short, online bulletin. the newsletter is "Common Ground: Glass," a 32- to 72-page publication that's sent to members of the Guild. We send one free copy to schools where glass techniques are taught, though. It's published quarterly and has pictures in addition to text. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 02:51:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJGjq-0000rfa; Tue, 14 May 96 02:49 PDT X-Path: tiac.net!glaslady From: glaslady@tiac.net (glaslady) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 05:54:55 -0400 Message-ID: <199605140954.FAA15570@mailserver1.tiac.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > I do photo- >graph my works with a simple polaroid camera. I don't have a scanner so I >guess it is just too much trouble to get it converted to .jpg for now. Maybe >someday I'll do it as my inventory grows. I think I have a problem with >getting .jpg, since I didn't get yours and it isn't the first time that >happened. Oh well, thanks for the effort anyway. > actually, you may want to check out your local drugstore film processing service. CVS in the boston area provides a couple of interesting services aside from one hour and one day processing. if you're willing to wait 3 days and pay an extra 3 dollars, you can receive a floppy diskette with your pictures in addition to to 2 copies of your prints. I have access to a scanner, but find this is a whole lot easier - painless, in fact. I'm getting ready to put together my homepage, incorporating my 2 loves - gardening and glass...and it's a whole lot easier to deal with system ready prints. I'm planning on incorporating some of my student's work in the home page (I teach about 40 students a term through an active adult ed program and the exposure will be good for their morale/self image - the town has a very active website that I'm going to link to so that my student's neighbors can see their good work Judy in Northern MA glaslady@tiac.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 05:15:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJIzK-0000r8a; Tue, 14 May 96 05:14 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Mailing List Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 08:13:57 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May14.41357.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Yes!! I would especially be interested in the other files. Alas, I too am a Non-Compuserver, but I do have access to the Internet. Please let me know how to access these files on the Net. Thanks. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 08:47:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJMGH-0000T1a; Tue, 14 May 96 08:43 PDT X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 08:41:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1996May14.14147.0> References: <<199605140434.VAA25689@otter.mbay.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk An individual will need only to consider the point at which solder melts and solidifies to make the determination on whether to use 50/50 or 60/40 solder. The melting point for 50/50 solder is about 412 degrees compared to 378 degrees for the 60/40. They both become solid at 358. (The degrees may be different since I'm trying to remember without references). What this basically tells you is that the 50/50 requires such a hotter degree of heat to melt, it will also transfer this heat to glass and could cause thermal shock (breakage) easier than using 60/40. Those who use 50/50 solder on copper foil run a higher rish for breakage due to the higher heat. At least this is what convinced me. Peggy Johnsen PJs Stained Glass Studio Santa Maria, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 12:02:12 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJPLx-0000era; Tue, 14 May 96 12:01 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 13:28:21 -0500 Message-ID: <199605141828.NAA16239@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 09:34 PM 5/13/96 -0700, you wrote: >At 01:15 AM 5/10/96 -0700, you wrote: >>At 08:12 PM 5/9/96 -0600, you wrote: >>>Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have >>>seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he >> >>Well, 50/50 is recommended for lead came since it allows more time before it >>sets up over 60/40. A matter of seconds is all. When you work with foil >>it is more important that the solder harden quicker so you can run your seam. >> >>>uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" >>>octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually >>>work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered >>>if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. >>>Lorley from Phoenix area >>> >>>---- >>>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >>> >>> >>DR NO >>Monterey, CA >> > >May have gotten that backwards. Sorry >DR NO >Monterey, CA I was told that 60/40 melts at a lower temperature than the 50/50 and is very good for beginners. I also prefer to work at a lower temperature because I have cracked glass with higher temps. 60/40 would also be good when working with lead came because it melts at a lower temp. as well. That way you wouldn't have to worry about melting the came. Joy Hall ----------------------------------------------------- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 12:45:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJQ25-0000Y6a; Tue, 14 May 96 12:45 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 14:11:55 -0500 Message-ID: <199605141911.OAA16752@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 10:08 PM 5/13/96 -0700, you wrote: >I guess that would work too, Albert, if you are willing to add us to your >mailing list then please add me also. > >drno@mbay.net > >Thanks > > >> >> >>Will do, Kelly ... do you have a glass program there? If so, we'd like to add >>it to our database and send you a copy of the newsletter for your students. >> >>Albert I have heard lots of talk of a news letter. What is it and how can I get it if it is about stained glass. I guess I joined the group kinda late and hadn't heard about it until recently. Joy Hall joyhall@peoples.net >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 14:13:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJROb-0000Wha; Tue, 14 May 96 14:12 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: IGGA News Memos, 2B or not Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 22:05:06 +0000 Message-ID: <199605142120.WAA02649@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Am glad that "she-who-must-be-obeyed" has spoken out favourably. Thank you Glenna. Albert, count me IN, please. Even though I can't visit from across " the Pond" to any of the venues listed, still nice to know what's going on. There is always a delete button... (Which is what I did accidentally to the first of your Memos... , ****!) My students, on the whole, learn for pleasure and do not as a rule take up stained glass as a profession (although a few have..). In any case, they tend to have more money than I, so I can send them across to your listed venues instead.... Stained glass "innovations":, agree about the grinder. Therefore, it's got to be the gas/electric soldering iron, surely? My father left me his collection of tools, some really very old ones. One of them an old prehistoric soldering iron that you heated up by putting it in the fire. What a performance that must have been! IGGA files: I too am a non-Compuserve who would be interested.....Any hope? Elisabeth ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 14:15:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJRQi-0000lPa; Tue, 14 May 96 14:14 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Joy Hall Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? Date: Tue, 14 May 96 14:12:28 -0500 Message-ID: <199605142114.OAA14985@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- Another consideration on the solder useage is that you can run a lower temperature to melt 60/40 and therefore be less likely to melt the came. As I have previously stated, because I do only foil, I use an 1,1000 ungar iron with a rheostat for lowering the temp when necessary. I work fast enough and cleanly enough to not need to stay on the foil long enough to crack the glass to melt a GOOD bead. enjoy...H -------- REPLY, Original message follows -------- Date: Tuesday, 14-May-96 01:28 PM From: Joy Hall \ Internet: (joyhall@peoples.net) To: Glass list \ Internet: (glass@bungi.com) Subject: Re: 50/50 ? 40/60? At 09:34 PM 5/13/96 -0700, you wrote: >At 01:15 AM 5/10/96 -0700, you wrote: >>At 08:12 PM 5/9/96 -0600, you wrote: >>>Hello all.. Some of the talk just recently has been about lead and I have >>>seen comments reference the solder. One such comment from Steve was that he >> >>Well, 50/50 is recommended for lead came since it allows more time before it >>sets up over 60/40. A matter of seconds is all. When you work with foil >>it is more important that the solder harden quicker so you can run your seam. >> >>>uses 40/60 for foil work. Well I'm in the planning stages of an 18" >>>octaganal hummingbird/flower window hanging. I usually use 50/50 (usually >>>work w/ lead came) but did buy a spool of 60/40 today ($7.50) and wondered >>>if there was any difference in using one type of solder over the other. >>>Lorley from Phoenix area >>> >>>---- >>>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >>> >>> >>DR NO >>Monterey, CA >> > >May have gotten that backwards. Sorry >DR NO >Monterey, CA I was told that 60/40 melts at a lower temperature than the 50/50 and is very good for beginners. I also prefer to work at a lower temperature because I have cracked glass with higher temps. 60/40 would also be good when working with lead came because it melts at a lower temp. as well. That way you wouldn't have to worry about melting the came. Joy Hall ----------------------------------------------------- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass -------- REPLY, End of original message -------- -- UNDER CONSTRUCTION... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 15:05:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJSDQ-0001DSa; Tue, 14 May 96 15:05 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Which newsletter? Date: 14 May 96 18:02:59 EDT Message-ID: <1996May14.22259.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I have heard lots of talk of a news letter. What is it and how can I get >it if it is about stained glass. I guess I joined the group kinda late >and hadn't heard about it until recently. >Joy Hall All the fuss & feathers is about an online NEWS MEMO that we began sending out last Friday, Joy. Some people were glad to get it; others weren't. If you continue to subscribe here to glass@bungi.com, you'll keep getting it (regularly or irregularly, often or not). The Guild also publishes a quarterly newsletter (as distinct from a MEMO!) called "Common Ground: Glass" which is sent to the members of the Guild. That's got photos, of course as well as bunches of other information of interest to glass artists and craftspeople, hobbyists and pros. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 15:13:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJSLT-0000O1a; Tue, 14 May 96 15:13 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: 2Bor ... I guess B, eh? Date: 14 May 96 18:11:55 EDT Message-ID: <1996May14.221155.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elisabeth, Glad you've liked the MEMOS! that have been sent. If you deleted one, I could send it to you directly, if you like, since I've saved them. They were dated May 10, 11 and 13. Which don't you have? Your students are like most everyone else's students, I think. And your father's soldering iron is exactly like the one I learned with, filing the tip to a coppery sheen, then priming it with solder, right? You're not the only one interested in files ... and I mean to send them via the ftp to bungi.com's archive. Soon. I'll let you all know. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 18:11:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJV6u-0000uta; Tue, 14 May 96 18:10 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!75054.2542 From: Monona Rossol <75054.2542@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: filters and Pb tests Date: 14 May 96 21:07:54 EDT Message-ID: <1996May15.1754.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joseph D. Nobel, >>Thanks for the info Monna. [Monona] It is always good to get this type of >>info. Maybe my nubers were not exactly accurate. I am still not yet an >>expert in this area, or maybe I have too much lead in me to think >>straight (just kidding of course). I sit/type corrected.<< Albert has connected me up with you guys and so I'll just be kinda lurking and making the odd and sundry technical comments. Any time you or anyone in the group wants to check something out with me first before putting it out there is welcome. I already answer 15 inquiries a day by e-mail and about another 15 by phone and letter. One more never seems to matter much. >Monona Rossol, industrial hygienist with Arts, Crafts and Theater Safety ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 18:24:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJVJf-000167a; Tue, 14 May 96 18:23 PDT X-Path: imcnet.net!drgnswve From: Dragon's Weave To: glass@bungi.com Subject: unsubscribe Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 21:26:01 -0400 Message-ID: <9605150126.AA26148@ns1.imcnet.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please unsubscribe me from the list. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 14 19:19:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJWBP-00015oa; Tue, 14 May 96 19:19 PDT X-Path: voicenet.com!2cgs From: cgs <2cgs@voicenet.com> To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Which newsletter? Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 22:20:25 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May14.182025.0> References: <<1996May14.22259.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > > > All the fuss & feathers is about an online NEWS MEMO that we began sending out > last Friday, Joy. Some people were glad to get it; others weren't. If you > continue to subscribe here to glass@bungi.com, you'll keep getting it (regularly > or irregularly, often or not). > > The Guild also publishes a quarterly newsletter (as distinct from a MEMO!) > called "Common Ground: Glass" which is sent to the members of the Guild. That's > got photos, of course as well as bunches of other information of interest to > glass artists and craftspeople, hobbyists and pros. > __________________________________________ > Albert Lewis Executive Director > International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. > __________________________________________ > > ---- This was (and is) a great newsgroup when it's about stained glass. I've learned a lot from the tips and ideas of the pros who share their experience. But it's a lot less interesting and useful when the subject matter is guilds, memos and newsletters. I don't have a problem deleting a single memo once every month or two. But there have been at least twenty promotional letters ABOUT the memo in the past month. I'd sure like to see it get back to glass and leave the promotions to some other forum. CHUCK ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 08:41:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJigK-0001AZa; Wed, 15 May 96 08:40 PDT X-Path: fox.nstn.ca!cmunro From: "Celia Munro" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: unsubscribe Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 00:38:21 -0400 Message-ID: <199605151539.MAA27539@Fox.nstn.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please unsubscribe me from your list Thankyou ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 20:52:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJu5U-0000sRa; Wed, 15 May 96 20:50 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Dye?? Date: Wed May 15 20:50:46 1996 Message-ID: <96May15.204426-0700pdt.268185-27438+91@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Julie, You wrote: >A fellow at work today asked me to inquire on whether or not there is such a >thing as glass dye. Several years ago he had some stained glass panels made >up, but the brightness of the light coming through them makes it such that >it is difficult to see the patterns. He was wondering if there is any way >to dye the glass to make it so that less light can get through thus they >will be more visually appealing. He specifically said that he is not >interested in a paint, but a dye. > >Any answers I can pass on to him? > >Actually, there is a liquid that can be applied to glass and it looks like stained glass. The product is used with whats called liquid lead, and applied with a dropper. I'm sure it's available at craft stores. I have some myself & I used it many year ago, not a very exciting craft, that why I switched to the real thing. Karin >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 21:09:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJuNM-0000Q9a; Wed, 15 May 96 21:09 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Sheep pattern Date: Wed May 15 21:09:18 1996 Message-ID: <96May15.210326-0700pdt.268291-27450+121@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Jodi, > >>I want to do my mother's front door, which right now it has a very large >>oval bevelled glass in it. The house was built approx. 1916 so it also has >>windows which are old stained glass, so I would really like to put something >>in the door which will compliment the windows, but I haven't found anything >>yet. > >What is the pattern in the windows? What is the dimensions on the oval? I >will keep my eye out for something. > I'm not sure of what the pattern is. I think my best bet would be to take a picture of it and then go searching. The oval glass is actually quite large, but I haven't measured it yet. There are some really nice oval patterns available which I'd really like to do, but certainly won't be appropriate for her old house. >>No I don't spin, although I've been known to get a little spinny on occassion. >>I was just kidding about the wool as it probably wouldn't make it thru customs. >>ie. We can't bring wicker products across the border. > Apparently, wicker products carries some kind of bug, and I think it's Canada Customs that won't allow it in unless it's gone thru de-contamination. >I also get a bit spinny often. I did not even think of customs. Wow, no >wicker baskets over the border, that is ridiculous. > >Oh yea, Customs is an power all on it's own. These people are worse than your locals, (police want to be's) Power & Control. So I think before we go into export & import I'd check into whats allowed. I'd hate to have them confiscate something. > >Karin. >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 21:22:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJuaD-0000TUa; Wed, 15 May 96 21:22 PDT X-Path: nz1.netzone.com!lorley From: "Lorley L. Oneyear" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Light Box Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 21:30:16 -0600 Message-ID: <2.2.32.19960516033016.0069bb68@mail.netzone.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thank you all for the info on the 50/50 60/40 solder. Will use the 60/40 w/ my next foil project and will let you know how I liked it. Thinking of having a light box made. I would like to use the plastic gridded square that comes w/ the Morton cutting system as my cutting surface. It's approx 2 foot by 3 foot (probably a bit smaller). Any suggestions about how much and what kind of light to use in the box? Will probably place the light box on on storage cart so I can move it around. Any suggestions would be appreciated. thanks to all once again. Lorley from Phoenix ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 21:40:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJuaD-0000TUa; Wed, 15 May 96 21:22 PDT X-Path: nz1.netzone.com!lorley From: "Lorley L. Oneyear" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Light Box Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 21:30:16 -0600 Message-ID: <2.2.32.19960516033016.0069bb68@mail.netzone.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thank you all for the info on the 50/50 60/40 solder. Will use the 60/40 w/ my next foil project and will let you know how I liked it. Thinking of having a light box made. I would like to use the plastic gridded square that comes w/ the Morton cutting system as my cutting surface. It's approx 2 foot by 3 foot (probably a bit smaller). Any suggestions about how much and what kind of light to use in the box? Will probably place the light box on on storage cart so I can move it around. Any suggestions would be appreciated. thanks to all once again. Lorley from Phoenix ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 21:49:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJuza-0000SYa; Wed, 15 May 96 21:48 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: fishing line Date: Wed May 15 21:48:47 1996 Message-ID: <96May15.214221-0700pdt.268276-27438+115@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Okay guys, arent' you just smart ones, hinds sight always has 20/20 vision. But then with my luck I would have been up the tree & fallen out or something. Or worse yet, having the back of my pants get caught on the branch & leave me dangling. Actually, Toby there is a lady not far from where I live that actually spin's her dog's wool, & does make sweaters for her friends & family. Now that's creative ! Karin ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 22:06:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJvGO-0000Xda; Wed, 15 May 96 22:06 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Wed May 15 22:06:07 1996 Message-ID: <96May15.215819-0700pdt.268299-27439+128@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Lorley from Phoenix, >Thank you all for the info on the 50/50 60/40 solder. Will use the 60/40 w/ >my next foil project and will let you know how I liked it. > >Thinking of having a light box made. I would like to use the plastic >gridded square that comes w/ the Morton cutting system as my cutting >surface. It's approx 2 foot by 3 foot (probably a bit smaller). Any >suggestions about how much and what kind of light to use in the box? Will >probably place the light box on on storage cart so I can move it around. > >Any suggestions would be appreciated. thanks to all once again. >Firstly, I use 50/50 to do my bulk work & them I use 60/40 for my beading. I personally find that 60/40 leaves a nicer finish after its polished. I have a light box and I went to the local junk yard, actually they re-cycle building material, windows, wood, doors, sinks, from demolished homes & offices, and picked up a florescent light box. Then had the table built around it. That way it can be make to suit you. Mine is quite low or short, so that I can look over it. All the other light tables I've seen are great, if I could only learn to cut glass with my nose. I've been checking out your weather down there. How can you stand it ??? It is 'just' starting to warm up here, at least this end of the country. > >Karin >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 15 22:35:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJvhz-00014Na; Wed, 15 May 96 22:34 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Wed May 15 22:34:37 1996 Message-ID: <96May15.222709-0700pdt.268314-27449+152@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Judy, how did you make out with your know it all students ? Karin >> I do photo- >>graph my works with a simple polaroid camera. I don't have a scanner so I >>guess it is just too much trouble to get it converted to .jpg for now. Maybe >>someday I'll do it as my inventory grows. I think I have a problem with >>getting .jpg, since I didn't get yours and it isn't the first time that >>happened. Oh well, thanks for the effort anyway. >> > > >actually, you may want to check out your local drugstore film processing >service. CVS in the boston area provides a couple of interesting services >aside from one hour and one day processing. if you're willing to wait 3 days >and pay an extra 3 dollars, you can receive a floppy diskette with your >pictures in addition to to 2 copies of your prints. > > >I have access to a scanner, but find this is a whole lot easier - painless, >in fact. I'm getting ready to put together my homepage, incorporating my 2 >loves - gardening and glass...and it's a whole lot easier to deal with >system ready prints. I'm planning on incorporating some of my student's work >in the home page (I teach about 40 students a term through an active adult >ed program and the exposure will be good for their morale/self image - the >town has a very active website that I'm going to link to so that my >student's neighbors can see their good work > >Judy in Northern MA >glaslady@tiac.net > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 03:03:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJzta-0000n8a; Thu, 16 May 96 03:02 PDT X-Path: tiac.net!glaslady From: glaslady@tiac.net (glaslady) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 06:08:06 -0400 Message-ID: <199605161008.GAA11948@mailserver2.tiac.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk morton actually has a light box dit to use with their cutting surface. comes with wood frame and relector strips - you add a GE lightstrip . works fine. I have 2 set up in my classroom and have a double set up at home in my studio >Thank you all for the info on the 50/50 60/40 solder. Will use the 60/40 w/ >my next foil project and will let you know how I liked it. > >Thinking of having a light box made. I would like to use the plastic >gridded square that comes w/ the Morton cutting system as my cutting >surface. It's approx 2 foot by 3 foot (probably a bit smaller). Any >suggestions about how much and what kind of light to use in the box? Will >probably place the light box on on storage cart so I can move it around. > >Any suggestions would be appreciated. thanks to all once again. > >Lorley from Phoenix > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > Judy in Northern MA glaslady@tiac.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 03:04:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uJztf-0000nEa; Thu, 16 May 96 03:03 PDT X-Path: tiac.net!glaslady From: glaslady@tiac.net (glaslady) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 06:08:15 -0400 Message-ID: <199605161008.GAA11959@mailserver2.tiac.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Judy, how did you make out with your know it all students ? > well, Mr. I'm not a beginner even though I've never done any of this beofre brought in his 'ready to solder' leaded piece (5ft x 3 ft) and asked me to critique it. The first question I asked was "is this a practice piece - or are you gong to install it in a door" Oh, it's a practice piece...but I'm going to install it. well, then...and with my handy-dandy sharpie, I started marking pieces he'd have to recut - and lead that would need to be recut...we ended up with 25 out of 40 glass pieces needing major work and almost every non-straigh strip of came.....I explained that if you can fit a horseshoe nail between the glass and the lead, you have a problem that no amount of DAP is going to heal. he then started complaining aobut the fact that he could only find white DAP. I suggesetd kneading a small amount of lampblack into the dap before applying it - or goin with my 100 yr old messy cement formula that hardens to a rock-like finish. no neither would do... soooooooo, if he redoes his work, he'll be soldering next week (another adventure, we'll see how much lead he melts, since he has done zip so far..... and the saga continues. on the other hand, my 'beginners' who had studied lead at another school are doing wonderful work - one is almost done with an intricate panel lamp and the other is working on a design with really tiny pieces - and both are reveling in the grinder (their former teacher only let them use the grozing teeth on their cutter and a pair of breakers - no runners, no grozers , no grinder, forget Mrton - I can see why they didn't enjoy the work and wasted a lot of glass. I guess I'm enough of a techie that if there's a tool out there to make life easier, I say go for it as long as the art remains intact (i.e., I have a band saw that I rarely use - only for those next to impossible cuts on difficult glass....I have a morton breaking & cutting system...I have a came saw....I don't use these on every job, but they're there if I feel I need them) Judy in Northern MA glaslady@tiac.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 03:47:28 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK0aN-0000r9a; Thu, 16 May 96 03:47 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Light Box Date: 16 May 96 06:45:32 EDT Message-ID: <1996May16.104532.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >suggestions about how much and what kind of light to use in the box? The first thing that pops into *my mind is that you should use the kind of bulbs/tubes that "replicate" natural sunlight. Inevitably, you'll select glass on top of the light box, so you'll want to get the colors *right and uninfluenced by light that's "off." __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 04:10:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK0w7-0000nca; Thu, 16 May 96 04:09 PDT X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: favorite tool Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 07:09:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605161109.HAA05339@brutus.bright.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Awhile back someone mentioned we should all give a tip of the month. Now don't get me wrong, I don't want to start the discussion again, on whether we have to, I don't think anyone should be forced into anything, but I would like to. I've been searching for something to "tip" everyone with, and decided I would tell why I like the strip cutter. I use it on absolutely every project, whether straight cuts or all curved. I love the way every single piece is the same, when I make picture frames or a border. I love the way there is very little grinding necessary (I do copper foil). I just completed cutting out a 450 piece oval window to be inserted into a door, and every piece was a curved cut - but I still used my strip cutter to cut off a smaller piece of glass from the half sheets that I usually have in storage. That kept the edges of the remaining piece straight, and I find I have less of a tendency to cut myself (stab, really) on the sharp corners that result from cutting off a little bit here and there in any direction. What is everyone's favorite tool? Joyce Moran joyce@bright.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 04:47:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK1W9-0000y5a; Thu, 16 May 96 04:46 PDT X-Path: voyager.net!delphigl From: delphigl@voyager.net (Delphi Stained Glass) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: favorite tool Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 07:46:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605161146.HAA16118@vixa.voyager.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >What is everyone's favorite tool? Since you are asking to pick a favorite, I would have to say that mine is a combination of 2 tools - the "Professional Boxer" and the "Octa/Hex" box making jigs. I haven't found any other tools so handy for accurately assembling the the sides. When used with the "Wedgies", I can position two sides of my box inside the jig and hold them in place with non-slip wedgies, and solder with ease! It's really helped cut down on my soldering/assembly time! (I make a wide variety of boxes which incorporate using other miscellaneous findings such as stamps, lace, pressed flowers, special pictures, etc.) Thanks for asking! Stephanie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 06:52:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK3T6-0000xda; Thu, 16 May 96 06:51 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 09:51:40 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May16.55140.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi folks, Where is the best place to get bulbs that produce "natural light", and should you use fogged glass on a light box. I have one that I made from an end-table that had smoked glass, but it seems that after putting the light in that it isn't evenly lit. Would fogged glass help, and if so, do I have to get it at a "glass" shop? None of my stained glass resources seem to have it, or at least don't list it in their catalogues. Janet Farrington IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 08:06:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK4cb-0000vUa; Thu, 16 May 96 08:05 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 11:06:09 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May16.769.0> References: <<1996May16.55140.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk IMN2GLASS@aol.com wrote: > > Hi folks, > > Where is the best place to get bulbs that produce "natural light", and should > you use fogged glass on a light box. I have one that I made from an > end-table that had smoked glass, but it seems that after putting the light in > that it isn't evenly lit. Would fogged glass help, and if so, do I have to > get it at a "glass" shop? None of my stained glass resources seem to have > it, or at least don't list it in their catalogues. > > Janet Farrington > IMN2GLASS@aol.com I made my own light box using two fluorescent bulbs under a sheet of fogged glass (16"x48"). I have found it to be very useful. I bought the glass from my 'backup' supplier, but I've never seen anyone that doesn't carry it. I'm pretty sure it's a Spectrum glass, but I'd have to look it up. As far as natural light, I wait for the sun to come up and hold the glass to the window. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 08:14:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uK4kq-0000tsa; Thu, 16 May 96 08:14 PDT X-Path: gjr From: gjr@daver.bungi.com (Glenna Rand) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 08:14:07 PDT Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk [In the message entitled "Re: Light Box" on May 16, 11:06, Matt McDonnell writes:] > > Where is the best place to get bulbs that produce "natural light", and should > > you use fogged glass on a light box. I have one that I made from an > > end-table that had smoked glass, but it seems that after putting the light in > > that it isn't evenly lit. Would fogged glass help, and if so, do I have to > > get it at a "glass" shop? None of my stained glass resources seem to have > > it, or at least don't list it in their catalogues. Hi Janet, I made a light box using flourescent bulbs. I used 2 sheets of glass and between them I place some plain white paper. It works great. -- Glenna Rand gjr@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 14:03:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKAAH-0000GPa; Thu, 16 May 96 14:00 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: BlindCopyReceiver:;@compuserve,.com Subject: IGGA NEWS MEMO! 5/16/96 Date: 16 May 96 16:58:07 EDT Message-ID: <1996May16.20587.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ----------------------------------------------------------------- IGGA Online News Memo! May 16, 1996 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Random glass info passed along after being compiled by the International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. a 501(c)(6) nonprofit organization ----------------------------------------------------------------- IGGA'S "SOURCES GUIDE 1996" UPLOADED TO FTP/PUB/GLASS/IGGA ON BUNGI.COM -- USE IT FREELY! We uploaded a large file to bungi.com's archive this morning ... and it's already been put into its own directory on ftp.bungi.com -- the file's name is IGGA01.ZIP, which has been unzipped into 30 different files, including IGGA01.TXT -- the master file -- and 30 other subfiles: File Name Size Description IGGA01 .TXT 213,901 Glass Arts Suppliers, Alphabetically IGGAACID.TXT 8,217 Acid Etching on Glass IGGABEAD.TXT 2,437 Glass Beadmaking IGGABEVE.TXT 12,247 Glass Bevels & Beveling Equipment IGGABOOK.TXT 14,981 Glass Books & Magazines IGGACAME.TXT 11,961 Came & Foil IGGACHEM.TXT 12,521 Chemicals (patina, etc.) IGGACUTT.TXT 10,022 Glass Cutters & Cutting Equipment IGGADOOR.TXT 7,248 Doors & Entries IGGAENGR.TXT 8,806 Glass Engraving IGGAETCH.TXT 5,928 Glass Etching IGGAFLAM.TXT 3,416 Flameworking/Lampworking IGGAFOIL.TXT 11,961 Foil & Came IGGAFRAM.TXT 8,875 Frames & Framing IGGAFUSE.TXT 10,471 Glass Fusing IGGAGLAS.TXT 14,084 Glass IGGAKITS.TXT 10,270 Kits IGGALAMP.TXT 11,069 Glass Lamps IGGAMAGS.TXT 14,981 Glass Magazines & Books IGGAMISC.TXT 5,904 Miscellaneous Glassworking Supplies IGGAPAIN.TXT 9,571 Glass Painting IGGAPATT.TXT 10,726 Glass Patterns IGGAREST.TXT 7,032 Glass Restoration IGGASAFE.TXT 9,314 Glass Safety IGGASAND.TXT 12,332 Glass Sandblasting IGGASCHO.TXT 6,065 Glass Schools & Workshops IGGASOLD.TXT 12,222 Soldering & Soldering Equipment IGGASTAT.TXT 66,154 Glass Arts Suppliers, By State IGGASUPP.TXT 9,139 Supporting Suppliers (discounts) IGGATOOL.TXT 13,993 Glass Tools IGGALIBR.TXT 23,049 Glass books available from the Guild Companies are first listed alphabetically [IGGA01.TXT] with long descriptions of their product lines and services. They're also listed by state (in IGGASTAT.TXT) so one can find the nearest ones. And they're also available by category; use IGGAFUSE.TXT, for example, if you're looking for a supplier of glass fusing materials and equipment -- you just read (or download) IGGAFUSE.TXT and there they are! The "1996 Sources Guide" also includes a comprehensive list of schools with glass programs [IGGASCHO.TXT] and more than 40 companies -- "Supporting Suppliers" -- that offer Guild members discounts of 5% to 50% on their products and services [IGGASUPP.TXT]. We're kinda proud of this piece of work! This is the first of a planned series of files we'll put in the ftp/pub/glass/igga subdirectory on bungi.com ... watch for further announcements! Note: these files are also available in Library 5 [GLASS] of the Handcrafts Forum on CompuServe. ================================================================= Do you like receiving this online news memo? Don't do anything; we'll send it to you whenever we get around to it, which might be fairly often. Or not. It depends on how busy the Exec. Dir., Albert Lewis, might be that day or week. You don't like it? If this is addressed to you DIRECTLY, simply reply to 70544.3642@compuserve.com saying UNSUBSCRIBE in the text of your message. If you receive it via a NEWSGROUP with a glass focus, you'll have to UNSUBSCRIBE from the newsgroup, alas. If you're receiving TWO copies, that's because you get it direct at your email address AND via the NEWSGROUP. Let us know in a note to 70544.3642@compuserve.com and we'll set the program to eliminate the duplicate copy. ================================================================= Our Mission: To facilitate communication among glass artists, to encourage education and promote excellence in the glass arts. __________________________________________ International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 (914) 278-2152 Fax: (914) 278-2481 __________________________________________ Membership info: 70544.3642@compuserve.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 14:52:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKAxO-00013na; Thu, 16 May 96 14:51 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: light boxes Date: Thu, 16 May 96 14:47:22 -0500 Message-ID: <199605162151.OAA12182@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- This is Howard...I see a few posts that are not making much sense. Why would anyone want smoked glass for a light box?, are you going to view the finished product that way. Second, I assume you are doing a lamp, so as to emulate the same lighting conditions as when the lamp is lit. Are you going to use flourescent tubes inthe final product for a light source? if not why view the glass that way on your light table? I use 60watt CLEAR bulbs in all of my tables. My smaller cutting table has a piece of tracing paper under the 3/8" clear plate glass that I cut on to soften looking into the clear bulbs. (yes that is right I DO cut on a piece of plate glass). Even using the Morton jig surface will not give you the same values as a piece of clear glass for light transmission. Look for the nuances of the color changes in the hand-made glasses and use them. If you are using machine made glass, why bother with a light table at all, as there ain't much going on in a sheet of production Spectrum or like glass. Unless something on this subject really piques my desire to respond...I have said what I wanted to...enjoy -- UNDER CONSTRUCTION... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 15:37:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKBf1-0000sia; Thu, 16 May 96 15:36 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Elisabeth's home page Date: 16 May 96 18:34:00 EDT Message-ID: <1996May16.22340.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Elisabeth, I managed to take a look at your web site today. Very nice! Good idea, too, to offer only thumbnails of your photographs at first (it speeds up the load time), then the bigger photograph when you click on the ones you want. Nice work! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 15:39:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKBhB-0000ySa; Thu, 16 May 96 15:38 PDT X-Path: g7-p8.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 96 15:38 PDT Message-ID: <1996May16.22380.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 08:14 AM 5/16/96 PDT, you wrote: >[In the message entitled "Re: Light Box" on May 16, 11:06, Matt McDonnell writes:] > >> > Where is the best place to get bulbs that produce "natural light", and should >> > you use fogged glass on a light box. I have one that I made from an >> > end-table that had smoked glass, but it seems that after putting the light in >> > that it isn't evenly lit. Would fogged glass help, and if so, do I have to >> > get it at a "glass" shop? None of my stained glass resources seem to have >> > it, or at least don't list it in their catalogues. > >Hi Janet, > >I made a light box using flourescent bulbs. I used 2 sheets of glass and >between them I place some plain white paper. It works great. > > >- A variation on the above, I use two 24inch twin lamp flourescent fittings (daylight lamps) in a 24inch square box and a sheet of white plexiglass as a cover painted the inside surfaces white and - it works fine!! Steve Anthony. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 15:47:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKBog-000151a; Thu, 16 May 96 15:46 PDT X-Path: voicenet.com!sadams From: Steve Adams To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 18:46:48 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May16.144648.0> References: <<1996May16.55140.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi, I used to raise angelfish... I had natural plants in the tank and could only get the plants to grow in full spectrum lights. I bought these lights at the pet store and they fit into a flourescent light fixture. As far as the fogged glass, white paper will do the trick as someone else has already mentioned. Good luck with the box -- you'll love what it does for your work. Steve > Where is the best place to get bulbs that produce "natural light", and should > you use fogged glass on a light box. I have one that I made from an > end-table that had smoked glass, but it seems that after putting the light in > that it isn't evenly lit. Would fogged glass help, and if so, do I have to > get it at a "glass" shop? None of my stained glass resources seem to have > it, or at least don't list it in their catalogues. > > Janet Farrington > IMN2GLASS@aol.com -------------------------------------------- http://www.voicenet.com/~sadams/mstrpcs.html -------------------------------------------- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 15:54:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKBwA-00016qa; Thu, 16 May 96 15:54 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Fire260 From: Fire260@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New Link Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 18:54:17 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May16.145417.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Check out the New Blenko Glass Homepage at http://www.citynet.net/blenko ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 18:10:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKE2f-00015ga; Thu, 16 May 96 18:09 PDT X-Path: g8-p11.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Elisabeth's home page Date: Thu, 16 May 96 18:09 PDT Message-ID: <1996May17.190.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 06:34 PM 5/16/96 EDT, you wrote: > >Elisabeth, > >I managed to take a look at your web site today. Very nice! Good idea, too, to >offer only thumbnails of your photographs at first (it speeds up the load time), >then the bigger photograph when you click on the ones you want. > >Nice work! > >Albert > >- Will someone kindly post the address of this homepage, I seem to have missed it! Thanks, Steve Anthony ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 19:40:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKFSp-0000yea; Thu, 16 May 96 19:40 PDT X-Path: advtel.net!pittman From: Paul Pittman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:40:44 -0500 Message-ID: <199605170240.VAA00697@aopen.advtel.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please remove my name from your posting e-mail list. Thank You. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 19:42:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKFUn-0000yMa; Thu, 16 May 96 19:42 PDT X-Path: advtel.net!pittman From: Paul Pittman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Stained Glass Postings Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:42:53 -0500 Message-ID: <199605170242.VAA00709@aopen.advtel.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please remove my name and address from your e-mail mailing list. Thanks ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 19:51:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKFd7-0001CAa; Thu, 16 May 96 19:51 PDT X-Path: aol.com!KSikor5208 From: KSikor5208@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: New kid on the block Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 22:50:54 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May16.185054.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello, I'm new to Stained Glass art. I was hoping I could find a computer software program to aid in pattern creation. Does anyone have any suggestions? Thank you! Karen ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 20:05:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKFqv-0000eva; Thu, 16 May 96 20:05 PDT X-Path: hooked.net!nsherman From: Neil Sherman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 20:02:18 -0700 Message-ID: <199605170305.UAA12670@mom.hooked.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I like everything about doing glass. I like designing a pattern, picking the glass, cutting it, grinding and foiling it. I even like burnishing the foil down. Then I start soldering. Everything goes wrong. The bead is too thin, too thick. My solder puddles out and sticks to the glass. Pieces of it spit out and sting my arm. My hand shakes. The bead looks terrible! I go over it again and it slips through to the back. I'm ready to throw my project on the ground and stomp on it. I realize everone has their own favorite way to solder, but since I hate everything I've tried so far, any suggestions about soldering technique would be helpful. (I'm using 7/32" copper foil, a water-base gel flux, 50/50 solder, and a 100 watt iron without a rheostat. I flat solder before trying to get a nice bead and then the problems start!) Thanks, Bonnie (who gave up soldering for the night and is watching tv for a change instead) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 16 21:31:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKHCB-0001Cea; Thu, 16 May 96 21:31 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Neil Sherman Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Thu, 16 May 96 21:27:13 -0500 Message-ID: <199605170431.VAA09235@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- First thing comes to mind is that you have trapped moisture from the flat soldering, and the second pass is causing the solder to pop as the moisture turns to steam and escapes. Another technique is to go only in one direction and let the heat and solder chase the moisture out as you go. The gel water base sounds like glass-star and IMHO that is fine (I use it to ). Using a 100w iron....I use a 50w ungar 1,100 degree iron and that is CERTAINLY hot enough to melt solder...if your soldering is peaky (merangue like) you are not staying on long enough to melt it...make sure you feel the foil joints of the glass and stay on them til the solder melts and flows. It takes practice, do not lose heart, keep at it, it will get better. enjoy...H -- UNDER CONSTRUCTION... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 01:36:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKL0j-00010Ha; Fri, 17 May 96 01:35 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Design software Date: 17 May 96 04:33:31 EDT Message-ID: <1996May17.83331.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Karen, There's been a lot of discussion of the "best" design tools in the Glass section on CompuServe [GO HANDCRAFTS]. The consensus seems to be that the CorelDraw software is the most flexible and powerful for the price. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 02:48:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKM8y-0000sRa; Fri, 17 May 96 02:48 PDT X-Path: nethawk.com!1091 From: 1091@nethawk.com (Sue Eiszler) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: tiffany lamp question Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 05:47:08 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I finally got my lamp (22" impatiens border) off the mold and am ready to solder the inside. I used 50/50 for the first outside soldering and need to know if I should use 50/50 on the inside or if I need to go to 60/40. Also, because of the size of the lamp, does it make any difference whether I start soldering on the sides or the bottom. It seems like it would be more logical to do the sides first because of dripping solder, etc. but I wonder if the bottom needs to be done first for stabilizing the lamp. Right now I have it sitting 'belly up' in a garbage pail lid with sponges between it and the lid so that it is pretty snug. That was the only thing I could find large enough to hold it...has anyone found something else that works better? I seem to be able to tip it at some pretty good angles and then support it with Wedgies. Also, is it better to use wire on the bottom edge or copper rope stuff (which is what I used on the top opening)? Thanks for any info/suggestions you may have. Sue 1091@nethawk.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 02:57:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKMHB-0000qza; Fri, 17 May 96 02:56 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Membership info Date: 17 May 96 05:54:46 EDT Message-ID: <1996May17.95446.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >From: joel@compuserve.com >Subject: Membership info >I'm interested in receiving membership information. Joel, you'll have to include your CompuServe account number in your address for mail to reach you. *My address at CIS, for instance, would be internet:70544.3642@compuserve.com Structure yours the same way, substituting your account number for mine in the model above, but using a period instead of the comma CompuServe uses when you precede it with the "internet:" indicator. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 05:13:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKOOu-0000y6a; Fri, 17 May 96 05:12 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 08:12:46 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.41246.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello Lorley: I just completed my light box. I roughly used the demensions suggested by Joe Procelli in his lamp making book. His demensions were 30" X 48". When completed, the light box sits on 4 legs on which I mounted ball casters. I found a local glass company that cut and ground the 1/4" clear glass for the top. The local hardware stores here in Houston, will cut the lumber to the proper size, free of charge. I installed 6 ceramic sockets (like the ones on the ceiling of you closets) inside. I chose ceramic because I figured that they could handle the heat generated in the enclosure. I use 100 watt soft white bulbs, which I control by a dimmer switch . I also mounted a "tap-strip" on one of the legs so that I could plug in soldering irons, etc. I would suggest not using the plastic "Morton's" grid on your table because of the difficulity of cleaning out all of the little pieces of glass that will accumulate inside the box. I would suggest that you use incandesent bulbs (not flouresecent tubes) because the regular bulbs should give you a better approximation of how the glass actually looks when lighted.(unlessof course, you are planning to light your projects with flourscent lighting.) I am just starting on the Tiffany "Dragonfly" 20". I purchased a sheet of beautiful Youghiogheny glass, which has purples,greens, and blues, running through it. The sheet of glass was so impressive that I took a photo of it! I make quite a few lamps, and thought the light table would be indespensible. I don't like surprised when I light up a lamp and find out that one piece of the glass is noticablly different than the others. Now, I can lay all of the pieces on the light table and see them as they should appear when lighted. The total cost of construction was approx. $ 150.00 - $200.00. That may sound like a lot for what the table does, but I know that it will pay for itself in the ease, and the glass saved. Good Luck... Michael McGrew Shattered Images Studio ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 05:30:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKOfz-0001B6a; Fri, 17 May 96 05:30 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 08:30:26 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.43026.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-16 18:48:56 EDT, you write: >From: sadams@voicenet.com (Steve Adams) > >Hi, I used to raise angelfish... I had natural plants in the tank and >could only get the plants to grow in full spectrum lights. I bought >these lights at the pet store and they fit into a flourescent light >fixture. As far as the fogged glass, white paper will do the trick as >someone else has already mentioned. Good luck with the box -- you'll >love what it does for your work. > >Steve > Steve, Thanks for the idea. I just happen to frequent pet stores for my cockatiel and my golden retriever puppy. I'll definately look into that. I hate the smoked glass I use now, the only reason I used it in the first place was just so I could see if I would benefit from having a light table, and it was free. It's good for tracing layouts, but what I really wanted it for was so that I could lay out glass samples so as to decide what glass I wanted to use. I work in a basement so Mother Nature is not very accessible. My dream studio has picture windows that always face the sun. :-) Thanks again, Janet Farrington IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 06:33:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKPeB-00010qa; Fri, 17 May 96 06:32 PDT X-Path: cpcn.com!maruca From: maruca@cpcn.com (la madrugadora) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: flourescents, compact flourescents Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:28:14 -0400 Message-ID: <9605171328.AA28393@info.cpcn.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Despite the sceptical eyebrow I know I'm going to get from Howard, I'd like to encourage folks to try compact flourescents for lamps. The light they give is much nicer than your average long F-tube, they last forever (or just about) and they don't throw a lot of heat. Yes they are expensive in the initial purchase, but as they use less than a third the energy an equivalent incandescent does, they pay off quickly. My teacher and I have been very happy with the way the compact flourescent light is diffused in small box lamps. Due to their design, you don't get that one bright spot shining someplace mid lamp. All the best, Mary ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 06:54:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKPz1-0000kua; Fri, 17 May 96 06:54 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:54:10 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.55410.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-16 23:06:24 EDT, you write: >Then I start soldering. > >Everything goes wrong. The bead is too thin, too thick. My solder puddles >out and sticks to the glass. Pieces of it spit out and sting my arm. My >hand shakes. The bead looks terrible! I go over it again and it slips >through to the back. I'm ready to throw my project on the ground and stomp >on it. Karen, I use a 60/40 solder and I do not solder it flat before running a bead. Also, I always solder the back side of the piece first, it doesn't really matter if a little goes through it will clean up when you do the other side. Are you using a temp. control. Possibly you have it set a little too hot if you are having real problems with you solder running through. It definately takes practice, but don't get frustrated it will come. If the solder is running off and sticking to the glass, you probably don't have it fluxed properly. Too little it runs off, too much it spits. I like to use Classic 100 gel flux. It stays where you put it and it won't spit at you. I aply it with a flux and patina brush, but I cut the bristles shorter so that I have more control. Practise is the key. Don't give up!!! Hope this helps. Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 06:56:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKQ0X-0000qja; Fri, 17 May 96 06:55 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 09:56:26 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.55626.0> References: <<1996May17.43026.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk I guess I'm not sure what the big deal is. We use our light box for tracing patterns onto the glass, that's about it. [I don't have Howard's courage to cut on a glass surface. He's problably got a much gentler touch than me. ;-)] If I need a light source to see the glass color, like I said before, I hold it to the window. I do agree with Howard that to look at glass for a lamp, you should find an incandescent light source. That works for me too, I don't have to wait for the sun to come up! Just my two cents worth. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 07:46:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKQmn-0000Kda; Fri, 17 May 96 07:45 PDT X-Path: MAIL.B-N-K.COM!MATT From: "Matt Burleson" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Your Mail Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 10:46:02 +0000 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I seem to be getting your email at my compuserve address. Matt Burleson ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 08:25:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKROz-0000GVa; Fri, 17 May 96 08:25 PDT X-Path: aol.com!GCmagazine From: GCmagazine@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tiffany lamp question Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:25:03 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.7253.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Sue, Let me make some suggestions to you about your lamp. Before you do any soldering on the inside of the shade, you should first fill in all your solder lines and reinforce the bottom edge of the lamp in some way. If the lamp has a straight border, apply an 1/8" diameter Odyssey ring (you should be able to get one in the proper diameter from your supplier) to the edge of the glass by tacking it wherever it meets a solder line and then fill the entire ring with a bead of solder before going on. This will reinforce (stabilize) the lamp substantially, enough so you can proceed without worrying too much about handling and moving it about. If your lamp has an irregular border, apply a wire reinforcement in the same way. We use a 16 gauge copper wire for such lamps. remember, do this before you start to fill or finish soldering. With the reinforcement in place, you can go on soldering the shade. In our studio, we begin flat and finish soldering at the aperture and continue downward, whether we're soldering on the inside or out. Your gerry-rigged lamp holder should work out fine. Bottom line is you need something that will position the area so the solder won't flow away from you. The area has to be flat in front of you. We use a neat little bench mounted tool called the Warren Glass Positioner. We reviewed it in our magazine (Professional Stained Glass Feb/March 1994). It angles the lamp to you preference and also allows it to spin while your working on it. Give them a call at 410-268-0308. If you plan to apply a good patina finish to your lamp, I would suggest your working with 60/40 solder as much as possible. The added tin content of the 60/40 goes a long way in promoting better color and consistency when using coloring agents on you lamp's metal surfaces. I hope these suggestions help. Joe Porcelli ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 11:55:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKUf5-00019ra; Fri, 17 May 96 11:54 PDT X-Path: microsoft.com!a-mattla From: "Matthew Lang (S&T Onsite)" To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: New Link Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:53:35 -0700 Message-ID: <1996May17.45335.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I'm using the Microsoft Internet Explorer and it crashes every time I try to use this URL. Matthew Lang a-mattla@microsoft.com >---------- >From: Fire260@aol.com[SMTP:Fire260@aol.com] >Sent: Thursday, May 16, 1996 3:54 PM >To: glass@bungi.com >Subject: Re: New Link > >Check out the New Blenko Glass Homepage at >http://www.citynet.net/blenko >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 12:00:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKUkA-0000y1a; Fri, 17 May 96 11:59 PDT X-Path: fbo.com!dloda From: Dave Loda To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:07:51 -0700 Message-ID: <1996May17.4751.0> References: <<1996May12.19451.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Stained Glass of Newport Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was > >different from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this > >is a duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the > >site at bungi.com. > > pj, > > IGGA publishes Common Ground: Glass, a quarterly newsletter of 32 to 72 pages, > in the old-fashioned ink-on-paper-delivery-via-the-Post-Office kind of way. > Last Friday, I put together an announcement for a few people, then realized > there were *others who might be interested ... and it evolved into the "IGGA > News Memo," which is available online only. > > So I'm not removing you (since you say to do so only if it's a duplication of > the newsletter), until I hear differently. And this is going to you via > bungi.com, so everyone else will understand the difference, too. > > Albert > > [Oh, I see what's happening, pj. Glenna's note made it all clear! You were > sent a copy of the memo direct to your email address ... and a copy was sent to > bungi.com as well. Since you also get everything that appears on bungi.com you > received *two copies of the memo! Once as a member of the Guild and once as a > reader of bungi.com > > Since I can't control whether you're reading bungi.com or not and since the > direct copy is sent to you because you're in the Guild's mailing list, the > duplication's inevitable, unless you stop reading bungi.com or drop your > membership in the Guild or *keep your membership but have us eliminate your > email address from your record so you won't get the duplicate, but then you > won't have it listed in the Guild List that appears in CG:G ... gawd! this is > getting confusing!] > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassDear Al, I guess you can add me to your list of meatheads who really have no interest in receiving your newsletter. If I wanted it I would join your IGGA. Nothing against you since I don't know you, but I really feel that if someone is recruiting members for an association like yours, it should be done either on your home page or one to one, not clogging up everyones mailboxs. About a month or so ago, I found glass@bungi and enjoyed reading the give and take between readers. Now however it appears that this site should be renamed glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com Dave LodaAlbert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >Ok, now I'm confused.....I thought the newsletter that you had was > >different from that of the IGGA. I already get that online...so if this > >is a duplicate please remove. Thanks and maybe you could explain the > >site at bungi.com. > > pj, > > IGGA publishes Common Ground: Glass, a quarterly newsletter of 32 to 72 pages, > in the old-fashioned ink-on-paper-delivery-via-the-Post-Office kind of way. > Last Friday, I put together an announcement for a few people, then realized > there were *others who might be interested ... and it evolved into the "IGGA > News Memo," which is available online only. > > So I'm not removing you (since you say to do so only if it's a duplication of > the newsletter), until I hear differently. And this is going to you via > bungi.com, so everyone else will understand the difference, too. > > Albert > > [Oh, I see what's happening, pj. Glenna's note made it all clear! You were > sent a copy of the memo direct to your email address ... and a copy was sent to > bungi.com as well. Since you also get everything that appears on bungi.com you > received *two copies of the memo! Once as a member of the Guild and once as a > reader of bungi.com > > Since I can't control whether you're reading bungi.com or not and since the > direct copy is sent to you because you're in the Guild's mailing list, the > duplication's inevitable, unless you stop reading bungi.com or drop your > membership in the Guild or *keep your membership but have us eliminate your > email address from your record so you won't get the duplicate, but then you > won't have it listed in the Guild List that appears in CG:G ... gawd! this is > getting confusing!] > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 13:23:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKW2b-00018Oa; Fri, 17 May 96 13:22 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: odds & sods Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 21:14:21 +0000 Message-ID: <199605172028.VAA27256@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Albert; sorry for the delay. Please do use any comment/observation from me in your Newsletter. (with the reservation that any flak from the Brits will be on your head) Matt: Good on you; lovely to see you out of the "wood-work".Will communicate. Karin: Smashing, thank you The breakage wasn't just (superior) 20/20 hind-sight vision, it was an emotional "gut-kick" (We have BEEN there, for goodness sake!! I have done it too!) That doesn't stop us from succumbing to an affectionate tease.... Dog-spinning: I'm saving my pennies, I GOT to get over and talk to your neighbour!!!! I love the bit about wicker-baskets...... and I thought Europe was crazy..... "Know-all" classes (Jodi??) I too run "leisure classes" Amongst them was a 70-year old "madam" with arts-degrees galore. She knew it ALL; She insisted as a "first" project to make a panel-to-fit (for her darling son) of a medevial jester. Her glass-cutting was about 1/2" out of true; she insisted that kitchen scissors was the only way to cut lead. In the end I hope I managed to persuade her that SHE deserved ALL the credit for the work, and that MY name was nowhere to be mentioned, at ANY cost.........She KNEW it all, .... of course...... That was 3 years ago, yet my current students still relish in the details.... I can only cringe... (But it was a torture that I had to endure for about 6 months...!) Light Box: I have 3 myself; the one I use the most is basic one. Basically its structure is made out of old discarded floor-boards, 3 ft x 3 ft. ; top and bottom, connected by hinges and a handle (so I can carry it about anywhere and everywhere). The bottom half consists of thelightening-up bit, quite crudely a wooden box with 5 fluorescent light tubes, mounted side by side in a structure that is designed to change any tube efficiently and easily. Top half part is the "illuminating bit". It's not glass at all, but frosted perspex, in one sheet, screwed down in such a way that it can be easily replaced when too scratched/ damaged. The "frostyness" is designed so that it defracts the total sum of light sources into a diffused - but clear - light-source (I can cut greys, blacks, dark browns and other dark obscure/opalescent colours through it) It's a 4 mm. thick sheet. I can change the tubes at any stage, at any time, to "day-light "type tubes. I can pick it up, move it, carry it, put it outside, , in any room of my house to get the "feel" of my colour composition. I always keep the perspex surface pristine clean (hence I do not use the Morton surface, which I find messy, defractive and confusing (when scraps collect) ). The persepex sheet I find , transluscent enough to show the colours, firm enough to cut against, smooth enough to clean off, reesilient enough to keep cleaning and econmical enough to replace as and when. Very crude, very basic, very cheap - but by God it works a treat. I might stir up a "can of worms" here, but you across "The Pond" are very fond of "commercial gadgets" Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKYsw-0001Fpa; Fri, 17 May 96 16:24 PDT X-Path: interserv.com!ebsousa From: ebsousa@interserv.com To: Glass@bungi.com Subject: soldering Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 16:24:13 -0700 Message-ID: <199605172324.AA27039@relay.interserv.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Bonnie, I think that soldering is one of the trickiest parts of stained glass. I think your iron is too hot. I don't know what type of projects you are working on, but if your are doing suncatcher kind of things 100 watts is more power then you need. I started out using a 40 watt iron which worked fine, though I found as I worked on larger projects ( or maybe I just got quicker) that the iron would lose too much heat so I moved up to a 60 watt iron and I don't think I would need anything larger. Maybe there are applications where one would need the power of a 100 watt iron, maybe the more experienced artists out there could share their views. You could try keeping your iron cooler by frequent wiping on a wet sponge which is what I do as I don't have a rheostat either. I have used both liquid and gel fluxes and I have had more problems with spitting and solder sticking to the glass when using the gel flux, perhaps because of the thickness I put on too much but I prefer the liquid. Good Luck! Donna S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 17:41:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKa49-00013Pa; Fri, 17 May 96 17:40 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: soldering Date: Fri, 17 May 96 17:36:36 -0500 Message-ID: <199605180040.RAA28605@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- A major assumption that most users get lost in is the watts versus heat.... ain't no one paying attention! A 100w iron probably puts out less heat than my 50w Ungar. Watts are not a measure of tip temperature. More heat, smoother beads, work goes faster, seems to be the way to go. enjoy...H -- new construction 5-117-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 20:47:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKcyh-0000UNa; Fri, 17 May 96 20:46 PDT X-Path: airmail.net!bad From: bad@airmail.net (Beckie Decker) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: soldering Date: Fri, 17 May 96 22:46:36 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >-- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- > >A major assumption that most users get lost in is the watts versus heat.... >ain't no one paying attention! >A 100w iron probably puts out less heat than my 50w Ungar. >Watts are not a measure of tip temperature. >More heat, smoother beads, work goes faster, seems to be the way to go. >enjoy...H *** I keep two 80 watt irons hot while I'm soldering, switching back and forth as they cool. Works for me. Beckie bad@airmail.net http://web2.airmail.net/~bad/ Mama to: Nate the Gentleman Hound @-->-->-- Myrtle the Good Dane --<--<--@ and the two-leggers, Laura and Sarah The one thing I know for sure; never shave your legs when you have chill bumps. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 21:43:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKdqo-0000uZa; Fri, 17 May 96 21:42 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Sat, 18 May 96 14:11:50 Message-ID: <199605180442.OAA10743@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199602132301.SAA17927@pilot01.cl.msu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199602132301.SAA17927@pilot01.cl.msu.edu>, on 02/13/96 at 06:01 PM, "Lisa Anne Rosochacki" said: >Hi all >There has been an ongoing discussion on soldering irons...here is what I >know from working in a SG store... The Weller 100's range in temp from >600 F to 800 F and they come standard with a 700 F degree tip... most >people if they are doing decorative soldering, don't want to go any lower >than 600 F because then the iron doesn't melt the solder very well. The >800 F tips are more for those people that are more experienced and want >to work alot faster.... there are cautions to the higher temp and that is >that you can crack the glass alot easier because of all the heat, and you >can melt right through your solder lines if you don't work fast enough. >When I tell people about soldering irons I like to highly recommend >getting the Weller 100 and the moving to different tips (temperature >wise) to do the decorative. The iron is top of the line and the company >stands behind their products. I think that I have only seen one come >back and that was a manufacturing defect and they replaced it. Also the >tips come in the different sizes and the different sizes come in >different temps too, so make sure you check all those things before you >make your choice. >I hope that that all helps. >Lisa R. This is an old message, but I just purchased one of these irons and need some advice. I had a 80 watt iron that I used for came work, and I thought I would indulge myself with a qality iron for came and foil (which I wanted to try). I cut my glass, cleaned it (in water with detergent and then rinsed thoroughly), dried it, foiled it. When it came to soldering, I noticed that the foil lifted in places. If I pressed it down after removing iron, it seems to have 'stuck' again. I am typing this several days after the exercise and it still seems 'stuck'. My questions are: 1. Should I not clean the glass the way I did? 2. The Weller tip is a no 8, which I think is an 800F tip. Is this too hot for foil? Even if I was tinning the copper foil and moving very quickly, the foil still seemed to lift. 3. Would a no 6 tip be too cold? Is a no 7 a better option? Thank you all in advance for any advise/help. P.S. The project I did was a little rectangular planter with a triangular roof to it. I am amazed at how strong this copper foil technique is. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 22:02:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKe9r-0000nDa; Fri, 17 May 96 22:02 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: "Guitarshop@aol.com" Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Fri, 17 May 96 21:58:50 -0500 Message-ID: <199605180502.WAA08005@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- This is Howard...I too, am working on a 20" fly..sounds like the same run of Yock, can produce the factory # if necessary. I have done (and sold) 4 20'flies with this one being sold when done as well , so far so good. you are on the right track. I suggest switching to clear bulbs, though...(those of you who are flourescent light fans need not comment). A fan would not hurt to circulate the heated air in the box. I place a second sheet of plate over the glass top and use that as an easel to move and remove pieces so as not to tie up the box and make moving sections easier. what colors for the grids and wings? Be not afraid to mix the jewels, and DO use the pale and milky parts of the sheet as well to drip colors into each other. If it is not too much trouble, keep me posted...will answer most questions. One last thought, not a Worden (I hope). -- new construction 5-117-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 22:07:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKeES-0000wqa; Fri, 17 May 96 22:07 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Fri May 17 22:07:06 1996 Message-ID: <96May17.220053-0700pdt.28729-979+1116@orb.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Toby, I know you were just joshing me, that's why I said with my luck I'd be hung in the tree & wouldn't that just have looked real swell. Haven't we all had students from hell at one time or another. Ya gotta hope that no one has ever had wonderful stories to tell about us. ( I hope, I hope). at least not since we've all matured. Actually, your light box sounds very much like mine, only I've got 1/2 " scrap glass from a window glass shop, it's so heavy I can hardly pick up the glass, never mind the box underneath. I do believe that learning the art of stained glass is also a lesson humility. Just when you feel your getting know it well, you learn something new. I make a 365 piece tiffany style lamp about a year ago, and was that tough !!. It took myself and my mentor, to finally assemble the panels. That was one big project, and of course I'm so fussy that the inside solder has to be done just as well as the outside. Being just a shorty & alway looking up at things that's the first thing I notice. Especially annoys me when I see these, so called tiffany lamps from elsewhere, the workmanship is offensive, yet people do buy them, at their $200. price, and think they bought a wonderfull piece of art. Like Albert would say (aaaggghhh). Oh yes, our customs officials & the American officials are just wonderful !! Even better if you get a female, they really have something to prove. We're not allowed to transport apples either. (apples magots apparently). You can imagine their horror when I went across the border with my kids & my vehicle got checked, and they found all these brown apple cores under my seat, amongest other wonderful things. Kids are wonderfull aren't they. Then so are husbands, when they leave their herring in the trunk of your car after a fishing trip & forget to tell you. I actually drove to work for a week during the summer before I mentioned it to my now ex-husband about the awful odor in my vehicle. Karin ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 17 22:30:17 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKeaF-0000ysa; Fri, 17 May 96 22:29 PDT X-Path: aye.net!chh From: chh@aye.net To: glass@bungi.com Subject: E-mail Date: Sun, 12 May 1996 19:39:48 -0700 Message-ID: <1996May12.123948.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk pLEASE REMOVE ME FROM YOUR MAILING LIST THE FLOOD IS TO MUCH TO DEAL WITH. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 00:33:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKgVV-0001Asa; Sat, 18 May 96 00:32 PDT X-Path: aol.com!BarbaraBGS From: BarbaraBGS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA newsletter Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 03:32:48 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.233248.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-13 08:16:14 EDT, you write: >Why not let the meathead unsubscribe rather than depriving the rest of >us who are indeed interested in reading the IGGA material? > >Please continue to forward that valuable newsletter through glass@bungi. > >thanks! > > I agree - Albert - please keep sending the newsletter. Also - an aside - since you are relatively new, you haven't seen all the "meatheads" who can't seem to read the directions regarding unsubscribing. We get a lot of those messages and mostly just ignore them. Barbara ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 00:51:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKglY-00019ta; Sat, 18 May 96 00:49 PDT X-Path: aol.com!BarbaraBGS From: BarbaraBGS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Glass Dye?? Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 03:49:15 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May17.234915.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-15 23:53:07 EDT, you write: > liquid lead, What she's referring to here is a product (I think from Plaid) called Gallery Glass. It and the liquid lead are squeezed from a bottle or painted onto glass within the spaces created by the liquid lead. It's available from Michaels and on the cable home shopping networkds and Craft King. A great many discussions have surrounded this product as it's bulletin board known as faux stained glass is included in the stained glass section. \ Incidentally, I used it before trying the "real thing" and didn't find it very satisfying. Barbara ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 01:19:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKhBE-00014Sa; Sat, 18 May 96 01:16 PDT X-Path: aol.com!BarbaraBGS From: BarbaraBGS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hot glass classes Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 04:15:54 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.01554.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Recently returned from Hot Glass Horizons in Corning, NY. (A wonderful museum is there as well as Steuben Glass). I participated in a glass blowing class which was delightful and came home wanting more. Alas, I can't find any classes in my area - which seems ridiculous since my "area" is Chicago. Anyone know of schools or individuals in the general midwest willing to share glass blowing info? Thanks. Barbara P.S. Sorry if my previous messages were rehashing old news. That can happen when you don't read your mail for a while. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 03:55:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKjc4-0001ASa; Sat, 18 May 96 03:51 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: The "meathead effect" Date: 18 May 96 06:50:11 EDT Message-ID: <1996May18.105011.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I agree - Albert - please keep sending the newsletter. >Also - an aside - since you are relatively new, you haven't seen all the >"meatheads" who can't seem to read the directions regarding unsubscribing. > We get a lot of those messages and mostly just ignore them. Barbara Thanks for the encouragement, Barbara. I've seen the "meathead effect" before, having edited magazines. At the time, we called such people "the subscribers from hell" because there wasn't *anything one could do to please them. Did the mailman tear their issue shoving it through their mail slot? We would *overnight a new copy by Federal Express and they would call back to complain that it didn't have their address label on it! (Or something else equally inane.) Publishing stuff isn't glamorous, even if you do it from New York City; it's *hard mostly thankless *work! This online stuff *is a little confusing, not only to others, but to me as well (it wasn't for nothing my father called *me "meathead"). When I get an "unsubscribe" I'm not sure whether they're referring to bungi.com and just can't read the directions at the foot of each message or whether they're referring to the IGGA NEWS MEMO! we've been sending *within bungi.com -- I just send them an explanatory message and hope that something seeps through. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 03:56:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKjc4-00019sa; Sat, 18 May 96 03:51 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Hot glass classes Date: 18 May 96 06:50:14 EDT Message-ID: <1996May18.105014.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Anyone know of schools or individuals in the general midwest willing to >share glass blowing info? Thanks. Barbara Try these for weekend and summer workshops: Joel Philip Myers Illinois State University Department of Art Normal IL 61761 William Carlson University of Illinois 603 W. Michigan Urbana IL 61801 Bill Boysen Southern Illinois University Southern Glassworks School of Art & Design SWC (4301) Carbondale IL 62901 There's a pretty complete (but we're never sure, of course) list of glass schools and workshops in IGGASCHO.TXT in the archive here. Check the IGGA folder. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 05:15:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKkrU-000179a; Sat, 18 May 96 05:11 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 08:11:51 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.41151.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello Bonnie: I am still a Newbie also, and can really appreciate your feelings. I recently built a "Flying Fairly Lady" kit. The wings went to gether O.K., but when I tried to solder them to the body..... She finally "FLEW" into the trash can. After regaining my composure (and a good night's sleep), I decided that I wasn't going to be defeated by a stupid fairy. So, I dug her out of the trash the next morning and completed her. She seems to be one of everyone's favorite pieces (except mine). Concerning your problems, I have a few ideas that I learned by trial and error. First of all, you can make things much easier for yourself by getting a rheostat for your soldering iron. These should be readily available at your supplier, or the can be ordered from most any major catalog. They are fairly inexpensive ($17.00 approx.), and will give YOU the ability to control the heat that your iron is putting out. I usually work with 7/32" foil and 60/40 solder, and have a 100 watt iron also. I feel most comfortable running my iron at approx 50-55 on the rheostat, and a little higher for 50/50 (55-60). I primarily build lamps, and have found this to minimize "Run-through" and some of the other problems that you mentioned. Also, you might try using a paste flux. I found out that the liquid flux, no matter how sparingly applied, tended to run down between the pieces, and in turn, draw the moltent solder with it. After changing to a paste flux (which is also cheaper), I had much better success. Good Luck, and don't give up!!!!! Michael McGrew Shattered Images Studios ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 05:16:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKkrU-00015ba; Sat, 18 May 96 05:11 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 08:11:47 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.41147.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello Karen: I too have been doing glass for only a short time. The general concensius on the Net is , Corel Draw 5.0. I have Corel Draw 5.0 on floppy. I haven't been using it for a while, and when I went to re-install it, I found that the last disk was corrupted. If anyone would be so kind as to send a zip of the last floppy to me, it would be greatly appreciated. I recently purchased "Glass Magic - Ver 2.0" from Delphi Glass. It works O.K. but only if you are building panel lamps or jewelry boxes. You can import clip art, etc., But there is no provisions for altering the clip are images, or creating your own. Would be interested in hearing any other ideas that anyone could offer... ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 07:20:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKmoF-0000qma; Sat, 18 May 96 07:16 PDT X-Path: mail.gardencitynet.co.uk!kris From: "Kris" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 14:02:32 +0000 Message-ID: <199605181423.PAA17561@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > images, or creating your own. Would be interested in hearing any other ideas > that anyone could offer... Before anyone wonders what happened to my attempt to produce some stained glass software :-) - unfortunately all my free time has been taken up recently by 'emergencies' :-( - but I'm still monitoring what people would like and what might be possible. Just hope that the Summer in the UK this year is too wet for me to be tempted into the garden at weekends. Kris -- "Everything in life is transient; including life itself" ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 08:27:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKnqr-0001A5a; Sat, 18 May 96 08:23 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tiffany lamp question Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 11:23:22 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.72322.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I hope this works..... Hello Joe: In your reply, you mentioned a "Professional Stained Glass" magazine. I would be interested in subscribing to it. Could you please e-mail me some info on it? Also, I just finished the light table design in you "Lamp Making Handbook". There were several dementional "mis-prints". In spite of these problems, I finally got it together. Since I primarily manufacture lamps, it is an invaluable tool for selecting glass. You also mention, in you "Tiffany Green" chapter, several chemicals that I haven't seen before. Where are these products available? Thanks for the info... Michael McGrew Shattered Images Studios. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 08:59:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKnqr-0001A5a; Sat, 18 May 96 08:23 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: tiffany lamp question Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 11:23:22 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.72322.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I hope this works..... Hello Joe: In your reply, you mentioned a "Professional Stained Glass" magazine. I would be interested in subscribing to it. Could you please e-mail me some info on it? Also, I just finished the light table design in you "Lamp Making Handbook". There were several dementional "mis-prints". In spite of these problems, I finally got it together. Since I primarily manufacture lamps, it is an invaluable tool for selecting glass. You also mention, in you "Tiffany Green" chapter, several chemicals that I haven't seen before. Where are these products available? Thanks for the info... Michael McGrew Shattered Images Studios. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 09:12:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKocU-0000Gia; Sat, 18 May 96 09:12 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Aluminum came Date: 18 May 96 12:11:19 EDT Message-ID: <1996May18.161119.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: Albert M (Merv) Carter 76040.2361@compuserve.com >My wife is currently receiving more and more orders for stained glass >items of increasing size. While careful planning and common sense >engineering help to alleviate the problems of using lead and zinc, the >time is clearly at hand for a superior material/technique. >There is too much of a gap between the characteristics of these two >metals. Something lighter and stronger than lead while still being >easier to work than zinc would be a great help. There are a number of reasons lead is used in preference over any other metal. As Julie Sloan points out in her recent book (which is about restoration, it's true, but she covers lead came quite exhaustively): "Although most came is made of lead or a lead alloy, zinc, copper and brass were also widely used at the turn of the century, and some windows employed more than one type. " Not only that, but, "Damaged lead and solder can be easily replaced." ... which is something that should be planned on at the time a window is being designed and built. She goes on to explain why lead is the best choice: "Lead is one of the most stable metals known to man, and for that reason is one of the most popular building metals. Lead cames are traditional and still used most widely for joining the individual pieces of glass into a whole panel. Other metals such as zinc, brass, and copper were introduced in the late nineteenth century and remain popular, but not to the extent that lead is. There is a great variety of profiles, different in dimension and thickness of heart and flange. "The major difference between lead and the zinc/copper/brass group is its workability. Lead is malleable; the others are not. Flexibility has been the primary reason for lead's use. It takes solder well, with a minimum of accessory equipment required for forming and joining. Lead came can be formed around the glass pieces by hand, and easily cut with a knife as needed. The joints are usually butted or lapped, and soldered with 60/40 or 50/50 tin/lead solder. "The malleability of the came at room temperature make it well-suited to being conformed to the perimeter of the glass pieces. However, this property also makes it susceptible to deformation under the weight of the glass. The came will stretch if the window is not properly supported in the frame and tied to saddle bars. The window will sag, bowing under its own weight, causing pieces of glass to break or become loosened in the cames. In addition, this malleability decreases with time, especially in pure lead cames. The flanges become brittle, a condition known as "fatigue," and exhibit cracks at stress points. This is a common problem in nineteenth-century cames because their lead content is almost 100% pure. Medieval cames are more durable because they contain as much as 30% copper, which reduces their flexibility, which in turn reduces the tendency to fatigue." ----------------------------------------------------------------- from "Conservation of Stained Glass in America" [1995, Art in Architecture Press] by Julie L. Sloan, available (blatant plug follows) from IGGA, most major art glass suppliers (like Ed Hoy and D&L Stained Glass), the Corning Museum of Glass and the Metropolitan Museum of Art. So, looking carefully at that last point, what might work best for you is a *different alloy of lead, one that includes at least 30% copper (ask for the specifications and constituent elements in "restoration came" from G.A. Avril Lead Products, PO Box 12050, Cincinnati OH 45212. Phone: (513) 731-5133. (800) 331- 9173. Fax: (513) 731-5135. Then you can shop around among the *other suppliers for the best price (which isn't to say that Avril's won't end up being the best, of course). "Pure lead," often hyped as the `best' lead to use, is best only for the *manufacturers of lead came, since they've removed all of the trace metals like copper, silver and so on, which they can then sell elsewhere at a profit. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 10:27:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKpmh-0000Kda; Sat, 18 May 96 10:27 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 13:27:11 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May18.92711.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-17 15:02:37 EDT, dloda@fbo.com (Dave Loda) writes: > About a month or so ago, I found glass@bungi and enjoyed >reading the give and take between readers. Now however it appears that >this site should be renamed glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com > I personally have found Albert Lewis' information quite helpful, and would like to thank him for his contribution to the list. As for the memo, I take from it what I want then hit delete, simple, painless. I haven't found my mailbox overflowing, and don't think it's really a problem any more than the discussion about it, I delete that too. J Farrington IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 11:26:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKqhJ-0000a2a; Sat, 18 May 96 11:25 PDT X-Path: selune.demon.co.uk!jc From: Jerry Cullingford To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 19:22:24 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <199605181822.TAA00199@gond.selune.demon.co.uk> References: <<199605180442.OAA10743@mail.mel.aone.net.au>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > 3. Would a no 6 tip be too cold? Is a no 7 a better option? Mine came with a no 7 tip, which seems to work OK for me. I guess it depends how fast you work, to some extent. I haven't had any trouble with foil lifting in the relatively small number of projects I've tried so far, but I can't say what would be likely to cause it :-). -Jerry ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 15:53:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKus9-0000bUa; Sat, 18 May 96 15:53 PDT X-Path: mbay.net!drno From: "Joseph D. Noble" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 15:53:16 -0700 Message-ID: <199605182253.PAA18238@otter.mbay.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >actually, you may want to check out your local drugstore film processing >service. CVS in the boston area provides a couple of interesting services >aside from one hour and one day processing. if you're willing to wait 3 days >and pay an extra 3 dollars, you can receive a floppy diskette with your >pictures in addition to to 2 copies of your prints. Sounds like a good service. Don't think the local ones here do it, but I bet one of the computer stores would do it for a fee I'm sure. >I have access to a scanner, but find this is a whole lot easier - painless, >in fact. I'm getting ready to put together my homepage, incorporating my 2 >loves - gardening and glass...and it's a whole lot easier to deal with >system ready prints. I'm planning on incorporating some of my student's work >in the home page (I teach about 40 students a term through an active adult >ed program and the exposure will be good for their morale/self image - the >town has a very active website that I'm going to link to so that my >student's neighbors can see their good work Please let me know the website address when you get it. DR NO Monterey, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 16:14:09 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKvC2-0000XLa; Sat, 18 May 96 16:13 PDT X-Path: interserv.com!ebsousa From: ebsousa@interserv.com To: Glass@bungi.com Subject: soldering irons Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 16:13:28 -0700 Message-ID: <199605182313.AA19536@relay.interserv.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Another soldering iron question. Since I have been operating under the apparently erroneous assumption that it was the wattage of the iron that determined how much heat it gave off, I would like to know what the significance of the number of watts is? How do I decide what wattage is appropriate or does it make no difference? Donna S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 18:14:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKx4G-0000lLa; Sat, 18 May 96 18:13 PDT X-Path: light.lightlink.com!sharrow From: "Ray Sharrow" To: Dave Loda , glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo (RANT!!) Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 20:57:57 +0000 Message-ID: <199605190113.VAA16269@light.lightlink.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > I guess you can add me to your list of meatheads who really have no > interest in receiving your newsletter. If I wanted it I would join your > IGGA. Nothing against you since I don't know you, but I really feel that > if someone is recruiting members for an association like yours, it should > be done either on your home page or one to one, not clogging up everyones > mailboxs. About a month or so ago, I found glass@bungi and enjoyed > reading the give and take between readers. Now however it appears that > this site should be renamed glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com THERE ARE NO MEATHEADS HERE. I couldn't disagree more. If Albert's "recruiting" ammounts to 5% of his total input, I would be VERY surprised. I don't see his comments as "glass according to...." at all. I see his comments more in the light of "Here is what I know, here is what I think and here are some resources that may have the info you really need." I don't know Albert either - other than from his posts here, which I enjoy. I read 8 newsgroups and mailing lists regularly. One has 100-150 new articles daily and a couple of others are in the 40-60 range. At the level of a dozen or so new posts a day,glass@bungi.com certainly does "not clogging up everyones > mailboxs" I think that I much prefer "glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com" to "RULESfortheINTERNETaccordingtoLODA@ego.com". Mailreading and newsreading programs are supplied with filter capabilities for the topics and/or writers that we would prefer to avoid or ignore. Deleting articles is our choice as well. The proprtion of usable info. is my primary reason for reading or deleting an article, writer or newsgroup. If you don't like the program, change the channel; if you don't like the food, go to a different restaurant. If you don't like part or all of a newsgroup or maillist, don't read it. As long as Albert can continue to provide his share of "the give and take between readers", we should be happy to have the choice of reading it or not. I for one prefer it to the meaningless flamewars and censorship spam that has begun to pervade many usenet and listserve groups. If it is pertinent to glass, I want it here - I can decide whether a writer or "guild" or any other source is worth my time. IF YOU LIKE IT, BUY IT. IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, DON'T BUY IT. BUT PLEASE REFRAIN FROM STIFLING ANYONE. ************************************************ ** ALL CATEGORICAL STATEMENTS ARE FALSE. ** ************************************************ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 18 19:27:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uKyD7-0000txa; Sat, 18 May 96 19:27 PDT X-Path: hooked.net!nsherman From: Neil Sherman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hot glass classes Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 19:24:03 -0700 Message-ID: <199605190227.TAA28085@mom.hooked.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >There's a pretty complete (but we're never sure, of course) list of glass >schools and workshops in IGGASCHO.TXT in the archive here. Check the IGGA >folder. > Sorry to ask a REALLY basic question, but how do I 'get' to this? Bonnie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 02:51:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uL58t-00018va; Sun, 19 May 96 02:51 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Hot glass classes Date: 19 May 96 05:50:13 EDT Message-ID: <1996May19.95013.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >There's a pretty complete (but we're never sure, of course) list of glass >schools and workshops in IGGASCHO.TXT in the archive here. Check the IGGA >folder. > >Sorry to ask a REALLY basic question, but how do I 'get' to this? Bonnie, Do you have access to the web? Here's how I do it: launch AOL, go internet, select FTP and enter "ftp.bungi.com" (without the quotes), click on okay and when the list appears, select the IGGA folder and the list of files appears. At that point, you can highlight IGGASCHO.TXT and click on download. Or I could email it to you. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 03:34:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uL5oa-0001BUa; Sun, 19 May 96 03:34 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: News memo (RANT) Date: 19 May 96 06:33:15 EDT Message-ID: <1996May19.103315.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I read 8 newsgroups and mailing lists regularly. One has 100-150 new >articles daily and a couple of others are in the 40-60 range. Wow. Are those *glass groups/lists, Ray? If so, I'd like to know where/what they are. Incidentally, thanks for the supportive comments. I/we are interested in passing along as much solid info as possible and try to keep our "recruiting" to a bare minimum; just a single line at the bottom pointing out that membership is available. It's true that membership dues underwrite the Guild's projects, but nobody's salaried or paid in any way/shape/form. I'm the only so-called "employee," but I'm a dollar-a-year man and after three years with the Guild have yet to see dollar one. What actually happens is that I shell out many shekels of my own every month, my wife's office underwrites all of the phone/online costs, plus most of the office supplies, and I spend 20-30 hours a week of my own time on Guild projects. Why? Habit: I've been doing this kind of thing (sharing of information on glass) since 1972. Why stop now? Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 06:29:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uL8Xt-0001H3a; Sun, 19 May 96 06:29 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com, Ray.Sharrow@lightlink.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo (RANT!!) Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 09:27:44 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May19.52744.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-18 21:14:40 EDT, Ray.Sharrow@lightlink.com (Ray Sharrow) writes: > I think that I much prefer "glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com" to >"RULESfortheINTERNETaccordingtoLODA@ego.com". Mailreading and >newsreading programs are supplied with filter capabilities for the topics >and/or >writers that we would prefer to avoid or ignore. Deleting articles is our >choice as >well. The proprtion of usable info. is my primary reason for reading or >deleting an >article, writer or newsgroup. > If you don't like the program, change the channel; if you don't like the >food, >go to a different restaurant. If you don't like part or all of a newsgroup or >maillist, >don't read it. As long as Albert can continue to provide his share of "the >give and > take between readers", we should be happy to have the choice of reading it >or not. >I for one prefer it to the meaningless flamewars and censorship spam that has > >begun to pervade many usenet and listserve groups. If it is pertinent to >glass, I >want it here - I can decide whether a writer or "guild" or any other source >is worth >my time. Good Letter!!! Janet Farrington IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 09:28:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLBLV-0000Rra; Sun, 19 May 96 09:28 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo (RANT!!) Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 17:20:36 +0000 Message-ID: <199605191635.RAA20329@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please, please, please. Can we have a little mderation somewhere! There seem to be a number of hot-heads out there (No, NOT MEATheads!!). First of all, we're all mature adults, secondly were artists; thirdly we're on the NET; fourthly each and all of us have a lot to "say". (Points 1-4 not necessarily in the correct order...) ALL of us are joined together by "stained glass", from every corner on the Globe. Spinning dog hair, shearing sheep, dad's old tools, the weather and national border guards have nothing to do with stained glass either... Yet, it adds to the colour of our Group, is part and parcel of "fleshing out" a name at the bottom of a message. It certainly puts a smile on my face, as I go about my solitary occupation of earning my living from stained glass. I for one am always pleased to have the opportunity to get to know the person behind the name. So what's all this "huff & puff" about Albert?? Have any of you young "hotheads" any notion about just how valuable his contributions are! Or do you really know it ALL??. I for one subscribe humbly to the philosophy of "the more I know, I also know, how little I know...." Albert has a vast well of resources available that he is sharing with us at a push of a button, served up in a very gentle way, with a great touch of humour and good common sense. He has gone through all the right channels, done all the right sensible things; we've even "voted" on it; all you need to do is to say "yea" or "nay", without additional "steam". I for one found the whole (quite lengthy) discussion on "copyright" very pertinent to my own business. I also found the exchange about old Louis Tiffany most interesting (even though I don't make Tiffany lamps). There are many such examples; ALL of them very relevant to (yes, you got it) stained glass.... Yours is the choice of using your computer to select, delete, filter and so on (thank you, for your wise words Ray Sharrow). When I have learnt to get the hang of it myself, I will do the same - no doubt. In the meantime, I cannot use my lack of computer knowledge as a weapon to try and stop the flow (or over-flow, as the case may be). This IS supposed to be a discussion group. If we all agreed, there wouldn't BE a discussion. So have a beer, cool down and let's put the fun back into the proceedings (and a tiny bit of compassion with each other). Let's argue with our heads and not with our emotions.... Sorry if I sound like "Old Great-Auntie Jane" from across "The Pond". Elisabeth 'n Toby P.S. Steve Anthony: Tried to e-mail you. WEB-site you picked up about was my own, see below for details.. Karin: Loved the maggots & herring. Will reply direct. Jenny Cullingford in UK: where abouts are you?? Albert: Thanks for comments. appreciated! Folks in New Zeeland: Thanks. Will reply direct. ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 12:06:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLDo1-0001Haa; Sun, 19 May 96 12:06 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: Hot glass classes Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 13:43:26 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May19.94326.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4594.961BC7E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just so bonnie doesn't feel alone in asking stupid questions... What if I dont subscribe to aol? Thanks in advance! BTW as soon as I get some spare shekels myself I plan on becoming an IGGA member. Keep up the great work. KT ---------- From: Albert Lewis [IGGA][SMTP:70544.3642@CompuServe.COM] Sent: Sunday, May 19, 1996 5:50 AM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Hot glass classes > >There's a pretty complete (but we're never sure, of course) list of glass >schools and workshops in IGGASCHO.TXT in the archive here. Check the IGGA >folder. > >Sorry to ask a REALLY basic question, but how do I 'get' to this? Bonnie, Do you have access to the web? Here's how I do it: launch AOL, go internet, select FTP and enter "ftp.bungi.com" (without the quotes), click on okay and when the list appears, select the IGGA folder and the list of files appears. At that point, you can highlight IGGASCHO.TXT and click on download. Or I could email it to you. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4594.961BC7E0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IhATAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAWAAAAUkU6IEhvdCBnbGFzcyBjbGFzc2VzAGQHAQWA AwAOAAAAzAcFABMADQArABoAAAA9AQEggAMADgAAAMwHBQATAA0AGwArAAAAPgEBCYABACEAAAA2 NEYxODBBNzcxQjFDRjExQURGNDQ0NDU1MzU0MDAwMADoBgEDkAYARAYAABIAAAALACMAAAAAAAMA JgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADADYAAAAAAEAAOQBgPiOvqkW7AR4AcAABAAAAFgAAAFJFOiBIb3QgZ2xh c3MgY2xhc3NlcwAAAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG7Raqu2KeA8WWxcRHPrfRERVNUAAAAAB4AHgwBAAAA BQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAWAAAAY2xhbWJlcnRAbW9ubW91dGguY29tAAAAAwAGEN0cdZsD AAcQwAMAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAEpVU1RTT0JPTk5JRURPRVNOVEZFRUxBTE9ORUlOQVNLSU5HU1RV UElEUVVFU1RJT05TV0hBVElGSURPTlRTVUJTQ1JJQkVUT0FPTD9USEFOS1NJTkFEVkFOQ0VCVFdB U1NPT04AAAAAAgEJEAEAAADFBAAAwQQAAHwIAABMWkZ1VpPQLP8ACgEPAhUCqAXrAoMAUALyCQIA Y2gKwHNldDI3BgAGwwKDMgPFAgBwckJxEeJzdGVtAoMzdwLkBxMCgH0KgAjPCdk78RYPMjU1AoAK gQ2xC2DgbmcxMDMUUAsKFFFFC/JjAEAgSnUTwCAoc28gBuBuAwBlIKRkbweQbicFQGYJ4D8DIAdA AiAbwAuAHKBzawULgGcbMHR1cGlkLCBxClATwGkCIHMuOR6wIFcRgAVABpAgSacb0QIwGzB1YgTy YhvAqnQbUGEG8D8KhVQRgExuawQgHRJkdgBwY4BlISAgQlRXHTHvGzECICLSH3BnEcAbMQeAxxsw CrEkIWhlaxyABCD+bROwHIAfUgtRA6AjMSBQDQWgbR1yA5FJR0dBlyUQE+AgUHIe0CBLCeD8cCAd 0CBwJLAjoBYQHxGSdwWway4KhUtUCoVBCotsaTE4MALRafAtMTQ0DfAM0CuzC1lcMTYKoANgE9Bj BUAtXy3XCocsiwwwLVZGA2E6by7eLVYMghSwbCdxBUBMEwfQBAAgWybyXVtTgE1UUDo3MDUrwEAu MzY0MkAIUG0EcHUGYXZlLkNP/E1dLn8vjQZgAjAwvzHLgFN1bmRheSwF0DE6ICAxOTpAOqA5NqAg NTo1MBSwTTXP2S+NVG84DzHLZwtgBBDEQGI58GdpLiZRO687Nt4f8GotkT3PMctSZc1DAEgtcD+U IGM/sgeQfynfKuM0gCxXGkUtVgqFPqdJNiFgBJBlJwQgYSWgfxYQAkA6gCZRC1ARwBvAKP9AACjR SnAkcRzgNVAFwB/gexYQOkBvH1AFoAhwEbApfiArEBsRTUE/o0k2BPBoPyMgJPEAcB4AKPIkoG9w AyGzJvJTQ0hPLlS8WFQdAihSCsARcGk1UJYgSkInoUMksGNrKEN3JvJJNgIQbASBKTZJp1M9BbBy OoAggh1QSqFSRTBBTExZG2AdQGljfx4XOkBL4k9gB+Ab4B9hJ30jsScgcihQBAAg5gqFQtUbgyxG PEQbUHkIYFKA/mFSYQDQIlAEEVljG8BMIPRiPyKASEpUWHIfch0An0LxC2A58BFwFLBPTDpA/mde 8QIwBJERwDpACoUlQV8wMzPwT7M30UyxIgGAcPouQAciS8AD8ChQCGAFQOcoUh4gLXFzKTpARcBX YHNTQCMxb2s6cU/CCoV3xySwUbRN82FwcCiwEaD/OkBhVVNmHFBUc0+zZudNQb8rgEuASpFnhCk2 CoVBZBK5HxFwb2BBOkBcQmMDkflSQGdoKxBtwAVAUNtPwnNlBxvgd24VoCIAa01P/wXAH3BNcVSA YjAAwAMRXxBnIHJcQR7QPGdJpnOuX390v3XPdkVzT3e0Mpt3uUXOeAWQS/BSUkRpFhAtoPcFsHdf e8RJYFMfEB5xB0C4IEd1AxAeAE1BR0Vz3wcQHmATwGfRfNBjKTZzv9+A74H/duwKhS45RgWxH+X/ BTAecUWwIXEjsGfRS3EdQN8bwHITIIBDAD+jLRYQHiP/P/89oGFBaYJdVE3yOkB/0/+Gvz+/a/NS JEqRIiADEAGgD0uAHKBYUQJAcDovL/Z3j2Bi6C9OekY/R09IXwsKshUxAJSwAAAAAwAQEAAAAAAD ABEQAAAAAEAABzCALgZ9qEW7AUAACDCALgZ9qEW7AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAAX+U= ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4594.961BC7E0-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 12:49:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLETr-0000cMa; Sun, 19 May 96 12:49 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Hot glass classes Date: 19 May 96 15:48:26 EDT Message-ID: <1996May19.194826.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Just so bonnie doesn't feel alone in asking stupid questions... What if I >dont subscribe to aol? >Thanks in advance! BTW as soon as I get some spare shekels myself I plan >on becoming an IGGA member. Keep up the great work. KT Uh. I just told you how *I do it ... and I can't do it from here, 'cause I subscribe to CompuServe at home and my Windows reader is "broken." (I use an offline reader called TapCIS to do this sort of reading/writing.) But at work I have both CompuServe *and AOL ... and I get to the ftp at bungi.com the way I described. I really can't say what other ways there are to reach the ftp, but hopefully one of the Rands will jump in and explain them if they exist. But I can send any of the IGGA files to you directly by attaching them to (or including them *within) email to you ... and I'm glad to do it again and again for as many individuals who want the info. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ P.S. By the way, what's that big encrypted passage at the end of your message? A PGP signature? ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 13:08:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLElp-0000nIa; Sun, 19 May 96 13:08 PDT X-Path: vkm.com!ABBES From: Steve Abbe To: GLASS%BUNGI.COM@vkm.com Subject: Schlitz studio/furnaces Glass sale Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 14:04:00 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <01I4W7CW7DEU0021ZY@mr.vkm.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Quick introduction, Steve Abbe, hobbist for fourteen years, starting to sell as a professional this year. now for the real news. Albert Lewis Sent (for Gerry): >I received a brochure in today's mail, and thought it might be of interest to >some of our members in this section. > >From: Schlitz Studios/ > Schlitz Furnaces > 245 N. Water Street > Milwaukee, WI 53202 > (414) 277-0742 > (414) 277-0505 FAX > > We're moving! > > - And we don't want to move all this glass! > We have 25 years of glass stashing > All hand picked. All glass for sale!! > For more information call.. (see numbers above) > > Sounds like there may be some real bargains to be had.. makes me wish I >weren't 2,000 miles away! Anyone who's in the area, and visits, please fill >us in here on the Forum. Peace -Gerry > Well I called and setup an appointment to visit the shop. (I live in Chicago area). Here is the details. The sale is open to the public starting June 10-22, though they did not have a problem with me making an appointment to come up early. REGARDLESS one should probably call first before one goes there (just to be nice) almost all the glass is tiffany style or reproduction opal. they are selling GLASS 23,000 pounds of Schlitz for $8.25/lb 10,800 pounds of old Uroboros for $7.25/lb - this glass is hard to come by, and worth seeing 2,700 pounds of Youghioney $4.50/lb 7,200 pounds of Oceana $4.50/lb 24,000 pounds of Kokomo $4.25/lb 7,800 pounds of Lins $4.50/lb - owner said this was the best buy 5,700 pounds of early 1900 glass $4.50/lb - actual antique glass good for restoration (you will have to subtract a few pounds that I and some others have already purchased) Jewels $3.50 each Dragonfly Pinched squares circles all jewels for tiffany projects ALSO $50.00 for Schiltz scrap Boxes These prices by my calculation are at or below wholesale. THESE PRICES WERE TAKEN FROM THE OWNERS FLYER, THEY ARE TO MY KNOWLEDGE ACURATE, HOWEVER ONE SHOULD VERIFY THEM WITH THE SELLER. ALSO I mentioned to the owner where I got the information for the sale (internet) and that I would report back. THEY ASKED ME TO MENTION THAT THIS IS NOT A GOING OUT OF BUSINESS SALE BUT A MOVING SALE. (I guess some people got confused about that) The onwer is looking to remove inventory and increase captial for the impending move. Now for my personal impressions. I must admit when I got there I was completely overwelmed with the selection of glass available. (It probably did not help that I had no projects in mind before I went) I probably wasted 15 minutes wondering where to start (chalk that up to being a novice) I spent 2 1/2 hours looking through the racks just picking glass that I liked. I could have spent many more hours picking out glass, alas the budget would not allow for more. If you go plan to spend at least 3 hours to look through everything. Unfortunately I did not get to the schlitz glass racks. The staff was curteous and helpful. The owner was very cordial, even when I started to leave without paying. (got too excited about the new glass) Overall, It was a good experience and I would encourage whoever is in the area to go and take advantage of the sale, it will help you and them. Oh yes, wear clothes you dont mind getting dirty, as this is a studio and some of the racks were dusty. (don't let that daunt you) That is it. Thanks for reading Steve Abbe P.S. If anyone has a account on compuserve could you cross post, I do not have access. (newsgroups too, if you can think of any) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 14:26:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLFyP-0001FIa; Sun, 19 May 96 14:25 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Schlitz studio/furnaces Date: 19 May 96 17:23:54 EDT Message-ID: <1996May19.212354.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Good report, Steve. I'll crosspost it to the Handcrafts/Glass section on CompuServe, where I'm a TechSupp (although they've never defined the job) Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 16:48:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLICc-000162a; Sun, 19 May 96 16:47 PDT X-Path: light.lightlink.com!sharrow From: "Ray Sharrow" To: 70544.3642@CompuServe.COM Subject: Re: Listserve & Usenet groups Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 19:31:52 +0000 Message-ID: <199605192347.TAA03503@light.lightlink.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > >I read 8 newsgroups and mailing lists regularly. One has 100-150 new > >articles daily and a couple of others are in the 40-60 range. > > Wow. Are those *glass groups/lists, Ray? > If so, I'd like to know where/what they are. > Sorry, this is the only glass oriented group I've found so far; I'd love to find others. I regularly read groups about anything from collegeiate and pro. sports to support groups for the depressed and for ex-smokers. This is consistently the most "civilized", which is probably why I reacted (over-reacted?) to the suggestion that anyone's contributions here have been out of order. Sorry if I've contributed to the HEAT - better to just focus the LIGHT. ************************************************ ** ALL CATEGORICAL STATEMENTS ARE FALSE. ** ************************************************ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 19 21:44:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLMox-0001Fna; Sun, 19 May 96 21:43 PDT X-Path: sprynet.com!glassy From: glassy@sprynet.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: favorite tool Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 21:44:23 -0700 Message-ID: <199605200444.VAA00995@m2.sprynet.com> References: <<199605161109.HAA05339@brutus.bright.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Speaking of favorite tools, I really like my Ringstar. I'm able to make some really difficult cuts with it, and have ended up saving a lot of glass by using it! I also too love my strip cutter! Debby ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 02:29:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLRGv-0000Yfa; Mon, 20 May 96 02:29 PDT X-Path: aristotle.net!rwsmith From: Rebecca Smith To: glass@bungi.com Subject: IGGA Memo Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 12:38:44 -0500 Message-ID: <2.2.16.19960519113649.248777b0@aristotle.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi all: I for one have found the information we receive from Albert and the Guild, Howard and his expertise, and Glenna with her patience and all the other wonderful folks out there with KNOWLEDGE to share, which I find to be very valuable. Since we are supposed to be mature adults why don't we just ignore the rantings of people who care not to become informed or who care not to enjoy the art and all it's trappings, whatever they may be. So lets all get back to the good stuff!!!!!!!!! Hooray for Glenna, Howard, Albert and all the rest of our wonderful artisians. Rebecca Smith (rwsmith@aristotle.net) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 07:44:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLWBj-00017da; Mon, 20 May 96 07:43 PDT X-Path: atlas.na.informix.com!marissat From: Marissa Toghyani To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo (RANT!!) Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 09:44:13 -0700 Message-ID: <199605201446.JAA27051@informixs-bh.na.informix.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 05:20 PM 5/19/96 +0000, you wrote: >Please, please, please. Can we have a little mderation somewhere! >There seem to be a number of hot-heads out there (No, NOT >MEATheads!!). The extra email from Albert doesn't bother me. I can delete it without opening it if I want - The subject section says "IGGA whatever". If I unsubscribe from this group it will not be because of the extra email from Albert (or anyone else) asking questions or providing info, it will be because of all the extra email from folks bickering and name calling. I spend much more time weeding through the mail that provides no usefull info (just someones opinions about something that has no direct connection to glass) than I would deleting a newsletter that I didn't want to read. I suggest that if anyone wants to blow off steam that they put the phrase "just bitching" in the subject section so that the rest of us who aren't interested can just delete it. Yes, with writing this letter I have become guilty of the very thing that I am complaining about. Please excuse me. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 08:24:37 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLWoE-0000rXa; Mon, 20 May 96 08:23 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Just Bi***ing Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 11:24:15 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May20.72415.0> References: <<199605201446.JAA27051@informixs-bh.na.informix.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Marissa Toghyani wrote: > >if anyone wants to blow off steam that they put the phrase > "just bitching" in the subject section so that the rest of us who aren't > interested can just delete it. Yes, with writing this letter I have become > guilty of the very thing that I am complaining about. Please excuse me. > Excellent idea. I, too, have considered dropping the list. It was quite enjoyable until about two months ago. I think if we all agree to include some comment in the subject bar like that above or 'off subject', which is used on other lists that I subscribe to, things would be better. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 10:00:41 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLYJU-0000hNa; Mon, 20 May 96 10:00 PDT X-Path: pilot.msu.edu!rosochac From: "Lisa Anne Rosochacki" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:59:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605201659.MAA94972@pilot08.cl.msu.edu> References: <<199605180442.OAA10743@mail.mel.aone.net.au>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > This is an old message, but I just purchased one of these irons and need > some advice. I had a 80 watt iron that I used for came work, and I thought > I would indulge myself with a qality iron for came and foil (which I > wanted to try). > > I cut my glass, cleaned it (in water with detergent and then rinsed > thoroughly), dried it, foiled it. > > When it came to soldering, I noticed that the foil lifted in places. If I > pressed it down after removing iron, it seems to have 'stuck' again. I am > typing this several days after the exercise and it still seems 'stuck'. > > My questions are: > > 1. Should I not clean the glass the way I did? Cleaning the glass is good, it helps remove any glass dust from grinding and any cutter oil that might be on the glass. the key would be to make sure that all of the detergent was rinsed from the glass, becasue that would interfere with the adherance of the foil...and it sounds like you rinsed it well. > > 2. The Weller tip is a no 8, which I think is an 800F tip. Is this too hot > for foil? Even if I was tinning the copper foil and moving very quickly, > the foil still seemed to lift. If the tip that you ahve says 8 on the bottom (the portion that fits into the iron handle) then you ahve an 800 degree tip and I would recoomend going to a 7. Most people work comfortably at 700 degrees, if you want to move faster then go to the 8. 6's are going to allow you to move slower and are usually only for decorative type soldering. > > 3. Would a no 6 tip be too cold? Is a no 7 a better option? > (see last comment) My suggestion would be to try the 700 degree tip. What is probably happening is that you are working at a slow enough speed with the 800 degree tip that it's allowing the glue on the foil to heat up and come loose, then as you move the iron and the hot solder flows, it pulls the foil up with it. see if that helps at all. Lisa R ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 10:09:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLYRy-0000pDa; Mon, 20 May 96 10:08 PDT X-Path: avery.med.virginia.edu!lbl From: Laurie Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Please unsubscribe Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 12:37:14 -0400 Message-ID: <199605201637.MAA152033@avery.med.Virginia.EDU> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please unsubscribe me; I find I'm not getting much out of the list anymore. Thanks. Laurie Hall E-mail: lbl@virginia.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 11:30:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLZiJ-0001AFa; Mon, 20 May 96 11:29 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Mon May 20 11:29:44 1996 Message-ID: <96May20.112214-0700pdt.268145-16414+523@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk To whomever wrote the note below: Don't give up. We've all been there at one time or another. Best thing to do is to temporarily walk away, before you kill your project. Doing stained glass will hopefuly eventually teach you patience. Learning stained glass is one of those crafts that you really have learn as you get more comfortable with the medium. Having someone always telling doesn't seem to help. You have to make those mistakes, frustrating as they are. Actually, I had a real good laugh when I read the note, because I could relate to you. Honestly, I've felt exactly that way with my computer when it acts up. I'd like to smack it (the monitor), like that would really help. Karin >In a message dated 96-05-16 23:06:24 EDT, you write: > >>Then I start soldering. >> >>Everything goes wrong. The bead is too thin, too thick. My solder puddles >>out and sticks to the glass. Pieces of it spit out and sting my arm. My >>hand shakes. The bead looks terrible! I go over it again and it slips >>through to the back. I'm ready to throw my project on the ground and stomp >>on it. > >Karen, I use a 60/40 solder and I do not solder it flat before running a >bead. Also, I always solder the back side of the piece first, it doesn't >really matter if a little goes through it will clean up when you do the other >side. > >Are you using a temp. control. Possibly you have it set a little too hot if >you are having real problems with you solder running through. It definately >takes practice, but don't get frustrated it will come. > >If the solder is running off and sticking to the glass, you probably don't >have it fluxed properly. Too little it runs off, too much it spits. I like >to use Classic 100 gel flux. It stays where you put it and it won't spit at >you. I aply it with a flux and patina brush, but I cut the bristles shorter >so that I have more control. > >Practise is the key. Don't give up!!! Hope this helps. > >Janet >IMN2GLASS@aol.com > > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 12:31:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLafU-0001GYa; Mon, 20 May 96 12:31 PDT X-Path: internexus.net!lwaldeck From: Lew Waldeck To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pictures Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 15:18:20 -0700 Message-ID: <1996May20.81820.0> References: <<199605182253.PAA18238@otter.mbay.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Speak For Yourself Precedence: bulk > CVS in the boston area provides a couple of interesting services > >aside from one hour and one day processing. if you're willing to wait 3 days > >and pay an extra 3 dollars, you can receive a floppy diskette with your > >pictures in addition to to 2 copies of your prints. > > Sounds like a good service. Don't think the local ones here do it, but I > bet one of the computer stores would do it for a fee I'm sure. > Seattle Film Works does this for a $4 additional charge with regular processing. They'll send you a free roll of film if you make contact with them either on the web at http://www.filmworks.com or by mail at: SFW 1260 16th Ave. West Seattle, WA 98119 (206)283-9074 They will also send yiou the files on the web so you don't have to wait for the mail. Processing is above average. Mary Waldeck > -- Lew Waldeck (lwaldeck@internexus.net) Power!... Power comes in two forms: Organized money and organized people. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 16:23:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLeHZ-0001Gda; Mon, 20 May 96 16:22 PDT X-Path: aol.com!FStryczek From: FStryczek@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 19:22:11 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May20.152211.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I've been using this same kind of light box for about the last 6 years, but mine is much smaller (30"X36"). The incandescent bulbs are almost mandatory if you are building a tiffany lamp. Most stained glass studios here in the Chicago area thought I was nuts for "staring into a box of light bulbs", but the finished product is well worth it. I am in my thrid year of work on a 22" Tiffany Wisteria-Laburnum, with 1,986 pieces. I've been using Youghiougheny Stipple exclusively in it. (Alas, I digress.) To help ease the eye strain of looking at bare light bulbs for any length of time, I use pieces of cardboard cut into various shapes to shield my eyes from the un-used spaces on the glass table top. After working on my project for an hour or two, I like to step back a few feet from the project (still on the light box), and look at it from different angles. With glass such as Stipple, it will look different from different angles. Try to look at it from the angle it will be viewed from when finished (from the top of the lamp, etc) - it makes a big difference! Best wishes in your project. Frank Stryczek, Jr. Des Plaines, Illinois ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 18:45:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLgW0-0000n2a; Mon, 20 May 96 18:45 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 20:14:10 -0500 Message-ID: <199605210114.UAA02404@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 10:50 PM 5/16/96 -0400, you wrote: >Hello, I'm new to Stained Glass art. I was hoping I could find a computer >software program to aid in pattern creation. Does anyone have any >suggestions? Thank you! > >Karen >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > I originally went to art school for vissual communications. I still like to do my drawing but the commputer is so much handier for alot of things. My husband bought me Corel Draw several years ago. We have version 3 but they now make a version 6 that does alot more. This is an expensive program but it does alot. This is what I use to design my stained glass patterns. Somethimes the clip-art helps with drawing what I need without alot of work. If you can find someone near you who has it I suggest going over and giving it a try. If you find something better, let me know. Joy joyhall@peoples.net ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 18:46:14 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLgWC-0001GAa; Mon, 20 May 96 18:45 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 20:14:12 -0500 Message-ID: <199605210114.UAA02407@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 08:02 PM 5/16/96 -0700, you wrote: >I like everything about doing glass. I like designing a pattern, picking >the glass, cutting it, grinding and foiling it. I even like burnishing the >foil down. > >Then I start soldering. > >Everything goes wrong. The bead is too thin, too thick. My solder puddles >out and sticks to the glass. Pieces of it spit out and sting my arm. My >hand shakes. The bead looks terrible! I go over it again and it slips >through to the back. I'm ready to throw my project on the ground and stomp >on it. > >I realize everone has their own favorite way to solder, but since I hate >everything I've tried so far, any suggestions about soldering technique >would be helpful. > >(I'm using 7/32" copper foil, a water-base gel flux, 50/50 solder, and a 100 >watt iron without a rheostat. I flat solder before trying to get a nice >bead and then the problems start!) > >Thanks, > >Bonnie (who gave up soldering for the night and is watching tv for a change >instead) > > Bonnie, I would suggest using 60/40 solder and turning your iron down as low as it will go and still melt the solder. This will prevent the solder from melting and going all the way through the glass pieces. This should be make things easier. I alot of times have moments when things go bad. Then I have to walk away for awhile and come back another day to work on my project. Also try relaxing. Being tense will make it harder to get a good bead of solder. Good Luck, Joy Hall >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 20 19:38:38 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLhKv-00014Ma; Mon, 20 May 96 19:38 PDT X-Path: highlander.cbnet.ns.ca!jcunning From: jcunning@highlander.cbnet.ns.ca (Joanie Cunningham) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 23:40:52 +0400 Message-ID: <199605201940.XAA07360@highlander> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I like everything about doing glass. I like designing a pattern, picking >the glass, cutting it, grinding and foiling it. I even like burnishing the >foil down. > >Then I start soldering. > >Everything goes wrong. The bead is too thin, too thick. My solder puddles >out and sticks to the glass. Pieces of it spit out and sting my arm. My >hand shakes. The bead looks terrible! I go over it again and it slips >through to the back. I'm ready to throw my project on the ground and stomp >on it. > >I realize everone has their own favorite way to solder, but since I hate >everything I've tried so far, any suggestions about soldering technique >would be helpful. > >(I'm using 7/32" copper foil, a water-base gel flux, 50/50 solder, and a 100 >watt iron without a rheostat. I flat solder before trying to get a nice >bead and then the problems start!) > >Thanks, > >Bonnie (who gave up soldering for the night and is watching tv for a change >instead) > Hey Bonnie I have a quick tip that you might find usefull. If your solder continues to melt through to the other side try wetting an old towel (more damp than wet) and place it under the glass and solder seam that you are working on. The towel will act as a cooling system and keep the solder from running through. Good luck with your project. Joanie Cunningham Check out my web page - http://mfusion.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 03:30:56 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLohC-0000RQa; Tue, 21 May 96 03:29 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: 21 May 96 06:28:29 EDT Message-ID: <1996May21.102829.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joy I agree that CorelDraw's a powerful tool. I use it every day, all day long (although not for stained glass design) ... one word of caution: since I visit the Corel forum on CompuServe every day, too, you should be aware that CorelDraw 6 is "buggy" and Corel's not a company known for its caring attitude toward its customers. I recommend CorelDraw 3 or 4, which are both being offered *very *cheaply by a wide variety of sources. In a year or so, the "fixes" for CorelDraw 6 will be out and *then it'll be smart to get it. (I just got the fixes for CD4 this past week!) Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 08:50:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLtgN-0000Noa; Tue, 21 May 96 08:49 PDT X-Path: peoples.net!joyhall From: Joy Hall To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 10:17:40 -0500 Message-ID: <199605211517.KAA24050@peoples1.peoples.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 06:28 AM 5/21/96 EDT, you wrote: > >Joy > >I agree that CorelDraw's a powerful tool. I use it every day, all day long >(although not for stained glass design) ... one word of caution: since I visit >the Corel forum on CompuServe every day, too, you should be aware that CorelDraw >6 is "buggy" and Corel's not a company known for its caring attitude toward its >customers. > >I recommend CorelDraw 3 or 4, which are both being offered *very *cheaply by a >wide variety of sources. > >In a year or so, the "fixes" for CorelDraw 6 will be out and *then it'll be >smart to get it. (I just got the fixes for CD4 this past week!) > >Albert > > Albert, What have you heard about version 5? The reason we bought Corel Draw in the first place was to design my own note cards. I wanted version 6 because is would allow me to make my note cards look like I used charcoal, pastels or pencil. Stained Glass is new for me. I have only done it since last July. Naturally I don't have the patterns I want so I make my own. Joy Hall joyhall@peoples.net ---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 09:28:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLuGb-00018ra; Tue, 21 May 96 09:26 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: 21 May 96 12:24:35 EDT Message-ID: <1996May21.162435.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >What have you heard about version 5? The reason we bought Corel Draw in >the first place was to design my own note cards. I wanted version 6 >because is would allow me to make my note cards look like I used >charcoal, pastels or pencil. Stained Glass is new for me. I have only >done it since last July. Naturally I don't have the patterns I want so I >make my own. Joy Making your own patterns? Bully for you! (as Teddy Roosevelt was wont to say). I've heard good things about CD5, but haven't upgraded yet myself. Have fun with it! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 12:24:54 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLx1t-0000kSa; Tue, 21 May 96 12:23 PDT X-Path: aol.com!BarbaraBGS From: BarbaraBGS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Web pages Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 15:23:07 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May21.11237.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Would anyone be terrible distraught if I asked for advice on creating a web page? I'd like to start selling some wares on the net, but frankly I haven't a clue as to how to create a page or who to contact to do it for me. What's a "good rate" for providing the design and/or hosting the site? Are things selling on the net? Is it a good place to be, i.e. is it cost-effective? I've noticed quite a few of you have pages and I'm hoping you can provide some insight. Thanks. Barbara Breckenridge Glass Studio ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 12:30:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLx7M-0001C4a; Tue, 21 May 96 12:29 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: New kid on the block Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 15:28:04 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May21.11284.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB472A.2453F0A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just called and got some really reasonable price quotes for coreldraw = 4... How user friendly is it? I am still pretty new at this whole = computer thing and dont want to get way in over my head... Katie ---------- From: Albert Lewis [IGGA][SMTP:70544.3642@CompuServe.COM] Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 1996 12:24 PM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block >What have you heard about version 5? The reason we bought Corel = Draw in >the first place was to design my own note cards. I wanted version 6 >because is would allow me to make my note cards look like I used >charcoal, pastels or pencil. Stained Glass is new for me. I have = only >done it since last July. Naturally I don't have the patterns I want = so I >make my own. Joy Making your own patterns? Bully for you! (as Teddy Roosevelt was wont to = say). I've heard good things about CD5, but haven't upgraded yet myself. Have = fun with it! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB472A.2453F0A0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IhQTAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAZAAAAUkU6IE5ldyBraWQgb24gdGhlIGJsb2NrAPwH AQWAAwAOAAAAzAcFABUADwAcAAQAAgAeAQEggAMADgAAAMwHBQAVAA8AGgAOAAIAJgEBCYABACEA AABBNjkyNzJENzFDQjNDRjExQURGNDQ0NDU1MzU0MDAwMAD7BgEDkAYA1AUAABIAAAALACMAAAAA AAMAJgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADADYAAAAAAEAAOQDgNd+hS0e7AR4AcAABAAAAGQAAAFJFOiBOZXcg a2lkIG9uIHRoZSBibG9jawAAAAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABu0dLoaPXcpKnsxwRz630REVTVAAAAAAe AB4MAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAFgAAAGNsYW1iZXJ0QG1vbm1vdXRoLmNvbQAAAAMA BhBn5RhyAwAHEFoDAAAeAAgQAQAAAGUAAABJSlVTVENBTExFREFOREdPVFNPTUVSRUFMTFlSRUFT T05BQkxFUFJJQ0VRVU9URVNGT1JDT1JFTERSQVc0SE9XVVNFUkZSSUVORExZSVNJVD9JQU1TVElM TFBSRVRUWU5FV0FUAAAAAAIBCRABAAAAVAQAAFAEAABKBwAATFpGdeHByxj/AAoBDwIVAqgF6wKD AFAC8gkCAGNoCsBzZXQyNwYABsMCgzIDxQIAcHJCcRHic3RlbQKDM3cC5AcTAoB9CoAIzwnZO/EW DzI1NQKACoENsQtg4G5nMTAzFFALChRRBQvyYwBAIEkganWpE8AgYwdAbAmAIABwKRuwZ28FQHMD cGUg2xYQG3F5HJIcUG4BoBuQkiATUGljHIBxdRwgDweRAhAFwAWhZWxkchJhB+A0Lh+AIEhv/wfg GyAEkB6ACIEb4BzhBACRINB0PyAa4WFtHEBedAMQAyATUBHAdBzwbiUH0WEFQHRoIOF3aMcG8ByA BaBtcHUT0AXA9yLxGRAbw2QCISMwAHAi0T5vHAARwCURIMEDoG921SAhbRzwaBywZB+BCoUeSyLA CJAKhQqLbGkxBDgwAtFpLTE0NM8N8AzQKeMLWTE2CqADYPUT0GMFQC0sBwqHKrsMMPUrhkYDYTot DiuGDIIUsGxsYgSQBUBMB9Ag4VsASUdHQV1bU01AVFA6NzA1KfAu4DM2NDJACFAjwQZhwSZgLkNP TV0sry29LwZgAjAu7y/7VApQc2RNJfAsBdAl8TIxOIAxCDk5NjkQMjoyNJggUE0z/y29VG82P40v +2cLYAQQQGJ1GRAcaS4joTn/NQ51YmpnK8E8Hy/7UmVBUAfCaz5pG7ACICLhHIACYG9j/msoDykT MrAqhxpFK4YKhXlIET5XEYAFQBGAJmAgfnkIYCbCCyAbwAbgI+Ag1yZhAJBD8TUhMVREMR0U5yMw REEIYGdoBUAIUB7x/CBEHzILgEe5RCIpsBGg/wVAC1Ed8SUgBCAlcQ2wAJDeZwOgJqEf0AOgbh5B G1F9CyBzH6Aa4SUiG6FKBjbfR7kw4BtgIAEg0ncIYB8QvxvAG4Af0RxxJXEAwGscgEsmoU/oIBWg b2tVcGn3VHEa8CABZEe5EXIFoAdAtziACrATwWwEIAWxcAnwdmMDEFCBUwGQC4AboUf/PgIg0iKC HpIHgFCDSLMCIP8c4Ee5JNFS4RwxC4Ad8T4B1QVASlNQeR+gTiLACHD3HMMa8CTRJ0iVRCIKsAJA /wSRBCBQtBxBGuBHuVRWT6HzJzYKhUpvW5YKhTigQ7C/JGFJAQXAT6JfliEwQlNQRxzhHpJJASEg KE6hVG0JgGQc8AgAbxGwJmBsVyUCUxIlRHMl8CknNkn+J0jRSUQcEARwJCQEIEmkeENENTiAPlBI lF7Cde5wCcAm8BuheSWxJqARsOxsZh+hSMJmPmAjMCEQ9mgKhSEQIUS8MMREvCxp+kYFsXNA8AT0 SkIRcRkQ/weQV7EbkB0wVIELcAMgJXC7QVA98y0WEB4gB5B0Pk//O/AcQCCBJWJEIilAE8A4gP93 s3OfPg9vw1dgIwAmYGrRHnZ0ER1zSIICQHA6L9Qvd3xALj5XL3kTRLwvRS9GP0dMFTEAgZADABAQ AAAAAAMAERAAAAAAQAAHMEBuZWBLR7sBQAAIMEBuZWBLR7sBHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAC3 uw== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB472A.2453F0A0-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 14:09:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uLyfN-00019Ba; Tue, 21 May 96 14:08 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: soldering Date: Tue, 21 May 96 14:03:29 -0500 Message-ID: <199605212108.OAA05116@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- to Joy, Joanie and the list. Not sure if this is going through...a test. if it comes back or gets acknowledged, I will expound in detail on soldering. Enjoy..H -- new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 18:26:36 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM2fk-0001Eba; Tue, 21 May 96 18:25 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Tue, 21 May 96 12:15:59 Message-ID: <199605220124.LAA03772@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199605201659.MAA94972@pilot08.cl.msu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199605201659.MAA94972@pilot08.cl.msu.edu>, on 05/20/96 at 12:59 PM, "Lisa Anne Rosochacki" said: >My suggestion would be to try the 700 degree tip. What is probably >happening is that you are working at a slow enough speed with the 800 >degree tip that it's allowing the glue on the foil to heat up and come >loose, then as you move the iron and the hot solder flows, it pulls the >foil up with it. Lisa, Thanks for the feedback. I have ordered the #7 and #6 tip. They were not that expensive, so I thought I'd get both. I am wondering if the sensor mechanism (for temperature control) is working. I had one of these irons (smaller for fine soldering) many moons ago, and I remember a distinct click when the magnetic tip disengaged from the element. Can't say I have noticed it with the new iron. I will listen for it next time. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 19:14:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM3Qd-00012Va; Tue, 21 May 96 19:13 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Design software Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:13:26 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220213.TAA16549@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >Karen, > >There's been a lot of discussion of the "best" design tools in the Glass section >on CompuServe [GO HANDCRAFTS]. The consensus seems to be that the CorelDraw >software is the most flexible and powerful for the price. > For about the same price you can get autocad light. Wtih this program you can not only have full size drawings printed out ( I had a job that was 14' high x 120' wide and comprised of 42 panel printed out full size using acad 12 ) but you can also have patterns cut through a service using a plotter with knives instead of pens. Acad is a heavily supported platform at the various printing services and the export .dfx format is widely recognized. Acad claims that you can draw the universe (full size) using there program so an art glass panel is a cinch. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 19:20:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM3Vb-0000rJa; Tue, 21 May 96 19:18 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Light Box Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:18:35 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220218.TAA16848@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Hello Lorley: > > I just completed my light box. I roughly used the demensions suggested I installed 6 ceramic sockets >(like the ones on the ceiling of you closets) inside. I chose ceramic >because I figured that they could handle the heat generated in the enclosure. > I use 100 watt soft white bulbs, which I control by a dimmer switch . I would suggest that you use >incandesent bulbs (not flouresecent tubes) because the regular bulbs should >give you a better approximation of how the glass actually looks when >lighted.(unlessof course, you are planning to light your projects with >flourscent lighting.) > > Unless you are producing a window, suncatcher or similar panel lit by sun light in which case using a combination of warm and cool floresent lights may actually come closer to "natural" conditions. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 19:23:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM3ZN-0001Dka; Tue, 21 May 96 19:22 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Pulling My Hair, Supressing a Scream Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:22:22 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220222.TAA08138@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Karen, I use a 60/40 solder I think the 60/40 is the key. 50/50 is a little harder to work if you are not adept at soldering. 60/40 seems to be more forgiving, and flows a little better. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 21:03:04 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM56n-00015la; Tue, 21 May 96 21:01 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Aluminum came Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:00:54 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220400.VAA11461@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >From: Albert M (Merv) Carter 76040.2361@compuserve.com > > >My wife is currently receiving more and more orders for stained glass > >items of increasing size. Something lighter and stronger than lead while still being > >easier to work than zinc would be a great help. > > >There are a number of reasons lead is used in preference over any >other metal. As Julie Sloan points out in her recent book The came will stretch if the window is not > properly supported in the frame and tied > to saddle bars. > >So, looking carefully at that last point, what might work best >for you is a *different alloy of lead, one that includes at least >30% copper Also consider as Julie points out that proper use of support bars can solve all of the problems alluded to. We just completed a panel that is aprox 65" x 78" and is free hanging. It took over a day to apply the support bars for two men! The piece is currently hanging at Loyola University in Chicago @ 25 E. Pearson. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 21:07:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM5BB-00014Sa; Tue, 21 May 96 21:05 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA News Memo (RANT!!) Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:05:33 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220405.VAA12919@dfw-ix9.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >> I guess you can add me to your list of meatheads who really have no >> interest in receiving your newsletter. If I wanted it I would join your >> IGGA. Nothing against you since I don't know you, but I really feel that >> if someone is recruiting members for an association like yours, it should >> be done either on your home page or one to one, not clogging up everyones >> mailboxs. About a month or so ago, I found glass@bungi and enjoyed >> reading the give and take between readers. Now however it appears that >> this site should be renamed glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com > >THERE ARE NO MEATHEADS HERE. > > I couldn't disagree more. If Albert's "recruiting" ammounts to 5% of his total >input, I would be VERY surprised. I don't see his comments as "glass according >to...." at all. I see his comments more in the light of "Here is what I know, here is >what I think and here are some resources that may have the info you really need." >I don't know Albert either - other than from his posts here, which I enjoy. > I read 8 newsgroups and mailing lists regularly. One has 100-150 new >articles daily and a couple of others are in the 40-60 range. At the level of a dozen >or so new posts a day,glass@bungi.com certainly does "not clogging up everyones >> mailboxs" > I think that I much prefer "glassaccordingtoallewis@igga.com" to >"RULESfortheINTERNETaccordingtoLODA@ego.com". Mailreading and >newsreading programs are supplied with filter capabilities for the topics and/or >writers that we would prefer to avoid or ignore. Deleting articles is our choice as >well. The proprtion of usable info. is my primary reason for reading or deleting an >article, writer or newsgroup. > If you don't like the program, change the channel; if you don't like the food, >go to a different restaurant. If you don't like part or all of a newsgroup or maillist, >don't read it. As long as Albert can continue to provide his share of "the give and > take between readers", we should be happy to have the choice of reading it or not. >I for one prefer it to the meaningless flamewars and censorship spam that has >begun to pervade many usenet and listserve groups. If it is pertinent to glass, I >want it here - I can decide whether a writer or "guild" or any other source is worth >my time. > IF YOU LIKE IT, BUY IT. IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, DON'T BUY IT. >BUT PLEASE REFRAIN FROM STIFLING ANYONE. > > > > > >Here, here. Score one for freedom of speach. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 21:08:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM5CI-0001A7a; Tue, 21 May 96 21:06 PDT X-Path: aol.com!BarbaraBGS From: BarbaraBGS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: GAS in Boston Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 00:06:39 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May21.20639.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk OK, I know it's late, but I have "studio under constuction" blues and want to attend at the last minute. Does anyone have any information on the GAS show in Boston? I think it's the first or second week in June. Thanks. Barbara ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 21:18:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM5M5-0001Iea; Tue, 21 May 96 21:17 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: New kid on the block Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:16:52 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220416.VAA05332@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >I originally went to art school for vissual communications. I still like to >do my drawing but the commputer is so much handier for alot of things. My >husband bought me Corel Draw several years ago. We have version 3 but they >now make a version 6 that does alot more. This is an expensive program but >it does alot. This is what I use to design my stained glass patterns. >Somethimes the clip-art helps with drawing what I need without alot of work. >If you can find someone near you who has it I suggest going over and giving >it a try. If you find something better, let me know. > >Joy > If your serious about drawing on the computer acad is the way to go. >joyhall@peoples.net > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 21 21:23:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uM5Qj-0000Gea; Tue, 21 May 96 21:21 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:21:30 -0700 Message-ID: <199605220421.VAA12249@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >> >> This is an old message, but I just purchased one of these irons and need >> some advice. I had a 80 watt iron that I used for came work, and I thought >> I would indulge myself with a qality iron for came and foil (which I >> wanted to try). >> >> I cut my glass, cleaned it (in water with detergent and then rinsed >> thoroughly), dried it, foiled it. >> >> When it came to soldering, I noticed that the foil lifted in places. If I >> pressed it down after removing iron, it seems to have 'stuck' again. I am >> typing this several days after the exercise and it still seems 'stuck'. >> >> My questions are: >> >> 1. Should I not clean the glass the way I did? > >Cleaning the glass is good, it helps remove any glass dust from grinding and >any cutter oil that might be on the glass. the key would be to make sure that >all of the detergent was rinsed from the glass, becasue that would interfere >with the adherance of the foil...and it sounds like you rinsed it well. > > > >> >> 2. The Weller tip is a no 8, which I think is an 800F tip. Is this too hot >> for foil? Even if I was tinning the copper foil and moving very quickly, >> the foil still seemed to lift. > >If the tip that you ahve says 8 on the bottom (the portion that fits into the >iron handle) then you ahve an 800 degree tip and I would recoomend going to a >7. Most people work comfortably at 700 degrees, if you want to move faster >then go to the 8. 6's are going to allow you to move slower and are usually >only for decorative type soldering. > >> >> 3. Would a no 6 tip be too cold? Is a no 7 a better option? >> >(see last comment) > >My suggestion would be to try the 700 degree tip. What is probably happening >is that you are working at a slow enough speed with the 800 degree tip that >it's allowing the glue on the foil to heat up and come loose, then as you move >the iron and the hot solder flows, it pulls the foil up with it. > >see if that helps at all. > >Lisa R > > Are those with these "lifting " problems properly burnishing the foil?? ms ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 02:48:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMAWg-0000xWa; Wed, 22 May 96 02:48 PDT X-Path: mail.deltanet.com!wldsculp From: wldsculp@mail.deltanet.com (KIM&SUSAN) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Web pages Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 02:44:47 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >>Would anyone be terrible distraught if I asked for advice on creating a web >>page? > > >Not at all. It's what we do. We design Web Sites professionally > > >>I'd like to start selling some wares on the net, but frankly I haven't a clue >>as to how to create a page or who to contact to do it for me. What's a "good >>rate" for providing the design and/or hosting the site? > > >The least expensive (money-wise) is to do it yourself. But allow time for >a learning curve. Unless you purchase software that automatically >generates HTML, you will have to invest time into learning code. Plus >creating graphics, scanning in photo's, etc. > >We have free web page tools & tips on our site. We also run our own glass >site w/ links. Check it out at > >(Home Page) http://www.billboards.com/billboards/flybynet/fbn1.html >(Looking Glass) >Http://www.billboards.com/billboards/flybynet/lookingglass.html > >Hint: As you're on AOL, you will experience some drawbacks. Turn off >"compressed graphics" in your browser preferences. You still won't get all >the bells & whistles, and what you see is definitely not what is. You >might want to consider a local ISP for your Internet access. It's cheaper >(and faster) than AOL and you will be able to see what the WWW is really >about. (Our pages look truly frightening when viewed with AOL.) > > >>Are things selling on the net? Is it a good place to be, i.e. is it >>cost-effective? I've noticed quite a few of you have pages and I'm hoping >>you can provide some insight. Thanks. Barbara >> Breckenridge Glass Studio > > >I believe the Net provides an economical way to promote what you do on a >global level. Think of it as a brochure that can take advantage of >MultiMedia, be accessed by anyone anywhere with Internet Access (at last >estimate there were 45 million people browsing the WWW). And yes, it can >be cost effective. Even hiring us (couldn't resist the inevitable plug) to >create and publish your Site. > >If you need some more help and info, let us know. > >Regards > >S & K >>---- > > > ...fly-by-net...Marketing wldsculp@deltanet.com http://www.billboards.com/billboards/flybynet/fbn1.html ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 03:15:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMAw9-0001Fza; Wed, 22 May 96 03:14 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: New kid on the block Date: 22 May 96 06:13:24 EDT Message-ID: <1996May22.101324.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I just called and got some really reasonable price quotes for coreldraw = >4... How user friendly is it? Katie Well, having used it for *years I can't say I'm an "impartial witness," but it's pretty straight-forward for simple things, while capable of very sophisticated stuff, as well. As you say, it's pretty reasonable -- I paid $1,300 for mine years ago when it was still a ... Ashton-Tate? No ... Xerox product (it's been sold and re-sold over the years, so it gets confusing). For one, *I'd certainly be glad to suggest tips on using CD4 to create stained glass patterns, make wholesale changes to the width of all the lines in a drawing, etc. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 04:14:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMBnr-0000mua; Wed, 22 May 96 04:10 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Recent work @ Loyola Date: 22 May 96 07:08:41 EDT Message-ID: <1996May22.11841.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > We just completed a panel that is aprox 65" x 78" and is free hanging. >currently hanging at Loyola University in Chicago @ 25 E. Pearson. Would you share a photo of it, either a slide or print, with an eye to publication in "Common Ground: Glass," the Guild's newsletter? (As well as, we hope eventually, in the online version of the newsletters that we're putting together to archive here?) If so, send it to __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 04:15:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMBor-0000pRa; Wed, 22 May 96 04:11 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: GAS in Boston Date: 22 May 96 07:08:43 EDT Message-ID: <1996May22.11843.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk The G.A.S. show, "Critical Mass," the 26th annual conference of the Glass Art Society, is June 6-9, 1996 at the Massachusetts College of Art, 621 Huntington Avenue, Boston MA 02115. $75-235 for the full conference; day rates $40-90. Information from Glass Art Society, 1305 4th Avenue, Suite 711, Seattle WA 98101-2401. Phone: (206) 382-1305 M-F 8:30a-4:30p PST; Fax: (206) 382-2630. The prospectus for the show is a *very nice 6x9-inch booklet that includes not only infor about the conference, but lists of gallery exhibits in the Boston area taking place at the same time, things to do that do have *anything to do with glass hotel and transportation info ... a very carefully thought-out and complete package. I'm sure they'll send one on request, but hurry! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 07:16:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMEeY-0000xia; Wed, 22 May 96 07:12 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Wed, 22 May 96 15:19:54 Message-ID: <199605221412.AAA17222@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199605220421.VAA12249@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199605220421.VAA12249@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>, on 05/21/96 at 09:21 PM, izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) said: >Are those with these "lifting " problems properly burnishing the foil?? >ms Well I got my #7 (700F) tip. And things are looking up. Burnishing was not the problem. Me thinks it was just that the temperature was too hot for 'me'. Another question if I may. I tried to patina my little project with a copper sulphate solution. It didn't seem to be very even in colour (that's how WE spell it). Some areas were almost black, others still solder coloured. I didn't apply this patina till several days after soldering and cleaning. Is there a 'recommend' strength for the copper sulpate solution. Nothing I have read mentions a mix. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 10:30:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMHjK-00014Sa; Wed, 22 May 96 10:29 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Nashville meeting Date: 22 May 96 13:28:28 EDT Message-ID: <1996May22.172828.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Can you provide me with more information about Navhsivlle meeting. Re: >1. who to contact. Art Glass Suppliers Association PO Box 2188 Zanesville OH 43702-2188 (614) 452-4541 Fax: (614) 452-2552 >2. How much would cost? Membership is $50-250, depending on which category you fit into Sessions are 20-180, depending on which you choose >3. program? Thanks. It's extensive ... too long to repeat here, for sure. Ask them for a copy of the Source'96 brochure/flyer. I'm sure they'll send you one. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 14:09:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uML8I-0000uHa; Wed, 22 May 96 14:07 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 17:06:41 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May22.13641.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4801.1215B400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I had the exact same problem with the copper patina. some one = recommended that I meticulously clean the project first and get all the = oxidation of the solder before I applied the patina... I tried it and I = did seem to get better results. Cant wait to hear what everyone else = does. Katie ---------- From: = Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au[SMTP:Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au] Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 1996 11:19 AM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 In <199605220421.VAA12249@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>, on 05/21/96 at 09:21 PM, izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) said: >Are those with these "lifting " problems properly burnishing the foil?? >ms Well I got my #7 (700F) tip. And things are looking up. Burnishing was = not the problem. Me thinks it was just that the temperature was too hot for 'me'. Another question if I may. I tried to patina my little project with a copper sulphate solution. It didn't seem to be very even in colour = (that's how WE spell it). Some areas were almost black, others still solder coloured. I didn't apply this patina till several days after soldering and = cleaning. Is there a 'recommend' strength for the copper sulpate solution. Nothing = I have read mentions a mix. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~= '-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636=20 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) = =20 = ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~= '-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4801.1215B400 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IjQVAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAgAAAAUkU6IFNvbGRlcmluZyBJcm9ucyBXZWxsZXIg VzEwMABWCgEFgAMADgAAAMwHBQAWABEABgApAAMAMQEBIIADAA4AAADMBwUAFgARAAQAEAADABYB AQmAAQAhAAAARDdBMzcwRjlGMkIzQ0YxMUFERjQ0NDQ1NTM1NDAwMDAADgcBA5AGAEgHAAASAAAA CwAjAAAAAAADACYAAAAAAAsAKQAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAwJo6kyJIuwEeAHAAAQAAACAAAABS RTogU29sZGVyaW5nIElyb25zIFdlbGxlciBXMTAwAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG7SCKS7/lwo9iz8hHP rfRERVNUAAAAAB4AHgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAWAAAAY2xhbWJlcnRAbW9ubW91 dGguY29tAAAAAwAGEJ3zMIQDAAcQGgUAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAElIQURUSEVFWEFDVFNBTUVQUk9C TEVNV0lUSFRIRUNPUFBFUlBBVElOQVNPTUVPTkVSRUNPTU1FTkRFRFRIQVRJTUVUSUNVTE9VU0xZ Q0xFQU5USEVQUk9KRUNURklSU1RBTkQAAAAAAgEJEAEAAADEBQAAwAUAADcKAABMWkZ13YRXvP8A CgEPAhUCqAXrAoMAUALyCQIAY2gKwHNldDI3BgAGwwKDMgPFAgBwckJxEeJzdGVtAoMzdwLkBxMC gH0KgAjPCdk78RYPMjU1AoAKgQ2xC2DgbmcxMDMUUAsKFFFFC/JjAEAgSSARgGSAIHRoZSBleADQ qQVAc2EHgCATUG8CYD0T4CAD8BtQG0MFoHBwEwSQHDBhdAuAYS4gfxvgA3AbcAIgG3AWEAWgbf0H gG4NsBsyHdAa4QeAHeCEY3UVoHVzbHkdQG8cgAORG1IcQWoFkAVAZt5pEaAFQABwGzBnEcAiUIZs AyAbUm94aWQd0VsCIB6QZhtDHlBsBIEgXmINwAWwG3Aa8GEdcGzfCJAbNB3FJpAa4XQIgRsw9xzQ IlMa8GQjgBvgCeAcoHx0byKTJOACQB2RFhBzaSBgdHMeIUMAcAVAd18LcAVAKHEbYArBdx+yZcp2 BJB5HqJlbBGwJ9CqbweQLgqFSx3RZQqFIwqLJaAxODAC0WkteDE0NA3wDNAvMwtZMd42CqADYBPQ G8EtMVcKh9cwCwwwMNZGA2E6Ml4w1pkMgiBHBbAsQG4uB8ERK/BsQGMZQDEuYRUeoS4esHQ3MHVb U7BNVFA6Nh83K10x/98zDQZgAjA0PzVLVwmAHrAycyOQeSwF0D7QIDJCMj7wMTk5Nj+AMTY6P5AU sE06TzMNVG8bPI81S2cLYAQQQGJ1ORkQaS4fAUBvO151YqchskKPNUtSZUfAUySD/QuAZxrgA2AG MT5gIvAdkc5XGTAKdi3NMzYv1xpFlTDWSQOgPD+SMDU/UAgwNDI3IFZBQTEBP1A0OUBkZnctfmkv kDcgUHA3gh8BRRI+1z7wI9FPEC9PcC8/sR/BGDA5Ok9wCoVQTSwDCoVUAWl6enkzQPFQyyAoTSBA EYAr8AYAZQRgdRFxICkb4SOAOrtLnAqFPgcQG3AbUG8sEbscxiwRIiWgAYBKQiIcNn8EIBxBHYEg sUTABKAEAGjPSkIbUgIQAxA/P1d9WsB3S5xK4hrhZzDwIAAgwCNqN1VwNy7QRlaQHeBw/R4gQSJx G1BKQQQgCsAbcKkVoG9rSkJ1YGFCW5j7KkAEIG4w8AqFIUUcch4gdk1YgguAawQgJ1Fi8mr/IJAq cR+yG1IT0R2BHdAIcH9Y4WMBKHAqoV9BJQEKhSf9B4AnLIYKhWCQMPAbYAXA/nEKUBPAI8IGkB/i PtAmuP8ocR3EX2IloAJAHIAhdxzDbmEKhR1VKXFwH7EkU3XPI7ImsQVAJ+FuJxvRKDX9JOAgK3Ir UmrRA6AVgghwO1VwH6InXdZYsAfgV0XvG+AdgCLxHNApHiBJ4BwR/2FBYwE44CUhB0AEYCIxAmD9 ANBrUaFqEgQgapEi8SR0/243coIJgGj9J8NwoiVyIMD/YNFa0WxUdzQrYgdAJ9A+0P9hIQGAbuJJ 9yJiIONKQXje32dxaiF1AWigHucndxEWEL8ZEBzhJQEdCm8Sb2xOagH7SkNzRmErcB7RGyEfMSOy D2EhIABQwUucfictLvBfLi0nhs+H34jvif9/ioKKZQqFOFQHsjjxPvBD/RGAbAWgBUBVkQNgE5Vd 1jpUK/Blb0AeoUfAKzZRGtAzIDlf4DhR4DHEMzQ+8EZheI/nP1DxkCE5NTg+8RxgAxBJsc9PUBrQ P+Aa0DY2TPAtthxPU1IQJ0AEIEQuRdAuQS5EVXBEDcALgPcc0CvwIMBFDdAgQAiQKhH9YJJECHAB oByAVpCXX5g7/1Omik+aX5tvnH+LD4wXCoXtMblGBbEpcGIE9CPCEXH/GRAHkD7wC1B1QRtwAMAD EfcocEfARGMtFhBqY0S/QmD/KBFgoiiAG1IloBPAPvCYM9eib0R/aaNyEXBpK3BhIS52ouGXAlJy aAJAcDqoLy93qxAuRMcvp+O/Vw9MP01PIcIKhRUxALBgAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAEAABzCANMQ8 Iki7AUAACDCANMQ8Iki7AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAARkw= ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4801.1215B400-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 14:29:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMLS1-0000xia; Wed, 22 May 96 14:28 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Is it just me...? Date: 22 May 96 17:25:29 EDT Message-ID: <1996May22.212529.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Hi Albert; I am having the first look around at the IGAA Resources page >on the web (I came through bungi) and for each of the items I select I >get a "404 Not Found, the requested URL /glass/igga/igga/igga01.txt was >not found on this server " I selected "Glass Arts Suppliers, >Alphabetically" and also selected "Glass" and "Kits" and "Glass Lamps" >and I receive the same such error for each. Is there a problem with this >page location that you know of? Liz, Not that I know of; sorry you're having access problems. I checked them yesterday (or the day before) and everything seemed fine, but I'll pass this reply to you through bungi.com to see if anyone else has had a problem. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 15:09:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMM4s-00018ja; Wed, 22 May 96 15:08 PDT X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: ssuter@intrastar.net (Shirley Suter) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Is it just me...? Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 17:04:26 -0500 Message-ID: <1996May22.12426.0> References: <<1996May22.212529.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service - (409) 687-9067 Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > > >Hi Albert; I am having the first look around at the IGAA Resources page > >on the web (I came through bungi) and for each of the items I select I > >get a "404 Not Found, the requested URL /glass/igga/igga/igga01.txt was > >not found on this server " I selected "Glass Arts Suppliers, > >Alphabetically" and also selected "Glass" and "Kits" and "Glass Lamps" > >and I receive the same such error for each. Is there a problem with this > >page location that you know of? > > Liz, > > Not that I know of; sorry you're having access problems. I checked them > yesterday (or the day before) and everything seemed fine, but I'll pass this > reply to you through bungi.com to see if anyone else has had a problem. > > Albert > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass Well, Albert, I, too, had the same problem several days ago when I tried. Shirley Suter Grapeland Texas where it is sweltering hot and the tomatoes in the garden are almost ripe! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 15:25:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMMKT-0001Aca; Wed, 22 May 96 15:24 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 23:15:27 +0000 Message-ID: <199605222232.XAA30237@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Copper sulphate. You say that you left your "little project" a few days before trying to apply the patina.. I think herein lies your answer... I find that - first of all - washing the prooject thouroughy with soap and water to remove all flux residues helps a lot. If you are then forced to leave the work for some days before you apply patina, the oxidization of the metals have already started .Try rubbing down your work with a very soft grade of wire-wool (so as not to scratch the glass) immediately before applying the patina. Hopefully you should receive better result. (By the way, once uo have applied the patina and achieved the desired result, I would recommend that you again wash your work with soap and water, to avoid the sulphate "eating" into the glass). Let us know how you got on... By the way, someone in the Group suggested using a damp cloth to stop solder seeping through in masses. What a great idea, many thanks! (Why didn't I think of that!?) My students used it to good effect yesterday. Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 16:17:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMN9F-0000x2a; Wed, 22 May 96 16:16 PDT X-Path: ucdavis.edu!krmcdonald From: krmcdonald@ucdavis.edu (Kathe R. McDonald) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 16:14:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <199605222314.QAA29080@peseta.ucdavis.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I'm a bit of a novice (<5 windows) but one thing I've been spending more time on is cleaning, cleaning, cleaning. I was having trouble soldering too, and a lot of my problem was from flux being left too long, etc. Now I am trying to be very meticulous. Sure makes a difference on the patina, too. I use soap/water first, then glass cleaner (spray kind). When I'm done, I use metal polish on the solder before the patina. My last window looked much more professional than the previous ones. Kathe R. McDonald Office of Curricular Support "Aint no time to hate." J. Garcia 1995 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 16:35:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMNQg-0001Bma; Wed, 22 May 96 16:34 PDT X-Path: voicenet.com!sadams From: Steve Adams To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 19:35:03 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May22.15353.0> References: <<199605221412.AAA17222@mail.mel.aone.net.au>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au wrote: > Another question if I may. I tried to patina my little project with a > copper sulphate solution. It didn't seem to be very even in colour (that's > how WE spell it). Some areas were almost black, others still solder > coloured. When I learned to do stained glass about 2 years ago, my teacher (Hi Barb) showed us to rub the solder lines with 0000 steel wool. It's important that it's four zeroes steel wool -- it will shine up your solder seams and get them ready for patina-ing (is that a word?) I've never been dissatisfied with the results. Your arm may get crampy rubbing that steel wool all over the place, but it's worth the effort. Steve. -------------------------------------------- http://www.voicenet.com/~sadams/mstrpcs.html -------------------------------------------- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 17:36:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMOOH-00014Ha; Wed, 22 May 96 17:36 PDT X-Path: vkm.com!ABBES From: Steve Abbe To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Is it just me...? Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 19:23:00 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <01I50NITSGXY00297X@mr.vkm.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk hi, The html page showing the IGGA info has syntax errors. They are missing some quotes in the href sections (actually I am making this comment here hoping the hosts of this list will see my message and fix the problem, I couldn't find an address for the webmaster on the pages, not to bore you with details) Regardless, I am using netscape and below the general web page appears a list of file names, the directory listing of bungi.com. If you double click on igga in this listing you will get a secondary listing of the files igga supplied the web site. double click on those to view the files. use the back feature on your browser to back out of viewing the files. (this should be similar on other browsers) hope this helps, if it doesn't don't blame me :-) Steve Abbe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 18:12:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMOwT-0001Dya; Wed, 22 May 96 18:11 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: Soldering as I see it. Date: Wed, 22 May 96 18:07:23 -0500 Message-ID: <199605230111.SAA14797@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- This is Howard... In my 15+ years of limited glass work, which include windows in foil, came, incorporation of both, zinc and lead came, about 950 or so lamps, a bit of fusing, old and new repairs, the ability to make a bead look like a strip of came, and various other related tasks, I feel SLIGHTLY more qualified than some of the neophytes who are expounding on theories they may never have experienced. As for soldering, IMHO the idea is to melt solder so as to flow it smoothly on the copper foil....heat makes it run better, why the attempt to make it colder with wet towels and other means? Simple, work a bit faster, as you get better you will be glad for your "skill". If you do get a few bleed throughs, you are going to solder the "other" side anyway, just use it. Why are you tinning and then soldering, if need be tack at joints, and then solder completely, going in one direction...this prevents flux from being trapped and then steaming which causes the solder to pop. Try using less flux. If your solder beads look peaky or you can see multiple layers of solder, you have not melted the solder enough to run it. Make sure you can feel the copper foil when you place your iron (what ever brand and wattage-another story) ON THE FOIL, apply the solder to the iron tip and let it melt. Move the iron along the foil keeping it on the foil, The heat from the foil will pull the melted solder (this is called capillary action). If you need to melt large areas, use the broadest area of the tip, to melt or touch up small spots, use the smallest part of the point. It takes a longer time to melt a multiple joint, so stay on a joint a bit longer...or heat it first and start from there, pulling excess solder along from it. The one MAIN secret is PRACTICE...you will get better as you do more. Can not wait to read MAJOR arguements about this post, and perhaps, even a few of you may have a "clue". SEE..I am not always a nice and polite person, and I am even given to sarcasm....Need some sunshine here!!! Enjoy.....H -- new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 18:14:39 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMOyl-0000UBa; Wed, 22 May 96 18:14 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: hat in hand I ask for help Date: Wed, 22 May 96 18:09:42 -0500 Message-ID: <199605230113.SAA15992@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- Need to talk at someone who KNOWS and has and uses E-mail connection for their e-mail... Thanks....H -- new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 18:24:34 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMP8I-0000lUa; Wed, 22 May 96 18:24 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Superior Lead Came Date: 22 May 96 21:22:12 EDT Message-ID: <1996May23.12212.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I posted a message in the handcrafts forum looking for a superior type >of came to lead or zinc. You steered me to G.A. Avril Lead Products >in Cincinnati, OH. In calling them, I found that they have a new lead >came alloy of lead, tin, antimony, and copper with greater strength than >conventional came while retaining most the ease of workmanship of the >conventional product. The came has been successfully used in a number >of large glass creations. They are sending me a sample for my evaluation. >Thanks for the tip. >P.S. You are welcome to post this in Bungi.com if you think anyone would >be interested. >Merv Glad it worked out for you, Merv. Thanks for reporting back. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 18:36:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMPJr-0001Dma; Wed, 22 May 96 18:36 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: hat in hand I ask for he Date: 22 May 96 21:34:27 EDT Message-ID: <1996May23.13427.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Howard, Not sure what you mean, exactly, by "KNOW" ... nor by "E-mail connection" but I use it *all the time. What's the question? I'll tell you immediately if I don't know the answer. Albert via TapCIS6.1 over CompuServe through bungi.com "Geez, I had 1,500 voice-mail messages on my machine today. Typical." (joke) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 19:00:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMPhZ-0000pfa; Wed, 22 May 96 19:00 PDT X-Path: idirect.com!mrum From: mrum@idirect.com (mike & carol) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering as I see it. Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:00:15 -0400 Message-ID: <199605230200.WAA03224@lucid.idirect.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi everyone, this is Carol. No darts Howard, just laurels. This is exactly what my glass teacher taught over 14(already?!) years ago. Mike at Fantasy in Glass Glassworks, Toronto, thanks again. Practice is definitely a major component of soldering well. Practice makes perfect. ******************************************* Mike and Carol Rumak Mississauga, Ontario Canada Visit Carol's stained glass gallery at: http://web.idirect.com/~studio ******************************************* ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 19:09:20 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMPpg-0000una; Wed, 22 May 96 19:08 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: ...soldering and other things that can make you want to ice pick some one... Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:07:46 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May22.18746.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk One of the most helpful things any one ever did for me in a stained = glass course was probably the simplest... Take a sheet -8 inches by 8 = inches or so of really cheap glass. Cut it in strips but not = perfectly straight lines. Foil everything and then lay the strips next = to each other so there are gaps and various other annoying mismatched = areas. Now practice practice. I thought it was really silly at first = but by the time I had gotten those ten strips soldered on both sides I = really felt much more comfortable with my technique. I hope this = doesn't sound like I know it all... I still have to work at it to make = everything come out the way I want to...=20 Katie And sometimes even then I go hunting for that darn ice pick:) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 20:25:19 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMR0e-000122a; Wed, 22 May 96 20:24 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering as I see it. Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 20:24:13 -0700 Message-ID: <199605230324.UAA21738@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >-- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- > >This is Howard... >In my 15+ years of limited glass work, which include windows in foil, came, >incorporation of both, zinc and lead came, about 950 or so lamps, a bit of >fusing, old and new repairs, the ability to make a bead look like a strip of >came, and various other related tasks, I feel SLIGHTLY more qualified than >some of the neophytes who are expounding on theories they may never have >experienced. >As for soldering, IMHO the idea is to melt solder so as to flow it smoothly >on the copper foil....heat makes it run better, why the attempt to make it >colder with wet towels and other means? Simple, work a bit faster, as you >get better you will be glad for your "skill". If you do get a few bleed >throughs, you are going to solder the "other" side anyway, just use it. >Why are you tinning and then soldering, if need be tack at joints, and then >solder completely, going in one direction...this prevents flux from being >trapped and then steaming which causes the solder to pop. >Try using less flux. >If your solder beads look peaky or you can see multiple layers of solder, >you have not melted the solder enough to run it. Make sure you can feel the >copper foil when you place your iron (what ever brand and wattage-another >story) ON THE FOIL, apply the solder to the iron tip and let it melt. Move >the iron along the foil keeping it on the foil, The heat from the foil will >pull the melted solder (this is called capillary action). >If you need to melt large areas, use the broadest area of the tip, to melt >or touch up small spots, use the smallest part of the point. It takes a >longer time to melt a multiple joint, so stay on a joint a bit longer...or >heat it first and start from there, pulling excess solder along from it. >The one MAIN secret is PRACTICE...you will get better as you do more. >Can not wait to read MAJOR arguements about this post, and perhaps, even a >few of you may have a "clue". >SEE..I am not always a nice and polite person, and I am even given to >sarcasm....Need some sunshine here!!! >Enjoy.....H >-- All good points. One other technique i've found to be helpful is to melt the solder on the metal as opposed to on the iron tip. In this way you assure that you are heating up the joint or foil line sufficiently. The problem that I see most often in came work (weather lead or zinc or rebar work) is the tendency to apply the solder melting it on the iron but not thoroghly heating the metals. The result is a "cold soldered" joint, one that is destined to fail. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 20:32:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMR7R-0000f4a; Wed, 22 May 96 20:31 PDT X-Path: hooked.net!nsherman From: Neil Sherman To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Thanks All, from the Frustrated Solderer Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 20:28:12 -0700 Message-ID: <199605230332.UAA07984@mom.hooked.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thanks everyone, for all your soldering tips. Especially the hint about the damp towel! I took a week off from soldering, things didn't look as bad as I remembered when I got back to it tonight and I worked a little faster so things went a little better. I'm working on a 22" square piece so I'm just doing it an hour or so at a time and then stopping for the night. It'll take a little longer at this rate but I won't be pulling patches of my hair out, either! Thanks again, Bonnie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 20:32:24 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMR7j-00010Va; Wed, 22 May 96 20:31 PDT X-Path: server.northernnet.com!hensley From: Mike & Jodi Hensley To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering as I see it. Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 22:32:21 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <199605230332.WAA00141@northernnet.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Howard, thanks for the tips. My soldering leaves a lot to be desired. I have missed the postings regarding what type of iron people recommend. Any help would be appreciated. I think my iron cuts out on me. At least, that is what someone told me. Do you, or anyone, have a favorite iron? Thanks, Jodi At 06:07 PM 5/22/96 -0500, you wrote: >-- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- > >This is Howard... >In my 15+ years of limited glass work, which include windows in foil, came, >incorporation of both, zinc and lead came, about 950 or so lamps, a bit of >fusing, old and new repairs, the ability to make a bead look like a strip of >came, and various other related tasks, I feel SLIGHTLY more qualified than >some of the neophytes who are expounding on theories they may never have >experienced. >As for soldering, IMHO the idea is to melt solder so as to flow it smoothly >on the copper foil....heat makes it run better, why the attempt to make it >colder with wet towels and other means? Simple, work a bit faster, as you >get better you will be glad for your "skill". If you do get a few bleed >throughs, you are going to solder the "other" side anyway, just use it. >Why are you tinning and then soldering, if need be tack at joints, and then >solder completely, going in one direction...this prevents flux from being >trapped and then steaming which causes the solder to pop. >Try using less flux. >If your solder beads look peaky or you can see multiple layers of solder, >you have not melted the solder enough to run it. Make sure you can feel the >copper foil when you place your iron (what ever brand and wattage-another >story) ON THE FOIL, apply the solder to the iron tip and let it melt. Move >the iron along the foil keeping it on the foil, The heat from the foil will >pull the melted solder (this is called capillary action). >If you need to melt large areas, use the broadest area of the tip, to melt >or touch up small spots, use the smallest part of the point. It takes a >longer time to melt a multiple joint, so stay on a joint a bit longer...or >heat it first and start from there, pulling excess solder along from it. >The one MAIN secret is PRACTICE...you will get better as you do more. >Can not wait to read MAJOR arguements about this post, and perhaps, even a >few of you may have a "clue". >SEE..I am not always a nice and polite person, and I am even given to >sarcasm....Need some sunshine here!!! >Enjoy.....H >-- >new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm > http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 >Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! >E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 21:03:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMRbr-0001Dca; Wed, 22 May 96 21:02 PDT X-Path: aol.com!Guitarshop From: Guitarshop@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 00:02:39 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May22.20239.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello All: I agree with the concensious about using 0000 steel wool. It does seem to make the finished patina job better. The only caution that I might offer (from personal experience), is to be careful when rubbing near the areas that are only tinned (i.e. at the edges of the glass). The coating of solder is so thin that it takes VERY little effort to rub it off with the steel wool. Of course, if this happens, the exposed copper will not take the patina at all. If this is discovered after the patina is applied, and if the area is very small, a black "sharpie" can cover those little "mistakes". Something else that I have found to work for me, is to use a terry-cloth rag to apply the patina. I don't know why that works better than paper towels,etc, but it does for me. Just make sure to keep moving to a clean spot on the cloth as you see the "copper" color showing. If you continue using the same spot on the cloth, it seems to make you black patina "coppery". I have tried applying the patina with a paint brush (after reading that the "pros" do it that way) but I was dissappointed with the finished product. I am new at this too, and can only relay what I have found by trial and error myself. Michael McGrew Shattered Images. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 23:45:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMU8s-0000dYa; Wed, 22 May 96 23:45 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Cleaning (was Re: Soldering Irons) Date: Thu, 23 May 96 16:05:12 Message-ID: <199605230644.QAA20460@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199605222314.QAA29080@peseta.ucdavis.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199605222314.QAA29080@peseta.ucdavis.edu>, on 05/22/96 at 04:14 PM, krmcdonald@ucdavis.edu (Kathe R. McDonald) said: >I'm a bit of a novice (<5 windows) but one thing I've been spending more >time on is cleaning, cleaning, cleaning. I was having trouble soldering >too, and a lot of my problem was from flux being left too long, etc. Now >I am trying to be very meticulous. Sure makes a difference on the patina, >too. I use soap/water first, then glass cleaner (spray kind). When I'm >done, I use metal polish on the solder before the patina. My last window >looked much more professional than the previous ones. I like that idea of using metal polish b4 applying patina. I just stole it! >Kathe R. McDonald ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 23:45:40 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMU8m-0001Aca; Wed, 22 May 96 23:44 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering as I see it. Date: Thu, 23 May 96 16:11:12 Message-ID: <199605230644.QAA20314@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<199605230111.SAA14797@desiree.teleport.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <199605230111.SAA14797@desiree.teleport.com>, on 05/22/96 at 06:07 PM, Elaine & Howard Rubin said: >-- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- >This is Howard... >In my 15+ years of limited glass work, which include windows in foil, >came, incorporation of both, zinc and lead came, about 950 or so lamps, a >bit of fusing, old and new repairs, the ability to make a bead look like >a strip of came, and various other related tasks, I feel SLIGHTLY more >qualified than some of the neophytes who are expounding on theories they >may never have experienced. >As for soldering, IMHO the idea is to melt solder so as to flow it >smoothly on the copper foil....heat makes it run better, why the attempt >to make it colder with wet towels and other means? Simple, work a bit >faster, as you get better you will be glad for your "skill". If you do >get a few bleed throughs, you are going to solder the "other" side >anyway, just use it. Why are you tinning and then soldering, if need be >tack at joints, and then solder completely, going in one direction...this >prevents flux from being trapped and then steaming which causes the >solder to pop. Try using less flux. >If your solder beads look peaky or you can see multiple layers of solder, >you have not melted the solder enough to run it. Make sure you can feel >the copper foil when you place your iron (what ever brand and >wattage-another story) ON THE FOIL, apply the solder to the iron tip and >let it melt. Move the iron along the foil keeping it on the foil, The >heat from the foil will pull the melted solder (this is called capillary >action). >If you need to melt large areas, use the broadest area of the tip, to >melt or touch up small spots, use the smallest part of the point. It >takes a longer time to melt a multiple joint, so stay on a joint a bit >longer...or heat it first and start from there, pulling excess solder >along from it. The one MAIN secret is PRACTICE...you will get better as >you do more. Can not wait to read MAJOR arguements about this post, and >perhaps, even a few of you may have a "clue". >SEE..I am not always a nice and polite person, and I am even given to >sarcasm....Need some sunshine here!!! >Enjoy.....H Howard, You may well be correct. But my first bicycle had training wheels. When I became comfortable, of they came! Several spills later, I could ride. Had I been forced to ride without training wheels, I may have given up in frustration (unlikely). Soldering copper foil may well be a similar scenario. Any variable in the equation, that I can control and understand (Heat, flux, 50/50 or 60/40) will aid to give me confidence along the way. All the input here has been invaluable - and every day, I learn a little more! So sarcasm or not, your input is valued. Regards Gordon (#7) Newell ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 22 23:45:44 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMU8o-0001Hca; Wed, 22 May 96 23:44 PDT X-Path: c031.aone.net.au!Gordon.Newell From: Gordon.Newell@c031.aone.net.au To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Patina (was:Soldering Irons Weller W100) Date: Thu, 23 May 96 16:07:25 Message-ID: <199605230644.QAA20433@mail.mel.aone.net.au> References: <<1996May22.15353.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In <1996May22.15353.0>, on 05/22/96 at 07:35 PM, Steve Adams said: >When I learned to do stained glass about 2 years ago, my teacher (Hi >Barb) showed us to rub the solder lines with 0000 steel wool. It's >important that it's four zeroes steel wool -- it will shine up your >solder seams and get them ready for patina-ing (is that a word?) I've >never been dissatisfied with the results. Your arm may get crampy >rubbing that steel wool all over the place, but it's worth the effort. And I've stolen this idea too! I better stop, or I'll get a bad name :) >Steve. ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ Gordon Newell, Chalcot Micro Systems Telephone: +61 3 9708 0134, Fax: +61 3 9221 3958, Mobile: 041 111 6636 OS/2 is D.E.A.D (Definitely Efficient And Durable) ~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'~'-._.-'-._.-'~ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 01:52:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMW8E-0001Dva; Thu, 23 May 96 01:52 PDT X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Drawing Programs Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 09:53:43 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <9605230853.AA18635@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<199605211517.KAA24050@peoples1.peoples.net>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > What have you heard about version 5? The reason we bought Corel Draw in the > first place was to design my own note cards. I wanted version 6 because is > would allow me to make my note cards look like I used charcoal, pastels or > pencil. There are basically two types of drawing programs - object/vector based 'drawing' ones and pixel based 'painting' ones. Each have their own strengths and weaknesses. object based ones (like corel draw) store pictures as a collection of objects - like lines, circles, rectangles - and can zoom the pictures up, or output to a printer and still have smooth lines. And you can usually go back and change things like colours or line thicknesses later. pixel based paint packages basically work like filling in squares on graph paper; clever ones can do very good imitations of traditional media like charcoal, pencil, watercolour or whatever, but the resolution of the pictures is fixed when they're created - enlarge the pictures enough, or sometimes when you print them (If you didn't use enough pixels for the final size and printer resolution), and you will usually start to see the individual squares, which can make lines look jagged and blocky. So for glass pattern design, object based programs like corel draw are probably better, while pixel based programs (like fauve matisse, fractal design dabbler, or fractal design painter) are better for imitating traditional painting/drawing styles. (corel draw also includes a paint package - and several other bits :-) ). If anyone *does* want to do freehand drawings on their computer, I'd suggest they try and have a look at the wacom artpad or something similar - it's a little digitising tablet with a lightweight, cordless, pressure sensitive pen - which you use like a normal pen or pencil instead of a mouse. Several paint packages use the pressure information so that you get a darker line or wider brush as you increase the pressure. -- _|_ / | Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) \_|_ jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \__/ Hemel Hempstead, UK jerry@shell.portal.com (alternate) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 10:08:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMdqI-0000oba; Thu, 23 May 96 10:06 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: Thanks for the help.... Date: Thu, 23 May 96 10:02:15 -0500 Message-ID: <199605231706.KAA14147@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- Solution was simple (but not for me)....someone had enlarged the subject and message window so as to obscure the to and cc windows. All is back to the way we learned to use it.... THANKS to ALL of you (and you know specifically who you are) who gave me the "clue" to do it. Next post may even bit a bit less caustic.... Enjoy....H -- new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 11:09:12 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMeoR-0001EOa; Thu, 23 May 96 11:08 PDT X-Path: voicenet.com!2cgs From: cgs <2cgs@voicenet.com> To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: ...soldering and other things that can make you want to ice pick some one... Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 14:09:57 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May23.10957.0> References: <<1996May22.18746.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk C Lambert wrote: > > One of the most helpful things any one ever did for me in a stained = > glass course was probably the simplest... Take a sheet -8 inches by 8 = > inches or so of really cheap glass. Cut it in strips but not = > perfectly straight lines. Foil everything and then lay the strips next = > to each other so there are gaps and various other annoying mismatched = > areas. Now practice practice. I thought it was really silly at first = > but by the time I had gotten those ten strips soldered on both sides I = > really felt much more comfortable with my technique. I hope this = > doesn't sound like I know it all... I still have to work at it to make = > everything come out the way I want to...=20 > Katie > Great idea! Thanks CHUCK ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 14:26:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMhsy-0001J2a; Thu, 23 May 96 14:25 PDT X-Path: interserv.com!ebsousa From: ebsousa@interserv.com To: Glass@bungi.com Subject: Howards cranky soldering advice Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 14:25:03 -0700 Message-ID: <199605232125.AA04587@relay.interserv.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Howard, O.K. We acknowledge that you are a font of wisdom. The rest of us are not claiming to be experts, only to share what we have experienced with our fellow enthusiasts.I would hate to see anyone be intimidated out of sending replies just because they haven't a decade or more of experience. While your advice is appreciated nxet time please wait till you get over your attack of the "crankies". Donna S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 14:30:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMhx9-0001JOa; Thu, 23 May 96 14:29 PDT X-Path: interserv.com!ebsousa From: ebsousa@interserv.com To: Glass@bungi.com Subject: G.A.S. Conference Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 14:29:30 -0700 Message-ID: <199605232129.AA04693@relay.interserv.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In conjunction to the G.A.S. conference in Boston,there is going to be an exhibit of glass art at the Worcester Center for Crafts running June 5-July 5. The phone number for those interested is (508)753-8183 ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 21:41:31 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMogQ-0000iha; Thu, 23 May 96 21:41 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: Thu May 23 21:40:58 1996 Message-ID: <96May23.213422-0700pdt.268282-16413+1729@aphex.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >At 10:08 PM 5/13/96 -0700, you wrote: >>I guess that would work too, Albert, if you are willing to add us to your >>mailing list then please add me also. >> >>drno@mbay.net >> >>Thanks >> >> >>> >>> >>>Will do, Kelly ... do you have a glass program there? If so, we'd like to add >>>it to our database and send you a copy of the newsletter for your students. >>> >>>Albert > > >I have heard lots of talk of a news letter. What is it and how can I get it >if it is about stained glass. I guess I joined the group kinda late and >hadn't heard about it until recently. > >Joy Hall > >joyhall@peoples.net > >>---- >>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass >> >> > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 23 22:32:23 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMpTl-0000kna; Thu, 23 May 96 22:32 PDT X-Path: direct.ca!kmccullo From: direct.ca!kmccullo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: News Letter Date: Thu May 23 22:31:56 1996 Message-ID: <96May23.222523-0700pdt.28746-22401+1756@orb.direct.ca> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi all, quite frankly, and my 2 bits worth, I rather enjoy the exchanges we have. From across the pond and neighbours to the south and east. Guess what ? The SUN has made it's appearance here. Yahoooooo!!! Anyway, I was at wholesalers today, and telling them about all the wonderful, mature, informative people there are to converse with about our common interest. And on occassion throw in something that someone just might get a chuckle out of, even though it's not necessarily related. It's all part of who we are, and personally I at least try to see the lighter side of life. It's just too darn short to get caught up in trivial ---- (fill in your own blanks). Humour and feeling good is contagious but you have to "work" at it, the other stuff (meatheads, hotheads, pigheads, horsesass's) etc. is easy and takes no effort, I guess that's why it's so easy to get caught up in .... The wholesalers asked if I could print some of the info about subscribing to the news letter etc. and they'll post it in the store. I said I would except my printer has gone gafoooy (broken). Can't get it to go on line and I not sure if I can transfer this info to a regular file which I could then fax to them. Anybody have any suggestions ?? Besides the obvious, (getting my printer fixed). Karin (that's Karin with an i) I'm originally from as Toby would say across the pond. His side of the pond. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 02:15:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMswb-00015ga; Fri, 24 May 96 02:14 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: News Letter Date: 24 May 96 05:11:21 EDT Message-ID: <1996May24.91121.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Karin-with-an-i, Tell me who the wholesaler is and we'll be happy to send them a "poster" about the newsletter for them to put up. Flyers, too, of course. Albert-with-an-e ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 02:15:00 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMswb-00010sa; Fri, 24 May 96 02:14 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: 24 May 96 05:11:23 EDT Message-ID: <1996May24.91123.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Joy, There are two newsletters ... the first, "Common Ground: Glass," is a traditional printed ink-on-paper-with-photos quarterly published by the Guild. It's sent to members of the Guild, galleries, museums with glass collections and other interested people. The term "newsletter" is a little misleading, since it runs 32 to 72 pages ... more like a magazine. Then, a couple of weeks ago, the Guild started sending out IGGA NEWS MEMO! -- a more-or-less one-page electronic note about stained glass and other techniques and the people who use them. That's sent to a much wider group -- not just members of the Guild -- including bungi.com -- so you'll see it here. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 04:35:15 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMv8S-0001Cla; Fri, 24 May 96 04:34 PDT X-Path: g7-p7.wchat.on.ca!worldchat.com!sas From: Steve Anthony To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: News Letter Date: Fri, 24 May 96 04:34 PDT Message-ID: <1996May24.11340.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At , you wrote: Hi Karin, >From another "across the ponder" who by your address is quite close by. I could fax or otherwise get the info to you. Steve Anthony Burlington, Ontario. >Hi all, quite frankly, and my 2 bits worth, I rather enjoy the exchanges we >have. From across the pond and neighbours to the south and east. Guess what >? The SUN has made it's appearance here. Yahoooooo!!! > >Anyway, I was at wholesalers today, and telling them about all the >wonderful, mature, informative people there are to converse with about our >common interest. And on occassion throw in something that someone just might >get a chuckle out of, even though it's not necessarily related. It's all >part of who we are, and personally I at least try to see the lighter side >of life. It's just too darn short to get caught up in trivial ---- (fill in >your own blanks). Humour and feeling good is contagious but you have to >"work" at it, the other stuff (meatheads, hotheads, pigheads, horsesass's) >etc. is easy and takes no effort, I guess that's why it's so easy to get >caught up in .... > >The wholesalers asked if I could print some of the info about subscribing to >the news letter etc. and they'll post it in the store. I said I would except >my printer has gone gafoooy (broken). Can't get it to go on line and I not >sure if I can transfer this info to a regular file which I could then fax to >them. Anybody have any suggestions ?? Besides the obvious, (getting my >printer fixed). > >Karin (that's Karin with an i) I'm originally from as Toby would say across >the pond. His side of the pond. > > > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/gla > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 05:40:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMw98-0001KBa; Fri, 24 May 96 05:39 PDT X-Path: YaleVM.CIS.Yale.Edu!UCONNVM.UCONN.EDU!HCLADM02 From: HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Practice (was...soldering, etc.) Date: Fri, 24 May 96 08:31:01 EDT Message-ID: <960524.083823.EDT.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk To: glass@bungi.com In-Reply-To: <1996May23.10957.0> X-Mailer: MailBook 95.01.000 I can't recall having much of a problem soldering. Interestingly enough, my husband had worked in electronics for years and was used to using those soldering irons with tiny tips on tiny components, so he figured the soldering part would be a piece of cake. I think he carried that caution over. To this day, I solder faster and hotter than he does. Here's another practice idea for those of you who are real neophytes: Get cheap glass (broken windows, for example) and practice your inside curves on it. Yeah, it runs and breaks easier than most of what you'll be working with, but you'll start getting a feel for what you can do and what you can't, and how to do it (if you can) ;^). Have a good holiday weekend. Howard, get some sun if you can. -- Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 06:16:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMwia-0000zua; Fri, 24 May 96 06:15 PDT X-Path: intrastar.net!ssuter From: ssuter@intrastar.net (Shirley Suter) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Practice (was...soldering, etc.) Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 08:11:30 -0500 Message-ID: <1996May24.31130.0> References: <<960524.083823.EDT.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Intrastellar Internet Service - (409) 687-9067 Precedence: bulk HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu wrote: > > To: glass@bungi.com > In-Reply-To: <1996May23.10957.0> > X-Mailer: MailBook 95.01.000 > > I can't recall having much of a problem soldering. Interestingly enough, > my husband had worked in electronics for years and was used to using > those soldering irons with tiny tips on tiny components, so he figured > the soldering part would be a piece of cake. I think he carried that caution > over. To this day, I solder faster and hotter than he does. > Here's another practice idea for those of you who are real neophytes: Get > cheap glass (broken windows, for example) and practice your inside curves > on it. Yeah, it runs and breaks easier than most of what you'll be working > with, but you'll start getting a feel for what you can do and what you can't, > and how to do it (if you can) ;^). > Have a good holiday weekend. Howard, get some sun if you can. > > -- > Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 > UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 > HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass Hi Dorothy, I, too, was involved in electronics for years before starting my career in stained glass. I work hot and fast, maybe because I am not intimidated by the act of soldering. Also, I enjoy decorative soldering very much....and I attribute this directly to my experience with electronics...I get to use those tiny iron tips, and attaching beads and jewels is very similar to soldering tiny resistors, diodes, and capacitors. And yes, Howard, get some rest.....a break from the keyboard will do you some good! Shirley Ex-Neophyte from Grapeland, Tx. MY Grandmother's advise: Never cut your own hair on a BAD-HAIR Day!! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 07:14:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMxcJ-0000dYa; Fri, 24 May 96 07:13 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: hat in hand I ask for help Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:04:45 +0000 Message-ID: <199605241423.PAA06879@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Very happy to help too, but have the same "semantics" problems as Albert. Please clarify a little. Elizabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 07:14:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMxcL-0000cxa; Fri, 24 May 96 07:13 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: Flux, patinas and cleaning Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:04:45 +0000 Message-ID: <199605241423.PAA06872@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Katie, The good-old fashioned "elbow grease" has no substitute (very often) to such problems. Cleaning, cleaning and cleaning again is a very "low-tech" answer, but is the one that works well. Try and be absolutely "petty" about cleaning your work down after each process and certainly immediately before you start the "next" process. I think you will find that this pays dividends. Like Howard, I have the odd year or so of stained glass under my belt, yet have only too much still left to learn... I still learn from my own students and am always delighted at each new discovery.... Let us know how you get on... Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 07:14:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMxcK-0000g4a; Fri, 24 May 96 07:13 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: this 'n that Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:04:44 +0000 Message-ID: <199605241422.PAA06870@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hmm, should have known it was that "wicked woman" again; (Karin-with-an-i). Yea, yea .. I know... am still working on replies but am caught up in quarterly accounts and have only 4 days left before they are due (it's those nasty Customs people again, if you are late, they slap a penalty on you before you can blink!) I take it (Karin) that you don't have a fax modem (or access to one). If you do have one, you won't need your printer for faxing. I have already set up a separate file for Albert's News Memos in my system. Whether you have yet or not, you should be able to pull them out of the memory (or floppies) and faxing them direct from the computer, bypassing the printer altogether. Do I make sense?? Pity you're not closer - have 2 printers at the back of my car..... I think you've got the sunshine now, 'cause we ain't got none. It's been doing very little but rain,rain,rain over here this last week. Let's send some sunshine to Howard!! What can we do to make him purr rather than growl? There are surely one or two of us who can probably match his "statistics", but resist the temptation to rise to it. Let's have a smile, Howard! Elisabeth-with-an-s 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 07:14:46 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMxcJ-0000dwa; Fri, 24 May 96 07:13 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Superior Lead Came Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:04:44 +0000 Message-ID: <199605241423.PAA06874@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk The absolute "king" in Europe in lead came and related lead products is the Belgian Company called "Stillerman"; superb quality, adventerous, reliable and absolutely accurate. Want to know more, or is it too remote for you? Must surely be some importers/distributers across "The Pond". Glad to help, if I can. Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 08:04:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMyPJ-0001KBa; Fri, 24 May 96 08:04 PDT X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: ...soldering and other things that can make you want to ice pick some one... Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 08:02:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1996May24.121.0> References: <<1996May23.10957.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk When my students start to solder, I have them cut a "solder board" out of clear glass into about five 2 x 4 strips (also teach them to use the strip cutter in the same process). They foil the pieces and practice soldering before they do their project. Later when we go into decorative soldering, they use their "solder board" to practice different types of soldering skills. Works for us. Peggy Johnsen Santa Maria, CA ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 08:15:18 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uMyZV-0000yWa; Fri, 24 May 96 08:14 PDT X-Path: slonet.org!edupjohn From: "Peggy W. Johnsen" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: Flux, patinas and cleaning Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 08:12:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1996May24.11233.0> References: <<199605241423.PAA06872@linux.nildram.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have learned that my projects accept black patina better if I wash it as soon as I finish soldering using soal and water. I brush the patina on to the color I like. If the patina "skips" areas it is probably due to the oxides in the solder. If I am using a spool of solder that has been out in the open, I sometimes use the fine steel wool (0000) and clean the solder wire before I solder with it. Brushing on the black patina works well and immediately rinsing. I let it dry and apply the wax and leave it overnight before polishing the project. Works for me. PJ from Santa Maria. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 11:36:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN1ib-0000uza; Fri, 24 May 96 11:36 PDT X-Path: bright.net!joyce From: Joyce Moran To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Flag pattern Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:35:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605241835.OAA21323@brutus.bright.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I looking for a flag pattern. Would like it to be as simple as possible, but at this point will take anything. Thanks for everyone's help in advance. Joyce Moran joyce@bungi.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 12:48:50 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN2qC-0000yDa; Fri, 24 May 96 12:48 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Howards cranky soldering advice Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:47:56 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May24.114756.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-23 17:28:21 EDT, you write: >While your >advice is appreciated nxet time please wait till you get over your attack of >the >"crankies". > Donna S. Thank you Donna. My sentiments exactely. We are all learning. If we stop learning we'll become stale, even if we've been doing glass for 15 or more years. Janet F. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 12:49:51 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN2rL-0000yBa; Fri, 24 May 96 12:49 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:47:55 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May24.114755.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-23 00:03:43 EDT, Guitarshop@aol.com writes: > I agree with the concensious about using 0000 steel wool. It does seem to >make the finished patina job better. Hello list, I was told by my instructor that using bronze wool was better is this true? If so why, or why not if it's not better. Does it make any difference? Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 14:32:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN4Rx-0000hNa; Fri, 24 May 96 14:31 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!100354.1531 From: Michael Read <100354.1531@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:glass@bungi.com" Subject: Re: Soldering as I see it. Date: 24 May 96 17:27:50 EDT Message-ID: <1996May24.212750.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Howard Sounds as though you were having a bad hair day when you did this post. But seriously it was very sensible an d practical advice. Neophytes must practise, practise, practise preferably not on their latest magnum opus but on odd pieces till they get the 'feel' of it. The other thing they must do is relax,as I think Joy has already commented. tension will make them work too slowly ( or too fast) they will get cramp and their hands will shake. So - relax, practise and enjoy! Michael and Jan Read ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 14:53:56 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN4nY-00011wa; Fri, 24 May 96 14:53 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 17:10:24 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May23.131024.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Sorry to open this can of worms again but I have a question about = copyrights. My brother wanted some windows done and he and his wife = could not decide on a single pattern. So I took two patterns and = combined them both to get what they wanted. Since I am not selling this = piece and will not be making it again, this question is = hypothetical...am I the "creator" of a new pattern or just the = manipulator? and if (Divine being forbid) some one saw this piece and = wanted to buy several, do I have to contact both the pattern makers? I = am really new at this whole copyright issue and am trying to learn so I = dont step on anybody's toes or infringe on any ones livelihood. Katie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 15:02:08 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN4vc-00011sa; Fri, 24 May 96 15:01 PDT X-Path: aol.com!DMacrae102 From: DMacrae102@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 18:01:39 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May24.14139.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-24 05:15:38 EDT, you write: >There are two newsletters ... the first, "Common Ground: Glass," is a >traditional printed ink-on-paper-with-photos quarterly published by the >Guild. >It's sent to members of the Guild, galleries, museums with glass collections >and >other interested people. The term "newsletter" is a little misleading, since >it >runs 32 to 72 pages ... more like a magazine. > >Then, a couple of weeks ago, the Guild started sending out IGGA NEWS MEMO! -- >a >more-or-less one-page electronic note about stained glass and other >techniques >and the people who use them. That's sent to a much wider group -- not just >members of the Guild -- including bungi.com -- so you'll see it here. > __________________________________________ > Albert Lewis Executive Director > International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. > Albert, Is the "magazine" available to non-guild-members? If so, how does one go about getting copies and/or subscription. Is Common Ground: Glass too technical for a beginner? Thanks in advance, Don dmacrae102@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 15:07:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN50M-0000tFa; Fri, 24 May 96 15:06 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: FW: Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 18:04:27 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May24.14427.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ---------- From: C Lambert[SMTP:clambert@monmouth.com] Sent: Thursday, May 23, 1996 5:10 PM To: 'glass@bungi.com' Subject: Hope I dont get "yelled at... Sorry to open this can of worms again but I have a question about = copyrights. My brother wanted some windows done and he and his wife = could not decide on a single pattern. So I took two patterns and = combined them both to get what they wanted. Since I am not selling this = piece and will not be making it again, this question is = hypothetical...am I the "creator" of a new pattern or just the = manipulator? and if (Divine being forbid) some one saw this piece and = wanted to buy several, do I have to contact both the pattern makers? I = am really new at this whole copyright issue and am trying to learn so I = dont step on anybody's toes or infringe on any ones livelihood. Katie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 15:17:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN5AP-00012ka; Fri, 24 May 96 15:17 PDT X-Path: city.lethbridge.ab.ca!scottd From: Donald Scott To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Bronze or Steel sheep - Which ones are the best? Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 14:41:38 -0700 Message-ID: <1996May24.74138.0> References: <<1996May24.114755.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: Lethbridge Fire Department Precedence: bulk IMN2GLASS@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 96-05-23 00:03:43 EDT, Guitarshop@aol.com writes: > > > I agree with the concensious about using 0000 steel wool. It does seem > to > >make the finished patina job better. > > Hello list, > > I was told by my instructor that using bronze wool was better is this true? > If so why, or why not if it's not better. Does it make any difference? I believe that the difference is that steel wool will rust whereas the bronze wool will not. There may also be some difference in the abrasive quality since steel is harder than bronze. I know that bronze is harder to find. Don Scott ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 15:50:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN5gj-000148a; Fri, 24 May 96 15:50 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Recent work @ Loyola Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 15:50:21 -0700 Message-ID: <199605242250.PAA11145@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >Would you share a photo of it, either a slide or print, with an eye to >publication in "Common Ground: Glass," the Guild's newsletter? (As well as, we >hope eventually, in the online version of the newsletters that we're putting >together to archive here?) > >If so, send it to > __________________________________________ > Albert Lewis Executive Director > International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. > Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 > __________________________________________ > >---- I am currently waiting for the photos to be developed. When they are done I will send some on. M.S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 16:07:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN5wT-0000G8a; Fri, 24 May 96 16:06 PDT X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51 From: Elaine & Howard Rubin To: Glass list Subject: not too cranky, yet Date: Fri, 24 May 96 16:02:57 -0500 Message-ID: <199605242306.QAA28630@desiree.teleport.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- How about using the plastic, green type pot scrubbers, they do not contaminate the unused patina, leave no wool "hairs", will not rust. They are as abrasive as steel wool, and need to be used carefully as they can scratch as well. As for cleaning before patina, I do use the green scrubbers with an abrasive cleanser. Works well for me, and I get a 'good" patina. One more tip, heat up the patina by putting the jar of it in a 1/2 gal container (old milk jug) with HOT water. Yes that stuff "do" work better with heat. Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each hand with the thumbs pointing in. Enjoy (sorry, could not help it). -- new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 16:53:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN6eq-00013wa; Fri, 24 May 96 16:52 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Recent work @ Loyola Date: 24 May 96 19:50:57 EDT Message-ID: <1996May24.235057.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I am currently waiting for the photos to be developed. When they are >done I will send some on. Great! I'll watch for them. Do you have our address? ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 16:53:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN6eq-0000qoa; Fri, 24 May 96 16:52 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: IGGA Newsletter Date: 24 May 96 19:51:05 EDT Message-ID: <1996May24.23515.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >Is the "magazine" available to non-guild-members? If so, how does one go >about getting copies and/or subscription. Is Common Ground: Glass too >technical for a beginner? Don, While it's not available to non-members, the student/hobbyist membership level is only $25/year, which is equal to the cost of the four quarterly issues, plus postage, if you want to look at it that way. Of course, there's more to the Guild and membership than just the 36- to 72-page newsletter, so you *could look at all of that as merely a "bonus" to getting a "subscription." (You'll soon be able to take a peek at back issues here in the archives of bungi.com -- I'm about halfway through prepping the first issue as a set of web pages, although there won't be as many pictures, as in the print version; watch for an announcement.) Too technical? I wouldn't say so. Some of it might be more than some people are "ready for," but that's how one grows and develops, isn't it? If I were a tennis player, for instance, I'd want to play against people better than I am. More interesting, more challenging, etc. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 24 18:51:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uN8VH-00012Sa; Fri, 24 May 96 18:50 PDT X-Path: prodigy.com!MPGP79B From: MPGP79B@prodigy.com (PEGGY M PALM) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Steel wool vs ?? Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 21:45:17, -0500 Message-ID: <199605250145.VAA25386@mime2.prodigy.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk As well as the pot scrubber things Howard mentioned, there are similar plastic wool (???) pads available in hardware stores. The type I have is white and is graded like steel wool (in this case 0000), thus might be less likely to scratch. They are washable and reusable. In fact, I discovered that washing them before use is advisable: New, they are quite stiff and don't conform well to beaded solder and tight corners. Once they are softened up a bit, they work quite well. I also have a bronze wool "sheep" that I haven't tried out yet. Will let you know how it works when I do... Peggy ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 25 04:29:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNHWF-0000wba; Sat, 25 May 96 04:28 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Practice (was...soldering, etc.) Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 07:28:18 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May25.32818.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Dorothy, My husband took electronics soldering courses. He's a Telephone Tech in the Coast Guard. He can't watch me solder. It makes him crazy. He likes the finished product, but just can't handle watching someone intentionally running a BEAD of solder. When he solders stuff you can't see the solder joint, it's all very precise. So now when I'm soldering glass, he just goes away. I think it's funny. :-) Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 25 05:50:59 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNInR-00012Ca; Sat, 25 May 96 05:50 PDT X-Path: netsync.net!shdybrk From: shdybrk@netsync.net (shadybrook farm) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: Flux, patinas and cleaning Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 08:48:59 -0400 Message-ID: Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have seen so many methods for applying patina here in the last few days but have not seen the method I learned way back in "glass class" a few years back. It's really quite simple and will sound a tad strange to folks but it works like a charm. I use the "Novacan" patina. After all the soldering is done, I set about to remove all the flux using a flux remover. After that I thoroughly scrub the whole piece with dish detergent. I rinse it completely with HOT water to get all the soap scum off. Immediately, without drying the water off, I apply the patina with a brush and rub it on the solder lines. You will get a very rich black color. I continue to rinse in the hot water to get the patina residue off and apply the patina where needed until done. The heat of the water seems to be the key to getting a nice black finish. This works well with the pieces I can fit in my big washtub in the basement. I did two 5' x 1' sidelights once and simply took them outside across 2x4's on the ground and hooked up my hose to the hot water. It worked quite well and it isn't necessary to heat any chemicals seperately. Just thought I'd share with you! Keep all those ideas coming! Karen Zuchowski ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 25 18:21:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNUVh-0000Xea; Sat, 25 May 96 18:20 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 21:19:22 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May25.171922.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-24 19:08:24 EDT, you write: > Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each >hand with the thumbs pointing in. Ohhhh, THAT must have been the problem. I wondered.... Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sat May 25 20:16:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNWJ4-00014na; Sat, 25 May 96 20:15 PDT X-Path: prodigy.com!NFTJ15A From: NFTJ15A@prodigy.com (MR HARRY W GERLACH) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: unsubscribe Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 23:11:25, -0500 Message-ID: <199605260311.XAA23496@mime4.prodigy.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk -- [ From: HARRY W. GERLACH * EMC.Ver #2.10P ] -- please UNsubscribe ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 04:02:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNdZz-0000zaa; Sun, 26 May 96 04:01 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Restoration Questions Date: 26 May 96 07:00:44 EDT Message-ID: <1996May26.11044.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk I have been asked to help restore several windows which are about 80-100 years old. The main problem with them is that a few pieces of glass in them are broken. While I have worked with stained glass for a number of years, I have never tried to repair something this old. I am hopeful that I will be able to locate the necessary glass, but I have a few questions related to restoration in general. 1. Is it possible to simply replace the broken pieces using new lead came and then using a petina to make the new came match the old came? 2. Will solder attach to old lead came, especially that which has been exposed to the elements? 3. A friend of mine suggested disassembling the old window, disposing of the old came and going in with new lead came. Is this necessary? And is it the best approach??? 4. My final question, and I know how much you will hate this one: Any idea what the going rate is on this kind of work? Thanks for whatever help or suggestions you can provide. =Gary >1. Is it possible to simply replace the broken pieces using new lead >came and then using a petina to make the new came match the old came? Yes to all of that, although serious restorers try to save every bit of original glass. If the pieces are broken, they're glued together or saved in some other way. If a piece is too far gone to save and reinsert into the window, the bits of glass are carefully stored and returned to the client against the day a technique might arise to restore them to their original place. >2. Will solder attach to old lead came, especially that which has been >exposed to the elements? Yes to that, too, although you might have to clean any corrosion off the surface before soldering. >3. A friend of mine suggested disassembling the old window, disposing of >the old came and going in with new lead came. Is this necessary? And is it the best approach??? Partial releading is done all the time. So is full releading. Both are considered good restoration practice; it's the lead that's considered replaceable (since it's merely the matrix to hold the glass), although there are cases when it's not (a window from a Boston museum being restored recently still had 13th-century lead in it; in that case, the lead itself was preserved as well.) >4. My final question, and I know how much you will hate this one: Any >idea what the going rate is on this kind of work? It varies, but it's usually very expensive ... more so than new work, since more time and labor's involved (you should photographically document the original, take rubbings so you can reassemble it properly, carefully take the window apart, preserve old bits (see above), then reassemble it). I've seen special and complex windows measuring ... oh, 3'x 5' ... that cost a quarter of a million dollars to restore. You should get Julie Sloan's "Conservation of Stained Glass in America -- a Manual for Studios and Caretakers" [1995, Art in Architecture Press]. It's available (shameless plug follows) from The Guild Library, the Guild's book service. I'll send you some info about it privately. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 05:45:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNfBy-0000uda; Sun, 26 May 96 05:45 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Restoration Questions Date: 26 May 96 08:43:17 EDT Message-ID: <1996May26.124317.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi Gary.. Well.. there's "fixing" and "restoration". There's an order of magnitude in difference, both in costs and expense, and in the level of work. I'd suggest that the first thing you do, is to do a full evaluation of the windows, in place. Take lots of pictures, stick little numbered dots on the windows so you can find the details, and take very accurate measurements. This is typically referred to as "documentation" of the windows, and can be an extensive project in and of itself. But this will give you a complete record of the condition of the windows prior to your doing anything to them. I'd also suggest that you examine the windows on site, looking for more than just broken glass. Are the came joints deteriorated? Is the came corroded? Are the windows compromised structurally? (Are they bowed in , pushed out, crooked in their frames, etc.?) What about the supporting framework, what sort of shape are the traceries (or whatever) in at the moment, and what if anything needs to be done to them to accommodate the windows? Also look for some destructive aspects to the installation, such as heavy wind load, or moisture, condensation, vandalism, etc. I'll also suggest that you find out exactly what the owners of the windows expect. What do they want done, how much are they willing to spend, and are they looking for a top quality certified "restoration" or an inexpensive "quick fix" to patch some minor damage? Okay.. now to some thoughts.. not necessarily answers to your questions. 1. Yes, it's possible to replace just sections of the existing lead cames. Often it's not very easy, as weathered lead cames can be very brittle and unforgiving. While it may be possible to find a suitable shaped came now, you probably will not be able to make such a patch "invisible". Even using patinas and other chemicals, you're not going to duplicate the effects of 80 years of exposure to the elements. While the new cames may not be objectionable, they certainly will be noticeable at close range. 2. You'll probably have to really clean the existing cames, perhaps abrading off some of the surface to expose the underlying material before the solder will bond to it. Again, this is a possible solution, but remember that the old cames and the new cames, and the new solder, all will melt at different temperatures. It can be some very tricky soldering. 3. For a full blown, top notch "restoration", the standard approach is to totally disassemble the window, and fully replace all of the lead cames. This can be extremely difficult work, very tedious. It also requires the very careful cleaning of the existing glass, and close matching of that glass with new repair pieces. Depending on the complexity of the window, this approach can be extremely time consuming. I'll also note here, that when such full "restorations" are performed, it's usually done by contract, and the expectation of the owners will be that the windows are exactly as they were when originally installed. For that reason, be very certain what the expectations are, and also have some consideration for the value of the windows. If they are of historical significance, extremely complex, and/or highly valued, you'll need to get yourself insured to cover yourself in case of accidental damage. Sad but true.. ours is a litigious society. You may even have to get a contractors' license just to accept the job, check your local codes. 4. Like most things that involve various levels of both experience and technique, there are no set figures for doing this sort of work. Again, it boils down to the complexity of the window, and what needs to be done. But, this is very specialized work, and extremely time consuming to do a full restoration. I've seen examples where the same window could be duplicated with current materials in less than a third of the time needed to do a "restoration". Since you already work in glass, you know that an "hourly" rate is rather thin, so I'd suggest bidding on the entire job, as a package. Do not underestimate your costs, and factor in at least half again the time you think the job will take. Much past that, I won't go, it's your decision to commit to do this, not mine. Finally, I'll offer a few other ideas. First off, remember that just because a window is old, doesn't mean that it's significant, or has any great value to it. Sure, there will be lots of sentimental value attached, and that's the rub. You can't put a value on sentiment. I've been asked to do similar work over the years, and I've turned it down because there were just too many obstacles to jump over. In dealing with churches, you're dealing with committees.. none of whom have a clue what's involved, but whatever your price, it'll be more than they can afford. With private parties, the windows may not really be worth a restoration, especially if complicated things need to be done, like matching painted areas, or special glass, etc. Whatever way it goes, be sure to get some money up front, set a reasonable time frame, and get a signed contract to complete the work. Be sure that your abilities are up to the challenges, and that you can perform the work - and still make enough to make it worthwhile for you to undertake the task. There are companies that do nothing but restorations, and they get very well paid for their work. It's quite possible that whomever has contacted you, may have already gotten a bid from such a firm. Ask to see it, it may help you get an idea of what to charge, or at least what the job was worth to someone else. Good luck, and.. Peace -Gerry PS.. there is a very good book on glass restoration by Julie Sloan titled "Conservation of Stained Glass in America" [1995, Art in Architecture Press] available from the IGGA, and most major art glass suppliers (like Ed Hoy and D&L Stained Glass), the Corning Museum of Glass and the Metropolitan Museum of Art, to note a few. ----------------- >stick little numbered dots on the windows so you can find the details, Ack! Be careful about this if the windows are painted; the dots' adhesive could pull off deteriorated paint! >when such "restorations" are performed, it's usually done by contract, Quite true. The stained glass restorer on the windows of a New York synagogue currently was presented with an 80-page contract. Of course, the congregation's made up most of attorneys. It took eight months to resolve the contract questions and finalize it all ... and that was *before any work began. >If they are of historical significance, extremely complex, and/or >highly valued, you'll need to get yourself insured to cover yourself in >case of accidental damage. Sad but true.. ours is a litigious society. Absolutely. Although one should be insured in *any case, even if one is repairing or restoring the most banal sidelights of a tract house. If you have employees, the risks involved in restoration work are higher than in the creation of new work, since "unzipping" old windows releases enormous amounts of lead dust, etc., putting them at risk. The perhaps finest restoration studio in the country, located in western Massachusetts, has a complete (and very expensive) exhaust system in the unzipping department, as well as rigid requirements for employee hygiene, lab coats, changing rooms, regular blood tests, etc. And that's just where the *employees are concerned; extensive precautions are taken on site (since lead dusts can infiltrate church spaces and put the members of the congregation at risk, particularly the children), not only because people might sue for real or imagined health problems that result, but because environmental cleanup of lead dusts can be more expensive than the restoration work itself. >You may even have to get a contractors' license just to accept the job, >check your local codes. And in some metropolitan areas, one must join the glazier's union in order to work on any buildings in the city. >just because a window is old, doesn't mean that it's significant, or has >any great value to it. Sure, there will be lots of sentimental value >attached, and that's the rub. You can't put a value on sentiment. Quite true. If the window's important to the owner, it's important to the restorer and the restorer's job is to respect the original intentions of the artist, whether the artist is well known or not. >whatever your price, it'll be more than they can afford. With private >parties, the windows may not really be worth a restoration, especially if >complicated things need to be done, like matching painted areas, or >special glass, etc. Sure, there've been many cases where glass has actually been manufactured to match old glass. Very, very expensive but worth it to some owners. Rarely done, but it does happen. >There are companies that do nothing but restorations, and they get very >well paid for their work. It's quite possible that whomever has >contacted you, may have already gotten a bid from such a firm. Ask to >see it, it may help you get an idea of what to charge, or at least what >the job was worth to someone else. Umm. There's an ethical question here. Certainly if the other studio(s) bidding on the job discovered that their bid(s) were exposed to other bidders they'd be very upset (see tendency of people to sue each other, above). If the client's willing to show others' bids to you, they'll also show your bid to others and that sort of thing ... one's bids ... are usually considered proprietary information, very private, etc., since one can impute the bidder's costs of doing business from them, which would allow competing companies to have information about you that perhaps you'd rather they didn't have. Same kind of ethical question arises when one studio is asked to write the specifications for the job: that studio should not also be allowed to bid on the work or actually do the work. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 09:27:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNier-0000kua; Sun, 26 May 96 09:27 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!71612.3254 From: DJ Stamm <71612.3254@CompuServe.COM> To: GLASS Subject: SUBSCRIBE Date: 26 May 96 12:25:52 EDT Message-ID: <1996May26.162552.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk SUBSCRIBE GLASS 71612.3254@COMPUSERVE.COM ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 17:50:01 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNqV1-0000yHa; Sun, 26 May 96 17:49 PDT X-Path: mail.nildram.co.uk!glass From: "Toby" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Summary: Authenticated sender is Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 01:40:31 +0000 Message-ID: <199605270056.BAA32487@linux.nildram.co.uk> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 21:19:22 -0400 Reply-to: glass@bungi.com In a message dated 96-05-24 19:08:24 EDT, you write: > Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each >hand with the thumbs pointing in. Ohhhh, THAT must have been the problem. I wondered.... Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- ...my thumbs were pointing OUT; now I know why it all went wrong!! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 18:15:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNquD-0000goa; Sun, 26 May 96 18:15 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: not too cranky, yet Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 21:14:43 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May26.171443.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4B48.665CB1E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit THUMBS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? NOBODY SAID NOTHING ABOUT NEEDING THUMBS! NO WONDER I HAVE BEEN HAVING PROBLEMS.... ---------- From: Toby[SMTP:toby@northlights.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, May 26, 1996 9:40 PM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 21:19:22 -0400 Reply-to: glass@bungi.com In a message dated 96-05-24 19:08:24 EDT, you write: > Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each >hand with the thumbs pointing in. Ohhhh, THAT must have been the problem. I wondered.... Janet IMN2GLASS@aol.com ---- ...my thumbs were pointing OUT; now I know why it all went wrong!! Elisabeth 'n Toby ---- As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" North Lights Stained Glass - homepage http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm ---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4B48.665CB1E0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgEBAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAYAAAAUkU6IG5vdCB0b28gY3Jhbmt5LCB5ZXQA+gcB BYADAA4AAADMBwUAGgAVAA4AKwAAAEABASCAAwAOAAAAzAcFABoAFQANABIAAAAmAQEJgAEAIQAA AEU2MjA2ODI4M0JCN0NGMTFBREY0NDQ0NTUzNTQwMDAwAO8GAQOQBgCgBQAAEgAAAAsAIwAAAAAA AwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5ACDT8+JpS7sBHgBwAAEAAAAYAAAAUkU6IG5vdCB0 b28gY3Jhbmt5LCB5ZXQAAgFxAAEAAAAWAAAAAbtLaeI8KGgg57c7Ec+t9ERFU1QAAAAAHgAeDAEA AAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8MAQAAABYAAABjbGFtYmVydEBtb25tb3V0aC5jb20AAAADAAYQCIZz rQMABxBaAwAAHgAIEAEAAABlAAAAVEhVTUJTPz8/Pz8/Pz9OT0JPRFlTQUlETk9USElOR0FCT1VU TkVFRElOR1RIVU1CU05PV09OREVSSUhBVkVCRUVOSEFWSU5HUFJPQkxFTVMtLS0tLS0tLS0tRlJP TTpUT0JZUwAAAAACAQkQAQAAACIEAAAeBAAAagcAAExaRnVBxugG/wAKAQ8CFQKoBesCgwBQAvIJ AgBjaArAc2V0MjcGAAbDAoMyA8UCAHByQnER4nN0ZW0CgzN3AuQHEwKAfQqACM8J2TvxFg8yNTUC gAqBDbELYOBuZzEwMxRQCwoUUQUL8mMAQCBUSFVNUEJTPyEbWyAHsE8QQk9EWQYAQUlEYxxRGvBJ TkcUsByAVWJUB7BFRUQdYhr0IQMcQBxRIFdPTkRFAFIgSSBIQVZFNCBCHhBOH9IdYlBS6RxwTEUF 4C4hcQqFCosgbGkxODAC0WkteDE0NA3wDNAjkwtZMa42CqADYBPQYwVALSW3rwqHJGsMMCU2RgNh Oia+ByU2DIIa4G9ieVtTIE1UUDp0KoFAbgUVsWgi8GdodHMu4QWgLnVrXSZfJ20GYAcCMCifKatT dW5kYYx5LAXQMOAgMjYxAIAxOTk2IDk6I7B9IOBNLI8nbSpwLs8pq2eTC2AEEEBiMLBnaSwRxm0y by2edWJqJXE0j3kpq1JlOcArYAVAKxBv1iAFAABwazDxeRHAIb95IsMzNiQ3GkUn3EBnSQBNTjJH TEFTU/xAYQbwNxk0YkK5Nm8Ko885V0BkO688u0RhE9BAWT0GEHQxABhAMRMxozIxkjoxoDoyEeAt MCOw5wp2RcALUHktKxBAVUN/JT06SQOgYSAHgXNhWGdlIDDQE9BkMeA2IUowNS0yNDGROjBuOEnw T1AeIFQ8wQhgIA53BRBHwT0cPiBPZv9GcAhhEbBF8UXwCeBOwCsQi03xAjBpAiAgVVMgEPVBQE8g AFMxABNQDcAEkLsBoEsgIAIgTmBTkWUA0L5oUWYRgDDAUIBQsGhGMDZoTmArkHUG0AQgcG83C4BT cBkQIAuAIa1PaJdZYTEAGvBBHeBtdRPA6iARgHZOYGIJ4VbzJTH7AmAT4C5A4VCAAiAEgQmAgSFy IDxWQkc+PRx+SgBwPPdBDwqFJhkhcW27MUBXRXdcQVeoHcE7RfHLB+AfwGti8ndoMUBQsH1N0GwD IGHAAjBQgQIgZ/QhIQqFRSLwTjBasFbR/icDoCpyX98UsAQgYSEJwF9WcQRgVwEFwE4waU7AIn8h cWiCTmAEAFUhVQErYGIvAxBQsFURUgBtC4BkIuUKhU4rciBMK8MGAAGQ+wuATrFHS/IloFpQA3BL AAdOQQqFK+B0cDovL3p3bvAuXiEi8DyQLBQv41ogBJBzL2sFEHBQK2miL2sRZXguK+BtIhbrJhkm GUYFsXM5YAT0U4L/EXEZEAeQVGFbgEwATmAAwNcDEUtSS+MtFhBxClATwP9MPypwaMAJ8FLzVwJl kUixr0BjdZ9L/2dzchFwaVqA/wQgWnB2EVThTmBHsG56Nsf+L3sTPRw9jz6fJUUKhRUxAgCDkAAA AwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAEAABzAAKHmwaUu7AUAACDAAKHmwaUu7AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAA AAAAOKM= ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4B48.665CB1E0-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Sun May 26 23:03:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uNvOY-0000gha; Sun, 26 May 96 23:03 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!100354.1531 From: Michael Read <100354.1531@CompuServe.COM> To: BUNGI Subject: Mottled glass Date: 27 May 96 00:15:28 EDT Message-ID: <1996May27.41528.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi I hope Howard has recovered sufficiently from his bad hair attack to advise us on mottled glass. We bought some when we were in Australia last year (we cannot get here in NZ) and I read somewhere that it has special characteristics (unknown to us). We do know it is very hard to cut. Any advice? We also have some lovely glass seemingly made with layers. This is also very hard to cut, Michael and Jan Read ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 09:12:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO4tM-0000iqa; Mon, 27 May 96 09:11 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Restoration Questions Date: 27 May 96 07:11:48 EDT Message-ID: <960527111148_70544.3642_JHD38-3@CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hello yourself, Gerry. You put the sticky notes/dots on the cames? Oh, well then, forget my hysterical response about the potential fragility of glass paint. No, don't forget it; it's still something that others here should keep in mind. And as for asking for ballpark ideas from the client on what the budget is, I understand now that you weren't expecting to see other studios' actual prices from their bids, although I still think that those studios would be upset that one would be "learning by picking their brains" even by examining what work they propose for the project. (I didn't mean to imply that *you were proposing something unethical or that *you are unethical, of course, but I *did want to point out the problem generally.) After all, in a bidding situation, whether for HVAC, repairs to a roof, or restoration of stained glass, the expectation on the part of all bidders is that there's a level playing field and that the amount of expertise and experience each bidder brings to the table is evident in the work proposed and the price asked. If a bidder is incapable of describing the work or if the work proposed is obviously not as carefully thought out as that proposed by another studio, that's the kind of information a client should have to make an intelligent decision. I would think that asking what other propose to do would only indicate that one doesn't know *oneself what should be done. If you had been doing serious restoration for thirty years and, in your bid, described exactly what you propose to do, based on that thirty years' experience, to preserve and strengthen a window so that it will endure for another 100 years or more ... and then your carefully written description of the work you propose is given to someone else with much less experience who then from the written description learns what's taken you 30 years to acquire .. you might understandably feel a certain unfairness in that. And "bottom dollar figures," if actually accepted by clients, can lead to problems, as well, since they can be seen as indications that the bidder doesn't really know what he/she is getting into. It's a common practice, in bidding situations, to automatically throw out the lowest and highest bids. If too low a price is asked, a studio might well be unable to complete the job and go bankrupt in the middle of the work, which would only lead to problems in recovery of the window by the client and additional expense in re-bidding the work; if too high, the client's paying too much, as a rule ... and as a rule that's why both highest and lowest bids are tossed. Which doesn't mean, of course, that all clients are this reasoned in their decision-making or that some clients wouldn't take the lowest bid without thinking about whether it would/could lead to subsequent problems. In fact, some clients (I'm thinking of state/city agencies, for instance) might be *required to take the lowest bid, nevermind what pitfalls might be involved, but no one's ever accused government agencies of being especially smart. But to ask the client, "just where does my pricing have to fall, to be considered for this job?" can also be seen by the client as an indication that you don't know yourself what the job will cost, although I understand that you're trying to determine if they themselves realize what the job is worth or *should cost and you're trying to avoid wasting time preparing a bid for a client who has some ridiculous idea of getting an inherently expensive restoration job done "for cheap." That's a perfectly understandable attitude on your part. But a studio or craftsperson experienced in restoration should *know that the work is going to be expensive since, as I've pointed out, so much more labor and time is involved in restoration than in the creation of new work. If that's pointed out to the client or the restoration committee -- "it's going to be expensive!" -- and then an explanation given of *why it's expensive, whatever the committee/client may have had in their minds regarding the cost of the work can be set aside. In other words, you may have to *convince them that your (higher) price is both valid and reasonable, but clients can (and quite often are) convinced to accept a (much!) higher price. Sure, the client may be unreasonable and, after having had your costs explained to them, they may still insist on going for the lowest price, the more fools they. But having to go through "lengthy preparations, detailed drawings, and a full-blown workup," only to have your bid rejected is just part of doing business. If you and ten other studios bid on a job, only one of you is going to *get the job; that means nine people went to the work of preparing the bids without seeing any return from it. The cost of preparing bids is merely part of the overhead of running a business and, in the very competitive world of stained glass restoration, a large part of that overhead. Of course, that means that if you win only one bid in ten, the cost of preparing those other nine lost bids has to be built into the one that was won, so bidding is a delicate procedure; if you win only one in ten, you're doing something very wrong. And sure, some clients *will use (or will want to use) your bid and description of work unethically; that's why many studios copyright their proposals or incorporate language that (supposedly) prevents such "sharing around" of the information they've spent years developing. If a client's going to behave like that before the work's even begun, they're going to be even worse at the other end, when payments are due, and you're well out of it to avoid taking the job at all. You're right. Stained glass restoration *is a complicated process, true. Not only do you have to know the techniques that will preserve heritage works for another five generations, you also have to be businesslike and sufficiently sound in your operating practices to protect yourself and those who work for you. The artistic value of the stained glass work, the intrinsic historical or sentimental value to the owner/client of the windows themselves, the demands and concerns of landmark committees and local/state building requirements, the needs of you and your family and of your employees, the ability of the client to pay ... all must be balanced so that none of them are harmed. After all, if the windows are damaged by poor restoration done at rock-bottom prices or if the studio has to go out of business because too little has been asked to do the job properly, everyone loses. My 2c worth, Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 09:12:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO4tO-0000jAa; Mon, 27 May 96 09:11 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Restoration Questions Date: 27 May 96 07:11:40 EDT Message-ID: <960527111139_70544.3642_JHD38-1@CompuServe.COM> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ----Forwarded Message(s)---- #: 258799 S5/Glasswork [HANDCRAF] 27-May-96 03:49:09 Sb: #258488-Restoration Questions Fm: Gerry Phibbs/CA[Staff] 76556,624 To: Albert Lewis 70544,3642 Hi Albert.. We agree on most points here.. basically that "restoration" is a very sticky situation most of the time. As to sticky dots.. well, I usually place them on the cames, as reference points for the photographs and documentation, not on the glass itself. I suspect "post-it" notes would work as well, maybe better. My only suggestion about other bids, wasn't intended to raise the spector of ethical dilemas, not at all. But in my experience, by the time a restoration job has been offered to an individual artist, there's usually been some input from a larger studio that specializes in such work. While I may not (ethically) ask to see the actual bid, I do believe it reasonable to inquire whether other bids have been solicited, and to get a ball park sort of range of pricing, nothing necessarily specific, but something pertaining to the overall repair/restoration job. In truth, contracting for glass work is no different from contracting for any other type of professional service, electrical, plastering, HVAC, etc. As a general rule, I suggest that most people looking for such work, obtain several bids, and use them as guidelines to make their informed decisions. In many cases, it's not the bottom dollar figure, but what has been spelled out in the contract/bid that offers the most information. No, I'm not really suggesting asking for a copy of someone else's bid.. I phrased that sentance a bit too quickly, and you've caught me on it. What I meant to say was to ask if there have been other bids on the work, and to see if you can get a "ballpark" figure as to what sort of dollar figure these bids represented. In some cases, I've specifically asked the question.. "just where does my pricing have to fall, to be considered for this job?" That question has yet to reveal any other company's secret proprietary information, but it has allowed me to decide whether or not I want to continue to pursue the situation. Oftentimes, the telling factor is the amount that the owner or "restoration committee" has allocated for the work, and then it's seldom a matter of beating somebody else, but of deciding if you want to take on such a project for that set dollar figure. And.. I'll also toss this in. More than once, I've gone through lengthy preparations, detailed drawings, and a full blown work up, only to have my "bid" used to leverage someone else into doing the work for less money. There are ethics involved on all sides of this sort of situation, and usually it's the customer that plays fast and loose in the gray areas, because it's their money that's involved. Odd how ethics can get supplanted by the almighty buck! I hope this glass person is able to step through this minefield successfully, but it's a far more complicated process than most of us are eager to get involved in. When in doubt, ask for some money to secure the project in one's scheduling. If the money is not forthcoming, it gives a fair indication of just how committed the folks are to the restoration project. Peace -Gerry ----End Forwarded Message(s)---- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 09:38:02 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO5Id-000039a; Mon, 27 May 96 09:37 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: BlindCopyReceiver:;@compuserve,.com Subject: IGGA NEWS MEMO! 05/27/96 Date: 27 May 96 12:35:45 EDT Message-ID: <1996May27.163545.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ----------------------------------------------------------------- IGGA Online News Memo! May 27, 1996 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Random glass info passed along after being compiled by the International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. a 501(c)(6) nonprofit organization ----------------------------------------------------------------- $144,000 IN GLASS ARTIST FELLOWSHIPS OFFERED BY CREATIVE GLASS CENTER IN NEW JERSEY The Creative Glass Center of America is offering 12 fellowships to glass artists during 1997, each of whom is underwritten to the tune of $12,000. Each receives 24 hour access to a gee-whiz studio setup, free housing and a monthly stipend for 3 months. For more information and an application form, write to Creative Glass Center of America, 1501 Glasstown Road, Millville NJ 08332. ----------------------------------------------------------------- TWO COASTS, THREE GLASS EXHIBITIONS Work by William Gudenrath, Robin Mix and Sam Stang is on exhibit through July 9th at Pritam & Eames in East Hampton, New York. Saying their name "has been synonymous with the finest work in American furnituremaking since 1981" and noting that theirs is "the country's oldest established gallery associated with the American studio furniture movement," Pritam & Eames is showing the glasswork in conjunction with that of furniture makers, jewelers, makers of holloware, ceramics and lamps. Knowing the work of lampmakers Noel & Janene Hilliard, as we do, speaks well of the caliber of the rest of the work. Check it out at Pritam & Eames, 27-29 Race Lane, East Hampton NY 11937. Phone: (516)324- 7111. Fax: (516)324-4942. On the opposite coast, William Traver Gallery in Seattle is showing the neon work of Fred Tschida in a show called "New Light" June 6-30. Tschida is known for his use of neon to create magical installations that circumvent the accustomed neon words found on storefronts and motels. He also searches for light in unusual places, where the possibility of illumination is remote. In 1980 on the Bonneville Salt Flats in Utah, he mounted a 22- foot-tall neon column on top of his car because he 'wanted to make light drawings, to create spaces while driving -- using the car as a moving platform for that vertical tube, so I could make planes of light in space, ribbons of light, walls of light.... I like the idea of moving pieces and creating volumes that exist in space without any commitment to materials.'" [William Warmus, "Glass: The UrbanGlass Art Quarterly, Spring 1996, Number 62] William Traver Gallery is at 110 Union Street, Second Floor, Seattle WA 98101-2028. Phone: (206)587-6501. Fax: (206)587-6502. In Cambridge, Massachusetts next month at about the same time, June 3-28, five glass artists are mounting "Dimensions in Glass" at the Cambridge Art Association's University Place Gallery. Daniel Maher is showing architectural glass; Tom Krepcio, leaded glass panels and objects; Nancy Nicholson, painted leaded glass panels; Carmen Sasso, glass sculpture; and Rufus Butler Seder, lenticular glass tiles. We received three different color postcards, each showing work by the first three of these five artists (maybe there are two more cards in the series?) and were struck by the excellence of the work. Go see it at the University Place Gallery, 124 Mt. Auburn Street, Cambridge, MA 02138 across the street from the Harvard Square Post Office. For information, (617) 876-0246. ----------------------------------------------------------------- MORE STUDIO PROMOTION You ask yourself, how did I get this beautiful house? Ron Dixon apparently knows how ... or at least how to go about promoting himself and his studio. His newsletter, called "Dixon Direct," arrived last week and it's got to be effective! A nice four-page (11"x 17" folded in half, then in half again to mail) with a single letter-size sheet inside, it's printed in an unusual but very pleasant purple-blue. Stories include the history of the studio, line drawings of patterns of work installed in particular churches, interviews and stories done about the studio by local newspapers, and ABC-TV's "Good Morning Virginia" show. Tandem articles recount successful collaborations with church committees, architects and contractors, along with lists of previous churchwork commissioned and an explanation of the symbology shown in the artwork on the insert sheet, which contains "free clip art," allowing churches to include the scannable art in their church bulletins, letterhead, etc., as long as they include the Dixon Studios copyright line. Clever! The churches promote the studio's work to its members in each and every bulletin! ----------------------------------------------------------------- LATEST COOL GLASS WEB SITE http://www2.accent.net/esvc is the new web site of the Stained Glass Craft and Fine Arts College in Sion-Champsec, Switzerland. Isabelle Tardif alerted us to it (since she designed it) and a very nice site it is, too! The Stained Glass Craft and Fine Arts College is internationally known, even famous, according to the text of the web site, in the world of stained glass artists. The school has been affiliated with the National Graduate School of Applied Arts and Crafts of Paris since 1989. Every year, 15 students come from around the world to this little school situated on the plain between the towns of Sion and Bramois in the district of Valais in Switzerland. The school trains professionals who are at the same time creative artists and qualified technicians, capable of assuring the research, the study and realization of an individual project. On leaving the school the students will have the practical know- how which will enable them to open up their own workshop. They will be able to offer their services and capably cope with all aspects of stained glass craft. In addition, they will be able to tackle many unexploited ancillary aspects of the craft such as: shop signs, shop windows, interior architecture, furniture, lamps, mirrors, etc. Previous knowledge of drawing is not necessary. Selection of students is based on the following human qualities: desire to succeed, sensitivity, personality, and the effort they are willing to make. The course is spread over three years; the curriculum includes drawing, sketching, documentary studies, studies of color, knowledge of stained glass craft from the 11th century to present times, the realization of models based on a choice of free or imposed subjects. For more info, go to the web site and fill out the application form for the Stained Glass Craft and Fine Arts College, Route du Manege, 51, CH-1950 Sion 4 - Champsec, Switzerland CP 4107. Phone: 027 31 24 00. Fax: 027 31 20 76. E-mail: esvc@accent.net ================================================================= Do you like receiving this online news memo? Don't do anything; we'll send it to you whenever we get around to it, which might be fairly often. Or not. It depends on how busy the Exec. Dir., Albert Lewis, might be that day or week. You don't like it? If this is addressed to you DIRECTLY, simply reply to 70544.3642@compuserve.com saying UNSUBSCRIBE in the text of your message. If you receive it via a NEWSGROUP with a glass focus, you'll have to UNSUBSCRIBE from the newsgroup, alas. If you're receiving TWO copies, that's because you get it direct at your email address AND via the NEWSGROUP. Let us know in a note to 70544.3642@compuserve.com and we'll set the program to eliminate the duplicate copy. ================================================================= Our Mission: To facilitate communication among glass artists, to encourage education and promote excellence in the glass arts. __________________________________________ International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. Tonetta Lake Road *** Brewster NY 10509 (914) 278-2152 Fax: (914) 278-2481 __________________________________________ Membership info: 70544.3642@compuserve.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 10:58:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO6Ys-00018Qa; Mon, 27 May 96 10:58 PDT X-Path: aol.com!IMN2GLASS From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 13:58:25 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May27.95825.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-05-26 21:16:21 EDT, clambert@monmouth.com (C Lambert) writes: > >THUMBS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? NOBODY SAID NOTHING ABOUT NEEDING THUMBS! NO WONDER >I HAVE BEEN HAVING PROBLEMS.... > >---------- >From: Toby[SMTP:toby@northlights.co.uk] >Sent: Sunday, May 26, 1996 9:40 PM >To: glass@bungi.com >Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet > >From: IMN2GLASS@aol.com >To: glass@bungi.com >Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet >Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 21:19:22 -0400 >Reply-to: glass@bungi.com > >In a message dated 96-05-24 19:08:24 EDT, you write: > >> Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each >>hand with the thumbs pointing in. > >Ohhhh, THAT must have been the problem. I wondered.... > >Janet >IMN2GLASS@aol.com >---- >...my thumbs were pointing OUT; now I know why it all went wrong!! >Elisabeth 'n Toby THUMBS, I don't need no stinking THUMBS!! :-) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 12:15:42 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO7lD-0000mca; Mon, 27 May 96 12:15 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Restoration Questions Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 11:50:15 -0700 Message-ID: <199605271850.LAA10212@dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > >Hello yourself, Gerry. > If a bidder is incapable of describing the work or if the work proposed >is obviously not as carefully thought out as that proposed by another studio, >that's the kind of information a client should have to make an intelligent >decision. I would think that asking what other propose to do would only >indicate that one doesn't know *oneself what should be done. > >If you had been doing serious restoration for thirty years and, in your bid, >described exactly what you propose to do, based on that thirty years' >experience, to preserve and strengthen a window so that it will endure for >another 100 years or more ... and then your carefully written description of the >work you propose is given to someone else with much less experience who then >from the written description learns what's taken you 30 years to acquire >. The long and the short of this seems to be saying that the original post By ?? was sent by someone clearly out of his league? Best to leave Restoration to the pros? I think that perhaps the word restoration was loosly used here. As someone earlier pointed out just bcause it's old doesn't mean it's intrinsicaly valuable. A true "historical conservation restoration" is best left to studios with extensive experince in the field. Most bid packets require the bidding studios to have a minimum of proven five years in the field of restoration. As pointed out not knowing what to charge points to not knowing what needs to be done. Definetly a dangerous way to start a sensitive project. Unfortunatly as you pointed out commitees often do not have the expertise to make an informed decision and can have work done which does more harm than good. Let the buyer beware. M.S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 13:20:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO8mK-0000lAa; Mon, 27 May 96 13:20 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: 27 May 96 16:19:36 EDT Message-ID: <1996May27.201936.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >As someone earlier pointed out just bcause it's old >doesn't mean it's intrinsicaly valuable. Things change ... and the perception of things' value changes, too. As recently as thirty-fifty years ago, Tiffany lamps were routinely thrown away as "junk," but now they're seen as (very) valuable. Ten years ago, very few people even knew who John La Farge was, much less that it was really he who discovered the basis for American opalescent glass ... and many of his works were trashed. Today, his star has risen and the value of remaining works by him have skyrocketed. Then again, windows and objects owned by churches or private citizens may be to our eyes and sensibilities unimportant and valueless ... but to *them they have sentimental values that mean much to them, if little to us. Those windows and objects may have been created by artists who are unknown to us (as were the cathedrals of Europe), but that doesn't make their work unworthy of the same care and attention in restoration than the work of L.C. Tiffany or F.LL.Wright, if the owners want them restored, preserved and maintained and can afford the labor-intensive process of doing so. I'm old, too. And there are few people who think I should be restored, preserved and maintained, but for those few, doing so is important. Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 14:28:07 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uO9p9-00016Fa; Mon, 27 May 96 14:27 PDT X-Path: execpc.com!kshawkey From: kshawkey@execpc.com (Curt & Karen Shawkey) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Subscribe Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 16:27:21 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <199605272127.QAA15958@mail.execpc.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please subscribe to the "glass newsgroup" ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 14:49:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOAAG-0000xMa; Mon, 27 May 96 14:49 PDT X-Path: eos.ncsu.edu!jbbrauer From: "James Bartley Brauer" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Coffee Table Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 17:49:15 -0400 Message-ID: <9605271749.ZM1570@eos.ncsu.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi All, I am going to build a stained-glass top coffee table, with a wood frame around the edge of the table-top. Does anyone have experience doing this? I plan to use a foiled pattern supported from below by a large piece of clear plate glass. Thanks, James B. Brauer Raleigh, NC ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Mon May 27 18:58:55 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOE3B-0000bYa; Mon, 27 May 96 18:58 PDT X-Path: ebtech.net!proffire From: Doug Scale To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Eveybody picking on Howard Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 21:57:48 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May27.175748.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Enough already!! Those of us that are follically challenged don't need to keep hearing how Howard was having a bad hair day. Some of us would love to have any kind of "Hair" day. Not only that, his comments made a lot of sense. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 03:50:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOMLf-00013ea; Tue, 28 May 96 03:49 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Restoration Questions Date: 28 May 96 06:48:14 EDT Message-ID: <1996May28.104814.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Well, I suspect that this particular "restoration" was related to a church somewhere, and since you and I both have a bit of history in that department, I think we can understand each other's perspectives. I've never tried to represent any of my ability as strong in "restoration".. but as usual, when folks find out that I do glass, the inevitable queries come anyhow. I have done some minor patching and fixing a few times, in situations where the work wasn't particularly noteworthy, relatively recent, and well within my abilities. But I must stress, that these were *minor* repairs, done only to temporarily halt the hassle factor, and were typically done for free, or nominal charges. And, I haven't had any time to do even any of this sort of thing in many years. There is an "up" side to having a full time career! (grin) From a simple business point of view, it is reasonable (in my opinion) to ask the sorts of questions I mentioned. In a very real sense it's "asking for the sale". While we can all get real deep in the "art & craft" of glass and restoration, the historical significance of what is to be done, and on and on, in most cases typically encountered by individual glass artists, it boils down to the age old ratio of time and money. By quantifying their budget, one gets a bit better idea of what is and what isn't affordable. Budgetary considerations are always a factor, and I for one believe that taking that into account, allows a glass artist to make a more reasonable bid/estimate. It does nobody any good to bid so high that there's no chance of getting the job, or so low as to lose money on the deal. The ability to negotiate such a transaction is an art form in and of itself in my opinion, and my hat's off to anyone who can handle such negotiations successfully. Since in many such situations, the glass artist is dealing with people that are not well versed in the structure, design, fabrication, and maintenance of stained and leaded glass, it becomes an educational challenge to make them aware of just what is involved to do the job correctly, and fortifying their understanding that in many cases, a "restoration" can cost quite a bit more than duplicating the windows from scratch, using contemporary materials. Unfortunately, we'll continue to see windows that have been patched by well intentioned but ignorant people. Gobs of silicone holding glass to stretched and broken lead, huge gobs of solder melted down on a vertical came in an effort to resolder a broken joint, etc. I saw one such "fix" at a church I visited fairly recently. The entire bottom two thirds of the panel was covered with filament tape and clear Contact paper, trying to hold it all in place. The window was so bowed that the gaps between the glass and the cames were noticeable from a distance. It was an unremarkable panel, just colored glass rectangles in a geometric layout, but I was saddened still, that the church hadn't had it properly repaired. But, since there were still rather large cracks in the interior plaster from earthquakes of years past, it dawned on me that the tape and Contact paper were perhaps all that they could afford to do for the present, and at least the tape seemed to be holding things together, without doing permanent harm. Finally, I generally steer clear of working with churches in general. As you know, I'm a preacher's son, and have lived most of my life with the "church" up against my nose. In most of my dealings with churches, there is an expected "discount" factor there.. "for the "church", that can be very intimidating. It's one thing if you're a member of that particular congregation, and far another if you're not, but that "church" factor will most often be brought into play. That's where the "level playing field" gets skewed, and where the negotiations can get real peculiar. Peace -Gerry ----------------------------------------------------------------- Gerry, Yes, as a preacher's son myself, I understand exactly where you're coming from: there's a tendency to want to give everything away, isn't there? A fulltime career's a definite benefit when one suffers from an affliction like that. I don't see anything wrong with asking the church what they've budgeted; I only bridled at asking them what other studios had bid or what work those studios had proposed. Someone else pointed out, I think, (or maybe it was me) that asking that would indicate a certain lack of knowledge and experience on the part of the asker, but the primary problem in asking the church what they can afford lies, I think, in that one might be tempted to try to *do the work for the amount (wrongly) budgeted, which could inevitably lead to the kind of shoddy work you describe seeing (and, yes, I've seen work like that, too, even by so- called reputable studios). And, yes, education of the client is definitely part and parcel of the job. It's going to be *required if the actual cost of restoration is dramatically higher than what they have in mind, cost-wise. Have you run across the instance of bowed windows described to you as "having been designed that way"? Yes, that quaint bowing was intentional, it lends such an antique air to the windows; wasn't the artist clever! Albert ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 04:51:33 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uONIu-0001A2a; Tue, 28 May 96 04:51 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Eveybody picking on Howard Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 07:51:24 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May28.35124.0> References: <<1996May27.175748.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T and M Stained Glass Precedence: bulk Doug Scale wrote: > > Enough already!! Those of us that are follically challenged don't need > to keep hearing how Howard was having a bad hair day. Some of us would > love to have any kind of "Hair" day. Not only that, his comments made a > lot of sense. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glassWow, We have truly drifted from the subject of glass, but everybody should remember: God made a limited number of perfect heads, the rest he covered with hair! Matt (not bald yet, but it's only a matter of time) -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 05:15:59 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uONgY-00019ua; Tue, 28 May 96 05:15 PDT X-Path: YaleVM.CIS.Yale.Edu!UCONNVM.UCONN.EDU!HCLADM02 From: HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Boxes Date: Tue, 28 May 96 08:07:26 EDT Message-ID: <960528.081451.EDT.HCLADM02@UConnVM.UConn.Edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Well, I'm really referring to wooden boxes, into which one can insert stained glass into the lid. If the wood is too hard (i.e., like oak) to push points into, does anyone have a good suggestion for holding the glass in? (Nope, it's not a Clarity box.) We drilled some little guide holes and drove in brads, but I wonder if there's a better solution. My garden is finally planted! I hope you all had a refreshing weekend (although I hear there is some rotten weather out there...too wet in some places, too dru in others and too snowy in the Rockies). -- Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 05:30:35 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uONug-0000qta; Tue, 28 May 96 05:30 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!104344.622 From: "Christie A. Wood" <104344.622@CompuServe.COM> To: "bungi.com" Subject: subscribe Date: 28 May 96 08:27:14 EDT Message-ID: <1996May28.122714.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk subscrive glass 104344.622@compuserve.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 08:06:45 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOQLf-0000yia; Tue, 28 May 96 08:06 PDT X-Path: ihgp.ih.att.com!cmb From: Charles.M.Buche@att.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 10:09:04 +0600 Message-ID: <9605281509.AA18599@ihgp68v.ih.att.com.ihgp68v> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk help ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 09:33:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uORht-0000SPa; Tue, 28 May 96 09:33 PDT X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: lead mill Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 11:30:35 -0500 Message-ID: <199605281630.LAA21319@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi my name is Len I'm new to this list as well as to computor communications. However I am not new to stained glass by any means and I am more then willing to contribute in any way I can. I am currently in sort of a retro phase .... using norman slab, blenko and other misc recycled flat glass I am interested in locating a hand crank lead mill along with dies and molds. the coarse nature of the resultant came would be an enhancement to the projects I have in mind I hope someone can provide me with some info ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 12:47:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOUjf-0000T6a; Tue, 28 May 96 12:47 PDT X-Path: monmouth.com!clambert From: C Lambert To: "'glass@bungi.com'" Subject: RE: Gatewayed mail message Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 15:45:49 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May28.114549.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4CAC.C37F3400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would be glad to help... message sent was kind of cryptic though.. kt ---------- From: Charles.M.Buche@att.com[SMTP:Charles.M.Buche@att.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 1996 12:09 AM To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message help ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4CAC.C37F3400 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IjoTAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG AAgBAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAD0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AU01UUABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAAAAHgACMAEAAAAF AAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAABAAAABnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4A ATABAAAAEgAAACdnbGFzc0BidW5naS5jb20nAAAAAgELMAEAAAAVAAAAU01UUDpHTEFTU0BCVU5H SS5DT00AAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAN8KwEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5N aWNyb3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQSAAQAbAAAAUkU6IEdhdGV3YXllZCBtYWlsIG1lc3NhZ2UA VAkBBYADAA4AAADMBwUAHAAPAC0AMQACAGMBASCAAwAOAAAAzAcFABwADwAtAAYAAgA4AQEJgAEA IQAAADA5RUIyNDFFODlCOENGMTFBREY0NDQ0NTUzNTQwMDAwAAMHAQOQBgCgAwAAEgAAAAsAIwAA AAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5ACAir0XOTLsBHgBwAAEAAAAbAAAAUkU6IEdh dGV3YXllZCBtYWlsIG1lc3NhZ2UAAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG7TM5FjR4k6wq4iRHPrfRERVNUAAAA AB4AHgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAWAAAAY2xhbWJlcnRAbW9ubW91dGguY29tAAAA AwAGEPzWIIkDAAcQVAEAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAElXT1VMREJFR0xBRFRPSEVMUE1FU1NBR0VTRU5U V0FTS0lORE9GQ1JZUFRJQ1RIT1VHSEtULS0tLS0tLS0tLUZST006Q0hBUkxFU01CVUNIRUBBVFRD T01TTVRQOkNIQVJMRVMAAAAAAgEJEAEAAAAdAgAAGQIAAD8EAABMWkZ1KmQZqP8ACgEPAhUCqAXr AoMAUALyCQIAY2gKwHNldDI3BgAGwwKDMgPFAgBwckJxEeJzdGVtAoMzdwLkBxMCgH0KgAjPCdk7 8RYPMjU1AoAKgQ2xC2DgbmcxMDMUUAsKFFGFC/JjAEAgSSB3CGCAbGQgYmUgZwtgARtQdG8gaGVs cIouHGAgB4FzYWcbgNcRsAIwGwBhBCBrC4AbUChvZiAFAHkFMGljZRvgaAhgZ2gcYAqFawZ0CoUK i2xpMTgwwQLRaS0xNDQN8AzQcyGjC1kxNgqgA2AT0GN9BUAtI8cKhyJ7DDAjRkadA2E6JM4jRgyC IEMRgYJsB5AuTS5CdRFwKGVAYQJALgWgbVtgU01UUDoojymUXb8kbyV9BmACMCavJ7tUClBgc2Rh eSwF0DBAIIQyODBgMTk5NjDw0DI6MDkUsE0r3yV9PFRvLh8nuxuhBBBAYjp1GRBpKbIx3yzudWLu aiOBM/8nu0cpgAfQMEB/CYAckAtwAyAcpR/PINMzfjYiRxpFI0YcIjx8JClG7QWxczjQBPRpAiAe IBGA7xkQB5AwYAtQZR2AG4A7s1cb8DkwNdMtFhBxMAF0/zYvM9AdEhvTHrAbgCEAE8B/MGBHA0Lv Ne8KsgcQEXBp8nYHkWF2O8EBoCqQSkCDP1ECQHA6Ly93S5D6LjY3L0hjPHw87z3/I1ULCoUVMQBQ 4AAAAAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAAAAABAAAcwILfKK85MuwFAAAgwILfKK85MuwEeAD0AAQAAAAUAAABS RTogAAAAAD/0 ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB4CAC.C37F3400-- ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 12:48:27 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOUjL-0000iza; Tue, 28 May 96 12:46 PDT X-Path: facstaff.wisc.edu!churtenb From: C Hurtenbach To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Gatewayed mail message Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:38:10 -0500 Message-ID: <199605281946.OAA34031@audumla.students.wisc.edu> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Please send info on accessing listserver and/or subscribing procedure. Thank you Cynthia churtenb@facstaff.wisc.edu ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Tue May 28 15:09:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOWwM-0000lUa; Tue, 28 May 96 15:08 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: lead mill Date: 28 May 96 18:05:21 EDT Message-ID: <1996May28.22521.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >I am interested in locating a hand crank lead mill >along with dies and molds. Very interesting! I'd be intrigued to see what you come up with. I'd say that the best bet would be to contact some of the old-line studios, those that have been around for years and years. Why don't you write to the Stained Glass Association of America, 6 SW Second Street, Suite 7, Lee's Summit MO 64063. Phone: (816) 524-9313. (800) 438-9581. Fax: (816) 524-9405 and ask them if they'd put an announcement (or run your letter) in an upcoming issue of their magazine. I think that'd be the most likely way (and the least expensive) to come up with a good possibility. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 04:03:22 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOj1c-00012Ha; Wed, 29 May 96 04:02 PDT X-Path: crosfield.co.uk!jc From: jc@crosfield.co.uk (Jerry Cullingford) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Coffee Table Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:03:55 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <9605291103.AA09299@crosfield.co.uk> References: <<9605271749.ZM1570@eos.ncsu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > > Hi All, > I am going to build a stained-glass top coffee table, with a wood frame > around the edge of the table-top. Does anyone have experience doing this? > > I plan to use a foiled pattern supported from below by a large piece of > clear plate glass. A few thoughts: if you're going to put food on the table, you may want to consider either using lead free solder, or putting another layer of clear glass over the top - which might be a thought anyway, if you're planning to use patina - I don't know how well that stands up to scratches? maybe someone with more experience could comment on that? If you're only intending to use opaque glass, and not illuminate it from below, then a mosaic technique would be another possibility - and avoid any lead issues as well. -Jerry -- _|_ / | Jerry Cullingford jc@crosfield.co.uk (Work) \_|_ jc@selune.demon.co.uk (Home) \__/ Hemel Hempstead, UK jerry@shell.portal.com (alternate) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 10:04:26 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOoeQ-0001Coa; Wed, 29 May 96 10:03 PDT X-Path: calvin.stemnet.nf.ca!rcrane From: "Robert M. Crane" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Coffee Table Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 14:33:05 -0230 (NDT) Message-ID: <1996May29.11455.0> References: <<9605291103.AA09299@crosfield.co.uk>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Anyone out there know of workshops in sandblasting-etching in the Maine-Vermont area or of any in stained glass a little above beginner level. Any reply would be greatly appeeciated. P.S. The time frame is July- aug. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 10:12:25 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOomm-0000wUa; Wed, 29 May 96 10:11 PDT X-Path: eos.ncsu.edu!jbbrauer From: "James Bartley Brauer" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Coffee Table Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 13:11:36 -0400 Message-ID: <9605291311.ZM21809@eos.ncsu.edu> References: <<9605271749.ZM1570@eos.ncsu.edu>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Thanks for the advice on a coffee table. I had not considered the patina getting scratched. I will include a piece of clear glass over my design. Thanks, James B. Brauer Raleigh, NC, US ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 20:07:11 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOy4Q-0000dHa; Wed, 29 May 96 20:06 PDT X-Path: gnn.com!PhillRoey From: PhillRoey@gnn.com (Jerri Roey) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: mosiac garden stones Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 22:34:25 Message-ID: <199605300235.WAA16393@mail-e2b-service.gnn.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi! I'm new to the group and have been having a great time reading the archives. I'm a novice and have done some copper foil suncatchers and panels. I want to do some mosiac garden stones and wanted to get opinions about cement. My husband and I have made some stones with molds using mortar, but I know it's not as sturdy as cement. We've used quick set Quickrete and I was wondering If anyone is familiar with this brand. Any problems? Is regular cement preferable to quick set? Also, I've heard of using cake pans for molds. Has anyone tried spring form pans? I wondered if they would leak. Thanks for any advice! -Jerri ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 20:18:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOyEp-000161a; Wed, 29 May 96 20:17 PDT X-Path: execpc.com!gorman From: Mark Ommodt To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: unsubscribe Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 22:17:18 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <199605300317.WAA29664@mail.execpc.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 12:38 AM 5/15/96 -0400, you wrote: >Please unsubscribe me from your list >Thankyou >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Wed May 29 21:03:48 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uOyxI-0000Qza; Wed, 29 May 96 21:03 PDT X-Path: aol.com!GinaJoe From: GinaJoe@aol.com To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: mosiac garden stones Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 00:03:17 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May29.20317.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jerri: I have done two mosaic garden stones so far--one in a class and one on my own. I'll know Sunday whether the one I did myself turned out!! Our instructor recommended using Quikrete brand cement. She said using the blend that included gravel is stronger than the sand version, and the using the gravel version eliminated the need for any chicken wire support. I'm having a lot of fun with this technique! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 06:57:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uP8Cz-0000mva; Thu, 30 May 96 06:56 PDT X-Path: westbyserver.westby.mwt.net!alcamoz From: len alcamo To: glass@bungi.com Subject: lead mill Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 08:53:24 -0500 Message-ID: <199605301353.IAA10076@westbyserver.westby.mwt.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk thanks for your interest in my persuit of a lead mill. I suspect that it might a difficult item to find. I will follow up on your suggestions. Did you know Robert Sowers? (my hero) ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 09:21:52 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPATP-0000qfa; Thu, 30 May 96 09:21 PDT X-Path: MARS.SUPERLINK.NET!morn From: "morn@mars.superlink.net" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: mosiac garden stones Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 11:11:23 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May30.71123.0> References: <<199605300235.WAA16393@mail-e2b-service.gnn.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Jerri Roey wrote: > > Hi! > I'm new to the group and have been having a great time reading the archives. > I'm a novice and have done some copper foil suncatchers and panels. I want > to do some mosiac garden stones and wanted to get opinions about cement. My > husband and I have made some stones with molds using mortar, but I know it's > not as sturdy as cement. We've used quick set Quickrete and I was wondering > If anyone is familiar with this brand. Any problems? Is regular cement > preferable to quick set? Also, I've heard of using cake pans for molds. Has > anyone tried spring form pans? I wondered if they would leak. Thanks for > any advice! -Jerri > > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass Well, I think that cement should work. However I wouldn't use spring form pans, because they would break (cement expands) as for regular pans, I would probably experiment first with a junky pan. Though you're probably better off making your own form from wood. I heard of someone using there rubber maid products as forms, and well, there unusable now. ---Mike Savad ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 10:16:53 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPBKa-0000fSa; Thu, 30 May 96 10:16 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: lead mill Date: 30 May 96 13:15:11 EDT Message-ID: <1996May30.171511.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >thanks for your interest in my persuit of a lead mill. I suspect that it >might a difficult item to find. I will follow up on your suggestions. >Did you know Robert Sowers? (my hero) Hope you find the mill. Sowers? Yes, I knew him well. Used to have dinner with him all the time ... loved his paintings, as well as his glass design. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 17:58:05 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPIVj-0000oQa; Thu, 30 May 96 17:56 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!vnunit1 From: vnunit1@ix.netcom.com (RICK D VAUGHN) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Boxes Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 17:55:58 -0700 Message-ID: <199605310055.RAA14857@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Well, I'm really referring to wooden boxes, into which one can insert >stained glass into the lid. If the wood is too hard (i.e., like oak) >to push points into, does anyone have a good suggestion for holding >the glass in? (Nope, it's not a Clarity box.) We drilled some little >guide holes and drove in brads, but I wonder if there's a better >solution. >My garden is finally planted! I hope you all had a refreshing >weekend (although I hear there is some rotten weather out there...too >wet in some places, too dru in others and too snowy in the Rockies). > >-- >Dorothy Kalahan, Interlibrary Loan (860) 679-2940 FAX (860) 679-4046 >UCONN Health Center Library, POB 4003, Farmington CT 06034-4003 >HCLADM02@UConnVM.uconn.edu >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > Have you tried setting it in clear silicone? Properly done, this creates a nice, clean installation without the risk of splitting the wood. Makes it alittle tougher to undo if the glass needs replacing though. Also, look into the cabinet clips. Luck Teresa V Color It Glass! ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 18:26:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPIxJ-00012aa; Thu, 30 May 96 18:24 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Coffee Table Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:24:37 -0700 Message-ID: <199605310124.SAA28213@dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Hi All, >I am going to build a stained-glass top coffee table, with a wood frame >around the edge of the table-top. Does anyone have experience doing this? > >I plan to use a foiled pattern supported from below by a large piece of >clear plate glass. > > To begin with you may want to rethink the idea of having the art glass on top. The surface is to uneven for one thing. You also run the risk of lead poising if you use a solder with any lead content. You also run a real risk of breakage of the art glass as it's individual pieces are considerably more fragile than a piece of plate glass. Unless you want to sandwich the piece between two pieces of plate, you should also rethink the idea of a foil piece. Foil work will not hold up unsupported in the application you are presenting. In your construction also be aware of the weight factors if you do decide to sandwich three pieces of glass. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 18:27:10 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPIy7-0000T6a; Thu, 30 May 96 18:25 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Eveybody picking on Howard Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:25:28 -0700 Message-ID: <199605310125.SAA16833@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > >Enough already!! Those of us that are follically challenged don't need >to keep hearing how Howard was having a bad hair day. Some of us would >love to have any kind of "Hair" day. Not only that, his comments made a >lot of sense. >---- > Hear hear ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 18:48:43 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPJIx-0001BOa; Thu, 30 May 96 18:47 PDT X-Path: ix.netcom.com!izzy3 From: izzy3@ix.netcom.com (Michael Smoucha ) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Restoration Questions Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:46:52 -0700 Message-ID: <199605310146.SAA29639@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk You wrote: > > > > >Gerry, > > >Have you run across the instance of bowed windows described to you as "having >been designed that way"? Yes, that quaint bowing was intentional, it lends >such an antique air to the windows; wasn't the artist clever! > >Albert > >---- We just bid on a residential window where the owner insisted that the bowing was intentional. Told me that his old house had similar windows with five panels "all bowed in the exact same place" They were diamond windows. I had a heck of a time telling him this was not "normal" , but an indication of damage. His window was in bad enough shape to need releading and he did ask me if the new window would have the same bow. I told him not in my lifetime. That was not the first or only time that that question was asked. I've seen this belief in at least a dozen clients and many times it is very, very difficult to convince them that they are mistaken in their beliefs. M.S. ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Thu May 30 20:17:30 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPKgf-00018Ma; Thu, 30 May 96 20:15 PDT X-Path: highlander.cbnet.ns.ca!jcunning From: jcunning@highlander.cbnet.ns.ca (Joanie Cunningham) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Coffee Table Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 00:18:37 +0400 Message-ID: <199605302018.AAA14085@highlander> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk > >>Hi All, >>I am going to build a stained-glass top coffee table, with a wood >frame >>around the edge of the table-top. Does anyone have experience doing >this? >> >>I plan to use a foiled pattern supported from below by a large piece >of >>clear plate glass. >> My husband and I made a mahogny coffee table a while ago. There is a picture of it on our web site. We went with opalesent glass, copper foil, supported from below with plywood, and a 4mm glass top surface. The stained glass was divided into three panels and the 4mm glass fits into a recessed surface so that the wood and glass are at the same level. We didn't have any problems with the weight of the panels. It was a great learning piece. Hope that you will enjoy making your table. Joanie Cunningham Check out my web page - http://mfusion.com/glass ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 03:28:58 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPRPK-00016da; Fri, 31 May 96 03:26 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: 31 May 96 06:25:01 EDT Message-ID: <1996May31.10251.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >We just bid on a residential window where the owner insisted that the >bowing was intentional. ... I've seen this belief in at least a dozen >clients and many times it is very, very difficult to convince them that >they are mistaken in their beliefs. Just so! I watched a couple of people at a stained glass restoration conference in Michigan try to convince an expert in the field that glass is a liquid that flows downward over time and that that's why some old windows of American Colonial vintage have panes thicker at the bottom than at the top. No amount of explanation about the old processes of producing glass panes ("crown glass") or installing them would convince the man and woman. Oh, well. They were wearing identical pale green jumpsuits and ponytails, which was odd enough for people in their 60s, but which might have been a partial explanation. Wonder if they were on their way to a convention of UFO abductees? __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 04:56:47 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPSnE-0000ZJa; Fri, 31 May 96 04:55 PDT X-Path: voyager.net!delphigl From: delphigl@voyager.net (Delphi Stained Glass) To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Boxes Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 07:54:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <199605311154.HAA04164@vixa.voyager.net> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >You wrote: >> >>Well, I'm really referring to wooden boxes, into which one can insert >>stained glass into the lid. If the wood is too hard (i.e., like oak) >>to push points into, does anyone have a good suggestion for holding >>the glass in? (Nope, it's not a Clarity box.) We drilled some little >>guide holes and drove in brads, but I wonder if there's a better >>solution. Clarity has also come out with a "Box Lid Tape" which is a foam tape with one adhesive side. After you lay the glass lid inside the lip, the tape would stick to the remaining lip and hold the glass securely in place. Stephanie ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 05:04:16 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPSuQ-0000nha; Fri, 31 May 96 05:02 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 08:02:41 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May31.4241.0> References: <<1996May31.10251.0>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T & M Satined Glass Precedence: bulk Albert Lewis [IGGA] wrote: > Just so! I watched a couple of people at a stained glass restoration conference > in Michigan try to convince an expert in the field that glass is a liquid that > flows downward over time and that that's why some old windows of American > Colonial vintage have panes thicker at the bottom than at the top. No amount of > explanation about the old processes of producing glass panes ("crown glass") or > installing them would convince the man and woman. > Albert, With all due respect, glass IS a liquid. (I should know, I'm a chemist.) Although crowning was an intentional method of producing glass, it is also true that old panes will tend to be thinker at the bottom. However, you are correct that a 200 year old pane will not see a lot of settling, this is probably due to crowning. But many panes, particularly those found in England and Ireland which date back to the 13th and 14th Centuries, are thinker at the bottom due to flowing glass. Just a little tidbit for all. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 07:10:13 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPUqp-0001AGa; Fri, 31 May 96 07:06 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: "Christie A. Wood" <104344.622@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 10:07:04 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May31.674.0> References: <<960531133819_104344.622_IHS32-1@CompuServe.COM>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T & M Satined Glass Precedence: bulk Christie A. Wood wrote: > > Hi there Matt. What is this "Stained Glass Marketplace" site you've listed? > ...Christie WoodWell, It's in the development stage right now, but in a nutshell, it's going to be a site where there will be links to stained glass suppliers, galleries and vendors. It will also have other stuff like search engines and general info about stained glass on the internet. Students and aritsts will be able to list their sites for free, vendors will have to pay a nominal fee based on what type of listing they want. Vendors who are interested will be able to locate their web page at The Stained Glass Marketplace (i.e.;http://www.stained-glass.com/glassvendor/). There will be web page consulting available to anyone who put their site at the marketplace. Think of it as a stained glass internet tarde center. I haven't had the time to advertise it well, so I'm a bit behind schedule, but I still expect it to be up in June. Let me know if you would like any additional information. Also, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 10:26:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPXy5-00018Fa; Fri, 31 May 96 10:26 PDT X-Path: stained-glass.com!webmaster From: Matt McDonnell To: "Peggy W. Johnsen" Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 13:26:14 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May31.92614.0> References: <> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Organization: T & M Satined Glass Precedence: bulk Peggy W. Johnsen wrote: > > Matt McDonnell. Your Stained Glass Marketplace sounds exciting. Do you > have any further information? Please keep us informed as you progress. > Peggy from Santa Maria. There is a new page at the site... http://www.stained-glass.com/market.html . It has most of the relevant information. Of course I'll be adding to it, but for now, that's what I've got. Matt McDonnell -- T & M Stained Glass - http://www.stained-glass.com Future home of the Stained Glass Marketplace Visit soon, visit often. send inquiries to mailto:webmaster@stained-glass.com ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 14:34:29 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPbpd-0000goa; Fri, 31 May 96 14:34 PDT X-Path: CompuServe.COM!70544.3642 From: "Albert Lewis [IGGA]" <70544.3642@CompuServe.COM> To: Subject: Re: Restoration Question Date: 31 May 96 17:29:37 EDT Message-ID: <1996May31.212937.0> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk >With all due respect, glass IS a liquid. (I should know, I'm a chemist.) >Although crowning was an intentional method of producing glass, it is >also true that old panes will tend to be thinker at the bottom. >However, you are correct that a 200 year old pane will not see a lot of >settling, this is probably due to crowning. But many panes, >particularly those found in England and Ireland which date back to the >13th and 14th Centuries, are thinker at the bottom due to flowing glass. Matt, On a molecular level, glass exhibits the properties of both solids and liquids, but I'd certainly be interested in a *proof* that there's a measurable flow. Can you cite chapter, verse and source(s)? As for "crowning" being "intentional" (and I'm not sure what you mean by the use of that word), crown glass was a _method_ of producing sheet glass, as was the "muff" method. If you'll look at Fig. 9.6, page 154 of Kenneth M. Wilson, "Window Glass in America" [Chilton, 1976], you'll see that every piece of rectangular glass cut from a crown (a large spun rondel) must necessarily be thicker in one dimension, ever more so toward the crown itself (the center of the rondel). But more to the point, "... it has been argued that cold glass should exhibit gradual plastic flow over very long periods of time. However, demonstrations to prove this have usually involved a misunderstanding of the actual mechanism involved, or misinterpretation of the evidence. Thus the various phenomena which have been claimed to demonstrate plastic flow in cold glass must be scrutinized carefully. ... It has also been claimed that medieval window glass is thicker at the bottom of the panes, again due to plastic flow, but there is no evidence for this and in fact medieval glass was often so irregular in thickness that there can be no reliable evidence that its thickness has changed." [Newton and Davison, Conservation of Glass, Butterworths, London, 1989. p. 13] Since Roy Newton is the acknowledged master of this particular realm of knowledge (he's an OBE, DSc, HonFSGT, FSA, after all!) and professor emeritus of glass technology at the School of Materials, University of Sheffield, I think I'll defer to him. __________________________________________ Albert Lewis Executive Director International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc. __________________________________________ ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 15:53:49 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPd4O-0000nha; Fri, 31 May 96 15:53 PDT X-Path: mars.superlink.net!morn From: "M. Savad" To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Restoration Questions Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 18:49:43 -0400 Message-ID: <1996May31.144943.0> References: <<199605310146.SAA29639@dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com>> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Michael Smoucha wrote: > > You wrote: > > > > > > > > > >Gerry, > > > > > >Have you run across the instance of bowed windows described to you as > "having > >been designed that way"? Yes, that quaint bowing was intentional, > it lends > >such an antique air to the windows; wasn't the artist clever! > > > >Albert > > > >---- > > We just bid on a residential window where the owner insisted that the > bowing was intentional. Told me that his old house had similar windows > with five panels "all bowed in the exact same place" They were diamond > windows. I had a heck of a time telling him this was not "normal" , but > an indication of damage. His window was in bad enough shape to need > releading and he did ask me if the new window would have the same bow. > I told him not in my lifetime. > > That was not the first or only time that that question was asked. I've > seen this belief in at least a dozen clients and many times it is very, > very difficult to convince them that they are mistaken in their > beliefs. > > M.S. > ---- > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com > To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass This is not completely true I saw a house where it was intentionally down, it was a curve to match the building, although you could see the curve in the zinc. But chances are that it's just stretched. ---Mike Savad ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 19:10:57 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPg8l-000048a; Fri, 31 May 96 19:10 PDT X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:08:08 -0600 Message-ID: <199606010208.UAA23620@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 11:15 PM 22/05/1996 +0000, you wrote: >Copper sulphate. >You say that you left your "little project" a few days before trying >to apply the patina.. I think herein lies your answer... >I find that - first of all - washing the prooject thouroughy with >soap and water to remove all flux residues helps a lot. If you are >then forced to leave the work for some days before you apply patina, >the oxidization of the metals have already started .Try rubbing down >your work with a very soft grade of wire-wool (so as not to scratch I use steel wool to rub down too, but then you need to rinse thoroughly again! I have heard that copper wool is better, but can't get it here. Need to get all the soap off too! Meg> the glass) immediately before applying the patina. Hopefully you >should receive better result. (By the way, once uo have applied the >patina and achieved the desired result, I would recommend that you >again wash your work with soap and water, to avoid the sulphate >"eating" into the glass). Let us know how you got on... >By the way, someone in the Group suggested using a damp cloth to stop >solder seeping through in masses. What a great idea, many thanks! (Why didn't >I think of that!?) My students used it to good effect yesterday. >Elisabeth 'n Toby >---- >As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind" >North Lights Stained Glass - homepage >http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm >---- >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ****************************************** Richard and Meg Laval Monteverde, Costa Rica ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 19:11:03 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPg8q-00015Oa; Fri, 31 May 96 19:10 PDT X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: not too cranky, yet Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:08:12 -0600 Message-ID: <199606010208.UAA23642@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk At 04:02 PM 24/05/1996 -0500, you wrote: >-- [ From: Elaine & Howard Rubin * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] -- > >How about using the plastic, green type pot scrubbers, they do not >contaminate the unused patina, leave no wool "hairs", >will not rust. >They are as abrasive as steel wool, and need to be used carefully as they >can scratch as well. As for cleaning before patina, I do use the green >scrubbers with an abrasive cleanser. Works well for me, and I get a 'good" >patina. One more tip, heat up the patina by putting the jar of it in a 1/2 >gal container (old milk jug) with HOT water. Yes that stuff "do" work better > I got a box of doctors disposable latex gloves. They are surprisingly sturdy, (I have even dripped hot solder on them and been saved a burn) and cheap! Meg with heat. Of course no need to mention USE GLOVES, preferably one on each >hand with the thumbs pointing in. >Enjoy (sorry, could not help it). >-- >new construction 5-11-96... http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard/hrubin.htm > http://www.teleport.com/~weaver51 >Elaine and Howard, mastering technology one byte at a time! >E-Mail address is...weaver51@teleport.com > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ****************************************** Richard and Meg Laval Monteverde, Costa Rica ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 19:11:04 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPg8r-0000mFa; Fri, 31 May 96 19:10 PDT X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: Re: Gatewayed mail message Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:08:17 -0600 Message-ID: <199606010208.UAA23690@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Sure, what help do you need??? At 10:09 AM 28/05/1996 +0600, you wrote: >help > >---- >For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com >To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com >Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass > > ****************************************** Richard and Meg Laval Monteverde, Costa Rica ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass From owner-glass Fri May 31 19:11:32 1996 Return-Path: Received: by daver.bungi.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0uPg8k-0001H4a; Fri, 31 May 96 19:10 PDT X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval From: Richard LaVal To: glass@bungi.com Subject: RE: Soldering Irons Weller W100 Date: Fri, 31 May 1996 20:08:02 -0600 Message-ID: <199606010208.UAA23610@sol.racsa.co.cr> Reply-To: glass@bungi.com Precedence: bulk Hi; I have had the same problem with copper sulfate patina at times, but with meticulous cleaning, and heating the copper sulfate solution and a lot of rubbing and elbow grease... I have had much better luck. I also use Blue Magic polish afterwards and it comes up a nice copper color... I am using 50/50 solder now, as that is what is available in Costa Rica, and I think that the 60/40 accepts the patina better that this does... Hope that helps... Meg >I had the exact same problem with the copper patina. some one = >recommended that I meticulously clean the project first and get all the = >oxidation of the solder before I applied the patina... I tried it and I = >did seem to get better results. Cant wait to hear what everyone else = >does. >Katie > > >Another question if I may. I tried to patina my little project with a >copper sulphate solution. It didn't seem to be very even in colour = >(that's >how WE spell it). Some areas were almost black, others still solder >coloured. > >I didn't apply this patina till several days after soldering and = >cleaning. > >Is there a 'recommend' strength for the copper sulpate solution. Nothing = >I >have read mentions a mix. > ****************************************** Richard and Meg Laval Monteverde, Costa Rica ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass